Need help. 45/70

[sfbandit]

I'm looking to buy either the cva hunter in 45/70 or the new Henry single shot rifle in 45/70. I've decided on the lee 405 mold as there is data for it in my Lyman cast bullet handbook 4th edition and my Richard Lee Book. It is basically broken up into 3 sections.
Lyman.
1st is for 1873 Springfield
2nd is for 1886 Winchester & 1895 marlin only
3rd is for Ruger #1 and #3 only

The third section is the only one that says anything about single shot rifles but doesn't directly say that it's ok to use data from that section. It just mentioned that some load exceed sammi but would be ok.

The Richard Lee book
1st all guns in good condition
2nd do not use for trap door or rolling block arms
3rd only for modern bolt action or Ruger single shot arms

Does anyone here load for this caliber in a single shot. I'm leaning towards the Henry single shot but haven't ruled out the cva. The Henry looks to be a better rifle.
Thanks, Nelson

[trails4u]

First and foremost, I would pick the rifle you like.....and then worry about the mould and accompanying load. Moulds and bullets are cheap, and easily sold/traded/remelted. But a good fitting rifle that you like and have confidence in is a way better place to start! Load data is plentiful, and you're in a great place to start your journey. There is a wealth of info. here, and great people who are more that willing to help. Don't let limited data be your defining factor in choosing a rifle!

[aspangler]

Try 25 grains of 2400 under that Lee 405 for 1450 fps. Upper trapdoor level but enough to kill most anything in North America. Also very accurate. Just my 2 cents. BTW Thats what I use in my bolt gun and it just works.

[runfiverun]

25 grs will get your attention in a 7 lb rifle.
22-24 is a little more manageable.

[Wayne Smith]

Again, chose your rifle. Then let recoil and your ability to stand it (different for everyone) determine the level of loading. Usually the gun is capable of way more than your shoulder!

[NSB]

I own and shoot several 45-70 rifles. A few years ago after a lifetime of shooting I found single shot rifles as my most enjoyable means of shooting. I just got a new barrel for my TC Encore and took it out yesterday to shoot some "mild" Trapdoor loads. The gun weighs about five and a half lbs. Tell you what, even the lightest Trapdoor loads will get your attention in a gun that light. I loaded ten batches of five shots each to try to see what the gun liked best. I still don't know the answer to that question, because after twenty shots I found out what I don't like the most......abusive recoil. I did find some decent loads and I'll do the rest this coming weekend to see where I end up. I will tell you for a fact that every pound you add on to what ever gun you buy will increase your enjoyment in shooting it. My High Wall and Sharps both allow me to shoot all the Trapdoor loads I want any day I want to. Not unpleasant at all. I have always found that the bullets that shoot the best are 400 grains and up. However, if you're going to use it for deer hunting you can get some pretty decent loads for that purpose at 300 grain and that extra hundred grains less makes the gun a lot more fun also. One really good load has already been mentioned, and that's the 2400 powder load. I'll offer another great powder with this caliber and that's 5744 powder. One of my better loads yesterday was with a 300g Remington JHP and a light charge of 5444. Very accurate and not unbearable at all to shoot. It pushes the 300g bullet at around 1500fps and that's enough to put any whitetail down in short order. Just a though on the Henry...they have what is probably the best customer service and support in the industry. I'm not knocking anyone else's guns, I'm just saying that Henry is immediately responsive to any issues and take immediate action to make it right. Good luck.

[Rattlesnake Charlie]

The 3rd section of most manuals with .45-70 data is for rifles capable of handling high pressure loads, like you would see in .458 Winchester.

If you are like me, I suspect you will get your fill -- and some thrills -- using data from section 1. I tried some from the middle of section 2 in my 1895 Marlin, and pulled the rest as recoil was quite stiff. I tend to stay with the upper area of section 1 - Trapdoor data. Plenty of power while still fun to shoot in my Sharps replica. Still exciting in the lighter weight Marlin.

[Duckiller]

When I got my Marlin 45/70 I got two lee molds,330 & 405. Both are fun to shoot over minimum charges of Trail Boss. For larger animals I use 5744. Black powder loads in trap doors killed lots of bison. Are you shooting something bigger than a bison?

[Digital Dan]

The buffalo spirits whisper that a case full of Lord Black and an ounce or so of lead was more than they could tolerate.

[wv109323]

I shot 22.0 gns. Of 2400 behind a 325 gn. Cast boolit yesterday. The gun was a Marlin 1895. That was about all that was comfortable to shoot in that gun.

