Casting and loading for "mild" recoil in .45ACP 1911

[second chance]

Hi everyone. I'm not new to reloading, but haven't done any reloading in a few years. The reason for the post is that my daughter (19) has shown an interest in my .45's. Shes not a big girl, but not "tiny" either. I just thought that maybe loading target loads might make it easier for her to overcome the 'jitters" and flinching that comes with the max load factory ball ammo.
Also I'd like to cast bullets, to off set the cost, of all that practice shooting that will be necessary. I have most of the needed casting equipment, but I don't have any .45ACP molds yet.
I'm leaning towards using the Hi Tech coatings, so I would like a bullet that works well with that. I know some are being made without lube channels for that purpose, but haven't seen any feedback from those. Any, and all help, would be appreciated. Thank you, Terry

[OS OK]

The best way I know of to fight flenching is to train with a revolver. Load the cylinder and withhold a couple rounds spaced apart by live rounds.
Let her shoot it and when she triggers over an empty cylinder she will see exactly what she is doing. She's fighting the recoil.
I can't imagine a better way to fight this reaction than to practice proper sight alignment and trigger control and focus on that.
After training like this it won't matter whether she shoots a revolver or an auto she will break this anticipation reaction. If and when it reoccurs, go back to the revolver and train more.
If you try to load soft loads in the auto you will eventually get down to where it doesn't cycle properly and then you'll have to start swapping out the springs...I'd rather get around all that.

[2ndAmendmentNut]

NOE probably offers some of the best molds that are in stock. If your 1911s are stock it will be simplest to stick with a round nose profile in the 200-230gr range.

Hi-Tech (or however it is spelled) does work, but the devil is in the details. I had inconsistent results with it and went back to traditional lubes. Lots of threads discussing Hi-Tech and the various methods. I'm sure it works, just haven't taken the time to get past the learning curve. If you want a toaster oven and a barely used container of Hi Tech powder PM and maybe we can work out a deal.

Clays or Bullseye are great powders for light loads that will still cycle the slide.


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[CraigOK]

I load 230 rn over clays @ 3.6 grains and its my wifes fav fun to shoot. Found that in a lot of places online and dropped down a bit and lpaded some up. It's pretty accurate too.

[DerekP Houston]

I download my rounds for my wife, I prefer the stout recoil for 4.7gr WST but 4.1gr still cycles the action enough for her. YMMV.

[second chance]

Good point OS, but i'm stuck with auto loaders at present. Thank you all for the replies. I've got 4 pounds of unique, and one pound each of 231 and Bullseye.

[Wayne Smith]

I use a 200gr boolit at about 800fps. Not a huge amount of recoil, not scary to shoot, and quite adequate for use.

[W.R.Buchanan]

The best way to get her shooting well is to send her to a professionally ran Shooting School.
I usually recommend Front Sight and they are supposed to be opening an east coast venue soon. www.frontsight.com

In a 4 day Defensive Pistol Class she will be taught everything she needs to know as to how to run and shoot any gun she shows up with. She will shoot @800 rounds over the 4 days and She will probably shoot a lot better than you do when she returns. Maybe you should go with her?

I personally would send her with a 9MM Glock for her first go round (rent one at the school) as that is the easiest and least complicated pistol to learn how to shoot and get the fundamentals in with.

After that she could work up to the 1911, and there is no woman with average sized hands that can't be taught to shoot a 1911 effectively with whatever ammo. She would just have to shoot a lot over a short period of time. Another 4 Day Defensive Pistol Class would take care of that.

As far as a mould, Lyman 452374 has been the goto .45 ACP mould for a real long time. That boolit with 5 grains of Bullseye will be easy to shoot and still make holes in the target.

I have been powder coating mine for some time now and they run flawlessly in my Glock 21 SF. almost no cleaning required for the barrel after shooting these.

That's my recommendation for getting the best training for her and keeping her interested in shooting. People that don't learn how to shoot correctly tend to not shoot as much and eventually loose interest. You've got to keep her shooting at least once a month or more if you can.

Randy

[fredj338]

You didn't say what 45, but if you want to run stock springs, then a 230gr bullet running about 700fps will run most guns & be soft shooting with faster powders. The softest shooting powder I have tried in 45acp is WST by quite a bit. I shoot a lot of 45acp, about 6K rounds a year in competition. IDPA requires a min power factor of 165, so a 200gr @ 825fps or 230gr @ 720fps. I feel the 230gr is a tiny bit softer shooting. These run in my stock spring 1911s.

