308 brass into 45 ACP shotshell

[mold maker]

I just watched several videos about using regular and specialty dies to produce 45 ACP shot shells using 308 brass. Does anyone here have experience doing it and does the Pistol primer seating deeper matter?
I think this may be my next project. It's too hot outdoors unless there is no choice. I need something worthwhile to do.

[skeettx]

No issue here,
Large Pistol primers will be fine
I have used 410 plastic wads trimmed to length
and an up side down gas check to seal the shot in.
I have also used 444 Marlin brass.
Mike

p.s. What gun? I used mine in 1917 Smiths and Colts, Smith 25 and Ruger Blackhawk.

Never messed with the 1911 as the cylinder length for the revolvers made more potent package.

[GRUMPA]

I just watched several videos about using regular and specialty dies to produce 45 ACP shot shells using 308 brass. Does anyone here have experience doing it and does the Pistol primer seating deeper matter?
I think this may be my next project. It's too hot outdoors unless there is no choice. I need something worthwhile to do.

Here.....I have a sticky about just that.

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?185253-Making-45acp-shotshells-(My-Way)

[mtbugler63]

I did like you and watched all the videos/ read the threads. It took a little tinkering with the load to get them to function in my Kimber 1911. It was a fun little project. I do the cardboard wad and up-side down gas check.

[jmorris]

I also made (edit: modified) a die to make 45 ACP shotshells with 308 (types of) brass, I use .410 wads cut down.

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?235886-Homemade-45-acp-shotshell-die&highlight=45+shot

[Bama]

After reading article in The American Rifleman over 35 years ago I ordered the die set from RCBS. Article suggested Remington SP 410 shot cups and 35 cal gas check to form front seal. Load has been used in 9 different guns during this time. Other than a few guns with short extraction ports all shot and cycled well as long as commercial 308 brass was used. Military brass is usually thicker and has trouble releasing from chamber reliably. A little fingernail polish at primer and edges of gas check makes them reasonably water proof.

[IllinoisCoyoteHunter]

I need to look into making some of these dies because they are super expensive to buy from RCBS. I have a complete set to take mesurements from.

[GRUMPA]

I need to look into making some of these dies because they are super expensive to buy from RCBS. I have a complete set to take mesurements from.

Just use what I use, never an issue and they're ready made ,and cheap. Chances are you already have what you need to do the conversion.

[DLCTEX]

I use a 41 mag size die to make cases from 308 blank brass.

[jmorris]

These are the dimensions I used posted (#7) in the thread I linked to above.

http://www.avr-developers.com/45shotshell/45_shot_cartridges.pdf

[TheDoctor]

Since my rock chuckers stroke will not allow me to set the die in a manner to get the case shoulder set the same way every time, I had to come up with an idea. Ended up doing the simple solution of taking a 1/2" piece of steel tube, and with a barrel in hand as a headspace guide, ground the piece of tube to be a positive stop between the shell holder and the mouth of the die. So I set the case in the shell holder, set the tube around the case, and bingo, perfect headspace everytime.

[Brazos_Jack]

After reading article in The American Rifleman over 35 years ago I ordered the die set from RCBS. Article suggested Remington SP 410 shot cups and 35 cal gas check to form front seal. Load has been used in 9 different guns during this time. Other than a few guns with short extraction ports all shot and cycled well as long as commercial 308 brass was used. Military brass is usually thicker and has trouble releasing from chamber reliably. A little fingernail polish at primer and edges of gas check makes them reasonably water proof.

Like Bama, I bought the forming and loading dies from RCBS right after the American Rifleman article came out.

One potential issue that would compromise function in semi-autos is if the wad burns through, dumping pressure. So they recommended Remington SP 410 wads because they were the thickest available at that time. They also recommended using W231 powder because it burns cooler than powder of similar burning speed available at the time, like Bullseye.

I used .375 gas checks instead of .35 gas checks so I didn't have to crimp the case mouth as severely.

