Air cool or water drop,what do you do?

[CRA]

Just trying to gets general consensus of what you guys do for casting 9mm. I've only ever water cooled and didn't know what the majority did and why.

[DerekP Houston]

As I powder coat or hitek coat, all the benefits of water dropping are lost to me during the baking process. I split my tray down the middle by eye ball, left half is sprues right half is keeper bullets. Anything that looks off gets flicked over to the left to be remelted. Once the pile is too big I take a break and move it to mason jars until I coat it.

[dragon813gt]

Water drop for convenience of handling. If I'm casting in the winter I may forgo the water and let them air cool. But that's for a round like 45acp where you can get by w/ using a softer bullet.

[bangerjim]

I PC so I air cool everything now. Even B4 that, I always mixed my alloys for the hardness I wanted and never ever counted on any black-magic-voodoo water dropping hardness that shifts like crazy over time. If I wanted 14 I mixed for 14. I have gobs of alloys to adjust my mix and do not rely on the rapidly-vanishing COWW's everybody seems to have used for the past many decades.

Stick with PC and shoot 9-12 for just about everything!!!!!! 14 for sonic.

But do what you feel you must do.

banger

[tazman]

I water drop. I may not need the extra hardness but it doesn't hurt to have it.
I cast in a small space and water dropping makes handling the boolits much easier and faster.

[Scharfschuetze]

I've never found a need to water quench my cast boolits including the 9mm. It's personal preference I guess, but I enjoy fine accuracy and no leading without the extra step.

[bangerjim]

Please understand: I water drop all my fresh-cast boolits......just to cool them down. Once they are PC'd and cured at 400F all the hardness is totally gone. That is why I mix for hardness I want.

I do not like being burned by fresh hot boolits, so I drop all my castings direcly in a pan of water with a towel in it. That also allow me to use my time-proven temperature "sizzle" test to determine when my mold/alloy is too cold/hot. Works far better (and cheaper) than a PID controller.......it's called "THE HUMAN BRAIN"!!

Cast on!

banger

[runfiverun]

I don't water drop any pistol or revolver cartridge boolts.
I water drop almost all of my rifle boolits.

[shoot-n-lead]

I don't water drop any pistol or revolver cartridge boolts.
I water drop almost all of my rifle boolits.

Same here...

[6622729]

I water drop for the convenience and for the hardness. I'm casting for 9mm handgun and 300AAC rifle. I don't see water dropping as an added step.

[GhostHawk]

I'm with Runfive, however if I am seeing signs of trouble, patterns instead of groups, keyholing. I am likely to try a few water dropped with a touch more tin just to see if it makes a difference.

In most cases however it ends up size being king. So if my 9mm bullets keyhole and shoot patterns I try the same size only bigger. In fact I bought a Lee 6 cavity .38/,357 mold exactly for using in 9mm. (and for lowering lead costs in .357)

And after my trip to the range today, I can say it worked, 2 for 2.

Instead of keyholes I had all nice round holes. Instead of patterns I was getting 2 holes side by side. And the more I shot it the closer they came. I suppose it has to work that nasty dang copper fouling out.

And I was not taking it easy on them, these were my hottest 9mm yet at 4.5 grains of Red Dot under that 125 gr wide meplat round nose plain base. They were a touch more than I would want to shoot in a pistol often, unless I was in serious danger.

125gr L 4.5 gr Red Dot 1,145 fps 1.15" WSP
Those were air cooled, water drop is nice for instant handling, checking for issues with the mold.
Air drop is nice as they can still be quite warm when I tumble them with Ben's liquid Lube speeding the drying process. Some of those were loaded with not quite dried boolits.

I think the key here is adapt practices to fit needs.

[Mica_Hiebert]

I air cool as my alloy is a little harder than I prefer as it is and I intend on powder coating as well, even air cooled my bullets hardly deform when shot into fire wood rounds and retrieved.

[Oklahoma Rebel]

I drop in sawdust, no dents or dings, but also no extra hardness. if I need a harder boolit ill water drop,the sawdust allows them to cool slowly, kinda like putting them in an oven for an hour then letting them air cool

[Garyshome]

Water Drop

[kens]

I water drop everything. It does away with soft rags and handling of hot boolits.
Water drop all of it, if you want soft boolits, use soft lead, it dont get hard,
If you want hard boolits, use alloy'd lead.

