Thinking aout a Mini 14

[Thumbcocker]

Many years ago we had a mini 14. Mrs. Thumbcocker liked it for blasting water jugs and other fun. Never ran lead in it and never tried to make it a target gun. I am toying with getting another one since I hear that the accuracy has gotten much better over the years. I just can't warm up to the AR platform. I would like to load bolts for plinnking and general shooting because I try to load cast in everything we shoot, yup I'm persistent, Mrs. Thumbcocker uses another word starring with s but we disagree.
So what type of realistic boolit accuracy can I wring out of a current production standard mini 14? I have molds up to 72 grains but am open to buying a new mold.

Thanks

[Grmps]

What I like about the mini is it is one of the few non-commercial platforms that can safely shoot 556, it's durable and comes in stainless steel & polymer

[Texas by God]

I would love one of the new improved ones-especially if they reintrduced the 6.8SPC. They are darn expensive though.

[Hardcast416taylor]

Don`t know about current manf. mini`s gas port system for changing. I have a 2nd year made old model and was always having to go into the next county looking for my fired cases. I got a 3 piece port kit from Brownell`s that had different sized port holes for gas operation of the rifle. The factory port is basically a wide open port. I swapped it out for the smallest size port and now the cases drop about 5 feet away from me and the accuracy has shown a marked betterment.Robert

[thegatman]

The new ones are much more accurate. Modify the gas port and you are not chasing brass. Brass is also not dinged up. Very nice gun based on the Garand.

[flint45]

I have one of the early stainless steel guns always works, accuracy is minute of commie invader at 200 yards does every thing I ask of it but never shot cast in it .223 ammo was allways to cheap.But I think they are a solid gun just dont buy cheap mags get good ones.Paid $179.00 brand new for it on sale 1981 or 82.

[Loudenboomer]

I chose the Mini 30. I wore out a couple dodge cummins diesel pickups with the same ol ss mini 30 under the back seat. At the time I bought mine Russian 7.62X39 ammo was $77 PER 1000. I put in a wolf extra power spring kit and I was in business. Shot about every thing around the farm that needs shootin with cheap HP ammo. For more serious shooting I have the Hornady Steel case SST ammo. See a patern here. The beauty of this and only auto is I don't pick up brass.

[RogerDat]

Durable as a sledge hammer but never known as a tack driver. Nice to shoot in .223/5.56 and I shoot cast. 70 grain from an NOE mold using Lyman #2 alloy +/- (homemade) with gas check and PC coating. Mine is pretty old and has the faster twist so it likes a heavy bullet. No problems so far with that. Using 24.5 grains of Varget it still throws brass a bit but at least keeps it mostly in same zip code as the shooter. Cycles down to 23 grains with that weight bullet and Varget.

I know some folks are into the high capacity mags and such but with 20 round or less it has a nice balance and isn't too awkward looking. Stick a 30 round magazine in it and the shape gets awkward looking. Works but look just seems "wrong" to me.

Barrel whip is something they are noted for, bull barrel models are reasonably expected to reduce that barrel end whipping around. More weight but reported to be more accurate. There are also a stiffening device that can be added, with some reporting more accuracy with it. Me I'm happy if 20 rounds end up all in the paper plate or 8 inch target using the peep sight. Which is a bit different and some have an adjustment period before it becomes natural. But my older eyes mostly like the peep site.

Hoot to shoot and price isn't too awful....

[Jeff Michel]

First three shots are right on the money. After that.......I have a .223 and a Mini 30 Tactical, the tactical is much more accurate than an older version that it replaced.

[Loudenboomer]

I've always considered this to be a short range platform. Part of the reason for the Mini 30. 6 moa red dot sight, commy ammo, off hand fast shooting are all minute of skunk. :) I've got plenty of precision guns this one doesn't have to be.

[Defender12]

I've always liked minis. Never owned one. But, i have shot a couple in the past,that friends have owned. If Ruger came out with a mini 14 that took M16 mags. And, a mini 30 that took AK mags. I would think alot harder about buying one.

[Thumbcocker]

How do they do with boolits?

[NyFirefighter357]

You can buy bulk .223 bullets FMJ, SP & a little more for HP for about $.07 each we've decided they are too cheap to spend the time, energy, alloy, lube and effort to cast them.

[sghart3578]

I really hope for Ruger's sake and for the shooting community at large that the new ones are as good as they say.

I had one in the 80's that was a certified ***. Pie plate accuracy at 50 yards. It almost cost me the valued friendship of a guy I have known forever. He was convinced the problems were with the operator, not the equipment. I sold it to him and he later said, half jokingly, that I had ripped him off.

As far as the barrel stiffeners and other aftermarket fixes my position is that no firearm should have to be re-engineered out of the box to get acceptable performance.

I have been kicking around the idea of trying another mini 14 so I have checked the forums. The newer ones seem to make people happy.

