I have found myself at a crossroads

[Indiana shooter]

I know that y'all can't make a decision for me but sometimes the best advice comes from complete strangers that have been there but have no skin in the game for your individual situation.

That said, I have been employed with a company for 11 years now. I have worked my way up through the ranks from press operator to night shift supervisor. I make a enough money to feed my outdoor additions and support my family and I am supposedly next in line to take the production manager job if and when it opens up.

This company used to be a decent one to work for but about 6 years ago we got a new plant manager that has let it go to s***. Routine PM has taken a back seat to tooling changes and several things in the plant are just barely held together and made to work with duct tape and zip ties. (Literally) the turnover rate is ridiculous as the combined experience in production employees on my shift is less then 2 years, that's with 8 people. About a month ago I caught the shift lead and a subordinate smoking pot out back, red handed, so I sent them home and contacted the plant manager to inform him on the situation. To my surprise they were both back to work the following night. The plant manager said he can't afford to lose both of them. There are many other issues going on but I'll stop ranting now.

Anyway, I have another job opportunity that has presented itself for a bit more money and better insurance that I am considering taking. My biggest fear is having to start over again with fear of being layed off due to seniority and not being able to pay my mortgage. I also find it hard to "give up" on a place that I have been employed with over 1/3 of my life (I'm only 30). It may just be a silly pride thing but I feel like quitting this job, even to try to better myself, is quitting something I have worked my entire adult life to achieve and I have never quit anything no matter how hard it was.

The floor is now yours, thanks for any input you may give and may god bless each and every one of you. Y'all may very well be the greatest group of people I'll never have a chance to meet.

[06ackley]

About 10 years ago I was in the same position you are now.I was a supervisor at a steel stamping company,been there for 13 years and I also had worked my way up the ranks.It got to be that the job was all I thought about from the time I woke up until I went to sleep.My wife told me if I didn't do something I would have a heart attack by the time I turned 40.I quit my job and went to work for another factory while going to school for hvac.I am so much happier now than I was then and it has been the best thing I have done.It is scary to think about leaving and starting over but could be the most rewarding thing you could do.Only you can make that decision and if you are a hard worker all will work out for you.Whatever you decide I wish you the best.

[mtnman31]

As you said, you can decide best for yourself but I'll give you some food for thought. The grass isn't always greener on the other side. If you know any employees at the other place you are considering, talk to them and try to get an honest feel for the company and work conditions. If it sounds good, you may consider a move. Just remember that work happiness translates to more happiness outside of work.

Also, consider that if you are in line for a promotion at your current job, would that promotion put you in a position to better influence change and improvement in your current company? If the promotion means that your voice will be listened to, then that's good. Maybe the plant manager listens to his supervisors and you can help to improve some of the things you are unhappy with. If the promotion only brings added responsibility and not the ability to influence positive change, then I'd probably start looking for a new job.

[Wayne Smith]

It is parallel and not directly related but remember that Ronald Regan stated that he did not leave the Democratic party, the Democratic party left him. Sounds like your situation is similar.

[Sweetpea]

I left my job a year ago, after almost 7 years, but I had worked with the other guys there for many years before that with another company, where we all got laid off.

The last company was built up around me, and what I knew how to do. Built it into a fairly large company, with several branches and many employees, and endured several large pay cuts as the economy continued to decline.

It got to the point that the owners would tell me they wished they could give me a raise, and in the next breath, brag about how all of our equipment and vehicles were paid for with cash, and oh, by the way, I'll be gone to Hawaii next week.

I was quite apprehensive about switching jobs, but had one referred to me by a friend. The $ wasn't quite good enough, so I passed. The guy called me up a week later, and offered me another couple of bucks an hour, but he was about .50 short of what i thought I could take, so I again passed. A month later, he called me and offered me another couple dollars an hour, so I jumped on it.

I can't even begin to tell you how much less stress I have!

I can't begin to tell you what is right for you, but I think I would move on.

[Garyshome]

Sometimes the job change is the best thing to ever happen. It was for me more then once.

[762 shooter]

If you decide to leave for a new job don't look back. Make up your mind to accept the future whatever it may bring. No risk no reward.

Dang, that sounded like a fortune cookie or horoscope.

