fixing some cases

[packnrat]

well i opposed just a tad.
need to reform about 50 cases. and they are all loaded. some will chamber with no problem but some just refuse to. can i run them back through the die with little to no problems. like setting off a round?
seeing as the shell holder does not press on the primer, one would thing the powder would never get hot enough to fire on its own. and the bullet does fit up into and through the die.
it is just a thing that goes up on the shoulder. or something like that. just need to adjust the shoulder of the cases.

case in point is a .223.

thinking of placing my stand outside under the big tree just in case.
sure can just break out the hammer and remove the bullets and powder. time.

[jcren]

Dangerous but can be done. Your call, depending how much work they need. I would remove the guts of the sizing die to be sure that if one did go off, there is nothing in its way. Better a hole in the roof than a pile bomb in your lap.

[mold maker]

I'd use a sharpie to determine where the problem is before making any choice as to how to fix it.

[packnrat]

they just need to go a slight amount deeper into the die. (shoulder adjustment.) i did not have it screwed down far enough. my biggest fear is the bullet would contact some part and get pushed farther into the case.
and this die is in a press that is on a movable stand so can test outside, so no hole in the roof, a .224 bullet does pass through the die as there is not decaping rod installed now.
i know not the best move. but i am lazy. (30 seconds a round or couple minuets a round?),
and any changes in the bullet on the first one. then all get pulled. if nothing else can do this during the heat of the day.

[leadman]

The problem is the neck of the die is smaller than the expander plug so the bullet will be sized down along with the neck. You might end up with loose bullets in your cases. Better to try the cases in your gun and pull apart the cases that do not fit. The brass has a certain amount of "spring back" where the lead does not have near as much.
To confirm the neck will size the case smaller than needed take the expander out an size a case, then measure the inside of the neck.

[fast ronnie]

The problem is the neck of the die is smaller than the expander plug so the bullet will be sized down along with the neck. You might end up with loose bullets in your cases. Better to try the cases in your gun and pull apart the cases that do not fit. The brass has a certain amount of "spring back" where the lead does not have near as much.
To confirm the neck will size the case smaller than needed take the expander out an size a case, then measure the inside of the neck.

When a case is sized, the neck is compressed to a smaller dimension than the bullet so there is a slight press fit to hold the bullet in the neck. That dimension can be up to several thousanths smaller than needs to be and then expander ball brings the inside back up to size on a standard type die. If you have lead bullets, the die MAY size them down, but then you would have a WAY undersized slug going down the bore. If is a jacketed bullet, I doubt you would be able to get it in the die without either getting it well stuck, or possibly ruining something. Get a bullet puller and disassemble the rounds. Then, you can resize without removing the primers, but will have to pull the de-capping pin out of the expander ball assembly. If it a standard type of a die, the neck will be sized too small to re-fit a bullet without using the expander ball. If it is a bushing die, it would not be a problem.

[country gent]

I would recopmend pulling the bullets and salvaging the powder, bullets and primed cases seperatly. As stated above the neck portion of the die will resize the bullets base ans shank area inside of case. I would remove the decapping pin from expander assemnly and size nack down over it to get everything right where you need it. ( besure and put the decapping pin in a piece of tape or foam where you know where it is. The only other way would be to find a 6mmX 45 die body and use it to bump shoulder back on the loaded rounds. Ifa bushing die then the bushing could be removed so as no neck sizing takes place also.

[Negster]

You could get a body die to move the shoulder back without affecting the neck. Not sure if the cost is worth it tho.

[EDG]

A trim die or body die can size the body without pulling the bullets. At least you can do that with most trim dies because the neck is about .010 larger than a FL die.

If you want to see what happens just resize one round in a FL die with the expander removed. It will just crush the case when the neck with the bullet jams in the die. Not recommended.

[Don Fischer]

I would get a live primer out. But run a loaded round back in? Not in a million years. Problem is if it does for some reason got off on you, you will probably die! Think about it!

[shortfal]

I had a large number of .223's that did not have the shoulder resized far enough back. Took an extra .223 sizer and bored out the neck area with a carbide cutter enough to not contact the neck.
Ran em thru the press, no problem. I could not see any reason for this to be dangerous the way I did it.
Only 50 rounds?
Pull the bullets and size as needed and reload. Not worth machining a die for.
Pete

[packnrat]

yes i decided this am to just hammer out the bullets. (no puller, just the hammer) lose a bit of powder for safety and might even be easer in the long run.

[EDG]

You do the same exact thing every time you seat a bullet in a charged case.
Have you ever had a loaded round blow up in a seating die?


I would get a live primer out. But run a loaded round back in? Not in a million years. Problem is if it does for some reason got off on you, you will probably die! Think about it!

[RP]

I was told by a member in chat his friend tried to resize some loaded rounds and one went off he was not killed but it messed him up. For 50 the time it take to pull them is a lot less time it take to tweak a die to keep from resizing the bullet or the time it take to recover if one goes off, Smart thinking about asking.
On another not he will not be using a seating die to reform the case it will be a sizing die which takes more pressure to do.

[EDG]

You are really quoting 3rd hand information so you have no first hand experience.
Please tell up how you set off a round like that?

