Boolit Feeding Problem

[Bill*]

To everyone who helped me work up loads for my first cast boolits: THANKS

I finally got out to the range to try them out and I'm having feed problems quite frequently--like 2 or 3 out of a 10 round magazine. (btw-when they DO feed they shoot fine). My camera's not good for close-ups so I snapped this through a desk magnifier. This is a typical jam shown below
Never had any trouble with J word bullets.
These are .452 230Gr. Lee tumble lube shot in a Springfield Armory XD 45. They are getting a "nick" in the brass and boolit just where the two meet. This mark sticks out enough so it can't chamber. Picture a screwdriver hammered straight down on an upright boolit at the juncture of brass and boolit shoulder!!! The boolits are loaded so that the tumble lube shoulder and brass meet. The "nick" is at 6 o-clock in the photo. As I remember they jammed while attempting to chamber and this damage was at the top of the cartridge, not down on the feedramp side. Obviously I must either change that case shoulder situation or touch up the chamber opening with a:confused: grinder-(not my first desire). Any thought would be appreciated. Regards......Bill

[Bill*]

I meant to add above: I ordered a Lee Factory Crimp die for these on the off chance it would help. Should be here Wed. or Thur. Might that fix the problem? If not I'll keep it for "whatever". :mrgreen:

[runfiverun]

i like to seat mine at or just below the shoulder case junction.
a taper crimp would probably help you also but on my swc's if i seat them like i described i don't need it.

[billyb]

the damage is at the top of the chamber? sounds like the clip feed angle is too steep allowing the slide to impact the bullet on the back travel,does this happen with the same clip? Bill

[Bass Ackward]

Wife is always complaining about all the heavy containers filled with bullets all over the basement. I told her that the lead was free and they don't eat nothin.

Now here you go and tell the world you have a bullet feeding problem? :groner:

That's all we need is a bullet wacko group. Might call it, People for the Ethical Treatment of Bullets, PETB.

[Bill*]

runfiverun; these are seated with a Lee taper crimp die now, I, also, seated them at the juncture exactly--that's why I wondered if the factory crimp might help. I guess next step will be to vary seating depth some?

billyb; it happened with all 3 mags- none of which gives me any trouble with Berrys plated 200 gr. And yes, if I remember correctly, the mark was made at the top. I examined the feedramp and can't see anything odd (not that I know precisely what to look for). I get what you're saying about the slide and will check it out but 3 different mags seems to rule that out.

BassAckward; What can I say??? As executive left handed secretary of PWBFBIAGT (people who believe feeding boolits is "a good thing") I must warn you - this is no laughing matter!!! :mrgreen::mrgreen::mrgreen:

[xr650]

Bill,
I have the same problem with my Sig P220 45 ACP. I found out the problem with a little help from folks a lot smarter than me.

http://www.fototime.com/F7D735D61F340E2/standard.jpg

When the barrel unlocks and tips up the empty case being extracted catches on the shoulder of the bullet in the mag. I indexed the brass on a few mags to prove this out.
I had 3 or 4 failures per 100. Frustrating as hell.
I went to a TC design and all my problems went away.
Good luck,
Larry

[straight-shooter]

The problem is definately the XD pistol. I own 3 different XD's including the one you have. The XD just plain does not like SWC boolits. I load SWC's for my 1911's but I then load either RN or TC type boolits for the XD's and have no troubles. I even called springfield about this and they confirmed to not use SWC in the XD's.

[HeavyMetal]

Looks like xr650 hit it on the head!

I also think the standard, non tumble lube, 230 round nose would be a good substitute. No shoulder to catch on so the ejecting round will just "slide" over the top of the rounds in the mag!

I guess this means your not going to shoot any semi wadcutters in these guns!

[EDK]

See if you can access magazines with a different style of feed lips. A lot of experts consider magazine troubles your first place to look.

Clean the gun vigorously...especially the chamber, slide face and extractor.

Check extractor tension.

How old and what pound rating is the recoil spring?

Do you have a firm grip....you can get into trouble with recoil operated guns if you don't have enough resistance to the recoil so the gun can cycle.

Remove firing pin from slide. Re-assemble and try hand cycling rounds. You might need to adjust over all length.

More taper crimp...most 45s headspace more off the extractor than the shoulder in the chamber.

Has the gun been throated and/or any gunsmithing to improve functioning?

How hot is your load? More recoil impulse might help your feeding.

An auto isn't too bad to trouble shoot...you can really get frustrated trying to get rounds to fire in a 45 ACP Smith & Wesson revolver without the moon clips....I played with 5 of them and was driving myself crazier!

:Fire::cbpour::redneck:

[Bill*]

Thanks to all of you for your thoughts!! I think XR650 wins the kewpie doll as I have other cases that exactly match the rounds in his photo. In fact the round on the right is absolutely Identical to my poor picture. I guess it's time to melt down 7-8 hundred boolits and repour with a new mold. Boy, am I happy I didn't load them yet. :-D
Thanks again to all who contributed for me. Regards......Bill

[Echo]

Well, I don't know about melting down all those lovingly prepared boolits. I agree with EDK, but in a different manner. IMHO - your magazines are riding too high in the frame, causing the ejecting round to drag on the top magazine round. I'm not blaming the magazines, I'm blaming the gun. When seated, are the magazines flush with the grip frame bottom? I don't know how one would go about correcting the situation if it exists, other than returning to the maker.