762

[randyrat]

Here is two sides of the coin

Unless something happens, you could last longer than the plant manager and the new plant manager turns things around. Seen a lot of good people and bad people come and go over the years, I outlasted the bad ones and glad I stayed now.

Sometimes you can smell death, the lack of concern may be that the plant manager knows something you don't..What is it? your gonna have to figure out, is there a buyout down the road. Get or keep your ducks in a row and prepare your self fiances for the future what ever it brings

[William Yanda]

You are closer to the situation than I am. My question is; How can the plant manager be operating in such a short sighted manor without his supervisors approval? Do you want to continue to work for a company which has such a short sighted approach to operating? How much longer can it continue before the piper must be paid?
If you progressed from entry level to management in 11 years, you are the same person, and can reasonably expect similar results in a new position.
I say go for it and don't look back, but what do I know. I'm hundreds of miles away, semi-retired, almost an empty-nester, and don't have a nickle in the pot.
Best regards,
Bill

[prsman23]

If it's an opportunity, you aren't quitting. You are transitioning.
Your premise is that if you leave, you have given up.

Change the premise around a little and see what feels right. Are you really leaving because you can't handle it? Or because opportunity came knocking?

The days when someone works there entire life for one company are gone. It's now up to us to decide if we have achieved what we set out to do with a particular company, and when it's time to move for growth.

[aephilli822]

Plant Manager has let it go to s*** for 6 (six) years? Sounds like his boss only cares if quota is met. (I'm assuming the Plant Manager's boss has been informed of what is happening?)
I think you should be very honest in your exit interview. If they don't do those, you should write a letter to the highest person in the company you know, calmly and clearly explaining why you left. It might help those who have to stay.

[cheese1566]

Think of yourself, no one else will.
Protect your family as the company won't.

good luck ! At least you haven't been fired or quitting before landing another opportunity .

[lightman]

Thats a tough call, my friend. You have worked hard and advanced. I would be tempted to stay. If you change jobs you will be starting at the bottom again. You will be subject to all of the things a new guy suffers. Crappy jobs, crappy hours, lay offs, ect. Good work ethics will help you move up, but you will still be the new guy for a while. Does your current job have decent benefits like vacation, insurance and retirement? Does the other job? Whether you move or stay I would begin to build an emergency fund. Try to save enough for 6 months of your current living expenses. A good worker can find a job in 6 months if you do get laid off. Good Luck with your choice.

[KAF]

Plant mnager a looser, lets druggies work there, other stuff going down the tubes. Talk to the owner or stockholders and wise them up. The plant manager is killing the place. If nothing done hit the new place.........better to chance a lay off then a closed company.

[country gent]

I worked for a large plant manufaturer in the skilled trades division ( Tool and Die maker) for 18 years and was reduced out to a production job while outside contractors were working in the plant and work we did was being sent out to job shops. I took close to $3.00 an hour pay cut going to production. I sent out resumes and got some feelers out with friends. I ended up at one of the big threes auto parts plantsn with a big pay raise much better benifits and better working conditions. It was the est move I ever made. It was a longer drive but the pay raise more than offsett it. You need to step back and think things thru some. You stated you found people using drugs and impared. Do you want to risk your wellbeing, saftey, and body parts working with these people? Do you really want to be there to see the results of it. A company that cant wont keep equipment up and enforce rules is on the way down and or out, you might ride it out. But now is the time to start looking while there is no pressure to find another job, right now you have a job you dont have to have one. This makes looking and interviewing much easier for you. Decide what needs to happen and then work towards it. Sometimes the move is the best thing to happen

[Alvarez Kelly]

It is parallel and not directly related but remember that Ronald Regan stated that he did not leave the Democratic party, the Democratic party left him. Sounds like your situation is similar.

As I was reading the original post, I thought almost the same thought as you. You are not leaving the job. The job already left you. I'd be looking real hard at other options.

Best of luck to the OP.

Now, I'll get back to reading the responses.

