Washing wheel weights

[Nick Quick]

I tried first to find a similar thread but I couldn't. Was probably debated before but here I come with my question.
Yesterday I decided to water spray 200 lbs of wheel weigh before smelting. The rust, grease and muddy dirt was washed out was horrible. I let them WW spreaded on the floor to dry out so I won't fill the smelting pan with wet lead.
Now the question. It is really necessary to wash the WW before smelting? Did I just waste time for nothing or will the washing actually help me?
Thanx a bunch. Any comment or constructive criticism highly appreciated.

[M-Tecs]

I never have. The oil, rubber and grease acts as a flux.

[OS OK]

Good question but it's not about time with me. The older I get and the more stories I read about water getting into the lead pot, the more skittish I am about getting water anywhere near molten lead. All that gunk will come off the lead within the dross, steel clips etc. but it'll smoke and gas different gunky smells, you want to stay clear of that.
I throw in a heaping handful of sawdust and throw in the WW's on top of that, when you skim it all off there is always a beautiful mirror beneath ready for the ingot molds.
When I used to water drop I would go to extremes with a rag over the bucket to prevent any splashes…I've just got this thing about lead + water…they ain't too friendly!

charlie

If you are new in this business…think about safety, eye protection etc., I'm not going to beat this old dead horse…I figure that a word to the wise is sufficient!

[old cobra]

Quite a few years ago I took a bunch of them to the local car wash the do-it-yourself kind sprayed most of the stuff off and found out it takes a long time for all the water to evaporate or dry from all the nooks and crannies specially around the mounting clips I decided it wasn't worth the time

[blackthorn]

As long as you start with a pot full of COLD WW, any water will be evaporated long before the WW start to melt. The danger comes from dumping damp/wet WW into a pot that already has molten metal in it. If there is liquid metal, the WW have the opportunity to get under the surface of the molten metal and that is when you will get a stem explosion!

[merlin101]

I've done it but usually it's range scrap that gets washed to get rid of some of the dirt. I don't really bother doing anymore because I just let them sit on a bucket for a few months and then the dirt just falls off when I shake the bucket. If the smell and smoke bothers you then by all means wash them, BUT DO NOT ADD THEM TO A HOT POT!!! Spread them out and let them dry good then put them in a COLD pot and turn on the heat, any water trapped will evaporate long before the lead melts.

[Nick Quick]

Thanx a bunch gents. Much appreciate all the advices. I do have protection equipment for my limbs, glasses, respirator with P100 filters for the nasty vapors and I got the fan in place when I will fire up the cast iron pot.
I'm not worried about water in the pot from WW I washed because it is very windy and the WW will dry in no time. I was not even worried about the grease coz someone said it acts like flux. My problem was the dirt, mud and rust if the float at the lead melting point. I was thinking they sink on the bottom and will go into the ingots and later on into the bullets.

[Electric88]

Nope, Lead is more dense than all that other junk, and it'll all float to the top to be skimmed off

[mdi]

As long as you start with a pot full of COLD WW, any water will be evaporated long before the WW start to melt. The danger comes from dumping damp/wet WW into a pot that already has molten metal in it. If there is liquid metal, the WW have the opportunity to get under the surface of the molten metal and that is when you will get a stem explosion!

I agree! And I see no need to wash old wheel weights as that's what the smelting process is for; cleaning and ingotizing lead...

[.455 Webley]

I started off cleaning all my WW's before melting i think its a common thing for new guys to do. Just glad that i was not foolish enough to slip on into the lead pot with any moisture still on it.

[bangerjim]

NO need to wash. All dirt, clips, garbage will float on top as said. Grease and HC's will burn off.

Water introduces a BIG hazard in re-melting WW's. Water can stay in the nooks & crannies for a long time. NEVER add washed WW's to molten lead . . . even when you THINK (!) they are dry! Always start off with a cold pot full of WW's and let them come up to temp and then melt. That is the way I did COWW re-melting back when I still messed with filthy old COWW's. Not anymore! Too much work....too little yield....even when free.