[Intel6]

Many years ago (2002) I borrowed a set of the RCBS dies and messed around with this. I used .243/.308/30-06 cases and they worked fine. I used trimmed down .410 wads and some thick clear acetate.
227146

Then I tried using a single buck shot to close them up and it worked pretty well

227147

The last thing I messed with was making longer cases for more payload to be used in my .45 ACP revolvers.

227150

227149

[17nut]

I did 30-06 to 45ACP shot and have a cuple of observations:

I did the bottom wad from a 45 cal gascheck and by the time it swaged down to .38'ish the neck stuck in the rifling.
Bad enough that i had to pound it lose.
I switched to plastic discs and with the load (for speed) i deemed proper it still rendered my auto a single shot.

On the other hand i cut down 460S&W and sized the top with a 44MAG die for proper fit in my 45 1873 45LC and they shot @225gr of shot HARD and worked like a charm!

[JavelinaBlanco]

This looks great! I will have to try, does RCBS still make this?


Many years ago I borrowed a set of the RCBS dies and messed around with this. I used .243/.308/30-06 cases and they worked fine. I used trimmed down .410 wads and some thick clear acetate.

Then I tried using a single buck shot to close them up and it worked pretty well



The last thing I messed with was making longer cases for more payload to be used in my .45 ACP revolvers.

[jmorris]

This looks great! I will have to try, does RCBS still make this?

Yep, $170 for the 3 die set.

http://www.midwayusa.com/product/728397/rcbs-3-die-set-with-roll-crimp-45-acp-shotshell

[shtur]

I bought the RCBS dies, and only have one die remaining. The die states "45 ACP SHOT SIZE D"
I think that is the only die necessary(if you have regular 45 acp dies) it's the one that forms the brass into the "shotshell". I haven't used it in over 20 years.

[jmorris]

I don't have the RCBS shot shell dies, modified an extra die I had to form the cases. Then I install an insert I also made that pushes the over shot card down while it crimps the mouth.

http://i121.photobucket.com/albums/o213/jmorrismetal/reloading/45%20acp%20shotshell%20die/IMG_20140324_174317_588_zpsbb497e50.jpg

[22cf45]

I have a set of the RCBS dies along with a trim die. I will be selling these as soon as I get around to it since they are part of a friends estate and I'm helping out. They are in excellent condition and will cost considerably less than Midway's price of $170
Phil

[dryflash3]

http://i250.photobucket.com/albums/gg272/dryflash3/shotshells/P1010831_zps097d2798.jpg (http://s250.photobucket.com/user/dryflash3/media/shotshells/P1010831_zps097d2798.jpg.html)

I use a 41 mag die for the shoulder. Home punched wads, have switched to TiteGroup.

[RIHP]

Has anyone tried using 400 Corbon dies for making 45 shot shells?

[Reverend Al]

Basically the same story ... I found a set of the dedicated RCBS .45 ACP shotshell dies cheap at a gun show years ago and couldn't resist buying them. I made up some cases from .308 brass, but found it faster and easier to use .45 Magnum (Wildey) brass which was available at the time. I used the RCBS suggestion and cut Remington .410 wads down to length, used their recommended load of Winchester 231, and roll crimped a .375 gas check upside down in the case mouth. In my commerial Colt Government model they feed, fire, extract, and eject without issue. They are a ton of fun to shoot at Station 8 Skeet too!


Like Bama, I bought the forming and loading dies from RCBS right after the American Rifleman article came out.

One potential issue that would compromise function in semi-autos is if the wad burns through, dumping pressure. So they recommended Remington SP 410 wads because they were the thickest available at that time. They also recommended using W231 powder because it burns cooler than powder of similar burning speed available at the time, like Bullseye.

I used .375 gas checks instead of .35 gas checks so I didn't have to crimp the case mouth as severely.