[jmort]

The only question I have after reading the entire thread, and especially the O/P, is whether the new company is solid, prosperous and growing? I would rather leave a ship as first mate that is going to sink and sign on with one that is in good condition. If they are union shops, then merit is not going to be properly rewarded. If the new shop is non-union, I have no doubt you can advance in short order based on merit. I am nearing the end of my career, but when I was 30, I would have picked the better company/firm, for sure, over short term $$$ or the hope of another promotion, or the hope that the company/firm would still be around in 10 years when then new company has a better shot at a longer existence. Want to know what is a blast? Living in Southern California as a dumpy middle-age/older white guy who does not speak Spanish and looking for a job after the owner of the company suddenly dies and you lose the best job you ever had. The next 20 to 30 years are the best opportunity you have at making it or breaking it, and I would go with the best company regardless of where I was on the Totem Pole. You will always have company/job "politics" to deal with no matter where you go.

[Der Gebirgsjager]

You need to pray about it and ask for guidance. Then wait a bit...things will work out for the better. You'll know what to do.

[shoot-n-lead]

Prayer sent for guidance in your decision.

[Mica_Hiebert]

Looking in on your situation I would run to the new job with flames on my feet. I spent 9 years at a career doing what I loved but never made enough money to support a growing family so I started climbing the ladder and found out how disgusted I was with the upper management in the company, I ended up taking a 7 dollar an hour pay cut to get out of there and after a couple of different jobs and promotions at my current job I believe I have once again found an actual career and am making more money than I was at my previous career. I've never looked back. They say never burn any bridges but some times that's what it takes to keep you moving forward instead of running back where you where. Good luck.

[bedbugbilly]

Equipment not being maintained . . . . large turnover in employees . . . . people doing drugs on company time and then no manner of discipline to them so one would have to assume that they are working "under the influence" . . . .
This whole scenario sounds like a train on a track approaching a trestle where there is no trestle. If the PM is allowing all of this . . he works for someone . . . and they must be allowing it as well. It sounds to me like somewhere down the road, either there is a "house cleaning" in order or the company will not survive.

You are only 30 and still young (I'm looking at this as someone who is more than twice your age). If a good opportunity presents itself, it will be much easier for you to get a job now than when you are 50.

There are no guarantees in life and even more so after the last eight years. Regardless of where you work of how long you work there, there is no guarantee that you won't go to work one day and the door will be locked. That's why it is important not to live from paycheck to paycheck but to also save along the way so that if you loose your job, you have at least enough money saved to carry you for a year of being out of work . . . not to mention saving for retirement.

But those things said . . . only you can make the decision of what is best for you and your family. Change can be good but whatever you decide, don't look back with regret and remorse . . . look ahead with the anticipation that things will be better in the end. When a door is closed . . . another one opens. Good luck to you and hope all works out for you.

[OS OK]

If you find a job that you truly enjoy doing, you will never work a day in your life. I am one of those men, now retired.
With todays standards of morale and ethics…and if you are as conscientious as said…don't worry about a new job position at the foot of the ladder…your 'performance' will stick out like a diamond in a goats butt…you will accelerate around those mediocre lads around you.
Money is absolutely necessary but not the most important thing in life…your mental health and your family is…no two ways about that.
Never, at any cost, let those around you compromise your character. In the end, your word and your character is what is remembered.

Now…do exactly what your heart is telling you is right.

OS OK

[Edward]

A new door opens ,if conditions are that bad now in these times the job (with the company) might be gone .It"s good that you are young , imagine if you were 50-60 yrs old /go for it:bigsmyl2:

[starbits]

Let us know how the new job goes.

Seriously, waiting on the production managers job at a place with high turnover, no PM and drug problems sounds like waiting on the chief bomb catchers job in the middle east. Even IF you get it there is no future in it. Take the challenge of a new job at a new place, you might even enjoy going to work again.

Starbits

[Mytmousemalibu]

I have been in those same shoes and know the feeling. Like you acknowledged, only you can decide. Listen to your heart, follow your intuition. Feelings can lead to irrational paths, they are certainly valuable and have their place, but trusting your intuition and fact is usually the safer bet.

I am about your age, little bit older but I can relate. I grew up a gearhead and mechanically gifted person, grew up at our family car lot, helping my dad fix cars. Naturally, this grew into my career path, working all automotive related jobs all the way through college. I went through Wyotech for auto tech and ended up being accepted into BMW's STEP program to be trained as a BMW tech. I worked on BMW's for the next 10yrs at the same shop. I did enjoy my work for a long time but keeping in mind, cars are all I have done and I was getting burned out on it. 20+yrs of doing it at that point though not all professionally but close enough. The shop I was at was wearing thinner on me, income was limited and less than it should be for someone of my skill set and duration of employment. There really wasn't any room for advancement either. So my other passion has always been for aviation but had no exposure to it. I did some checking around and made the commitment to go back to school and get my A&P cert. I transitioned to aviation almost 4 years ago and I have been loving it! It hasn't been all peaches & cream, I've had to endure a couple layoffs and do a little job hoping to make ends meet but that is kinda par for the course with aviation. My opportunities keep growing and though there's been a few hurdles, i'm happy, a make a good living now and enjoy it.