[second chance]

I was thinking 9MM myself. But I don't own one of those, "yet". I have four 1911's in .45cal and a Glock 27 in .40 cal. I do have a friend that wants to sell a "like new" .40 cal full size Glock for reasonable, any thoughts on converting that to 9MM? How are Glocks with cast bullets? I still need all recommendations for the .45ACP though, because I'm setting up to cast for that, regardless of secondary calibers.

[second chance]

WR that's good advice. She has been shooting air pistols and rifles for years. and taking away the recoil, shes a very good shot now. Action shooting is a whole nuther animal. I'm thinking that should be addressed after she's 21 and can actually own a handgun. I know you can never start too young, but I think when she's ready for that level of training, she should be running her own gun

[Echo]

The best way I know of to fight flenching is to train with a revolver. Load the cylinder and withhold a couple rounds spaced apart by live rounds.
Let her shoot it and when she triggers over an empty cylinder she will see exactly what she is doing. She's fighting the recoil.
I can't imagine a better way to fight this reaction than to practice proper sight alignment and trigger control and focus on that.
After training like this it won't matter whether she shoots a revolver or an auto she will break this anticipation reaction. If and when it reoccurs, go back to the revolver and train more.
If you try to load soft loads in the auto you will eventually get down to where it doesn't cycle properly and then you'll have to start swapping out the springs...I'd rather get around all that.

It's called Ball & Dummy practice, and it is the best practice a shooter can do, even experienced shooters. And it can be done w/auto's - use two magazines, and do the loading yourself, so she doesn't know if there is a live round or not. Or she can do it by herself, if she can juggle the mags behind her back and seat the selected mag with her eyes closed.
As for boolits, there are many 45 swc molds out there. Standard target load of 3.5 grs BE under a 200-gr swc might work, or you might have to jack it up a tenth or two, for functioning. Check eBay for a used Lyman 452460 4-banger - complete with handles will still be less than $100, and will turn out good boolits.

[Jal5]

Don't rule out a Lee 230 RN tumble lube which will produce a good boolit too at minimal expense. Its very accurate and mild over BE

[acoop101]

If she is flinching get some snap caps and mix in some dummy rounds, you load the mags for her so she doesn't know where the dummies are

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[W.R.Buchanan]

I was thinking 9MM myself. But I don't own one of those, "yet". I have four 1911's in .45cal and a Glock 27 in .40 cal. I do have a friend that wants to sell a "like new" .40 cal full size Glock for reasonable, any thoughts on converting that to 9MM? How are Glocks with cast bullets? I still need all recommendations for the .45ACP though, because I'm setting up to cast for that, regardless of secondary calibers.

By changing the barrel on a G22 to a G17 barrel you can shoot 9MM. You might also have to use a 9MM magazine. It doesn't work the other way around. IE: you can't make a G17 into a G22,,, the bolt face isn't big enough to swallow the .40S&W rim.

This is why I bought a G23 for my bug out gun, so I can have a G19 barrel and use 9MM in a pinch.

The thing about the school was the main point. They can make her a shooter in less than a week. If she starts with a rented Glock she can always transition to a 1911 or whatever when she is ready to be an owner. But waiting just looses however many years until she is 21, the idea is to get her shooting as fast as possible, and get her fundamentals in ASAP. That's what you build on, and the simpler the gun the faster it takes place.

This stuff all takes time to learn as you are learning Muscle Memory and Fine Motor Skills, the sooner you start the better,,, as everything else is just a waste of precious time.

Randy

[jsizemore]

200 grain lswc H&G 68 or clone with 4gr of Be, 4.5gr of 231, or 5gr of Unique will have you @ 725fps. Real easy to shoot as long as a 1911 fits her hands.

[fredj338]

By changing the barrel on a G22 to a G17 barrel you can shoot 9MM. You might also have to use a 9MM magazine. It doesn't work the other way around. IE: you can't make a G17 into a G22,,, the bolt face isn't big enough to swallow the .40S&W rim.

This is why I bought a G23 for my bug out gun, so I can have a G19 barrel and use 9MM in a pinch.

Randy
Randy have you actually used stock Glock 9mm bbls in your 40s? My understanding is the hood dims are diff so conversion bbls are the proper way to go. I have done this with several Glock 40/357sigs with great success & 9mm mags of course.