[mold maker]

In one of the threads on this subject, there was mention of a 3D printed jig for cutting the 308 to length. Now every search I do turns up everything else.
Does anyone remember the source for the jig?
I've successfully made the 45 ACP shotshells, but cutting them with a tubing cutter was painful and not accurate. I have the HF saw and several hundred primed 308 pull down blanks to cut.

[jmorris]

I have made simple fixtures to cut and sand to length.

http://i664.photobucket.com/albums/vv5/qvideo/gn/380ss/IMG_20160817_145519_219_zpsqjqwhubb.jpg

http://i664.photobucket.com/albums/vv5/qvideo/gn/380ss/IMG_20160817_133731_490_zpsey1x6sp6.jpg

[Bmi48219]

That's a neat fixture!

[oldsalt444]

I cut down .308 / 7.62 NATO to 1.18" and use a Lee 41 Mag Factory Crimp Die and Imperial Sizing Wax to set the shoulder. Costs a lot less than RCBS dies. I use any 410 shot cup cut down on top of 5.5 gr. Green Dot and cover the shot with a 410 overshot card. For crimping the overshot card into place, I use the regular 45 ACP round nose seating stem in my bullet seating die and carefully roll the case edge just enough to hold it good. This load will cycle in my 1911, but I use a lighter than normal recoil spring for target work.

[Bama]

The fixture looks like you have cut down the wall thickness for the forward portion that would expand into the throat and rifling, is that correct? Did you use a lathe? I have to use commercial 308 brass to get reliable operation because the thicker military brass does not release from the rifling very easy and causes hangup. Please give a little more info on your fixture--looks like you have found the cure!

[mold maker]

What I saw was a 3D printed jig that allowed the 308 brass to be held at the correct length and cut with the HF saw. Each cut piece was ejected by the next piece inserted. There was some kind of a detent pin that registered off the extractor groove.
I can't find the video anymore.
Anybody remember where it is?

[jmorris]

The fixture looks like you have cut down the wall thickness for the forward portion that would expand into the throat and rifling, is that correct? Did you use a lathe? I have to use commercial 308 brass to get reliable operation because the thicker military brass does not release from the rifling very easy and causes hangup. Please give a little more info on your fixture--looks like you have found the cure!

That one is actually for cutting down .223 brass to make .380 shotshells and yes before I made an insert to size them down I turned them in a lathe. Since no one had done .380 shot shells I wanted to make sure they ran before I did much work.

I actually "cheated" a bit making the forming die too. I just took the guts out of a Lee powder die and installed the insert I machined. To form them.

http://i664.photobucket.com/albums/vv5/qvideo/gn/380ss/IMG_20160829_142419_241-1_zpssajcwmjd.jpg

Much faster and the crimp looks a bit better but here is the difference between turned and formed .223.

http://i664.photobucket.com/albums/vv5/qvideo/gn/380ss/IMG_20160829_145301_364-1_zpso2ggoyki.jpg


In any case (no pun intended) the fixtures are pretty much the same for both of them, to cut the length.

[justashooter]

X57 has a better taper and can be cut just short of cylinder length and fire-formed in cylinder with moon clips. 308 does not have enuf taper.

[bbs70]

Several years back I made some of these 45 shot shells for my 1911 out of 308 brass.
The other day I decided to make some more to have on hand now that I live in the country.
Refreshed my memory via YouTube on how to make them.
Can't seem to get it done right though.

Deprimed, cut down to recommended size, sized in 45 die,and used a 41 Mag die to size the neck down.
But everytime I end up with a smashed 308 case.
Tried different head stamped brass, grease, oil,and about everything else, but still get mashed brass.
No, I'm not trying to size the whole thing, just a smidge on the case mouth.
I know it can be done because I've done it before some years ago, but am getting mighty frustrated.

[Boogieman]

Try sizing the 308 case down in your 41 mag die before trimming to length. I've never lost any cases forming that way.

[bbs70]

Well hell, after rechecking the cut down cases and making sure they were lubed I tried to make shot shell cases again from 308 brass.
This time for some unknown reason it worked perfectly, only 1 smashed case out of 30.
Don't know what I did differently, but this time it worked, must have held my tongue out wrong the first time.