So if I was in your shoes, I would look at the hard facts and do some deductive reasoning. Even with being unhappy and struggling to keep my head above water income wise, when I knew I was going to quit and move on, it did feel wrong at first, I felt like maybe I was making a big mistake. Goes back to those feelings. We become emotionally invested with our routines and it can be a hard thing to cut through. The hard facts did not parallel with my emotions and in the end, my feelings were wrong, the facts were not!

[smokeywolf]

Sounds like your company is being run by a bean-counter now. Bean-counters tend to look to only next quarter's profit statement, not where the company should be 5, 10 or 20 years in the future.

Look at the overall health, and likely future of the the two companies. jmort said much of what I was thinking. The one thing I didn't see mentioned was retirement. Look carefully at which company is most likely going to have the best pension package, and don't just look at the pension check amounts, but medical coverage.

I survived multiple layoffs in the motion picture industry (some lasting over 6 months), but stuck with it because the motion picture industry has a somewhat good pension, but amazingly good medical coverage.

Be sure to not just look at your immediate future, but what you and your wife will need when you're 75 and you're taking $400.00/month in prescription medications and have to go in for that $200,000.00 surgery.

[PB234]

30 is real young and you have another 30 years of work ahead of you. If the place is being held together with bandages and the equipment falling apart how does that last another 30 years? If the new place is offering more money that too speaks loudly. Look at the new place and ask yourself how their future looks? Good product? Good plant and equipment? Decent people

[JonB_in_Glencoe]

Now, I'm sure there is more to the story. But from what I read, I'd jump Ship.
Now-a-days, moving from Job to job is the norm, and is the "NEW" usual way to get ahead.
Good Luck.
Jon

[Blackwater]

IS, you ask a very sticky question. I've had some experience with that sort of thing, and ultimately, the answer, at least in my mind, boils down to the question, "How much can you tolerate before its eating at you becomes more unbearable than the benefits. I'll tell you this, too. I've seen others in that same situation, and seen what they did. Some left and some stayed, and either can be right and either can be "wrong" in the end. Ultimately, much depends on things you have no control over.

Here are some good questions to ask that you really need to know the answers to:

1. Is there reason to beleve that the current management is likely to change soon?
2. Where can I go with my skills set to get equal or better pay/benefits?
3. Should I be putting out feelers with other companies very quietly in preparation for a move, and can I keep this from my current employers?
4. What do I REALLY want in life and how much am I willing to put up with in order to get it?

These are trying times, and there's no assurance that either way you might go, that you might wind up regretting it, whether you go or stay. That's not a lot of help, I know. Sometimes, it's best to tread water for at least a while, but sooner or later, you're going to have to answer these questions, and take an action, whether it's to stay or go. And just know ahead of time that things beyond your control or knowledge may make either way you go wind up appearing later to be "wrong," so just take your best shot, as nearly as you can see it, and just be as wise as you know how to be. That's really all any of us can do. We'll be praying for you, and a good result. That's a good idea for yourself as well.

[starmac]

Sounds like a no brainer to me, but I was never one that thought I had to have any certain job, with any certain company. There is basically no gaurantee of any security at any job, sounds like you would be happier at a new one.

[robg]

Its always easier to get a job when you've got a job .sounds like your place is in decline .do you really want to be there in 30years?the only things you'll regret are what you didn't do.see what else is about on the quiet and go from there.

[Char-Gar]

I have quite a bit of faith in most folks ability to process information and come to conclusions. You are a unique individual and your situation is unique as well. What does your heart/gut/instincts tell you to do. Most likely that is more reliable than all this nit-picking back and forth over small points.

"The heart has reasons, that reason cannot know".......Blase Pascal

[Yodogsandman]

Sure wish I'd moved on about 25 years ago with just about your time in. I chose job security.

