newbie to casting bullets .

[pete.s]

Hi all.
I am a complete newbie to using cast bullets. I have the equipment but am trying to work out to make the lead harder. my lyman lubesize leaves a deformity in the nose when I use it. . What do you do to get the lead harder. I use Std grade roofing lead in the UK and add some lead free tin plumbers solder but I must be doing it wrong still.
Any guidance please folks.
Pete

[Echo]

Yo, Pete! Harder isn't always the answer. The nose punch in the Lyman (or any other) must closely conform to the shape of the nose of the boolit. If using a non-Lyman mold, it is possible to make do using epoxy to mold the nose of the punch to exactly conform to the shape of the boolit. You must, of course, use some sort of release agent on the boolit used in the molding process. I believe that process is given elsewhere on the forum, but it's simple. Put a dab of mixed up epoxy in the cavity of the nose punch, wipe some boolit loob, or other release agent, on the nose of a boolit to be sized, boolit goes into loob/sizer, lower the handle until contact is made, and go read the paper. Come back when the epoxy has set, and press on (after any necessary cleanup).
And what amount of Sn are you adding? And what cartridge will these boolits go into?

[mdi]

Welcome to the wonderful, oft confusing world of boolit casting. This forum has more info available dealing with bullet casting than any one place/site I've encountered. While I have only added tin and linotype to my lead to harden the alloy, I haven't found BHN as important as bullet to gun fit (there is a sub forum dealing with this subject; Lead and Lead Alloys). I'm sure some fellers here will add some insight to getting harder alloy. I wouldn't search for a harder alloy just to void marks left from the nose punch, rather I'd polish/reshape the punch or purchase the correct one that fits your bullet's profile.

I've seen this here many times; "The only way to learn to cast bullets, is to cast bullets"...

[runfiverun]

if it's just leaving a ring I wouldn't get too worked up.
your seating die when loading the round can leave one too.

you might just be bottoming out the boolit in the size die but still pushing on the handle a bit giving it all a little squish.

[pete.s]

Yo, Pete! Harder isn't always the answer. The nose punch in the Lyman (or any other) must closely conform to the shape of the nose of the boolit. If using a non-Lyman mold, it is possible to make do using epoxy to mold the nose of the punch to exactly conform to the shape of the boolit. You must, of course, use some sort of release agent on the boolit used in the molding process. I believe that process is given elsewhere on the forum, but it's simple. Put a dab of mixed up epoxy in the cavity of the nose punch, wipe some boolit loob, or other release agent, on the nose of a boolit to be sized, boolit goes into loob/sizer, lower the handle until contact is made, and go read the paper. Come back when the epoxy has set, and press on (after any necessary cleanup).
And what amount of Sn are you adding? And what cartridge will these boolits go into?
Loading for 308 I was told to add thick solder about 2 8th of an inch and around 1ft of it. interesting re the remoulding of the top punch. great idea.
the one I have was sold to me as the correct one for a 200gn lee mould round nosed boolit hope I have answered both of you. Thanks guys.

[Echo]

Loading for 308 I was told to add thick solder about 2 8th of an inch and around 1ft of it. interesting re the remoulding of the top punch. great idea.
the one I have was sold to me as the correct one for a 200gn lee mould round nosed boolit hope I have answered both of you. Thanks guys.
Eighth-inch lead free solder goes about 1 oz per 21 inches, or so I have determined. YMMV.

[Kraschenbirn]

Welcome aboard, Pete. Dunno what the hardness of 'Std grade roofing lead' might be in the UK but I treat the scrap roof flashing I get from my source here in the U.S. as, essentially, straight Pb. Cleaned, fluxed, and cast into ingots, hardness tests right at 8 Bhn. Adding tin in the form of lead-free solder isn't going to noticeably increase the hardness of your alloy but will improve the fill-out of your boolits. Again, I'm not familiar with what lead alloys might be readily available for 'hardeners' (linotype, automotive wheelweights, 'chilled' lead shot, etc.) in the UK but you'll need something containing a bit of antimony (Sb) to increase the hardness of your roofing lead.

Bill

[pete.s]

Thanks guys for the info. I will have to see what is available this side of the pond . Will get back to you all.

Pete

[runfiverun]

the Tin itself will add more hardness.
a mix of 20 lbs of roof lead and 1 lb of Tin will have the same BHN as ww alloy does.
it flows differently under pressure and such but it certainly is hard enough to shoot down a rifle barrel at 1900 fps.