[Johnch]

I water drop everything
But not because I need the extra hardness , as I powder coat at least 1/2 of my rifle bullets and close to that for the pistol bullets
For me it is quicker to drop the bullets into the water

I then dry them and size them as needed
Right now drying is putting several K of bullets in a 1/4" hardware cloth bottomed racks setting on concrete blocks next to the house
With the 90 degree days , I have dry bullets in a few hours ....if I remember to bring them in LOL

John

Not going to say my way is better , but it works for me

[sigep1764]

I water drop to hadle the boolits soon afterward. Then i dry them on a low setting in the toaster oven so i can run them through the lubesizer.

[imashooter2]

I water drop everything for the convenience of it, except for my 627 which leads like crazy when the boolits get too hard. Those I air cool by dropping them on a folded towel in a soda flat. When the towel gets too full, I just pick it up by an edge. The boolits roll off into the box and I lay the towel back on top of them and continue casting.

[jsizemore]

How long does it take to fish all the boolits from the water bucket and get them dry enough to run through the lubesizer or powdercoat?

[Loudy13]

Water drop I like being able to handle them right away

[bpatterson84]

How long does it take to fish all the boolits from the water bucket and get them dry enough to run through the lubesizer or powdercoat?

I also usually waterdrop, and how long does it take? Lol, the variables are infinite. How long to dry your rear end after a shower? A less sarcastic answer would be not long.

[runfiverun]

dump them out and put in front of a fan.
you'll want to get them sized asap though, especially if your sizing them down very much.
I usually size my water dropped stuff the next day.

[zubrato]

I water drop all my boolits, except for wadcutters. I like the extra bit of hardness where i push my bullets, or where I cut a little with pure lead to stretch my COWW. Just makes my life easier handling the things, but it's arguably better not having to worry about drops of water on your lead you may throw back into the pot (preheat lead before putting it in the pot!)
When I refill the pot, I take time to fish out the bullets, put them on a towel. I usually size the next day. Just leaving them out they're good to go in a few hours, unless the towel is drenched.

[rondog]

Interesting. I've always air cooled, but I'm still a noob at this casting stuff. I shall try the water dropping.

[quack1]

I air cool everything, rifle and pistol. If I need harder, I heat treat a bunch at once. I figure heating and quenching a bunch of bullets at once gives better consistency than water dropping individually.

[Yodogsandman]

I mostly air cool and then age harden most of my boolits for 3 weeks before shooting. I water drop 9mm pistol boolits because I'm using segregated SOWW and mystery scrap lead for an alloy. Lately, most of my rifle boolits are oven heat treated and quenched for a more consistent hardness and are used to shoot at higher velocities, over say 1800 FPS.

[DerekP Houston]

I air cool everything, rifle and pistol. If I need harder, I heat treat a bunch at once. I figure heating and quenching a bunch of bullets at once gives better consistency than water dropping individually.

You are probably correct in this regard, but how high do you heat them back up for the heat treatment? My understanding is the water dropped are around 600f+ when dropped, My oven only gets to around 450-500.

From my memories of watching knifes being made, consistency is key for heat treating. After the first batch or so my "cold" water is now luke warm and probably losing the benefits gained. I also am just lazy and didnt like having to worry about drying and cleaning them before I could pc/hitek coat them. To each their own.

[dragon813gt]

Everything you wanted to know about heat treating can be found here: http://www.lasc.us/heattreat.htm

Water dropping bullets directly from the mold is going to give you a fairly big difference in hardness between them. Especially if they don't drop freely every time. The question is, will the varying hardness matter for your application? For me, it doesn't. If I was shooting long range rifle bullets I'd want all the consistency I could get.

[gwpercle]

Air cool .
I don't like having to deal with the water and wet boolits. It only takes a few minutes for them to cool when dropped onto a soft pad. By the time I'm done casting , sit down and drink a bottle of water...they're cool !
Hardness is an overrated factor , boolits can be too hard for certain applications.

If I were going to harden boolits with heat , I would size them first , heat in the oven , quench in water then lube (without additional sizing) .