[jcren]

+1 for the 200 swc. I have the Lee h&g 68 style, standard lube groove and powder coat it. 4 grains of red dot is cheap light practice, easily managed in a full size with standard springs. Also, sticking with such a common bullet profile ensures lots of support. There is literally books of info on loading this bullet.

[lablover]

I load a 200 gr Noe SWC H&G68 clone with 4.0 gr of Bullseye and let the Wife shoot..She looks at me and says, thats it..I expected more. That was last year and she can't put the thing down now. She's about 5 ft tall and a buck 30 soaking wet... I can't load and cast these things fast enough for her. You may have to drop a little spring weight....Maybe not

[reddog81]

Any .45 ACP mold and using a starting charge of powder is going to be relatively soft shooting.

The H&G 68 is extremely popular and as good a choice as any. A minimum charge of bullseye will produce results so light you'll wonder if your shooting 32 ACP rounds.

[bwframe]

4.3-4.5gr of Clay's under the 200gr 45 caliber bullet of your choice is a standard "power factor" USPSA competition loading. It is a soft shooting load that is more of a push than a whip, which keeps the front sight lower between shots. This load is shot by thousands of USPSA shooters every weekend. I have shot tens of thousands of these myself over the years.

Power Factor in 45ACP loading is roughly 75-80% of most factory loadings. Most guns run this load without fiddling with the factory springs. The icing on the cake with this Clay's load is that it is very clean compared to factory and a lot of other hand loads.

I shot mainly commercially bought molly coated LSWC's, but the commercially bought RN Hi Tech bullets I tried were fat. They ran OK, but unloading was often an issue because the standard 1.25 OAL put the bullets in the lands.

I would certainly test some LSWC's in your gun. Both of my 1911's ran them fine without gun modification. That might be a solution to the .001-.002 of coating you add to whatever boolit you cast.

[ROCKET]

200 grain lswc H&G 68 or clone with 4gr of Be, 4.5gr of 231, or 5gr of Unique will have you @ 725fps. Real easy to shoot as long as a 1911 fits her hands.

What he said ...

[6bg6ga]

Some don't either have the time or the money to go to a fancy shooting school. Shooting basics can be learned by anyone. Some of the best information so far was in post #2 of this thread. I highly suggest that she go thru the NRA course on shooting.

My wife tried to shoot 45 acp years ago with a Colt officers 1911 and I ended up with it. I finally let her progress at her rate and with the calibers SHE wanted to try instead of me suggesting something. She progressed from 380 to 9mm to 357 to 40 and then to 45acp. She has fired my 44mag desert Eagle and isn't afraid to try anything now. 45LC with full loads...no problem now and she isn't a big woman .

[S.B.]

Be careful! If you reduce the recoil impuse you, also, risk not having enough power to work the action of the slide?
Steve

[Hickok]

My loves and took ownership of my Ruger .22 Semi Auto pistol with a 4 inch barrel.

I tried her with 9mm, .38 Special, and a .380 Walther. Nothing suited her except that Ruger .22 pistol. My fingers get sore reloading mags when I take her shooting.

[second chance]

Thank you all! I tried to give her my Ruger MKII, and she said she wanted to shoot the "real" one. LOL And yes, i did explain the .22 was absolutely real. She originally wanted to shoot my .380 PPKS, but after I shot it about 20 rounds, the web of my hand was throbbing pretty good, so I told her that. I will definitely get a mold for the .45, and go from there. I realize the only real cure for flinching is shooting and more shooting. I just need to make it a little less costly. Randy, I do agree with professional training, I'll look into that. I know I will probably end up with more than one mold, any likes or dislikes for a flat nose/hollow point, preferably in 200 grain + - ? Thank you all, Terry

[bwframe]

I'd agree with the suggestion for training. I'd research and go local rather than send her out of state at least initially. You both might be surprised at what a relatively small training investment can achieve.

[S.B.]

Yes but, that's most .45 ACPs isn't it? Maybe I'm just insensitive? Favorite load is 5.9 of Win. 231 under a 200 gr swc.
Steve

[W.R.Buchanan]

QUOTE=6bg6ga;4132138]Some don't either have the time or the money to go to a fancy shooting school. Shooting basics can be learned by anyone. Some of the best information so far was in post #2 of this thread. I highly suggest that she go thru the NRA course on shooting.[/QUOTE]

You are correct that they can be learned by anyone, and so can everything else in life.