[Indiana shooter]

Thankyou so much for y'alls input so far. Yes there is a bit more to the story than what I have said. The biggest part is my old supervisor is now the production manager, next in line for the plant manager job. He and I have the same idea of how the place should be ran and I have a great deal of respect for that man. I truly feel if he took over the company would once again become a good place to work. He tells me that corporate is watching the plant manager very closely and I should stick around a bit longer to see how it plays out.

We normally only worked a 4 day 40 hour week followed by a 5 day 50 hour week. Now what has happened is the current plant manager has allowed people to stay employed when they miss 2 times a week for months on end (we don't have a point system) so obviously we loose production. Once a couple started doing that then several others followed suit. It is partially because of this we have had to pull significantly more hours. Over the course of about the last year and a half I have averaged around 68 hours a week. This obviously takes away time with my family, that alone kills me.

[reddog81]

Sounds like a good opportunity. Is the new company as stable or more so than the current company? Leaving after 10 years is hard to do if you like working there, but you have to do whats best for yourself and not your employer...

[Plate plinker]

Don't make the mistake of staying in a job to long I have. Move on its the best thing you can do.

[454 shooter]

When I was 24 years old, I had worked for a very reputable contractor in my area, known for high quality custom homes. We took pride in our work. After 4 1/2 years on the job I was not really happy there, I just didn't realize it. The money was not there and raises were almost nonexistent, but it was my job.

Another guy was hired to work and we all had to go behind him to fix everything that he did. He was careless and dangerous. He quit after a week and came back three days later. He and I had the day to work by ourselves and he had a plan to get us all big raises and change the way we did things, blah, blah, blah. He showed me his pay stub as he had already gotten his big raise. I was the highest paid guy on the crew at $8.25, he had quit at $10 and came back at $13 per hour.

That was a big straw on the camels back. I left and on the way home prayed to the Lord that I was not looking for a job but if one came along I would consider it. I told a friend that before going to the funeral home for a brother at church that night. While there, another brother came to me with a job offer saying he had meant to ask me for a few years. This was all within 3 hours of the first prayer.
When I got back in the truck I prayed again" Lord, I know what I said, is this for real". Over the next two weeks I had seven people call me with job offers.

Well, I can be pretty dense but I did take another job, with a vacation between. I started dating a lovely young girl that I would marry and in 18 months would go on to start my own construction business. Now 22 years later the business is still going and lovely young girl is still by my side.

My point is, trust in the Lord with all of your heart; and lean not unto thy own understanding. In all thy ways acknowledge him, and He will direct your path.

[leeggen]

Our plant had some of the same things happening. We would send someone home and the PM brought them back so the verbal go home became write-ups andthat forced the PM to rethink cause of the paper trail. Uper management noticed and he took a hike an a really good guy moved up. With in a few weeks he also became a different person, upper management was pulling his strings and the bottom line was more important. Didn't take long maintenance went crasy muti brake downs every shift. Point being the future with a person you think would turn a plant around doesn't always go the way you think. Take a step back and look the job and the future it brings, be honest. Then decide what you really are looking at and decidewhat job you want. Sometimes less presure is better.
CD

[KYCaster]

A few points to consider..........

1) While you may feel loyal to the company, the company has no loyalty to you. It may have been different in the past, but not today.

2) Your pay raises will not keep pace with the increase in the salary required to attract new employees.

3) If the company fails because of poor management, will that adversely affect your ability to find another job?

4) The best chance you have to increase your income is to change jobs every 3 to 5 years.

Jerry

[Hick]

I'm not sure I could make such a tough decision myself, but I do believe (being much older now) that the older you get, the tougher it will be to change jobs, as you will be closer to retirement and less able to recover.

[pmer]

There is some really good advice here. When I was in my 30's I would not have thought much about a move. But with the OP in a shift leader position and the possibility of change coming I would think waiting 6 - 12 months wouldn't hurt.
I don't know what to say about the pot heads coming back to work on your shift. start a paper trail at work for own protection. Don't be left holding the bag if one of them get hurt on the job and insurance companies get involved.

Like Miley Cirus trewking - what was seen can't be unseen LOL

Edit:

[mozeppa]

i quit my job at 39.
started my own company with nothing.
made in my first year 3 times what i made my last year with them.
in 4 years i made almost 10 times my last year with them!
my job is service based ...so all i needed was a business phone and hand tools.

but anything is possible.

do what your conscience tells you....today is ripe for possibilities ...yesterday is history ...tomorrow a mystery.