[kungfustyle]

I had a CVA Scout in 45-70, had. I wanted to shoot a plane based bullet and the 500 gainers did ok 2 inches or so at 100 yards. The gun shot better the faster I ran the projectile. I had three molds at the time for 45-70 and didn't want to buy anymore, all were plane based. I wasn't happy with the cast in 400 or 500g it seemed to want to go to the 300 grain molds with a gas check that was the next step, however, I got the gun to shoot plane based bullets and didn't want to got that rout. Bottom line get the gun, slug the bbl and then get the mold.

[gwpercle]

Henry Single Shot , steel framed , 45-70....winner winner chicken dinner !

I'm a sucker for single shot's. Never could afford a Ruger #1 or Sharps...but that sweet looking little Henry might be affordable.

[buckshotshoey]

All above is good advice. But especially the one about get the rifle and slug the bore FIRST!
Then buy the correct size mould to get a perfect fit. You will save yourself time and money guaranteed.

I have heard lots of good about the cva. And the price is right. But i THINK its is lighter then the Henry and might be more uncomfortable in the recoil dept.

Another point to think about..... when I bought my Henry, I accepted the fact it will get some "character marks" on it when afield. But i HAD to have it. If you are concerned about this, stick with the CVA.

Also remember shooting from the bench will always give you more uncomfortable recoil. Shoot a load under field conditions before you make your final choice.

What do you intend to hunt? If Whitetail, i concur with above poster. 300 gr to 350 grain at around 1400 to 1500 fps fits the bill. UNLESS......your particular firearm doesn't shoot them well and likes a heavier boolit. I doubt this will be the case.

My recipe.......
50 gr Varget
CCI LR
STARLINE brass
325 gr RCBS plain base (actually weighs about 340 gr using wheel weights).
Edit.... I also use Satins lube.

Recoil in between a 12 ga and 16 ga in a Henry lever action. Sweet.

[tinhorn97062]

I’ve been from mild to wild in my Marlin. I used to have a Handi in .45-70 and found it could take wayyy more of a load than my shoulder could. Then, and now, my general purpose load is the Lee 457-340, which weighs 355 with my blend. I shoot it with 44gr IMR 3031, and it’s accurate and hard hitting. My heavy load is an RCBS 45-500 FN, weighing 535gr. I shoot that over 38gr H4198. Frankly, if anything got back up after either of those loads to the boiler room, I’d be surprised.

A nice light load is that same 355gr boolits over 15gr Trailboss, clocking around 1100fps. Accurate, easy on the shoulder, and cheap to shoot!

[Edward]

10-12 grains Unique under that boolit will kill most anything you are hunting and easy on the shoulder (Yours not the deer)

[country gent]

rifle weight makes and stock desighn makes a big difference in "felt" recoil. A buddy had a roller that went 9 lbs and the comfortable load (62 grns 2f OE 500gn bullet for 1200 fps) in my 12 1/2 lb sharps was brutal in that rifle. In a hunting weight rifle of 8-9 lbs the hotter loads are going to get stiff quick. But a 300-400 grn bulet at 1250 fps will take any game on this continent with ease.

[bstone5]

Have a H&R Handi rifle with a 45-70 barrel. Load with Trail Boss for light loads. The bullets are at a about the same speed you can throw rocks. Lots of fun too shoot and a mild recoil. Shoot with some Williams peep sights. Have killed wild hogs with the load, a well place shot drops them where they stand.

[Wayne Smith]

If you cast look at the Lyman 457125 Gould HP. It has become my all time favorite in two 45-70's.

[725]

The .45-70 is an easy round to load. So many combos work very well. I've done mild to wild and quickly came back to mild. Have hunted bear, deer, & wild boar with the cartridge and I'll never go hot again. Everything fell quickly & humanely with trapdoor level loads. I'm sure your experience will be the same. Enjoy your new rifle. That 405 gr. boolit is a standard, but in my world I considerate on the heavy side. Have shot 500's, 535's, and my favorite 420 gr boolit, but when it come to shooting and hunting I've moved over to the 330's & 300's. The RD boolit design is a top shelf performer.

[JonB_in_Glencoe]

There have been some good common sense info posted so far. Before I'd proceed to load "Ruger" loads in a CVA or Henry, I'd contact the manufacturers or search their websites for MAX specs...but I doubt they will provide that online?

[Victor N TN]

Personally, I save the 2400 for my 44 mags. I prefer IMR 3031 for the 45/70 and 405s. Of the 2 molds I have, I like the NOE 405 the best.