However we have schools that are supposed to be teaching our young people the Fundamentals of Everyday Living (IE: Reading Writing and Arithmetic) and it is painfully obvious that that doesn't always happen the way that was intended. Less so everyday.

There are all kinds of local "Instructors" and near me I can name off about 10 that I know personally. One out of the 10 actually knows what he is doing and the rest just took the NRA test, and passed it. The "one" was trained at Front Sight and has consistent good results and makes a good living training people who are looking to get their CCW permits, and some newbies as well. He sends all the Newbies to Front Sight after he teaches them which end of the gun the bullet comes out. I recommend him highly.

The reason why it is so important to get Intensive Professional Training at the beginning is because having the correct versions of the fundamentals embedded at the beginning circumvents having to break bad habits that were developed during poor training sessions, or at home doing what you thought they taught you.

I spent 5 years doing this only to slowly evolve into correct form IE: Stance, Grip, Sight Picture and Trigger Control. It took a while for me to duplicate what I was being taught.

The idea that a new person is going to totally understand all the fundamentals of Pistol Shooting taught in a 1 or 2 hour class maybe once a week is ludicrous. This takes lots of practice and that practice must be conducted correctly or you just get a sack of bad habits.

4, 8 hour days of intensive training and coaching done on a gradient scale so the student learns each key point, and then drills it, and then builds on those skills as more fundamentals are added. It must be done on a gradient so that the student doesn't get over whelmed with misunderstanding and give up. You also are coaching another person who is also coaching you. So both of you are working towards the same goal, and an instructor comes by often to watch and make sure you are doing it correctly. (both shooting and coaching)

The number of times you go over a given subject has a direct relationship to your eventual understanding of that subject. This applies to everything not just shooting.

In Alaska if you want to work for someone as a Bush Pilot, the first question they are going to ask you,,, "is how much Instructor Time you have?" This is because the more times you go over a subject while teaching it, the better you understand it yourself and the better Pilot you will be. The defining test is your ability to accurately tell/show someone else how to do something and have them actually duplicate what you said. IE: talking in plain English, physically demonstrating, and having the other person be able to do what you just explained.

Not what they "thought" you said!

The reason why I harp on professional training so much is because it works, and was not widely available 30-40 years ago. I have seen how it has improved my shooting from what I thought was pretty good, (turned out to be pretty abysmal) to relatively competent. If I had access to a school like Front Sight or Gunsite 40 years ago I'd be a top professional shooter now.

Another Example: My son bought a brand new C7 Z06 Corvette last year.($125K) This car has over 600 HP and is a friggin' rocket ship! He took me for a ride and literally scared the ship out of me. This car was so far above his driving abilities it was downright dangerous. However GM was kind enough to include a ticket to the Corvette Driving School in Pahrump NV.

First they went over the functions and operations of all the features of the cars, most of which he had no clue about, and then they played with them.

Then in the class room they taught the proper way to accelerate, brake, set up a corner and exit the corner.

Then they went out on the track with the company supplied Corvettes, and each instructor had 4 students in cars in line behind him. Each student would come to the front for 4-6 laps and the instructor who was in front was coaching the student thru his rear view mirror, while everyone else followed behind. By the time they were done with the first day each driver had 20 or so laps at speed under his belt.

On the second day they only drove, critiqued performance, and did repeated laps in the same way as done the day before except they were going progressively faster.

My son was lapping the 2+ mile course at 150MPH plus at the end of the second day, and is a pleasure to drive with now.

GM figured that it might be a good idea to teach people how to drive a High Performance Car so they didn't end up killing themselves in it, which would be bad PR. Good move.

Maybe Gun Manufacturers should think about doing the same thing?

No not Congress or elected officials mandating it, Totally voluntary on the part of the new owner.

There is a school for just about everything you can think of now. And that's a good thing.

All you have to do is use them, you'll the better if you do.

Randy

[bwframe]

We must be blessed to have quite a selection of good local trainers here. The one's with plenty of student references and their own published training resumes. Maybe Florida is similar to Indiana in that regard?

It certainly pays to research whether your potential trainer's sole experience is the NRA's certification or not. The NRA certification only trainers are pretty easy to spot around here, cause they don't have any clients, much less AARs from the classes they have taught.

[W.R.Buchanan]

We must be blessed to have quite a selection of good local trainers here. The one's with plenty of student references and their own published training resumes. Maybe Florida is similar to Indiana in that regard?