[dverna]

jmort gave good advice. If your under 50, changing jobs could be your best option.

Companies cut down on maintenance and upgrading to make their cashflow look better. Your current company could be preparing for a sale, and the sale price will be a multiple of cashflow.

[FredBuddy]

Go. Within hours, the relief you feel will be amazing!

[Echo]

Plant mnager a looser, lets druggies work there, other stuff going down the tubes. Talk to the owner or stockholders and wise them up. The plant manager is killing the place. If nothing done hit the new place.........better to chance a lay off then a closed company.
I agree with KFE - I believe that you owe the owners your opinion. If possible talk to the owners and tell them how the Plant Manager has hurt the company with his managerial style, and that you have had an offer from another company, including putting them at risk allowing criminal behavior, that you would rather stay with them, but that the PM's style is ruining the workplace, and you can't stand it. They may make you the Plant Manager! Maybe not - and if they aren't receptive, change jobs and love the new place.
On the other hand, if you have NO access to the owners, press on with the job change. There is only so much we can do.

[Handloader109]

I'd be jumping ship, I stayed with a sinking ship for 6years hoping it would turn around. Get out and on with your life. Drugs on the job seems pretty severe, people don't think pot is bad, but it impairs.

[southpaw]

Unless there was some way to guarantee that the job offer would still be there down the road I would jump ship. That is making the presumption that they are on a better path and have a market for their product. Lots of great points brought up by everyone else, I would really consider how long the better job offer will be on the table. The ship could start sinking or sink and the only job offers out there might not be much better.

I doubt that it will take you very long to work your way up in a new company.

Best of luck

Jerry Jr.

[geezer56]

GO! I work for a company that is a tier one supplier to the automotive industry. At 65, I am getting ready to retire. Coming here was the best thing I ever did. I left a company that was in the decline to come here. That company was in the same boat as yours. Lay-offs, no maintenance, no raises, no upgrades to processes or equipment were the norm. It was like a rock was rolled off my chest when I drove out of the parking lot for the last time.

[Safeshot]

Short and sweet: Be polite, Move out, Move up, Embrace the change, Enjoy the new job and Thrive in it.

[dragon813gt]

My story for what it's worth. I am 36 so only a little older than the OP. I was at a company for 15 years. I moved my way up and eventually created a new position for myself in the company. It was a great place to work until around 2008. The financial crisis seemed to cause the owner to snap. He always micromanaged but things got really bad.

I was worried about job security so I stuck it out. But I started brining all the problems home which wasn't good. I was very well compensated which was the one redeeming quality about the place. Healthcare got worse every year and retirement was nonexistent.

Come the spring of 2015 I started looking for a new job. This weighed heavy because at the time my son was less than a year old. I was also home every day to care for him. Long story not so short I took a position at another company and started in early October of last year.

I took a significant pay cut when I left. This job has me traveling all over the world. It does suck to not see my son every day. But I have a lot more vacation time and a great healthcare plan. And long term I will be making a lot more than I previously did. Don't be scared to leave a company. It's true that the grass isn't always greener on the other side. But you won't know unless you see it for yourself.

[1989toddm]

While I haven't been where you are exactly, I switched jobs at the beginning of 2016 from $50,000 a year to approx $30,000. Reason is I couldn't live with my conscience because I was working 15-18 hrs a day 80% of 2015. My family is so much more important than my job, period! I am so thankful for a supporting wife through it all and that God is making it work on what seems like low income. We are happy, healthy, have a roof over our heads, and aside from the loaner truck until mine gets rolling again, we owe no one.
I know my reasons are a bit different than the OP's, but one more thing.
Don't get so caught up in taking care of the Urgent, that you neglect the Important things/people in your life. God bless you in your decision.

[Blackwater]

An awful lot of these decisions hinge on whether we've been wise in avoiding accumulating too much debt too early in life, and before we're as "secure" in our position as we really CAN be at the time. Debt is a burden that holds many in jobs that wind up ruining the family life, so your assessment of how important things like that are to you is also crucial.

