Is Dry-Firing A Muzzleloader Safe?

[Fiddleharp]

Is it safe to repeatedly dry-fire a muzzleloader? I've always practiced this way with all my other firearms with snap caps, but am wondering how this can be accomplished with a sidelock without damaging anything.

[Half Dog]

Good question. I can't give any input but others will chime in soon.

Can we include BP revolvers in your question ?

[swathdiver]

Safe? Yes, nobody is going to get hurt but your cone will eventually be flattened.

Get some of those ring caps, pull out the charge and let the hammer bash them up.

[Fiddleharp]

Pardon me, I'm sorta a newbie, but what is a ring cap?

[rfd]

Is it safe to repeatedly dry-fire a muzzleloader? I've always practiced this way with all my other firearms with snap caps, but am wondering how this can be accomplished with a sidelock without damaging anything.

depends on the type of ignition system ....

[Fiddleharp]

Mine is a Lyman Deerstalker percussion system. Not Flintlock.

[pietro]

.

FWIW, I've been cushioning my sidelock hammer/nipple interface by using the EASY button - a (replaceable) 1"x1-1/2" piece of scrap leather attached to the hammer's stem with a thong/shoelace, for over 45 years with N.P.

:mrgreen:



http://s26.postimg.org/4obx0g4qh/DSCN1905.jpg


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[Earlwb]

Normally you don't dry fire a percussion gun as the nipple gets all buggered up in short order. Or worse the hammer face gets buggered up. Using a piece of leather to place over the nipple works well like pietro stated. You could take a small piece or length of brass tubing and crimp one end and bend it over flat to slip over the nipple too. One could make a dummy percussion cap using some sheet brass too. But the brass wears out pretty fast so it might not be worth the effort. If you saved the used percussion caps, that didn't get destroyed, you can re-use them for dry firing. The piece of leather method works about the best.

[Oyeboten]

Is it safe to repeatedly dry-fire a muzzleloader? I've always practiced this way with all my other firearms with snap caps, but am wondering how this can be accomplished with a sidelock without damaging anything.

If it is Percussion, you can 'Dry Fire' by putting a Percussion Cap on the Nipple/Cone, and then fire.

You can cast up some Wax Balls, and shoot those indoors at varius Target objects or Paper Target, and it is pretty quiet and they shoot straight and will not hurt anything.

Otherwise, if no Cap is on, as others are relaying, it will likely damage the Nipple/Cone.

[Yodogsandman]

Don't dry fire after hunting for the season. There can be built up primer residue in the nipple from putting a cap on and off, say for the hunting season. Shouldn't be a safety issue if you've emptied the barrel first (shot off) the powder and projectile.

The nipple face does get peened from very little dry firing, depending on the brand. Sucks to find out that you can't get the cap on the nipple the next opening day. Not me but, I've been told by others that it happened to them.

[bubba.50]

get a piece of stiff neoprene gas line that will fit snug on the nipple & cut pieces a bit longer than the cone of the nipple & snap away.

[Ballistics in Scotland]

The nipple can become burred over, or even snapped off if the impact isn't dead straight. The Enfield muzzle-loaders used to have a little brass and leather device on a chain. Best of all, though, is a double set trigger, which you can dry-fire without the hammer moving at all.

A flintlock can be dry-fired with exactly the same effect on the flint and the frizzen as in normal shooting. I wouldn't do that often, or do it with the flint removed to prevent sparking, which might throw excessive stress on the hammer, mainspring or stirrup. A cap and ball revolver, on the other hand, should be quite safe if properly set up with the correct nipples. The hammer should strike the steel frame, just close enough to the nipple to pinch a percussion cap if it is there, but not strike the nipple if it isn't.

[Shawlerbrook]

Personally I'm not a fan of dry firing any gun although some probably disagree.

[Geezer in NH]

When you have a double set trigger just cock and fire the triggers. Don't need to cock the hammer.

Or get a small piece of vinyl tubing and slip it on the nipple and cock and fire away, it is not rocket science.

[GhostHawk]

Ring caps here in my .36 cap and ball. Works fine for 10-15 firings. When I start seeing the nipple ready to come through time to replace.

I don't know if I will ever fire that old girl again but I still have half a pound of powder and 30 some .375 round balls for it. No caps though.

I loved shooting that gun, but I think I keep it around to remind me of the cleaning chores afterwards.

I have considered getting a cartridge conversion cylinder for it, it would let me shoot that old girl.
Love the feel of it, just don't love spending all the time maintaining it.