[mold maker]

Getting a 41 die for this project led to 2 41 pistols and 3 more molds. I'm having trouble finding time to make shotshells now. Is there no end to this maddness?

[Youngtimer]

There is a seller on evilbay with a jig for cutting 308 type cases. I purchased one for making 45acp shot shells. I had to modify it slightly to allow it to cut short enough for the intended purpose, but it works well. Do a search for 308 or 7.62 jig and it should come up.

[Eddie2002]

I was trying the same with .223 brass converted into .380 ACP shot shells. Only made two or three compete rounds, couldn't get them to feed properly.

[TheBoat]

Would you share your blueprints? I know a guy that is a machinist who maybe could make me a set of dies.

[TheBoat]

Could you use a pipe cutter like plumbers use?

[Bama]

I just watched several videos about using regular and specialty dies to produce 45 ACP shot shells using 308 brass. Does anyone here have experience doing it and does the Pistol primer seating deeper matter?
I think this may be my next project. It's too hot outdoors unless there is no choice. I need something worthwhile to do.

Been doing it for 20 years. Works well with non military brass. Miliitary brass is thicker and the froward section of case does not want to release from chamer without occasional problems. Non military brass works great and is reloadable. It is great for snakes and squirels out to 25 yards. Never seen any issue with primers and I have gone through several thousand with no issues. Its worth doing

[Baltimoreed]

I also built these .45 shot-shells years ago. I cut clear acetate, placed over the #9 shot and 410 wad and crimped it. Then I painted nail polish to seal everything. My thought was that a light piece of acetate would affect the shot ‘column’ less than a gas check would. They were good snake medicine.

[jessdigs]

I came across a set of rcbs .45 shotshell dies on cast boolits forum a few months ago. Knowing that rcbs stopped making them, i snatched them up. Made a few, but they are a little long for the mag if my sig P220. I will have to buy a 1911 in .45 just to play with these.
I first used commercial .308 brass, then used .45 mag brass as it is the same length as trimmed cut down .308 brass.
.410 wads, and a .375 gas check. The seller also included a c&h star crimper that reduces shot capacity, but helps feed in my p220. "
The July 1979 issue of handler magazine is still available to buy, that's what MJ from the ammo channel used. https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20191022/7490c5ba4289147b519715225480e29c.jpg250045https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20191022/f76188c5a76f425b6883a9966c4efb40.jpghttps://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20191022/c289b4b70b05a74634a1879379541947.jpghttps://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20191022/f73418242b93130248ec8fabd5069dee.jpg


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[Drm50]

I had the RCBS set back in 80s. I made up a few. I used commercial 308s and cut to rough size with dremil & cut off wheel, then squared up to length on case trimmer. I didn't get anywhere near 25yds killing range on anything other than a unlucky bird that. I sold my set to a Duputy that loaded a few to shot trouble calls on small animals at close range where he couldn't use a bullet.

[Reverend Al]

I've had a set of those same RCBS shotshell dies for years. Lucked into them at a gun show about 35 years ago! I made up about 100 rounds of reworked cases and they are an absolute hoot on station 8 at the Skeet field!

[17nut]

I did this and used a .45" gascheck as over powder wad!
Big problem as it sized the front ot the case to actual bore and made extraction a slam dunk thing (way more slam than dunk!).
So use a soft wad between power and shot and all will be fine.
Oh: And i used the bottom of a 44MAG sizer to bring my cases to fire size.

[dryflash3]

Several years back I made some of these 45 shot shells for my 1911 out of 308 brass.
The other day I decided to make some more to have on hand now that I live in the country.
Refreshed my memory via YouTube on how to make them.
Can't seem to get it done right though.