Very difficult position, and it WILL be unless and until you find a better option and position. Can you move to another area? This is also a big part of it. None of us LIKE moving, but sometimes, it can be a real boon to us. No way any of us here can make such a decision for you, but I hope some of us have helped organize your thoughts so you can make the best decision possible for you and your family. Just remember, nothing in life is permanent, and we all go through changes and transitions along our way. I think I heard or read somewhere that the AVERAGE number of jobs people hold in life today is 3-4, and more isn't uncommon. Many of these are upward moves, or work out that way eventually, but nothing guarantees that. If you wait around, though, for a guarantee, you'll sit where you are forever, 'cause guarantees just don't come along often in this life. It's an adventure, not a destination. Good luck.

[fatnhappy]

As someone that has walked your shoes I would say this:

You already know the best choice. The vast majority of people will stay on a sinking ship rather than trade the devil they know for the one they don't. Ask yourself this question, "how bad would the new job need to be to be worse than this one?"
You know what you should do. Like the nike commercial, just do it.

I would also advise this, you should parlay your supervisory experience into another supervisory job, or better. Climbing the ladder doesn't necessarily mean you need to start at the bottom with a new employer. If the new offer doesn't suit you keep looking.

Dean

[Nose Dive]

Mmmm... I read this thread several times. I suggest you do so also. There is a lot of good insight and 'work history' and astute advice from men like you. Men who started at the bottom, as you did, and by their work ethic, moved up, as you did. This to me is the big insight here. Simply, you can do better.

You have the desire, insight and work ethic to achieve. So, I believe you will do so no matter where you go. Now, let's be smart.

As to your current job..mmm... A Manager who allows employees to smoke pot on site, during work hours, when they should be working, is not a man to trust or work for. And, the pot smokers are endangering your work space, your JOB. If he allows them to smoke pot on the job, heck, he may be doing the same thing. A plant of pot smokers is not a safe plant in which to work. If you are in the hospital...or jail,,,you cannot provide for your family. To me, in my opinion, your and your family are in danger.

I have moved jobs many, many times. When I see that the job, the plant, the role I am in is 'stagnant'.... I move on. Look around, apply, ask, and network your skills. There are good jobs out there, but they are becoming harder to find. This is not the 70's when you could drag up on Friday and find a new job on Monday. We are in a GLOBAL economy...YOUR competition is not down the street or in another state...your competition is in CHINA, Japan, Mexico, Venezuela. [do I sound like Donald Trump?] So, be coy... be smart...don't prod-cast your desire to move on...keep cool and start looking.. get on the internet... and look for places to go. HIRE WIRE,,START WIRE...GLASS DOOR,,,WEEKLYJOBS... build a resume...get it on the net...RESUME BUILDER will help or PM me and I will help you build your resume. BEYOND....INDEED, LinkedIn...are all job websites that will scan the jobs on the net and send you EMAIL about jobs you describe. Take charge,,,but be coy, quiet, smart.....

BUT..be sure now... YOU must control your destiny... YOU MUST LEAVE ON YOUR TERMS...not the company's. I will use the word "CLANDESTINE". Be secretive,,,be quiet...be smart! I have used many days of vacation to go on job interviews in new plants. You do not want your boss to walk in and say...'hay man, I heard you're wanting to quit, so, your fired!'.... Leave on your terms and this means being 'quiet and smart'.

OK, enough about mehtodolgy. Now, let's consider the way your 'feel' about leaving. As mentioned above, 'they left you'. A hard working, responsible man who sent home pot smokers only to have them return the next shift is ridiculous. Move on son. Find a new place and really, you will not be 'beginning all over again', as your reputation and work ethic will have secured the new position for you. You will have a 'reputation' that precedes you in the new work place, or, you would not have secured the job. Yes, you will have to prove yourself, but, you did it before, do it again!

And...be ready to move... I mean move out of state. Many companies will pay to move you. Or, give you a relo allowance. I have move 10 times to new jobs...all on company moving allowances.

And lastly...as the fellas mentioned above...DON"T LOOK BACK!! Look to the future of your new job and the benefits it will provide you and your family for years to come!! I never ever, in my 10 or 12 job changes over 40 years ever once thought I had made a mistake.

OK.. to finish this little job move soliloquy, Time is Ticking. More guys are taking breaks and smoking pot and productivity and quality is suffering. As a Supervisor, this all reflects on YOU.