It certainly pays to research whether your potential trainer's sole experience is the NRA's certification or not. The NRA certification only trainers are pretty easy to spot around here, cause they don't have any clients, much less AARs from the classes they have taught.

Good point and you should always check the competence level of any instructor no matter what they are teaching before you sign up with them.

Plenty of people who "think they know," out there.

Only a few who actually do, and have the Mindset and Ability to share their knowledge in a way that actually promotes the discipline.

Beware the "Strict Disciplinarians." They are no fun at all.

Actus non Verba wins the day here.

Randy

[bwframe]

Good point and you should always check the competence level of any instructor no matter what they are teaching before you sign up with them.

Plenty of people who "think they know," out there.

Only a few who actually do, and have the Mindset and Ability to share their knowledge in a way that actually promotes the discipline.

Beware the "Strict Disciplinarians." They are no fun at all.

Actus non Verba wins the day here.

Randy

You are correct. There are some who just don't have the knowledge they should to be training. Consequently, there are some with a wealth of knowledge of all related subjects, that couldn't teach you to tie your shoes.

[Texas by God]

Light bullet at low velocity. In .45 ACP that can be 155 to 200 cast. Put in a "softball"recoil spring and load just enough Bullseye to maintain reliable function. IMO the 1911 is one of the easiest guns to learn to shoot well. I fired my first one at age 12 and was hooked from that point. My wife can't rack the slide on my .45 but hand it to her cocked and locked and she'll put seven rounds in a playing card at twenty feet. I just give her tips; this country gal could shoot when I met her!

[Texas by God]

Second Chance- I'm glad you mentioned the Walther PPK. All my life I wanted a PP in .32 ACP.
I got one and boy was it accurate. And well made and pretty. Problem was it was the meanest little thing to shoot I've owned. My bony hands may be at fault or the grip frame was wrong for me but I'd rather fire 50 full house .41 mags than 50 little bitty .32s in that PP. I had a 1922 FN .32 that I loved shooting so it's not the cartridge.
There. I've admitted it. Six foot two 200 lb man whooped by tiny pistol.
Best, Thomas.

[DerekP Houston]

Thank you all! I tried to give her my Ruger MKII, and she said she wanted to shoot the "real" one. LOL And yes, i did explain the .22 was absolutely real. She originally wanted to shoot my .380 PPKS, but after I shot it about 20 rounds, the web of my hand was throbbing pretty good, so I told her that. I will definitely get a mold for the .45, and go from there. I realize the only real cure for flinching is shooting and more shooting. I just need to make it a little less costly. Randy, I do agree with professional training, I'll look into that. I know I will probably end up with more than one mold, any likes or dislikes for a flat nose/hollow point, preferably in 200 grain + - ? Thank you all, Terry

I'd be happy to mail you some hg 68 to try out prior to purchasing the mold, shoot me a PM. I'll be casting some other stuff up this weekend and can do these as well.

[2wheelDuke]

I'm in agreement with the 200gr SWC crowd. A fairly light load of Bullseye, Win231, Clays, etc. will cycle a standard 1911 with no modifications and will be soft shooting and accurate.

[lablover]

I'd be happy to mail you some hg 68 to try out prior to purchasing the mold, shoot me a PM. I'll be casting some other stuff up this weekend and can do these as well.

I'd also be glad to pitch some in as well..Already lubed up and sized ready to go! Just PM if ya want some

[David2011]

My pet load for steel plates (not Steel Challenge; it's too slow) is 3.7 grains of WST with a 200 grain SWC. That gives a velocity in my gun of 645 fps. Depending on how slick your gun is you'll need an 8-10 pound recoil spring to cycle reliably. You might even want to go with 3.8-3.9 grains of WST. At 3.7 grains the cases land about 14"-18" off to the side. Recoil is unnoticeable.

[tazman]

My pet load for steel plates (not Steel Challenge; it's too slow) is 3.7 grains of WST with a 200 grain SWC. That gives a velocity in my gun of 645 fps. Depending on how slick your gun is you'll need an 8-10 pound recoil spring to cycle reliably. You might even want to go with 3.8-3.9 grains of WST. At 3.7 grains the cases land about 14"-18" off to the side. Recoil is unnoticeable.

I've been using 4.1 of WST under a 200 grain H&G 68 clone(LEE) with excellent results. While not unnoticeable, the recoil is low and the accuracy is excellent.