Don't waste your time and energy washing anything you re-melt. Heat takes care if it for you!

bangerjim

[Nick Quick]

Got the message. That's what I needed to know. So it looks like this was the first and last time I ever waste my time on washing WW.
Until I finish smelting the ones I washed I will dry'em up first in the stove prior to add them in the smelter.

[6622729]

Got the message. That's what I needed to know. So it looks like this was the first and last time I ever waste my time on washing WW.
Until I finish smelting the ones I washed I will dry'em up first in the stove prior to add them in the smelter.

That might not be a bad idea for the rest of them too if you don't know how they have been stored. Watch out for water!

[Mk42gunner]

The only semi valid reason to wash the wild WW is to get rid of the tobacco spit and dog pee before you sort them. Even that isn't a real good reason, since I wear gloves while sorting.

Robert

[lightman]

You didn't really waste your time. The cleaner weights will make for a cleaner smelting experience. That could be important if you live in town or in a crowded area. Like most of the others, I don't bother. I will be another to warn you not to add weights or any other material to molten lead. Wet weights are fine if you start with a cold pot, but will get exciting if dumped into molten lead.

[Nick Quick]

Yes I live in town. And I cannot smoke the neighborhood due to obvious reasons.

First batch is done. No issues whatsoever. The iron cast pot is empty and waiting for more.

First observation is that when I tried to use a round candle to flux, the whole surface became yellow and oily. Then I waited for a while and I threw a hand of saw dust and lit right away, but then ...what a mess. It took me forever to remove all the dirt. The molten lead was looking in the pot way better before the saw dust. As soon I removed the metals from the WW from the pot everything was looking beautiful. But after the dust it was quite an experience for me to clean up everything.

[fredj338]

As you noted, unless you live in the country, there will be a lot more smoke if you just toss stuff into the melter. I tend to clean at least some of the gunk off before melting.

[country gent]

A simple precaution when smelting is always start with an empty pot and heat from scratch. Any moisture will evaporate or burn off long before the lead melts. Adding more to a pot of molten meltal may allow moisture below the surface and resulting tinsel fairy visit. I would recomend fluxing 2-3 times with saw dust wood shavings then one last time with wax parrafin. If your going to alloy this is the time to do it add the additional materials and flux again when all is molten. You now have a batch of alloy ready for the casting pot. When I was smelting range lead and other scrape leads I did it in 350 lb batches iding each pot full with a number stamped in the ingots. Haveing 100 lbs + of the same alloy to work with is good. If you want to really extend it if you smelt 4 pots 1 ingot from each smelt batch in the casting pot gives the same alloy much longer.

[Blackwater]

I live in the country so fumes and aromas aren't a problem of great magnitude, except for my own delicate sensibilities. The way I do it is just to sort through the WW's to be as sure as possible I don't get any zinc ones mixed in with the lead, and in so doing, I usually just shake off any large amount of dirt, etc. Then I just melt them, and skim off everything that floats off. Really easy, actually. You may need to get some sort of "spoon" and bend it so you can skim off the surface. The bigger the batch of lead you're smelting, the longer the spoon handle needs to be to keep your hand away from high heat. Welding gloves are a good asset here. I have an old ladle spoon I use and bent the handle at @ 90 degrees. Works just fine, and was cheap. It was one my wife was going to throw out, and I like free stuff, when I can get it. All sorts of ways to skin this cat, and none are wrong, except as noted above in adding wet WW's to already molten metal. That tends to bring the tinsel fairy into play, and can hurt you or anyone nearby. You'll never forget this if it happens to you!