[rfd]

wouldn't want to dry fire a caplock much, even if the nipple was protected. i have no problem dry firing a flintlock, though. :)

[Lead Fred]

Dry firing a flintlock with a rock in the jaws will break your jaw screw every time.
To dry fire a caplock, use a spent cap. My bud cuts a piece of eraser off a pencil and glues it into the cap.

[rfd]

Dry firing a flintlock with a rock in the jaws will break your jaw screw every time.
To dry fire a caplock, use a spent cap. My bud cuts a piece of eraser off a pencil and glues it into the cap.

"dry firing" a flintlock is done with flint and steel, only the pan powder is missing - this is no different than if the pan and barrel were loaded. each drop of the cock to the hammer steel will eat both flint and steel, however - there's no free lunch with flintlock "dry firing", something's gotta give, same as if the powder was added for real ignition. i see no reason for this action to break a jaw screw - this is the normal operation of flintlock ignition, only minus the powder part.

[Ballistics in Scotland]

Should it be necessary to say don't dry-fire a percussion gun when it is loaded with the cap missing? You probably won't strike a spark with hard steel on hard steel, but you need something better than probably in that situation.

[waksupi]

I use a small piece of wood for flinters. For caplocks, you may want to get in some fun practice, if you don't mind using caps. Set up some candles across the room, and snuff them with the cap blast. You may be surprised how far away you can snuff the flame.

[pugjunga123]

Often wondered about my flintlock. I never dry fired it. I'll do the wood thing for practice.

[jhickdog]

A piece of leather over the nipple or a piece of wood will suffice.


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[OverMax]

Never got into dry firing my B/P guns. As those I use have Set triggers. I find just setting and squeezing the trigger/s alone works for me. I don't think doing so hurts anything? but excessive cocking and dry firing on a nipple has to produce some wear & tear on something other than just the nipple alone.

If I really needed to dry fire a cocked lock. >Very sparingly done.< __Bubba 50s reply is how I would go about it.

[mooman76]

I don't dry fire mine either. I was taught not to many years ago and it kind of stuck. I'm not trying to judge anyone that does either. If you do it allot though I think I would pull the nipple and rig something to replace it with, something that would absorb the shock better.

[bedbugbilly]

Lead Fred - I'm curious about your stating that dry firing a flintlock with a flint in the jaw will break your jaw screw every time?

Whether there is powder in the pan or not - the action of the flintlock is the same. If you are breaking a jaw screw . . . then something is out of whack. Your flint shock be cushioned with either a leather or lead wrap and not setting tight against the jaw screw. When the cock falls, the flint hits the frizzed the same and with the same lock geometry whether the rifle is loaded or not. In over 50 years of shooting BP - both flint and percussion - I have never had a jaw screw break. I'm not a big fan of "dry firing" either a flint or a percussion rifle. It's a waste of flint. It's easier to learn the trigger pull by actually shooting.

Percussion rifles - or pistols/revolvers - it will peen the nipple and if done on a bare nipple, over a period of time it will damage the cup of the hammer. If a person feels they must dry fire - then cushion the nipple as already explained above. Again, though . . . the best way to "learn" your trigger pull is to practice and fire your rifle. If the rifle has set triggers - whether it be flint or percussion . . . you can practice by just setting the trigger . . . but also remember that each time you pull on that set trigger, it is striking the sear arm and over time, can peen the trigger and the sear . . . especially if there is a lot of distance that the trigger has to go before tripping the sear.

[Rick Hodges]

I just take a heavy rubber faucet washer...pre cartridge style. Put it over the nipple like a donut.

[Earlwb]

For flintlocks, I would be concerned with the flintlock frizzen getting its face case-hardening worn off when dry firing. Then it won't spark anymore. You then need to get it re-case-hardened again or replace it. In the old days the soldiers used to carry an extra frizzen in case theirs stopped sparking. You cannot leave the flint off as the screw will likely hit the frizzen then too. Maybe a piece of hard rubber shaped like a flint would be the way to go in this case.

[Col4570]

With Percussion guns I do not Dry Fire due to battering the Nipple and Hammer.I usually Dry Fire my Flintlocks to check if sparking prior to the first loading.Over the years I have seen several Percussion Hammers broken off at the Neck probably due to the extra stress of Dry Firing.The several ideas for cushioning the blow are good and would be a help when recreating actual firing conditions minus the ignition.

[Squeeze]

Why would you dry fire anything? I never understood this. How can the pro's outweigh the cons? Either go to the range and shoot, or dont. Dry firing a gun always seemed to make as much sense to me as sitting in the car in the driveway going vroom vroom and pretending to turn the wheel.