[Artful]

New model Mini-14's Average under 2 MOA per people that own them.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GIZALtOcMf0

[sghart3578]

Awesome!

Thank you Artful.

That is in line with the reviews I have been reading on other forums.

[woodbutcher]

:) Hi Artful.Nice video.Thanks for posting.Also liked the ending audio."The Thunderer"by John Phillip Sousa.
Good luck.Have fun.Be safe.
Leo

[Idaho Sharpshooter]

Can I talk you out of that? Compared to an AR the Mini is:

1. much more expensive
2. pretty much a fixed platform
3. needs the services of a gunsmith
4. an awful lot more accurate with a bit of tinkering

You can buy one AR and add uppers in about ten other calibers and barrel lengths from 16" to 30". We won't even talk about magazine cost and availability.

[shoot-n-lead]

I have had one for 3 decades...it is still coyote accurate for the first 3 shots...that is good enough for me. I have AR's, also...I just prefer the Mini...much easier for me to carry and quieter to handle in the woods than an AR.

[Thumbcocker]

I have an Essential Arms J15 in the A2 configuration that I bought before the Clinton assault ban. Supposedly with mostly Colt parts. Runs ok with boolits and with a scope does under 2" at 100 with J words. Just never warmed up to it. Maybe I should look at a Savage bolt gun and go happily on my way. Still have fond memories of the handiness of the Mini 14 and Mrs. Thumbcocker handled it well and loved the muzzle flash.

[Hardcast416taylor]

The barrel whip problem that RogerDat refers to has at least 2 ways to tame it down somewhat.

Accuracy Systems
accuracyinc1@Aol.com

Accu - Strut
Admin@accu-strut.com

The Accu - Strut is an installation that most people can handle.Robert

[Sur-shot]

This is the 180 serial number 1-10 twist Mini that I built, the group is pictured next to it. I did all of the work. The list of fixes is fairly long but not all of that complicated. Replacing the gas block with one that has a round clamp to fit a round barrel that was a big help, the factory block had an oblong hole when it clamped on the barrel. Pulling the barrel and re-crowning was not a big deal, glass bedding it like an M-14 was not real difficult, the trigger job was a big help and the John Mason 6 inch muzzle cover was an easy install.

The one thing about the Mini is, if you can get a round in the chamber it will fire. It makes a very reliable self defense carbine. I have killed a couple of wild hogs with it on my farm. Never shot cast out of mine though.
Ed

199360

[Der Gebirgsjager]

If you buy one, definitely do buy a new one. I was in love with them the day they appeared on the market and own two of the original 180-series. They have an active roller on the bolt lug that engages the operating rod. One of mine is cracked and looks like it will eventually split off the lug, but has not done so over several hundred rounds. Ruger will no longer work on the 180 series, and has no parts, so unless one can scrounge up another bolt with an intact roller the rifle isn't worth much. Later I acquired one with the redesigned bolt (also a redesigned bolt hold open device) in the 183 series. Highly inaccurate. I tried just about everything short of a National Match bedding job, but I'm pretty certain that wouldn't have helped either. I eventually solved the problem by mounting the Ultimak scope mounting system which is attached to the barrel, so where the barrel is pointed the bullet goes. It shoots very well now, but the system is kind of awkward both in handling and appearance. But, I kept it. A customer came in once with a Mini-30 that he had loaned to a "friend" who kept it for almost 2 years and fired lots of corrosive Chinese ammo in it. The barrel was totally ruined, resembling the inside of an old cast iron sewer pipe. I tried to get Ruger to sell me a replacement barrel but they would not do so, insisting that the rifle had to be returned to the factory. Ruger does not like other people working on their guns--probably liability sensitivity. Anyway, they performed the job expeditiously and only charged $80.00. Were I to buy one today it would positively be one of recent production, probably stainless. I have to agree that the 30 round mags aren't ascetically pleasing, but the 20 rounder is just right as it was on the M-14 rifle. Go for it!

[mold maker]

Definitely buy only quality mags. I wound up with 4 that didn't function.

[Petrol & Powder]

I cannot speak to the newer Mini-14's because I gave up on the older models.
I know people say the new ones are far more accurate and I'm sure they are right. However, Once bitten, twice shy. I had several Mini-14's and I wasn't impressed with the accuracy. I'm just done with them.

I will agree with Sur-shot, if you can get a round in the chamber it will fire. In fact, I never had problems with the rifles cycling. Couldn't hit anything with them but it would go bang every time.

One of the best self-loading 5.56 rifles I ever shot was a H&K G41. They are capable of full auto and are covered under the 1989 ban so good luck getting your hands on one now. When firing it in semi-auto I almost couldn't miss. It was a fantastic rifle !

Based on that, I would recommend one of the H&K 91 series ($$$$$$) or one of the clones (less $).

