the 45-70 @1700-1750fps

[Oklahoma Rebel]

I have been looking at 300ish-330gr loads for my 1895 that reach velocities of 1700+fps, assuming I have the proper fit, does anyone have experience with these loads, and particularly the brinell hardness it should be (these are plain base boolits)? my guess is 15bhn, but that is , a guess. thanks a lot, Travis

[fredj338]

I run 1600fps in my short Marlin GG, plain base, shoots decent. I have some PC that I want to try, see if accuracy gets a bit better.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v703/fredj338/DSC_0041.jpg (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/fredj338/media/DSC_0041.jpg.html)

[Oklahoma Rebel]

that looks pretty good, what is the hardness of your boolits for running that velocity. also what powder do you use? I use imr 4198. for 405gr boolits I use 31.2grs the lyman start load for the 330 gould express is 40 gr. which equals somewhere around 1730fps

[Oklahoma Rebel]

are your boolits running small in diameter? because that's the only reason I would think that powder coating would help accuracy. just wondering. thanks

[osteodoc08]

He has written down range scrap so I'd guess a BHN around 10 or so.

[Oklahoma Rebel]

are your boolits running small in diameter? because that's the only reason I would think that powder coating would help accuracy. just wondering. thanks also that looks like a lee boolit, but it is hp'ed, what is it?

[Oklahoma Rebel]

yeah, I just noticed that, didn't know what the first pic meant. do you have a suggested hardness for 1700+fps

[Oklahoma Rebel]

I don't remember were I saw a chart that had minimum hardness for each fps velocity ex. 1,00fps=8-10bhn

[osteodoc08]

I've always used WW with 1% tin added and lined with either Tac1/TacX/LBT blue and sized to 460 on a LAM 2. I've not ran over a chrony but have used max loads of Varget and Rx7 in the past which would put the velocity up there in all my cast loads from 350-420ish. Granted those were all GC designs though.

I say give it a try. However, max velocity certainly is not needed for meat getting or metal twanging

[daengmei]

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?41975-Application-Chart-for-Brinell-Ratings

[sfcairborne]

FredJ what Bullet mold is that and from whom. Good looking bullet

[runfiverun]

the plain base starts to pose issues at the higher velocity's you can push the window back with good sharp bases and such but you start fighting skidding and trailing edge failure when you get up much over 1600 fps.
sometimes over 1400 is rough depending on the boolits base.

[Oklahoma Rebel]

having a boolit of 14-15bhn wont help to keep away them gas checks?

[knifemaker]

My hunting load for my Marlin 1895 LTD-V 45/70 is a Ranch dog 350 RNFP with gas check with White label 2500 lube. Straight wheel weight with 1-2% tin added for fillout and sized to .460. Powder is 43 gr. of IMR-4198 for a velocity of around 1850 fps. will shoot 3 shot groups of 1 inch at 100 yards. Have taken 4 bison and one 220 lb hog with that load, all one shot kills. Only recovered one boolit in the bison and it expanded to 73 caliber after going though rib bone lungs and top of heart and ended up hitting far side leg bone. On the hog that was facing me at 80 yards, hit him on left side of neck and should junction, boolit tore up left lung and ended up in left side ham after traveling about 27 inches. Expanded to 70 caliber. Dropped the hog in his tracks.

[Oklahoma Rebel]

what does that extra 1-2% tin do for the hardness, with plain ww's being 12bhn??

[Wayne Smith]

That boolit is the Lyman 457125 Gould HP.

[Oklahoma Rebel]

seems like most of yall's 1895''s run at about 460, I mean boolit diameter, I am getting my 457 die bored out to 359, that way if it is still a little small I could polish it out to 460 with some compound or something. does that sound smart, I would slug my bore but I don't have a caliper that is accurate enough to measure it, all I know is that 457 is to small, at 50 yards it iis shooting 6 in" groups, but I can tell it is capable of much better. I am also going to go with harder boolits along with the dia. change

[knifemaker]

The 1-2% tin does not do hardly anything for hardness. What it does do is help for good fill out in the mold to prevent rounded shoulders. I know several guys who use 45/70 guide guns and everyone of them size to .460 for best accuracy and no problems with leading the bore. The bullet I use is a gas check design, if you use a plain base I would think about an alloy that will be around 15-16 for hardness if shooting at 1700-1900 fps. White label 2500 or BAC is a good lube to use for that velocity.