Deprimed, cut down to recommended size, sized in 45 die,and used a 41 Mag die to size the neck down.
But everytime I end up with a smashed 308 case.
Tried different head stamped brass, grease, oil,and about everything else, but still get mashed brass.
No, I'm not trying to size the whole thing, just a smidge on the case mouth.
I know it can be done because I've done it before some years ago, but am getting mighty frustrated.

I anneal my cases before forming the shoulder with the 41 Mag sizing die.
I also use a bit of Imperial for lube.

[justashooter]

good results with 8X57cases trim to cylinder length and 4.5 green dot with card wads and 7.5 shot.

[cupajoe]

I read about those in an American Rifleman Reprint back in the 80's. Bought the RCBS dies and made up a bunch loaded with the published data and still use them on rats and snakes while mowing. I tested them against the .44 shotshells, no contest. The 45 with the .410 wad patterned soo much better.

[Outpost75]

The Starline 5 in 1 blank cases also make good shotshells for use in the .44 Special, .44 Magnum, .38-40, .44-40 and .45 Colt.

Instructions here: https://www.marlinowners.com/forum/team-44-40/496090-loading-44-game-getter-shot-starline-5-1-blank-cases.html

See also customer review here: https://www.midwayusa.com/product/1010093167

5 in 1 Revolver and Rifle Shot
Submitted 4 years ago
From West Virginia
Verified Buyer

The Starline 5 in 1 Blank cases work well to assemble handgun shotshells useable in the .44 Special, .44 Magnum, .38-40, .44-40 and .45 Colt revolvers. Powder charges must be kept mild due to the enlarged flash hole. I use 5 grains of Alliant Bullseye or 6 grains of WST or 231 and a Winchester Large Pistol primer. A Buffalo Arms .45 card wad must be inserted over the powder charge, first inserting the card sideways with tweezers, pushing it about halfway into the case, before rotating it to bridge across the interior case wall and then aligning and pressing it down against the powder using a 3/8" dowel. Next a Federal 410SC shot cup is inserted firmly against the card, seated with the dowel and its protruding wad fingers trimmed off with a sharp knife. It is absolutely necessary to use the .45 card under the plastic shot cup because it is not of sufficient diameter to prevent powder from otherwise leaking around it, which will cause bloopers. Load about 1/3 oz. of fine shot not larger than 7-1/2, to maintain adequate pellet count, within 1/8" of the case mouth. Insert a .38 cal. Buffalo Arms card wad over the shot and then crimp the shell using either a .44 Long Shot, .45 ACP Shot or Lee .308 Winchester seating die which has been shortened by 1" and a blank RCBS sizer-lubricator top punch positioned and adjusted in the seating stem collar to hold the top card at the mid point of the die shoulder, while the case mouth is bumped against the shoulder to form a nice, professional looking crimp. Waterproof the shell by painting the top wad with clear urethane or varnish. These produce rabbit and grouse killing patterns patterns at 20 feet with No.8s and burn rattlers to "snakeburgers" at 15 feet. More effective than the Speer factory shot and useable in a variety of guns. I pack 20 of these in each vehicle or aircraft survival kit.

251451251452

[Combat Diver]

Have always thought to use 7.62mm blank cases for cutting down to .45 ACP shotshells and using 5.56mm blank cases cut down for 9mm shotshells. Seems I have got a bunch of those fired cases

CD

[ReloaderFred]

Have always thought to use 7.62mm blank cases for cutting down to .45 ACP shotshells and using 5.56mm blank cases cut down for 9mm shotshells. Seems I have got a bunch of those fired cases

CD

That would be a good use for those expended blank cases. I used to have a bunch of them, but they went to the recycler as scrap brass a long time ago.

Hope this helps.

Fred

[robg]

I cut a 308 case down with a pipe cutting tool,brass is a lot tougher than copper pipe but it will work.

[jessdigs]

I got my little 3d printed jig in for cutting them down with a harbor freight mini chop saw. I just tried it out and it seems to work pretty good. I took a short video, so please excuse the shaky video, I'm trying to for the first time and doing it one handed.

https://youtu.be/lwgsdNWGRRA

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