1886 OAL for reloads- trouble feeding rounds

[TonyD]

I am having some trouble loading rounds into my new Pedersoli 1886.

My 300gr rounds load fine and there is no issue there.

Its the 405gr reloads I am having trouble with.

I have tried 405gr cast bullets and the commercial PPU 405gr 45-70 rounds (I put them thru the Lee commercial crimper first) and they both stop as the projectile enters the chamber and I have to back off on the lever and push the round home by hand.

Any advice on OAL or is there possibly another problem?

My current OAL are- 300gr- 2.37- 405gr- 2.54 and the PPU ammo is 2.53.

[pietro]

.

It looks like your problem isn't really feeding rounds (which is usually a lifter/carrier issue), it's chambering them.

The max cartridge OAL for a .45-70 Model 1886/86 with an issue chamber is 2.65" for any boolit - 2.88", if the chamber's modified by lengthening/deepening the short factory throat.

You issue with .405gr boolits sounds like the profile of the nose of the boolit you're using isn't compatible with your chamber's throat.

Translated, that means either the boolit style needs to be changed or the throat deepened - I'd deepen the throat, or farm the job out.
.

[NSB]

If your throat is made to SAAMI specs, it probably won't accept the profile of the 405g bullet. I own/owned several 45-70s that had this problem and ended up having the throats lengthened on them. They now work and shoot fine. A couple of years ago I bought two Pedersoli lever guns and had trouble with both of them feeding through the action,but both would feed into the chamber even with 405g bullets. I ended up getting rid of both of them for that reason. It sounds like the Pedersoli you have has a short throat. Both of my Winchester/Miroku guns had short throats and lengthening them caused no accuracy problems and they now chamber any bullet I try to use in them. A chamber cast will answer this question if you're unsure you want to just go ahead and lengthen the throat. Good luck

[Bad Ass Wallace]

These are 420gn Hensley & Gibbs boolits that feed from the magazine. Had the same problem initially then I applied a factory crimp, problem solved.

https://i.imgur.com/Pv5TKjU.jpg

[runfiverun]

my 86 needs the throat cut too.
your most likely engraving the boolit into the rifling, it stops because you need to snick the lever closed that last little bit, and it takes about double the effort on your part to make that happen.

[Bird]

Seat the bullets deeper, and adjust load accordingly. Just crimp lightly enough to remove any case bell at the mouth. Hornady has shorter brass used in their pointed bullet loads.

[TonyD]

Thanks all.

I will play with the loads first and then if all else fails it may be a visit to the local smith?

[runfiverun]

it's a common thing.
I worked around it with boolit design, but I'm okay with one boolit and one load in my rifle.

[hockeynick39]

I shoot this out of my Winchester 1886:
http://www.accuratemolds.com/bullet_detail.php?bullet=46-400M-D.png
I have some original W.R.A. brass and use Hornady brass as well. The Hornady and the W.R.A. brass are the same length. I also use an OAL of 2.550" with no feeding or chamber issues at all.

[hpbear101]

Are they hanging up just as they begin entering the chamber?


When you push them in by hand do they chamber all the way?

From your description it "sounds" like they hang up as they begin to enter the chamber and you can seat them by hand. If this is true then it is not your chamber dimensions. Check to see if the case is catching on the back of the chamber, also feel the back of the chamber and see if there is any burrs. Also if you cycle the action fast will it feed that way? If that works look at changing your crimp a bit. I like the Lee factory crimp die in a lot of cartridges but don't happen to have one for 45-70. Try the roll crimp from your seating die.

My thoughts on it anyhow!

Tom

[buckshotshoey]

Are they hanging up just as they begin entering the chamber?


When you push them in by hand do they chamber all the way?

From your description it "sounds" like they hang up as they begin to enter the chamber and you can seat them by hand. If this is true then it is not your chamber dimensions. Check to see if the case is catching on the back of the chamber, also feel the back of the chamber and see if there is any burrs. Also if you cycle the action fast will it feed that way? If that works look at changing your crimp a bit. I like the Lee factory crimp die in a lot of cartridges but don't happen to have one for 45-70. Try the roll crimp from your seating die.

My thoughts on it anyhow!

Tom

I was beginning to think I was the only one that caught that. If they push into the chamber by hand, it's not (probably not) a short throat issue. If it is a throat issue, it's feasible it could be caused by your crimp. I would also give the good ol roll crimp into the crimping groove a try before making any modifications of the chamber. And, as mentioned, a chamber cast certainly wouldn't hurt. Maybe a borescope or endoscope might reveal something.

[Greg G]

Just crimp lightly enough to remove any case bell at the mouth.

Couldn't that allow bullet setback on the rounds in the magazine when the gun is fired?

[Bird]

Couldn't that allow bullet setback on the rounds in the magazine when the gun is fired?

It can sometimes. I would not trust it with thumb seating on a neck that has not been resized. Generally, there is enough case neck tension to hold the bullet in place though. I use a crimp with low charges of pistol powder, as it helps a bit with consistancy. It should be tried and tested to make sure all is ok.

[osteodoc08]

It's needs to be throated. All my Miroku 1886s need or needed throating to work best with lead boolits