You might want to brush up on how the Brits loaded cordite in the .303 British rounds.
The case was still straight with NO neck when the long strands of cordite were inserted into the primed case.
Then the case was necked down with the cordite in the case. Then an over the powder wad was inserted. Then the bullet was seated and crimped.
Never in the history of reloading have I ever heard of a live round being set off in a die of any sort. Certainly if you manage to make one go off in a seater it would hurt you just the same. But that has never happened except in hearsay land.

I have set back the shoulders of many loaded rounds and know other members here that have done the same thing. You can look for the thread because the guy had about 225 rounds of .22-250 ammo. If you check out a bench rest forum you will find they have to do it sometimes also.



I was told by a member in chat his friend tried to resize some loaded rounds and one went off he was not killed but it messed him up. For 50 the time it take to pull them is a lot less time it take to tweak a die to keep from resizing the bullet or the time it take to recover if one goes off, Smart thinking about asking.
On another not he will not be using a seating die to reform the case it will be a sizing die which takes more pressure to do.

[6622729]

By your own admission you are being lazy. pull these cartridges down and fix them. Laziness and reloading don't play well together. You could probably get away with this from a safety standpoint but as was pointed out, you're likely going to size down the bullet in the process you are proposing. Why create a bunch of new variables? Just break it all down and redo.

[RP]

You are really quoting 3rd hand information so you have no first hand experience.
Please tell up how you set off a round like that?

You might want to brush up on how the Brits loaded cordite in the .303 British rounds.
The case was still straight with NO neck when the long strands of cordite were inserted into the primed case.
Then the case was necked down with the cordite in the case. Then an over the powder wad was inserted. Then the bullet was seated and crimped.
Never in the history of reloading have I ever heard of a live round being set off in a die of any sort. Certainly if you manage to make one go off in a seater it would hurt you just the same. But that has never happened except in hearsay land.

I have set back the shoulders of many loaded rounds and know other members here that have done the same thing. You can look for the thread because the guy had about 225 rounds of .22-250 ammo. If you check out a bench rest forum you will find they have to do it sometimes also.

Yes its third hand info you are correct. As it has been said the force used to seat a bullet and the force used to size a case are not the same I think we can agree on that. Also it has also been pointed out the sizing die is not intended to size a loaded round since it sizes the neck smaller then the bullet can we agree on that also. I have not doubt that someone has done it but I do not know first hand or second. So I am unable to advise a person where to buy a die that will set the shoulder back on a loaded round or how much they should cut out of the die so it will not resize the bullet. The OP ask a ? to advise him just resize the bullets would not be the best path without informing him of the risk. Besides you doing it and some others that have posted on the internet that they have done it can you find in data in book by speer hornady lyman herters ..... Or a company that sells a die designed for this?
What the Brits were doing is necking the case down without the bullet in place the last thing done was seating and crimping the bullet not the same thing so no need to brush up on that.

[EDG]

Perhaps you should reread the preceding posts for content. Most posters advised the OP that he could not resize with the normal FL die.

Body dies, trim dies and dies for the same body with a larger neck can do this job with almost no effort. The RCBS trim dies have been around about 60 years yet you seem to know nothing about them. You are apparently unaware of the array of dies that have been available for decades. If you are unable to offer advice then don't.

RCBS bottle neck trim dies have a neck diameter than is .010 larger than a loaded round. Redding and other die manufacturers produce body dies that are also large in the neck.

Again tell me how the British got away with forming the .303 brass around the cordite when they made billions of rounds?
What the British did is exactly the same. They formed a case full of propellant at mass production speeds in a closed die. Then they seated a bullet in those cases.
They did not blow up their ammo plants.

You own experience in this matter does not support your opinion because you have no experience doing this.
You apparently do not anything about trim dies or body dies. Why not check them out at Midway, Graf and Son, Midsouth and any other mail order house?

You have never offered a clue as to how a little more force is supposed to set off a round. If it were easy we would have rounds going off when dropped and when fed through auto loaders and when guys crank down the bolt handle on an oversize round in a bolt action rifle.



Yes its third hand info you are correct. As it has been said the force used to seat a bullet and the force used to size a case are not the same I think we can agree on that. Also it has also been pointed out the sizing die is not intended to size a loaded round since it sizes the neck smaller then the bullet can we agree on that also. I have not doubt that someone has done it but I do not know first hand or second. So I am unable to advise a person where to buy a die that will set the shoulder back on a loaded round or how much they should cut out of the die so it will not resize the bullet. The OP ask a ? to advise him just resize the bullets would not be the best path without informing him of the risk. Besides you doing it and some others that have posted on the internet that they have done it can you find in data in book by speer hornady lyman herters ..... Or a company that sells a die designed for this?
What the Brits were doing is necking the case down without the bullet in place the last thing done was seating and crimping the bullet not the same thing so no need to brush up on that.

[packnrat]

By your own admission you are being lazy. pull these cartridges down and fix them. Laziness and reloading don't play well together. You could probably get away with this from a safety standpoint but as was pointed out, you're likely going to size down the bullet in the process you are proposing. Why create a bunch of new variables? Just break it all down and redo.

please read post #12.

.

[RP]

Sir I would not advise anyone to use a trim die to reset the neck on a loaded round yes it can be done but that is not what a trim die is made for. I did offer advise PULL THE ROUNDS BE SAFE

[Brasso]

I agree with RP. Pull the rounds down, start over and do it right.