[Nick Quick]

While everyone was taking turns posting I was smelting counting on every advice. Thanx again. No problems whatsoever. I fill the 22 lbs cast iron pot with WW and turn the heat on, skim the metals, saw dust, burn, skim again then cast into ingots.
When the pot is empty I turn the burner gas off and I start handpicking the WW. By the time I selected another 20 lbs or so of WW the pot is cold so no adding wet WW in the pot. Everything starts again and again. I almost finished 150 lbs of WW and have a bunch of yummy ingots all sizes.
I feel like getting better and faster with each pot. Now I know where to keep the tools, the molds and everything. It is like any procedure, the more organized the faster and better overall.

The respirator with P100 filters are kinda annoying but I rather not smelt than breath lead vapors and all the **** inside the pot.

I keep the temperature is around 550 F. It should be higher ?

[runfiverun]

another 150-f wouldn't hurt anything.

I wash my ww's all the time.
I want clean material coming from the pot.
that's the whole point of cleaning them up before using them in the casting pot.

I use 2 pots and when I get to the bottom of one I dump it in the other and start over again.

[Nick Quick]

"another 150-f wouldn't hurt anything" and that's what I just did the last cast and now I know why you said that. The muffins looks way better then the previous ones and the molten lead pour also better.
Yeah, I'm learning with every batch.

This place Is the best book I ever read. Thanx a bunch gents.

[country gent]

Another thing is to keep the ladle hot give it some time to rewarm in the melt between pours. If you have alot of lead to smelt and clean up a bigger pot would speed things up alot.

[sutherpride59]

I'm far from an expert here but for what it's worth I don't wash mine. It's way more important that they be properly separated than that they be clean. Literally everything that isn't lead will either burn off or float to the top when you begin smelting the WW's. Just flux the melt and skim what's left on top and dispose of the dross as it's a lot of lead-oxide which is easier to ingest and get contamination from than pure lead.

Make sure you start smelting on a low heat though, around 700 if you have a PID or thermometer, the zinc takes longer to melt at a higher temp than the lead so if you make a mistake and get one in there it will be floating on the top rather than ruining your batch a WW alloy. I've had only a couple of incidents with this but luckily I watch my alloy as it melts and just do general clean up in the garage or watch HULU while it melts down checking it ever couple of minutes. I'm more worried about the fire hazard aspect though but if you watch as they melt and there is only one or two weights on top scoop them up and set them off to the side, these get a check with the hardness tester or a couple of drop and scrape test before I throw them back in to make sure they aren't zinc. Also if you live near the city like I do all that grease will smoke and awful lot. So when it starts smoking a good bit throw some flaming paper into the pot or take a torch to it and that will generally catch all the vapors on fire to cut down on the smoke.

[swmass]

I never wash mine but I've noticed some pretty nasty stuff coming off... All that smoke from that stuff burning can't be good for you.. I definitely get some looks from the neighbors when they see my trying to stay away from the smoke that's blowing down the road... They don't know what it is but they know I do and im staying away from it! Anyway, if you don't mind doing it I say go for it. I have a big cast iron skillet that I use for melting wheel weights only so I've never bothered to clean em up first:

[jimb16]

I'm sure you've heard of the tinsel Fairy. Washed wheel weights are a great way to meet her!

[TXGunNut]

I don't wash my WW's, they stay in out of the weather so moisture is not an issue. All the same, a smelting session is more efficient if you drop WW's into molten lead. I've met the tinsel fairy. When I add lead, casting or smelting, I walk away ASAP.

[6622729]

While everyone was taking turns posting I was smelting counting on every advice. Thanx again. No problems whatsoever. I fill the 22 lbs cast iron pot with WW and turn the heat on, skim the metals, saw dust, burn, skim again then cast into ingots.
When the pot is empty I turn the burner gas off and I start handpicking the WW. By the time I selected another 20 lbs or so of WW the pot is cold so no adding wet WW in the pot. Everything starts again and again. I almost finished 150 lbs of WW and have a bunch of yummy ingots all sizes.
I feel like getting better and faster with each pot. Now I know where to keep the tools, the molds and everything. It is like any procedure, the more organized the faster and better overall.