[Bill*]

Well...Just ordered a 230 gr. TC mold from Midway. Wish I asked you folks last week- then it would have gone in with the factory crimp die order. Oh well!!! .....Bill

[colbyjack]

id call springfield armory. i shoot with team springfield all the time in IPSC matches. there customer service is top notch. they shoot XD's and 1911's in IPSC they all shoot reloads too. if there is a problem they will fix it. if you tell them whats up be honest and tell them what your shooting in there. id even ship them some ammo UPS to them with the gun or over nite the gun and UPS them a box of 50 so they can see it them selves. dont clean it, ship them the bad ones too so they can see. there smiths and custome shop will have it shooting what ever you want. they will make it right. they have the best customer service in the game. good luck sorry i have nothing to add besides have them take care of it for you. -chris

[Bill*]

EasyEd: Yes, the mags seat flush. I think if it were the mags I would have the same problem with the Berrys plated but I've shot over 1500 of them without this occuring even once. I'm hoping the TC design will cure it.Straight-shooters post above mentions Spring/Arm doesn't recommend SWCs in the XD line. I guess that's why. ...Bill

[Bill*]

Colbyjack; Thanks-that will be my next step after trying the TC mold.....Bill

[gray wolf]

Sorry you are having the problem.
If your pistol should not use SWC without a tweek from S-F. find out what the tweek is. Or send it back to them for a remedy. No cost to you, they will send you a shipping label and you can call for a pick up or take it to a fed. x depot.
They are top notch and I have gotten pistols back from them in a week.
You said you are having feeding problems correct? and then we drifted to extraction problems as to the cause of the mark on the case and head.
If there is a extraction thing going on I would think that is separate from the feeding problem. Or I might say that a little mark even though it should not be there should not cause the pistol not to feed--unless it is really deforming the case and or the bullet.
You have said that other bullets feed fine and there is no problem.
? are the other bullets the same shape as the ones with the problem?
That bullet looks very short in the head and the shape is not very friendly to feeding in all 45 acp's yes it may work in some.
I would not go after the feed ramp with any kind of grinder.
More 45's are turned into trash this way. The angles are very sensitive to screw up. I think you would have a better chance with a bullet more like the #68 in 200 grn. or the TC bullet. or better yet go with a true round nose for a 230 Grn. and be done with it. The tapper crimp die will not help this problem unless the bullets will not drop into your barrel ( with the barrel out of the gun. I do not use it for lead bullets anymore, I found they reduce the lead bullet and have given me leading ( under size bullet ). When you do crimp just remove the flare and perhaps J U S T a little more on the handle pressure. tapper crimp does nothing on a 45 for bullet hold.
Yes I would get rid of that shape bullet and I think you will have no problems.
I sent my pistol back to spring field for a feeding problem and now it feeds anything and I mean bullets so far out or so far in you would think a crazy person would try to use them. Not that I load crap bullets.
Sorry for the long post I am just trying to help.

GW.

[Cloudpeak]

I had occasional FTF problems with two different Lee 200 SWC bullet designs. The TL version and the regular version. They'd go several mags without a problem when practicing but it always seemed that, when shooting at our club's plate shoot, they'd FTF on a more regular basis.

I sold them and bought the Lyman 200 gr SWC 4 cavity mold (4526300V) and have fired several thousand rounds without a hitch. The Lyman design is a more accurate copy of the H&G 68 than either of the two Lee designs.

Cloudpeak

Penns bullet on left (identical to the Lyman 200 gr. SWC) and Lee 200 SWC on right.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v620/WyoBob/Guns/DSCN1442.jpg

[Bill*]

"Awrite!!!"....Get to smoke out some mosquitos when I remelt the SWCs with Alox. Gonna make new ingots (outside) and wait for the TC mold to arrive. Then it's phase II with the new boolits. I'll check back in a few weeks with a progress report, but after seeing the photo XR650 posted, I'm pretty sure he's got the cure for me--that photo is EXACTLY like three of my boolits. You all are very helpful- I appreciate it greatly. Regards.....Bill

PS gray wolf; I wont touch the dremel...I promise:rolleyes:

[Y2K]

I don't have an XD, but with Series 80 set up for 400 Corbon, I had to push the oal out to the point that they barely fitted in the mags. About 3/32 of an inch out of the case with the shoulder. Yes this was with Lee SWC .40 155 gr, and not .45. but it may save you remelting all those boolits.

[randyrat]

Have you tried to seating them out a little more it may help. Flush with the shoulder seams too deep to me (without any measurements) I skim read this thread and couldn't find any suggestion on this. It worked for me and my XD40.... Mine was a little touchy on depth/seating the bullet. I got mine to work perfect with TL 180 gr TC design, once i found the sweet spot/ perfect seating depth. Check your mags some have little gremlins that cause problems also.

[xr650]

Bill
DO NOT MELT THEM BOOLITS!

When I found this problem my wife told me I would have to buy a new pistol that would shoot them.
I love her lots. :mrgreen:

[Bill*]

WOW....Don't blame ya!!!:-D