[DerekP Houston]

I've been using 4.1 of WST under a 200 grain H&G 68 clone(LEE) with excellent results. While not unnoticeable, the recoil is low and the accuracy is excellent.

I must've stolen my load data from you ;) that's the same I recommend for powder puff 45 acp. To me that load was less snappy than the factory 40 S&W.

[tazman]

You didn't steal it from me. I have only been using that load for about 4 months. I didn't have a 1911 45acp before then.

[6bg6ga]

Dispite my 55+ years of shooting I took an NRA course a year ago which was the "Basics of PISTOL Shooting" the book portion of the NRA instructor training class. Never got to do the shooting portion because the company I work for saw to it that I had to work. Still a goal when I retire this following spring. Dispite thinking that I knew everything like some here in this forum I still managed to learn a little.

Most guys I know took the class with the idea of the economic gains to be made. One needs to find a committed teacher and unfortuntely most are not. Having people being taught how to properly shoot by someone who is only in it for the money doesn't make much sense. Being taught by a bad teacher is worse than no schooling at all.

I'm still for starting out with small caliber guns and working up to the 1911. Worked for my wife and severl other women I have helped.

[second chance]

Second Chance- I'm glad you mentioned the Walther PPK. All my life I wanted a PP in .32 ACP.
I got one and boy was it accurate. And well made and pretty. Problem was it was the meanest little thing to shoot I've owned. My bony hands may be at fault or the grip frame was wrong for me but I'd rather fire 50 full house .41 mags than 50 little bitty .32s in that PP. I had a 1922 FN .32 that I loved shooting so it's not the cartridge.
There. I've admitted it. Six foot two 200 lb man whooped by tiny pistol.
Best, Thomas.

HaHA! I've had my .380 PPK for 25 years, and it has less rounds through it, than any I own, and for that very reason. That little gun is a beast, and it doesn't help that it has nothing to hold on to. I've never had a failure with it though.
Lots of very good advice here, and I thank you all. Thank You also to those who offered samples. I've been away from shooting for a while myself, and her enthusiasm has rekindled my desire to get back on a regular visit to the range. I'll check into the pistol training courses, I agree completely with the value of proper training, and it is much easier to learn the proper shooting method, than to unlearn bad ones. I read here quite a bit, and i'm proud to be a part of such a knowledgeable member base. Thank you all

[garym1a2]

This works with 4.2gr WST also.

200 grain lswc H&G 68 or clone with 4gr of Be, 4.5gr of 231, or 5gr of Unique will have you @ 725fps. Real easy to shoot as long as a 1911 fits her hands.

[Beau Cassidy]

4.2... 200gr SWC... a classic load... usually accurate and reliable. Just a no fuss load. Have shot many.

[garym1a2]

You can get police turn-in Gen3 G22 for $279 in Jax Fl. The G22 will take a 9mm conversion barrel and run well. My G22 and G35 both have conversion barrels.

I was thinking 9MM myself. But I don't own one of those, "yet". I have four 1911's in .45cal and a Glock 27 in .40 cal. I do have a friend that wants to sell a "like new" .40 cal full size Glock for reasonable, any thoughts on converting that to 9MM? How are Glocks with cast bullets? I still need all recommendations for the .45ACP though, because I'm setting up to cast for that, regardless of secondary calibers.

[second chance]

Thank you Gary, I'm guessing that's through JSO? I wonder what kind of hurdles, one would have to jump through, to buy a gun from the sheriffs office in Jax?

[jsizemore]

This works with 4.2gr WST also.

I posted those because the OP said he had those powders in hand. I shoot Promo cuz it's really cheap and my gun likes it. Smokes a bunch and the gun gets dirty but I've ran 2500 rounds through it before cleaning with nary a failure to feed/fire.

[S.B.]

As with most threads here, this has gone so far from the original post should be considered dead subject, now. If you'd like to talk about other things, start a new thread, please?
Steve

[Shiloh]

You can load the .45 ACP down so low that it will need softer recoil springs. Two of the Bullseye League shooters did that.
Just don't shoot full power loads without changing the springs. Both of these guy had dedicated guns to reduced loads.