[Thumbcocker]

Update. We got a very good trade on a DPMS "Sweet 16" at the local gun pusher. Probably the best for our purposes all things considered. Thank you all for your input.

[W.R.Buchanan]

OK guys I do know something about this subject.

First the Mini 14 was designed as a replacement for the M1 carbine, but with a better cartridge,,, which it is.

The accuracy problems with Mini14's all stem from the gas system. Ruger made these guns this way so that they will cycle ANY AMMO Reliably. Thus they are typically bleeding more gas than needed to run with lots of ammo.

The Mini 14 Action is essentially a Garand action with the Op Rod of an M1 Carbine.

What happens when there is too much gas is the heavy block of steel on the op rod hits the front of the receiver pretty hard with every shot, thus repositioning the action in the stock with every shot. This is the root of the accuracy problems.

There are two fixes or this problem. One is an adjustable gas block (ASI makes a nice one) and the other more economical fix is to change the gas bushing that is in between the barrel and the gas block to one with a smaller hole. One with a .045-.050 hole in it will choke the gas bleed off down to a level that poops the brass out right next to you and lessens the hit to the receiver to almost nothing.

In addition a 1911 buffer pad in between the op rod and the receiver completes the fix and both of these together shouldn't cost you more than $15.

Now your gun should be 1.5" -2" at 100 yards with a scope mounted.

I chose to mount a Bushnell TRS 25 Red Dot on my gun as it doesn't weigh it down and destroy the handling like a big cumbersome scope would. I have used a 1-4X scope as well but it wouldn't do anything the red dot wouldn't do better.

The newest guns, (583 series) even in stock form are easily 3" guns. So at 300 yards they still have decent battlefield accuracy (3" at 100 is 9" at 300 and that is pie plate accuracy.)

I can easily hit at 8x10 steel plate every single time at 200 yards off a rest. 8/10 at 300 with the Red Dot, so the accuracy of this gun is more than sufficient for any realistic intended use. (Like the defensive usage like they were designed for.) They are not "Varmint Rifles" in the normal sense of the word, however they are totally capable of hitting a Coyote at 300 yards,,, as long as you are,,, and if you are maybe a little off,,, they still offer quick follow up shots. On Prairie Dogs maybe not so much, but inside 100 yards,,, sure.

I have talked about this a lot over at the Perfect Union Mini 14 Forum which is the goto place for all Mini14/30 information. http://www.perfectunion.com/vb/

Used in the proper context a Mini 14 with the proper mods is a joy to shoot, and they are as reliable as a Singer Sewing Machine as long as you only use Ruger Brand Magazines. don't bother with any after market mags, they will not work well. Sorry, been there done that too! Everybody from the Mini 14 world will tell you the same thing about the mags, and don't believe anyone who says different.

Here's a few pics of my 580 series gun made in 2005 it has a Grey Laminated Stock. You'll notice that I have the Bushnell Red Dot mounted and a Side mounted BPM Sling which allows cross body carry.

If you're considering a Mini 14 I would suggest getting a new 583 series Ranch Rifle or Tactical Rifle with the plastic stocks and in SS as they are completely weather proof. They are also a little lighter than my gun due to the stock.

Any way that's my .02 on the Mini 14, and good luck.

Randy

199419

199420

[Loudenboomer]

Buch you kinda got that whole Rambo thing goin on in the bottom picture :)

[Petrol & Powder]

I like the pens in the tee shirt pocket. Kinda says "I can take you with a crossword puzzle too" .

:kidding:

[sawinredneck]

Update. We got a very good trade on a DPMS "Sweet 16" at the local gun pusher. Probably the best for our purposes all things considered. Thank you all for your input.
That DPMS looks wicked, I can't wait to here the range report on it!

[W.R.Buchanan]

I am not a fat as that picture makes me look! Really! Remember the camera adds 15-20 lbs to you,,, right?

The whole idea is to see how the rifle hangs off the sling. I have several other pics taken the same day that show the gun across my back and in Standard "on the shoulder carry" or "African carry" with the muzzle down.

One of the other good things about a Mini 14 is that if you run out of ammo they make a damn nice club. Much better than any AR!

Randy

[Ricochet]

In the old days Ruger only sold 5 round mags to "civilians," and had 20 round mags for "law enforcement only." Most aftermarket mags won't snap into place. The only ones I have found to fit an early 180 series are USA brand. Ruger didn't make any claims of accuracy. They marketed it as "The World's Most Expensive Plinker." I've never been able to stay on a sheet of paper at 100 yards, but it's a lot of fun to blast things at pistol distance and would work for house and yard defense. I've always wondered why they were so inaccurate.

[Artful]

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v355/rowdyfisk/RugerMini-14556ScoutCarbine.jpg (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/rowdyfisk/media/RugerMini-14556ScoutCarbine.jpg.html)

Yeah , I find the camera adds about 50 pounds to me