Get cracking son. PM me if you need resume help. And again for the umpteenth time... keep your plans for your career under your hat.

Nose Dive

Cheap, Fast, Good. Kindly pick two.

PS:... OK...one last 'war story' to make another point.

If your are working in a place where the leadership is, well, a bunch of idiots,...be sure..at some finite point in time...somebody...somewhere will notice it. And if your in the 'bunch'...well, it's too late....your are 'guilty by association'....

I worked in a plant where a newly hired plant engineer was a complete, total idiot. I knew it, my boss knew it and we both decided to move on. At one time, he actually had three different crews working against each other. Jeeezzzz.

So, my boss left, three weeks later I left. He went to Michigan, I went to Louisiana. New plants, new refineries.

Four weeks after we left, well, some one woke up and fired the plant engineer Idiot and his three Superintendents. Four men fired, four families with unemployed bread winners. If OSHA hears of your management 'condoning' pot use by refusal to apply discipline...well...look out... The company will 'clean house' of manager, superintendents and supervisors just to 'save face' and avoid the fines that go along with it.

Don't get caught in the 'house cleaning'....

ND

[facetious]

If you can pull off the switch to a better job with a future do it, at 30 you are still looking at a lot of years to go.

I know what it is like to work for a bunch of A Holes. I started working in newspaper 37 years ago. I have had the name on my pay check change three times and I still have the same locker. And I can tell you it never got any better. The shop i work in has slowly turned from a newspaper in to a job shop printing stuff for every other paper. For the last year I have been working on runs for Gannett. We get graded on quality every quarter. In the last year our crew has went from about 37 to #5 in the country. we start at 7:30 pm and the shift is over at 3:00 am, but our dead line is 1:00 am. When you get done you get to go home and still get payed for the hole shift as kind of a incentive pay. So to night I find out that having met our deadlines all year that thy are cutting our hours to 30 hours a week. That is a 400.00 $ a month cut (take home) . So much for busting your butt so that the trucks can get out on time. We have to bid for our markups every year so now I have to choose my markup for the next year and get to stay with this markup or pick between a 33 hour shift and only lose 160.00 and have five shifts starting at the same time or a 35 hour markup with five different start times but get a full weeks pay. ( we have a 35 hour week as full time) I am doing the care giver thing for my wife so it is a lot easy'er working nights to get things done and trying to make appointments, but if you starting time runs from 3:00 pm to 9:00 pm and you are working till any were from 1:00am to 4:00am and your not getting up and going till noon it is a real PIA some weeks. So it is starting to look like I will be going to the 33 hour markup to get five sifts all starting at 7:00 pm. That way I can still have some time and it is a lot easy'er getting dinner ready. Well thank you letting me ***** a bout my job, I get to tell the wife when I get up tomorrow.

The only good thing I can say is I only have three more years till I can quit.

[shooterg]

Pot smoking at work allowed ? Leave. Now.

[atr]

I changed jobs 3 times mainly because I wanted to find new challenges and new work experience (I'm a structural engineer). I lasted an average of 7 years at each different company and my job skills improved at each. I too had a family and a mortgage to support so I always made certain that I had a job to go to before I left the old one. My philosophy was that I was not running from something but going to something. So after 21 years of corporate engineering I really was very tired of it and so decided to go out on my own. I quit my job ($58,000/year) and started my own consulting business. The first year on my own I made about $20,000, which put a big strain on the family finances. I was fortunate in that my family supported me even though my lack of salary affected their lives.
I believe if you are unhappy with your work environment then you will bring that unhappiness home with you and that is not a good thing. If changing jobs improves your mental attitude (if not the bottom line) then that in itself is a very positive reason to change jobs.
Protect your family, move toward new goals and challenges and remember "the only constant is change"

I wish you the best of luck in your decision

atr
ps...I am 70 now and have been successfully working on my own since 1992

[1989toddm]

I believe if you are unhappy with your work environment then you will bring that unhappiness home with you and that is not a good thing. If changing jobs improves your mental attitude (if not the bottom line) then that in itself is a very positive reason to change jobs.
Protect your family, move toward new goals and challenges and remember [I]"the only constant is change"


Very good advice here. [emoji106]

[Diver07]

Agreed that there's a lot of good advice. I'm in a similar situation as the original post, not quite so many years in, but I think I'll be reading this several times as I contemplate my next move.