Shiloh

[second chance]

Thank you all, I'm going to order an H&G 68 style mold from NOE, and I will probably be back with casting questions in a new thread. You all have given me plenty of info to start me in the right direction, and that's what I needed. Thanks again, Terry

[Rich/WIS]

I have a similar problem caused by arthritis, have been slowly working down in power in my 1911 so I can still do at least limited shooting. The Lee 200 gr works well for me but I modded it to remove the bevel base so it is less messy when lubed and it now drops at 190 grs. Backed by 3.5 grs of Bullseye and using a 14 # recoil spring and a 19# hammer spring it functions reliably and the recoil is in a range I can tolerate. Going to try dropping the load and using a lighter recoil spring but if all else fails it is usable now.

[second chance]

Yeah Rich, that's another valid reason for reduced recoil. I have stopped denying that the strength in my hands is not what it used to be. I have a bad form of arthritis(gout), and when those attacks occur, even airgun shooting is out. So all info will be adapted for my own shooting as well. Thank you, Terry

[bwframe]

Thank you all, I'm going to order an H&G 68 style mold from NOE, and I will probably be back with casting questions in a new thread. You all have given me plenty of info to start me in the right direction, and that's what I needed. Thanks again, Terry

Throw us up a link to your new thread so we can follow your journey. Maybe include some pics of your casting (PC'ing?) results and the loads you work up?

[W.R.Buchanan]

Second Chance: Take "Tart Cherry" for your gout. and squeeze a hand ball for your grip.

Randy

[6bg6ga]

Second Chance: Take "Tart Cherry" for your gout. and squeeze a hand ball for your grip.

Randy

Tart cherries, cherry juice, vinegar, and the rest of the so called cures don't do a thing. Been there done that. Lay off butter and rich foods and it will have an impact.

[David2011]

Wilson Combat used to offer a set of 1911 springs in a roll kit. Not sure if they still do but they were indispensable in setting up 1911s for light loads.

[mac266]

I load a 200 grain RNFP over 4.0 grains of Clays. This load is awesome in a 1911!

[Bama]

I use a 200gr boolit at about 800fps. Not a huge amount of recoil, not scary to shoot, and quite adequate for use.

+1 for the 200 gr. The HG 68 with WW231 is sweet shooting, reliable and very accurate

[second chance]

My 50th edition Lyman manual shows two similar Lyman lead bullets both weighing 200gr with 1 grain different starting loads. I bought cast bullets from two different sources both 200grain and Hytek coated, but both slightly different. example- one has lube channel and the other does not. How do I determine the starting grains for these? I haven't reloaded in about 22yrs, in fact, I just last night pulled my press out and mounted it and started cleaning it and removing surface rust. Today I'm checking and cleaning the dies.

[KMac]

I have a son that is very recoil shy. He does not like shooting even his 30-30 or the 300 blackout I built for him. Had to load some 125 grain mouse fart loads for him to shoot the 30-30 more than a few times at a setting or shoot subsonic loads in the 300 blackout. But he will shoot 230 grain hardball loads going 850 fps out of my Kimber all day long. I think it has more to do with setting and shooting the rifles and standing and shooting the 1911 more than anything. He also loves shooting my Ruger Blackhawk 45 Long Colt with 255 gr Cowboy loads going 850 fps. The Ruger shoots much softer with the cowboy loads than the 1911 does going the same fps and I did start him on that.

[6bg6ga]

My 50th edition Lyman manual shows two similar Lyman lead bullets both weighing 200gr with 1 grain different starting loads. I bought cast bullets from two different sources both 200grain and Hytek coated, but both slightly different. example- one has lube channel and the other does not. How do I determine the starting grains for these? I haven't reloaded in about 22yrs, in fact, I just last night pulled my press out and mounted it and started cleaning it and removing surface rust. Today I'm checking and cleaning the dies.

When loading cast bullets I simply look up the bullet weight and go from there. I don't start at max listed loads either but rather about 5 tenths or 1 grain under max. To me and others may not feel this way I don't worry about bullet shape just weight.

[reddog81]

Start with either load and see what works the best. I have Lyman #49 and it's got similar variances between probably the same bullets you are looking at. Worst case scenario is that the gun doesn't cycle automatically and you'll get some practice clearing jams.

One thing to note is that bullets without lube grooves will have more air space behind the bullet and therefore less pressure. Using the higher staring load would probably be just fine for those bullets.

45 ACP Has some load data that's all over the board. There are some real light loads out there and conversely some loads that really pack a punch. It's a really versatile round.

[second chance]

Thanks all for the input. I thought I was ready to start loading, but I can't find my large primer pick up tube, I'll have to order one. Family reunion next weekend, so It'll be a bit, dang it!