The respirator with P100 filters are kinda annoying but I rather not smelt than breath lead vapors and all the **** inside the pot.

I keep the temperature is around 550 F. It should be higher ?

How big is a 22lb cast iron pot? Diameter and height?

[Nick Quick]

13 inch diameter by 6 inch high. But I guess the 22 lbs is referring to water. Filled with lead is probably double or even more due to it's density. The best part on the pot is that it came with a cover which is great for the initial warm up part. I cover the pot keeping just a bit open to let the steams go out.
I calculated and it takes 20-25 minutes until my presence is needed. I fire up the thing and then stay inside and watch through the window for the fire not to go out. Is pointless in sitting out and endanger my health when I can come right when is the time and do hat is needed.
The pot is cast iron. Heavy thing. Even the cover is heavy like heck.

[6bg6ga]

Had a visit from the tinsel fairy once from using a box of wheel weights that had sat on the garage floor for a while and they were never wet or moist from what I know. After cleaning the ceiling in the garage of the beautiful patter I vowed never to use anything from a box that had been sitting for a while. I firmly believe that washing wheel weights invites stupidity to be your casting helper. It is far simpler to use an old spoon to skim the **** off the top and throw it away.

[Shiloh]

I have washed them.

How soon are you gong to smelt?? Plan on hosing them down several or more days before you plan on smelting. If wet, they will certainly dry when heating them up.

SHiloh

[lightman]

Also beware that your material is not the only thing that can attract moisture. The tools, molds and ladles can build up moisture too. All in all, it sounds like you are off to a good start and well along in your "addiction".

[Nick Quick]

Ok, so I calculated some weights. The 22 lbs pot full with WW, after skimming and all gave me 31.31 lbs of lead in ingots.

Also, I finally seen with my own eyes how one zinc WW was afloat while everything else was a molten mass. The thermometer rulz. Some people told not to spend money on it but I'm happy now that I know all the temperature phases the smelting process goes through.

I almost run out of WW, what am I gonna do? I have around 600 lbs ingots only. The smelting thing is so addictive. I was hoping will last longer but is almost gone. I wanna smelt more.

[bangerjim]

Please provide full infomation on that re-melting pot you have!!!! You put in 22# of WW's and get out 31.3# of ingots. WOW. A lead-making pot. We all want one of those.

If you wanna smelt more, get a fishing net and get out there and catch those little smelts......I believe they are running right now!

HA.....ha.

banger

[OS OK]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sn3oChBpeUw

Iraqveteran8888...made the above flick about water in the lead pot. Saw this years back and forgot until now.

OS OK

[Nick Quick]

I appreciate the joke, but if you would read carefully what I wrote at the post #29 you would realize that the pot water volume is 22 lbs. How much fluid lead will come out of that pot is hard to tell from one cast to another depending on how much WW I can shove into it.

All in all, the conclusion to the thread is that I did not encounter any splash or other accident due to the fact that I washed the WW before smelting them. I carefully followed the suggestions I read here and I had no hiccup whatsoever. Now I know "how to".
Thanx again to everyone.

[lightman]

Ok, so I calculated some weights. The 22 lbs pot full with WW, after skimming and all gave me 31.31 lbs of lead in ingots.



I almost run out of WW, what am I gonna do? I have around 600 lbs ingots only. The smelting thing is so addictive. I was hoping will last longer but is almost gone. I wanna smelt more.

You wanna come to Arkansas? I've got maybe 1200 more pounds sorted and ready to smelt! :D What used to be a fun afternoon for a fit 20 something year old ended up being a tough afternoon for a worn out 50 something year old. I usually get a couple of buddies over to help. It is satisfying to turn a nasty looking bucket of scrap into a nice neat stack of useable alloy. Its even more fun after you have done enough smelts to have acquired all of the tools that you need and established a workable routine.