Gary

[imashooter2]

How long does it take to fish all the boolits from the water bucket and get them dry enough to run through the lubesizer or powdercoat?

I dump the bucket into an old colander to drain, then dump the colander onto an old bath towel. Grab the ends of the towel so the boolits sit in the center like a hammock. Roll them back and forth a couple times and you're good to go. That works for quantities up to a couple thousand at a time. Way less than 5 minutes.

[Bigslug]

Water drop. Had real problems initially with 9mm leading caused by the cases sizing down on seating to below proper diameter. Also ran into some tumbling problems in one gun. It all got better by going harder and using a .38 S&W sizer.

[StuBach]

Water drop for convenience. Like other I powder coat most rounds now so benefits are lost. Use the alloy calculator to get the hardness you want.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[zomby woof]

Air cool, heat treat if necessary.

[Victor N TN]

I started casting for 50 cal Hawken in the mid 1970s. Not really a high volume deal for me. A few hundred a year would be a generous number. Then I started shooting NRA Bullseye pistol. And in the early 1980s IPSC became popular and I added that. I ended up shooting over 1,000 rounds a month. And I was also casting for my best friend, our oldest daughter, and my brother. According to my logs, there were years when I cast almost 1,000 pounds of lead into mainly 230 grain H&G #34 for 45 acp and maybe 1/5th as many 158gr, Lyman 38 spl. I remember having to take breaks to re-hydrate while casting in the summer months.

But now I'm looking at casting rifle bullets. I have a new RCBS pot. And 8 new bullet molds. The last 3 NOE rifle bullets. The last was a 405 grain 45-70 4 cavity. I currently have 30 or 40 pounds of accumulated lead and lead allow. Now if my health will co-operate I would REALLY like to experiment with the newer processes including water quenching. Until now everything I've cast has been air dried.

I'll stop now. I just realized I've been rambling.

[mdi]

I started casting "pre-web" and didn't hear a lot about water quenching, as most info I had casters alloyed their lead to achieve the hardness needed. Plus I had a huge supply of wheel weights and my .44 Magnums just gobbled them up (started with a Lee 240 gr. T/L SWC). When sized correctly I never got any leading to speak of and never found a need for bullets over linotype hardness (an then rarely that), so all my cast bullets are air cooled. I haven't picked up a newly cast, hot bullet in many years...[smilie=1:

I use a folded towel, but I can't seem to get any dings/dents on my air cooled bullets. How do you fellers manage that?

[Shiloh]

Usually water drop.

If it is wet, it isn't hot.

Shiloh

[edwardware]

As I powder coat or hitek coat, all the benefits of water dropping are lost to me during the baking process.

I've had good success water dropping after the last PC or HiTek coat. Just remove from the oven, and drop in the bucket.

I water drop from casting because it improves quality by not deforming soft bullets.

[popper]

AC isocore is working fine for my 9 & 40. I used to quench but found I didn't need it, HiTekd or BLL. I add some As and WD ESPC for all rifle.

[leebuilder]

I water drop all, started casting and water dropping. I just find it easier. I tried sawdust and towels found sawdust most like water dropping. With a towel I got dings from handling them more.
I like the pssssst sound when the hot boolits hit the water, sounds like adventure.
Be well

[Geezer in NH]

Air cool all, by the time I deplete the 20 pound pot I need a break for coffee and a nap anyway.

[runfiverun]

you don't really heat the boolits up enough to temper them back down in 20 minutes.
you have to heat soak them at least a whole hour to get the benefit of oven quenching.

your boolits are coming from the mold at about 350-375f
that's why you get a higher BHN quenching from the oven at 400+

[Iowa Fox]

A C for me

[6bg6ga]

I've done both. With the large batches I make the last ting I want is bullets with water still on them when I size them.

[243winxb]

9's need hard BHN. Air with proper alloy or oven heat treat with 2% antimony.

[imashooter2]

Just trying to gets general consensus of what you guys do for casting 9mm. I've only ever water cooled and didn't know what the majority did and why.