[TXGunNut]

My hunting load is the 350gr RD boolit with a gas check. I cast them from 50/50 and heat treat before adding 2 coats of LLA. My hunting load is probably 1700-1800 (can't recall chrono-ing it) so GC's and HT may not be necessary but my goal for this load is to put two big holes in any hog I might run across. So far, so good ;-). It's a bit much for our S TX whitetail but that's OK by me.

[Oklahoma Rebel]

yeah, I am about to mix a batch of lymans #2 especially for the high vel. 45-70's and also for my mosin nagant if I get around to getting a mold for it. #2 starts at 15, so that should be good,. but I can always heat treat it if I need it to be harder. might have some questions on how to raise the hardness just a couple bhn's in the future, not sure if I should lowe the oven temp or time?

[plainsman456]

I shoot a 325+- gas checked boolit,loaded with a stout charge of H-322.

I don't shoot many of them at that speed because the deer we hunt gets hurt to much.
And hogs say they don't like it either.

I size them to 460 and it likes it,lead is ww's and cores,with some 95/5 for good fill out.

I think that anything shot with this boolit going along behind 19.0 grains of Trail Boss will kill anything walking in the woods.

[ghh3rd]

My hunting load for my Marlin 1895 LTD-V 45/70 is a Ranch dog 350 RNFP with gas check with White label 2500 lube. Straight wheel weight with 1-2% tin added for fillout and sized to .460. Powder is 43 gr. of IMR-4198 for a velocity of around 1850 fps. will shoot 3 shot groups of 1 inch at 100 yards.

I also was lucky enough to obtain a Ranch dog 350 grain mold for my Marlin Guide Gun. My boolits wear gas checks, and I also size at .460.

It has been the only boolit in that weight range that I have used with that rifle, so I can't say whether it is that particular boolit, or just because of that particular weight ... but it has proven to be the most accurate boolit so far in my rifle with 1" groups @ 100 yds.

I have also been using the same load as knifemaker -- 43.0 gr of IMR-4198, but I am using Felix lube.

Randy

[fredj338]

I don't remember were I saw a chart that had minimum hardness for each fps velocity ex. 1,00fps=8-10bhn

Not so much about vel as pressures. The 45-70 is a low pressure rifle round. So I think for 1500-1700fps, clip ww hardness works fine. I think the range scrap is a bit soft by the over expansion. So water dropping that or adding some clip ww for my next test & then PC just because.

[Tackleberry41]

The 1895 may hold you back if it has the microgroove barrel. I can get a range scrap PC 390gr going 2200FPS in my H&R, bit bruising to do so. Thats a NOE gas check mold, a hollow point one, its 425gr without the HP. The Lee mold it replaced, it did not work so good. It was the 500gr spitzer. But was casting undersized, tumbling in flight, funny to hear a bullet that big tumbling. I leemented it, and got one driving band up to snuff, the middle one meh, the base one would need more work. I was cursing at it, said screw it just get a proper mold.

[45-70 Chevroner]

The boolits in the picture could also be the Lyman 457122 330 gr hollow point. I have that mold and the boolits look identical.

[Oklahoma Rebel]

I am melting a mix to make lyman's no.2 alloy as we speak. it's hardness is 15bhn before any hardening or quenching is done. I don't think I will need to do that for the 45-70 but maybe the 7.62x54R

[Oklahoma Rebel]

man I need a mic. to slug my barrel and measure its groove diameter! I figured going with the .459 is better than .460 because I can always try to lap out the last .001 myself if it is still too small.

[Oklahoma Rebel]

whats the best way to lap .001 out of the die? wooden dowel with sandpaper wrapped around it, some kind of compound on a cotton (or whatever it is) barrel cleaning attachment?

[runfiverun]

use a boolit as a lap it is already the right shape.
I use a star headed screw and pre-drill the base before starting the screw.
.001 takes about 20 seconds or so in a lyman mold, and aluminum is a lot quicker than steel.

[9.3X62AL]

I am lazy, so I have a "default setting" of 1400 FPS that I use to determine gas check use or avoidance--rifle or handgun. Above that velocity, it gets a gas check. Below it, I'll roll the bones with a well-fit bullet usually of 92/6/2 alloy. 9mm pistol bullets at 1225-1250 FPS do fine at .357", 32/20 rifle bullets are fine with a plain base to 1882 velocities (1275-1300 FPS). Ditto the 44/40.

[Oklahoma Rebel]

runfiverun, I am talking about a star sizing die, are you thinking of a mold?