[Hickory]

Why would you dry fire anything? I never understood this. How can the pro's outweigh the cons? Either go to the range and shoot, or dont. Dry firing a gun always seemed to make as much sense to me as sitting in the car in the driveway going vroom vroom and pretending to turn the wheel.

Logic of this caliber is seldom seen or voiced.

[rfd]

"dry firing" is personally subjective thing.

on the plus side, it does provide the shooter's finger and brain with positive feedback for the unique trigger action and control of a unique trigger and firearm.

you can get that good brain/trigger training at the range by allowing the firearm to do what it's s'posed to do, and get positive feedback as the machine fires and you get to experience both recoil and noise. the down side *might* be yer wasting ammo in teaching yer brain and finger, there *may* be the associated dollar cost$ of getting to and using the range, and a time frame must be carved out in yer schedule to get to said range (unless yer range is in yer back yard :) ).

you can dry fire train that specific trigger/firearm whenever and wherever the urge strikes. in doing so, and in *some* cases you wear or possibly damage firearm parts, yer losing the real world sensations of shot control due to the lack of recoil and noise, and missing out the results of physical projectile placement on a target.

however, since most of this is personally subjective, yer choice will always be the correct route to take. ;)

[Col4570]

Why would you dry fire anything? I never understood this. How can the pro's outweigh the cons? Either go to the range and shoot, or dont. Dry firing a gun always seemed to make as much sense to me as sitting in the car in the driveway going vroom vroom and pretending to turn the wheel.
I agree those where my first thoughts but since the question was asked I offered my advise.Your logic is sound.

[Ballistics in Scotland]

Why would you dry fire anything? I never understood this. How can the pro's outweigh the cons? Either go to the range and shoot, or dont. Dry firing a gun always seemed to make as much sense to me as sitting in the car in the driveway going vroom vroom and pretending to turn the wheel.

Seems like seeing how the engine fires the day before an important trip is quite different.

You scrape away the striking surface of the frizzen every time you fire, though, and if it is case-hardened it makes sense to save that for real shooting. When people mentioned a piece of wood or rubber with a flintlock, I assumed it was the excellent idea of clamping it in the jaws and using it as a dummy flint.

[curator]

With a flintlock, simply make a wood "flint" to replace the real one and fire away. With a percussion gun, it is not good to let the hammer hit an unprotected cone/nipple. For these I recommend going to the hardware store and finding some "faucet washers" these are half-round with a hole through their centers. They fit right over your nipple and cushion the hammer blow to protect the nipple. Dry fire to your heart's desire. Do not remove the nipple/cone and dry fire as you will possibly damage your lock or stock.

[M-Tecs]

Why would you dry fire anything? I never understood this. How can the pro's outweigh the cons? Either go to the range and shoot, or dont. Dry firing a gun always seemed to make as much sense to me as sitting in the car in the driveway going vroom vroom and pretending to turn the wheel.

Dry fire practice is vital part of training for top level competitors simple because it develops you into a better shooter by ingraining proper position building and rebuilding, sight alignment, sight picture, focus, trigger release and calling the shot.


http://www.beingofservicerifle.com/dry-firing/

https://www.usna.edu/HPRT/_files/documents/Dry%20Fire.pdf

http://www.handgunsmag.com/personal-defense/how-dry-firing-can-make-you-a-better-shooter/

There are cons to dry firing some rim fires and old firearms. With firearms designed to be dry fired or when using proper snap caps there are only pro's to dry fire.

[Tatume]

Since someone asked to include percussion revolvers in this discussion, Ruger specifically advises that dry firing the Old Army is harmless to the gun.

[swathdiver]

Pardon me, I'm sorta a newbie, but what is a ring cap?

Those red caps that are arranged in a circle that are used with children's toy cap guns. Usually 6-8 caps form a ring and make their sixshooters go bang with flash and smoke for realism while they play cowboys and indians.

Dry firing practice allows one to develop good trigger habits without expending inordinate amounts of ammunition to create the proper muscle memory for accurate shooting and train out any flinching.

[bones92]

Dry-firing can be very helpful in practicing proper technique, particularly when getting to know the feel of a rifle or pistol.

I use short piece of clear fuel tubing, cut a bit long and slipped over the nipple. Keeps the nipple from getting flattened.

For flintlock, one can merely push the frizzen forward to get the feel for the trigger and action without wearing out the flint. You only get so many strikes out of a flint before you have to sharpen it.