And as usual, the consensus is that there is no consensus. :)

[jsizemore]

I air cool and heat treat anything that needs it. About half way through a pot of alloy I lift the edges of the boolit landing towel to make a pile at the edge. At the end of the casting session I have 2 distinct piles. I unplug the pot but leave the vent fan going. I scoop up the first pile of boolits and get to sizing before stasis hits my behind. By the time the first batch is done the remainder is cool enough to handle. I don't cast anything larger then 250gr so I can't say how this works for the big boys. I've found that sizing soon after casting makes sizing easier, especially with larger differences between as cast and final size, and final size is largest after aging (it ain't much but my Kart barrel notices).

[S.B.]

In the beginning of my casting I always just let them cool normally in air, now I water drop everything I cast.
Steve

[kenyerian]

I usually water drop.

[mdi]

And as usual, the consensus is that there is no consensus. :)
So true...

[catman81056]

I water drop everything. I keep a 5gal bucket 3/4 full next to my casting table with a bath towel zip tied to the top. I let 1/2 of the towel hang down in the water to act as a funnel/anti-splash landing pad. They hit the towel, roll into the water. I have an old aluminum colander in the bucket, when done casting just grab the handle and pull it out to drain.

[copdills]

I water drop all my pistol rds, shotgun rds I let air cool

[ohiomadman]

How long does it take to fish all the boolits from the water bucket and get them dry enough to run through the lubesizer or powdercoat?

I put an old T-shirt on the bucket with clothes pins with enough slack so it just goes into the bucket about 8 inches. I can scoop them out by hand or wad the T-shirt up with all the boolits in it.

[bangerjim]

9's need hard BHN. Air with proper alloy or oven heat treat with 2% antimony.


Or normal 10-12 with PC!

[DerekP Houston]

I put an old T-shirt on the bucket with clothes pins with enough slack so it just goes into the bucket about 8 inches. I can scoop them out by hand or wad the T-shirt up with all the boolits in it.


When i water drop for large batches (tray fills up too fast) I found a piece of styrofoam with an old t-shirt on it worked great. Always floated above the water line and the water wicked up in the shirt and kept anything from melting the styrofoam or burning the shirt. My only downside was it took me longer to find the cull bullets, as I typically take a break and look through the pile.

[white eagle]

Air cool everything never in that big of a hurry that I
need to pick up boolits as soon as I cast them

[Don Purcell]

When I water drop I use a 5 gallon bucket with a screen type waste paper basket that I found at Lowe's which fits nicely inside the bucket. When I have a good supply of bullets cast I'll lift the basket out of the bucket draining the water at the same time and dump them on some folded towels and then back into the bucket it goes and casting resumes while that batch dries.

[twc1964]

I used to water drop all my pistol boolits until I learned that my hardness was mostly lost after baking for pc. Now I just add a bit more antimony and air cool.

[Pumpkinheaver]

I have air cooled and water dropped my 9mm bullets, I can't tell a difference. I powder coat all my 9MMs as I shoot them mostly from Glocks.

[BNE]

I dump the bucket into an old colander to drain, then dump the colander onto an old bath towel. Grab the ends of the towel so the boolits sit in the center like a hammock. Roll them back and forth a couple times and you're good to go. That works for quantities up to a couple thousand at a time. Way less than 5 minutes.


Good idea.... That is more simple than what I do! I have done it both ways, but when I am water dropping, I use a towel in the bucket. I fold the towel and cut a hole in the bottom, so it acts like a funnel. This keeps the splash back low. I then put a plastic coffee container in the bottom of the bucket. The coffee container has holes drilled in it, so the water drains out when I lift it out.

[RP]

The way I spill stuff I air cool

[Walter Laich]

AC since all mine get PC afterwards.

[fatelvis]

I air cool them all

[gwpercle]

Just because it's a slow day at the office , I went back and counted all the votes so far, I might be off 1 or 2 but those that gave a simple air cool or water cool answer:

Air cooled.....26
Water cooled.....25

It's a toss up , I air cool because I don't like dealing with the water .

[Ken in Iowa]

AC

Since I'm still experimenting with lubes and sizing, I typically stockpile a lot of unsized Boolits

[abunaitoo]

Ever since I burnt my finger on a boolet I tried to pick up, I water drop.

[Shoot66]

Watter drop, not for hardness but convenience.

[clum553946]

I water drop as well, it's just easier for me!

