Soft BHN for Hunting, Whadda ya Think?

[JohnH]

My recent experience with softening up the boolits for my 357 Max lead me to explore another area.... A softer boolit for huntin'.

As I was doing load work, I noticed that the bullets I was recovering were at once well deformed but not broken up like WW tends to do when shooting into wood, nor were they acting like FMJ's and just plowing on through till friction stoped 'em. I"ve recovered such bullets typically water dropped WW that with a little cleaning could be fired again.

Currently I'm playing with an alloy than is 1 to 1 WW and 20:1 that turned out to be softer than 20:1, it was 8 BHN instead of the 10 it should have been. The new alloy comes out at 9.7 BHN according to the calculator. Stuff is soft enough that I have to seat gas checks on the Lee 312-185-1R using Lee's push through sizer, the bullet will bend in my 450 sizer just trying to get the gas check started into the size die.

Yet I have no trouble pushing the alloy to circa 1700 fps in either my 357 Max or 38-55 without leading. So I'm wondering just how good a bullet this alloy will make for plunking deer using the RCBS 35-200 in the Max and the Lyman 379449 in the 38-55. Range here is better measured in feet, as 60 yards is a long shot, so impact velocity will be somewhere around 1500 fps or a tad higher.

I'm not sure where all the big meplat hard alloy stuff came from for a cast hunting bullet, Keith used 16:1 far as I know in his 44. A good bit has been written on 2 alloy bullets, a soft nose with a hard shank, but I've seen nothing on using a softer metal for the bullet.

[shooter93]

They managed to kill off several hundred million Bison using very soft lead bullets. I've never had a problem using bullets 1/20 or softer and a good case can be made that paper Patched are one of the best hunting bullets and they are generally pure lead.

[Bret4207]

Softer is often better. Add a hollow point and then ya got all the mushroom you need. The "hard boolit" idea comes from not fitting the boolit to the throat. You need an imitation jacketed bullet to make up for the undersize generic boolits out there. A hard boolit will shoot great if it fits the throat, not so great if it's way too small. IMHO hard is taken too far and plain WW a little tin if needed will do 95% of what you need, especially hunting.

[Bass Ackward]

My recent experience with softening up the boolits for my 357 Max lead me to explore another area.... A softer boolit for huntin'.



John,

A softer bullet for hunting ............. BRILLIANT!!!!!!! :grin:

But just a word of caution. Don't take any short range shots in case the bullet bounces off. Let me know how you do. Remember, if you think you need a wider meplat, just load your bullets backward. (BRILLIANT!!!!)

[Wayne Smith]

Bullets bending in a 450? I've sized 30-1 458125's in mine with no problem at all. How much are you sizing yours?

[Nrut]

John,

A softer bullet for hunting ............. BRILLIANT!!!!!!! :grin:

But just a word of caution. Don't take any short range shots in case the bullet bounces off. Let me know how you do. Remember, if you think you need a wider meplat, just load your bullets backward. (BRILLIANT!!!!)

BRILLIANT??? Why thank you Bass....I have done that with a 358156 in my Dan Wesson for close called coyotes (when I lived in Ariz.)....kills them just as quick as a 22-250....and then there's that sexy boattail you get by loading backwards also.......mic

[StarMetal]

Way back in the 70's my friend gave me a whole coffee can full of pulled jacketed FMJ bullets for the 7.65 Argentine Mauser. As you know most FMJ's are open at the rear. I loaded these backwards for devasting results on groundhogs and it wasn't exactly calling distance.

Guess we PA boys things the same.

Joe

[JohnH]

Bullets bending in a 450? I've sized 30-1 458125's in mine with no problem at all. How much are you sizing yours?

Bullet is .312 on the driving bands, but I don't have a nose punch that fits the bullet, so I was using a flat punch. Works good so long as one has a meplat and short fat bullets like the Lee 379-250-RF or any of the flatnose 44's and such, but obvioulsy not so well with long skinny bullets. I need to get a nose punch for that Lee-312-185-1R, got any suggestions?

Edit: Somedays I hate computers, hit the wrong button and the universe disappears.......I'm sizing to 310 in the 450.

BA, Are you having fun at my expense???? :) Should I go to my room or shout my brilliant idea from the rooftop? Actually my concern is would the bullet act like a fast expanding varmint bullet, expand to the size of a half dollar and not penetrate.

[SharpsShooter]

A soft 20:1 500gr boolit accounted for my last Whitetail Deer from a BPCR 45-70. The exit wound showed serious expansion had taken place and the boolit sure wasn't going 1700fps. Soft often works best for game where extreme penetration is not required.

[Nrut]

John before I got my Star lubrisizer I use to size my bullets nose first in my 450 and used a flat punch like you have.....I think it was Al Miller that wrote about doing it that way so you don't have misalinement problems between the die and the nose punch....you have to fool with it a bit to get it to work but it saves bullet bending and having to have a bunch of different nose punches for the same cal.....mic...
oh almost forgot it makes it easier to load your bullets backward like Bass suggested cause the bullets are already pointing that way...

[waksupi]

Does anyone here use thier Lyman sizer, nose first? Maybe remove the bottom stop, and just poop them out the bottom? Or run them down, and back up again?

[Bullshop]

Does anyone here use thier Lyman sizer, nose first? Maybe remove the bottom stop, and just poop them out the bottom? Or run them down, and back up again?
I do it with the RCBS, push them clean through nose first. Dissambly/reassembly only takes a minute. I do this if I am getting noticable distortion sizeing base first. I was explaining this to Starmetal when I first signed on here and we had an interesting discussion. At the time Joe seamed to think nose first sizeing was a wast of time. I am well satisfied that if there are any problems with base first sizeing causing uneven sizeing due to improper nose punch or missalignment of any kind the nose first sizeing will center the boolit to the die. Once sized first this way I then reassemble the press and lube in the same die base first.
BIC/BS

[StarMetal]

Bullshop

I happen to have a Lyman 4500 luber/sizer that must have been made on a Weds. as it's perfect. Everything is in alignment and I have nose punches that fit good and I told you the trick of floating that nose punch. Thus my Lyman sizes straight and I haven't yet bent a bullet. So to me or for me to size bullets nose first IS a waste of time.

Joe

[Wayne Smith]

John

Get any nose punch of adequate size, fill the cavity with slow dry epoxy or JBWeld or similar, and drop it on the nose of a very well waxed bullet. Wipe up the excess and let it dry. Do all of this in the 450, making sure to keep things clean. Now you have a nose punch that fits that bullet.