Crimping past the crimp groove?

[Tripplebeards]

My Ruger 77/44 magazine won't allow me to crimp where my crimp groove is. There is not enough room. I have my devistators loaded to 1.640" which is past the crimp groove. When I crimp should I be worried about distorting my boolit?

[robg]

The only way to find out is try a few for accuracy etc,shouldn't be a problem but work up load as pressure will be higher with boolits seated deeper.

[Tripplebeards]

203039

I loaded 7.5g of trail boss and 21g of h110 which is a starting load. So both should be way under pressured. I didn't want to get carried away with the crimp since the BH is 7.5 so I put a mild crimp on it to try.

203040

[jsizemore]

You could always trim the brass to fit.

[centershot]

This is where a Lee Factory Crimp Die should be used.

[Tripplebeards]

This is where a Lee Factory Crimp Die should be used.

What is the difference between the Lee factory crimp die and the rcbs carbide die I used to crimped it with?

I have a Lee factory crimp die in 35 rem..

[runfiverun]

no squishing the lead.....come on man.

just barely bump a roll crimp in place over a drive band or against the side of the boolit.
champher the case mouth first, or taper crimp.
I taper crimp 45 acp bullets in my 45 colt cases for my lever guns, roll over the front drive band of the 454424, and do the champher and bump with the old 454491 which was designed for black powder.
I could probably taper crimp the last one too but I been doing it that way for over 35 years now and I'm happy with it.

[osteodoc08]

You can crimp past a crimp groove so long as you're not on an ogive. I have to crimp past the crimp groove on some of my Keith's to get them to work. Try it and see how it goes. Be sure to evaluate for bullet pull and set back.

[Tripplebeards]

no squishing the lead.....come on man.

just barely bump a roll crimp in place over a drive band or against the side of the boolit.
champher the case mouth first, or taper crimp.
I taper crimp 45 acp bullets in my 45 colt cases for my lever guns, roll over the front drive band of the 454424, and do the champher and bump with the old 454491 which was designed for black powder.
I could probably taper crimp the last one too but I been doing it that way for over 35 years now and I'm happy with it.


I should be good then. I trimmed and chamfered all the brass before each and every loading. I put a light roll crimp in place but no taper. I taper my 450 Bushmaster which I like the taper look. I'll try my already rolled 44 rounds and if the crimp from my rcbs carbide won't hold or isn't accurate I will have to try the Lee. I tried doing both crimps on my 450bs and the extra budge from the roll after the taper caused feeding issues. These 44 rounds feed and function fine in my 77/44 magazine after the light roll. I'll have to see if they are accurate. I trimmed down some casings to shoot the FTX bullets and I bet they would work purfect with these longer cast boolits. I just don't want to have to cut my brass short if needed.

[Tripplebeards]

Here is how close it is to the crimp groove...203083

[runfiverun]

the crimp is just there to keep the boolit from moving when your moving the round into the chamber.
the neck tension does the real work.
a heavier crimp on super slow powders is just hanging on a little more. [barely]

I think what you got going on there will work no problem.

[buckshotshoey]

Measure your neck tension. If it's .002 to .0025, your good to go.

[Tripplebeards]

I had enough neck tension when seating the boolits that it felt like I didn't need to crimp. So the light crimp should work.

[mdi]

This is where a Lee Factory Crimp Die should be used.
The Lee Collet style FCD (as rifle collet crimp).

[Tripplebeards]

The Lee Collet style FCD (as rifle collet crimp).

Thanks, I ordered one off eBay for $18 shipped. It was Lee part number 90930 if I ordered it right. I'll give it a try. I read on lees site that it is powerful enough to form its own crimp groove. I will make sure to press lightly so I don't distort the boolit. I watched a few YouTube videos s, it Looks like it will give it a nice even crimp when applied properly. Is it as powerful as a roll crimp? If so I'll use this die exclusively for all my 44 mag loads since it looks to give a more even/consistent crimp. Any tips on how much crimp to use with this die? I remember trying my 35 rem collet crimp years ago and didn't get the hang of it. It looked like there wasn't a crimp....before YouTube days. I'll have to try it again.

[Tripplebeards]

Loaded up some 35 rems and j words I had laying around. 180g Speer hot cores with a cannalure to try out my Lee collet factory crimp die I forgot I bought back in the late 90's/early 00's. I only tried it once and then didn't crimp my rounds since they are shot out a lmt Ed Remington 7600 that didn't require a crimp as far as I thought? Never had an issue with it.

I loaded these up for my Marlin 336. It's a hot load of 38g of H322 that shoots MOA out of my lever so i wanted a heavy crimp. I might have over crimped? How did I do? I crimped, spun the bullet a quarter turn and crimped again to try and smooth out where the collet comes together.

Gives me practice when my 44 collet crimp die shows.
203216

I like how this crimp style dosent budge the case.

[runfiverun]

as long as you ain't damaging the bullet/boolit you can apply all the crimp you want.
the lee crimper thingy's will squish the jacket.
but they look alright.

[MT Chambers]

With the Lee die you don't need lube grooves, just squeeze the Sh?t out of it!

[Tripplebeards]

I chronied the 35 rem loads. They averaged 2300 fps. The 44 mag loads with h110 averaged 1575fps. Then I tried my 7.5g of trail boss. The first 5 shots averaged 963fps. Then I shot 2 more loads...one at 563 and one at 562fps!? I measured each individual load so I know the powder charge was not off. Could this be from an improper crimp or old powder? I dId have a primer not ignite. Could Weak primers be the cause? I was using federal match large pistol primers. I've had three or more of the same federals not ignite for me in the last week. Or even from.crushing the powder...don't know if I did.

[runfiverun]

I would suspect that batch of primers.
I generally see part of a box out of a brick give me grief when the issue pops up.
it's like I get 3-4 bad ones then nothing for 20 shots then 2-3 more then nothing for 50 rounds.

[Tripplebeards]

I think that collet crimp is going to be my goto crimp in most rounds now. I really like how even it crimped my 35 rem loads.

[Tripplebeards]

203568203569

My lee collet crimp die showed today. I loaded at 1.640". I lightly crimped and it made just a little ring around the case mouth. I felt it needed a little more crimp so I gave the die a quarter turn and the case lip rolled into the boolits crimp groove! It looks good to me and kinda looks like a more even roll crimp. I'm going to try a few tomorrow.


Thanks for everyone's help....again!


How did I do?

[buckshotshoey]

Let us know if it affects the case life at all. It looks in the picture like its possible. Looks like a double fold.

[Tripplebeards]

204031204032

Can't tell you on case life but they feed and function great in my 77/44. 7.5bh at 1575fps.

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