[flyingrhino]

Water drop just to protect the bullet. I PC so the hardness benefit of water dropping is lost there. Air dropping them seems to cause more deformities when I'm running a hot mold.

[Aunegl]

I water drop all cast bullets. Then cull and size within 24 hours.

[gnostic]

Water drop for rifle and high pressure handguns, 9mm and magnums and air cool for the others.

[DerekP Houston]

Ok, can someone answer a noob question. What do you do with the water you are dropping the boolits into? I had read about lead acetate and the dangers of lead in water hence my initial hesitation to water dropping without good reason. As I only load low pressure rounds and no cast for rifles I've avoided it for now. I feel bad enough dumping all the water I use for washing brass in the SS pins.

[dragon813gt]

I dump it on the lawn. Water is not going to dissolve lead.

[DerekP Houston]

I dump it on the lawn. Water is not going to dissolve lead.

ok, better a dumb question than killing my vegetable garden and yard.

[dragon813gt]

Well I don't dump it on my garden ;)

The lawn can die for all I care. I'd put in all hardscaping if I wouldn't have drainage and runoff issues. I hate mowing even though my yard is small.

[DerekP Houston]

Well I don't dump it on my garden ;)

The lawn can die for all I care. I'd put in all hardscaping if I wouldn't have drainage and runoff issues. I hate mowing even though my yard is small.

Tell that to my HOA...I'd rather grow something useful than grass...but rules is rules. At least the backyard is my domain for now.

[tazman]

I would not live in a neighborhood run by an HOA unless forced to. Far too many horror stories about stupid and unjust rules. I just hope I am never forced to.
I am fortunate to have a gun club with excellent indoor and outdoor ranges relatively nearby. I have to drive a bit to get to it but it is still much cheaper and more useful than the indoor ranges that are closer. If gas prices go up really high again, that may change but I will still need the rifle ranges that the club has available.
Since I currently only cast for handgun, I really don't need the extra hardness from water dropping but I do it anyway. With proper fit, hardness above 12 bhn isn't necessary but it certainly doesn't hurt anything. It is also very convenient for me since my casting table is very small with little to no room for dropping quantities of boolits to air cool. I will often cast 500 rounds or more of boolits for my 38 or 9mm in one sitting.
I use a medium size rounded bottom, Tupperware bowl with cool water in it soften the impact of dropping the boolits and to cool them quickly so I can handle them as needed. I have the bowl setting on a stool about a foot below table height so I don't need to bend far to drop the boolits or worry about splashing water into the lead pot. The bowl size makes it easy to handle and move around as needed. Since the boolits drop from the mold directly above the bowl, they don't have far to fall and don't develop enough force to dent each other when they make contact. The bowl is sufficiently shallow that scooping the boolits out by hand is easy to do. They only take a couple of minutes to dry after rolling them on a towel. I then size as needed and lube appropriately.
This works very well for me and has for several years.

[robg]

I aircool by the time I tidy up after casting they are cool enough to tumble lube and leave over night and if I need to size or gas check do that next day .

[gundownunder]

I water drop into a 5 gallon bucket, only because I get less dings and dents that way. Any hardening I might have got by water dropping is lost when I put them all through the oven 3 times to cure my Hi Tek coating.

[trixter]

I water drop all of my .225 and .309, but my .453 I just drop them on the casting table and let them cool and set for at least 2 weeks. Then the rifle boolits get gas checked and lubrisized. I cast 99% of my boolits from range brass, and the water dropping for the rifle boolits seem to get them hard enough for what I do.

[popper]

I drop onto a damp (soak and then wring real good) folded towel, just to keep the cloth from scorching. Drop is maybe 3" and don't get any dents or dings. When the drop area gets full, pick up one end and roll to the back. I heat treat as needed for hot rifle loads.

[rintinglen]

Mine are Air-cooled. If I need harder boolits, I heat treat them in a 450 degree oven and plunge them in ice water.

[DerekP Houston]

well I repurposed my "water drop" bucket to hold other random ****...so all air cooled for now still.

[dverna]

Air drop.

[TXGunNut]

Air cool. If a rifle requires a harder or tougher boolit I'll heat them in the oven and water quench them. I don't think my casting cadence is even enough to get consistent results with water dropping.