[Oklahoma Rebel]

I personally like 20:1 and have been using it in my 45-70, but Run, its too soft for a 308 isn't it?

[Wayne Smith]

If the mold is a gas check mold then you might get away with running it in a 308 to, as Run said, about 18-1900fps. If it is a flat base mold I'd limit it to around 12-1300fps. That's with the alloy you have, roughly 20-1 Pb-Sn. If you find a way to add antimony and/or arsenic you can water drop it and run it faster.

[Digital Dan]

Pete, you would do well to review the info in this link, and for that matter, the other stickies in the forum. 99% of what a fella needs to know about casting bullets is found therein.

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?222520-Why-some-new-members-will-do-better-than-others-here

[runfiverun]

soft is relative.
fit is what makes up the difference.
my higher velocity [2400+] 30-30/308 alloy is ww's with soft lead mixed in at a 3-1 ratio.
that gives me about 2% antimony and about 3/4% tin with what I add back.
I use a long slow launch to keep the boolit in shape until it is in the barrel, then accelerate it along to speed.

RCBS uses 10-1 lead to tin for their rifle boolits but accelerate their loads with mostly faster powders.
changing the powder pressure timing can work in your favor with the softer alloys.

[pete.s]

going to try and get some Antimony and some tin and start adding that
Pete

[Blackwater]

Pete, this may not be what you want to hear, but really, there's no real way to learn to cast except casting. You can get good advice, and this is the best place in the world or on the 'net to get that, but even so, you still have to do it, observe the results closely, and learn to pay attention to all the things you think are "little things." Once you start watching those "little things," like alloy, alloy temp, mold temp, timing to cut sprue, etc., etc., etc., you'll wind up ultimately teaching yourself. If you know another caster, go watch him a couple of sessions. That should help.

It'll help a lot to read the Lyman Cast Bullet Handbook cover to cover, and really concentrate on the front section where they talk about the various factors involved. Casting is really a lot like cooking. Temp and ingredients and time all work together to create your final product. The ONE mistake that you can't afford to make is putting wet lead into an already molten pot of lead. The water will instantly vaporize, explosively, and blow lead all over the room, including on YOU! Other than that, casting is really very safe. Lead doesn't fume until it hits 1,000 degrees, and anybody who lets a pot get THAT hot isn't really a caster. Most of us are impatient while it comes up to casting temp.

The things that will help you most initially are a good 1,000 deg. thermometer, and they're only about $30 or so, and you really need one if you're going to learn quickly and minimize the "learning curve." Just remember mold temp, alloy, alloy temp, and pace (time to cut sprue), and you'll be casting really good bullets in no time. It's far from rocket science, but you DO need to pay attention to the "simple things." If I can cast, anyone ought to be able to cast! Sincerely!

Welcome to the club! You'll learn more and quicker about all aspects of shooting and ballistics and all the related sciences, than anyone who doesn't cast. It's a real win-win situation. It doesn't get any better than that. And if you're like me, the time spent casting will help keep ya' out'a jail, too! :mrgreen:

[pete.s]

Thanks Blackwater. I take all advice. I have the Lyman hand book and a thermometer have cast a few and adjusted my lee pot down on the heat scale. but re read the book yes I will and keep on trying till I hit the magic numbers I guess. good job I have some time on my hands.
Thanks,
pete

[Blackwater]

With an attitude and proceedures like that, you're gonna' be an "old hand" at it soon!

[Kraschenbirn]

Thanks Blackwater. I take all advice. I have the Lyman hand book and a thermometer have cast a few and adjusted my lee pot down on the heat scale. but re read the book yes I will and keep on trying till I hit the magic numbers I guess. good job I have some time on my hands.
Thanks,
pete

I get really warm feeling when a new guy writes something like this 'cause it says to me: (a) he ain't lookin' for 'instant gratification' and (b) he's willing to invest his labor to get it right. Good job, Pete...drag up a rock, plunk yourself down, and join the party.

Bill

[WHITETAIL]

#1 With what Bill just said!
Like the old saying goes,
Pay attention to the pennies and the
dollars will take care of themselves.:holysheep
Welcome to the forum>>>>>

[pete.s]

It is a gas check mold thankfully. but I am also trying out some pre cast 115gn heads as well but not had the chance to shoot them yet perhaps next week?