Boolit Weight for 308 Winchester...

[BCB]

O.K., I've decided on the 308 Winchester cartridge for my Encore 24" barrel...

Now, I am wondering what boolit weight I should consider. The Encore has a 1:10 twist and I am looking to shoot in 1400-1800 fps range...

Heavier boolits or lighter boolits?...

I have some Lee 150's and the 311041...

Vote in the poll and make comments if needed...

Thanks...BCB

[osteodoc08]

What is the purpose of the loading? Plinking? Hunting? Paper punching?

[BCB]

What is the purpose of the loading? Plinking? Hunting? Paper punching?

I would say mostly just shooting from my bench at steel silhouettes or paper out to 300 yards...

So, I suppose accuracy might be the main thing. Probably not hunting at all...

I don't care if it is a "slow club" just so it "rainbows" into the target...

Thanks...BCB

[Harter66]

I've been pleasently surprised by the NOE 311-230 in a 1-12 30-30 it was just a geewiz let's see what happens opportunity. It is a very slippery boolit also . I didn't chronograph the load but by Strelok it needs only about 1550 fps to carry legal energy well past 100 yd. 100 yd zero nets a 16" hold over at 200 .

[Kraschenbirn]

My old McGowan-barreled M700 (1-10 twist) really likes the RCBS 30-165SIL and H4198. Accuracy doesn't quite match the sub-MOA I get with 168 gr. SMKs but comes awfully close (if I'm having a good day;)).

Bill

[runfiverun]

that 165 gr silhouette boolit at 1850-1900 fps is gonna be hard to beat.
I also like the accurate 31-165=A.
it will carry higher velocity's and will turn in stellar accuracy too, that might be because it was designed around the 308's throat.
you don't need no fancy alloy for either of them to work and a 310 sizer is alright for all of my 30 cal rifles.

[Clay M]

For cast bullets in the .308 I like the 180-200 gr bullets.
For jacketed I like the 175-185

[Artful]

I would look at mid weights - you can get lighter and heavier but if shooting at steel at distance I'd go with midweight.

[Scharfschuetze]

300 yards? I'm in the heavy boolit camp for that and I do it quite a bit with old military rifles in 30/06. They almost always have a 1 in 10 twist and with the Lyman heavy boolit designs like the 311299, 311284 and 311334 at 1,800 fps I enjoy good results out to double what you want to do at 300 yards.

Give the heavies a try for long range. They buck the wind better for less needed deflection in your sights than lighter designs and they hit gongs and what ever else you are shooting at with enough authority that you get immediate feedback.

For shorter range shooting in my carbines I like the Lyman 311041 or the RCBS 30-150-SP or the 30-180-SP. Perhaps for a one mould solution you might try that RCBS 30-180-SP.

[OS OK]

That 1:10 twist is designed to spin up a 175 grain or heavier to any distance you want to shoot.

[TenTea]

that 165 gr silhouette boolit at 1850-1900 fps is gonna be hard to beat.

you don't need no fancy alloy for them to work and a 310 sizer is alright for all of my 30 cal rifles.

I recently took this advice (So, thanks rfr!) for my first foray into cast rifle loading for a Rem700 and now an old Krag.
Excellent initial results on paper with a moderate charge of Unique.
I will give a couple different powders a try this spring and develop a *standard load.*

[BCB]

I have a Lee mold that is ~150 grains, I have the 311041 @~174 grains, and I see reference to the 311299 many times in some of The Fouling Shoot mags that I have from a few years gone by...

I guess the 311299 would get me to the 200 grain range...

Is that a bore riding design. I really have never had much luck with that design. Don't ask me why as I know many have had very good accuracy with them. It just seems there is not much surface area on that boolit to engrave into the rifling?...

Thanks...BCB

[Clay M]

That 1:10 twist is designed to spin up a 175 grain or heavier to any distance you want to shoot.

My 1:10 rifle loves the 175's

[MostlyLeverGuns]

For targets the heavier pointed bullets work better if the is any wind. I use the 311299 and 311332 in the .308, usually with 20-25 grains Reloader 7.

[runfiverun]

BCB the rsbs silh boolit is just about all bore rider.
it relies heavily on the nose to work but has a stopper at the base to block the gas and grip the rifling.
the key to a bore ride boolit is to get engraving on that nose when you chamber it.
it helps align the boolit to the bore and grabs the rifling spinning up the boolit without skidding.
without the engraving you are just pushing a long piece of lead in the barrel at whatever angle the case happens to be sitting in the chamber.
get the cases fire-formed and straight to the barrel, get the nose diameter up to about .301 and making marks when chambered and your results will improve.
you might even want to try water dropping or consider a harder alloy for more accuracy.
the speeds and pressures are fairly low with the bore ride boolit types you can get away with a harder alloy and manipulate the nose diameter at the same time by doing so.

the nose diameter and straightness is the key here.

TenTea:
try the slower powders 17-18grs of 2400 shoots well for me and 28.5grs of imr 4895 with a filler is as close to a match round as I have shot with the rcbs boolit.
there are other powders that will do the same 3031/H-322 that need a filler too.
and some that don't need a filler, Enforcer [just got 2 lbs of this yesterday] or AA-4100, mp-300,AA#9,Alliant's 410, are all right in there and should be findable right now.
all of them should do well in the 16-18gr area.

[TenTea]

...28.5grs of imr 4895 with a filler is as close to a match round as I have shot with the rcbs boolit.

I have this powder on hand.
I assume the above powder charge is for .308?
Is a filler necessary in the .308 or .30-40 case?
If so, what material is used?
Thanks for the input.

[Menner]

I called NOE and got a 30XCB Mold I am not shooting HV but like the design so I figured I would give it a run
Weighs 171gr gas checked
Driving at an average of 1850fps COWW with 2% tin HT 1hr at 375 degrees tumble lubed In Lee Alox
10 twist barrel
shoots a ragged hole at 100
this past Sunday shot a 5 shot group 1 3/16" at 200 and a 2 1/4" 10 shot group at 200
have not shot it past 200 yet
Tony

[runfiverun]

it works in either the 308 or the 30-40 Krag I shoot both the load and the boolit in my bolt gun 308 and model 95 30-40.
as far as filler I have used about 1 gr of Dacron and 1 gr of dryer lint [cotton towel dryer lint with dog hair]
and yes dog hair dryer lint shoots better than cat hair dryer lint :lol:

either way make damn sure the filler sits down on the powder and is slightly compressed by the base of the boolit.
I use that same load in the 30-06 with a little more filler for deer hunting and swap the boolit out for the
rcbs 30-150 fngc.
it insures I have consistent ignition and the velocity doesn't change no matter if I shoot up or down hill.

[runfiverun]

the XCB boolit is patterned off the 30-06 throat but the 308 throat is so super close that it will shoot very well in it.
a harder alloy is generally required to get the velocity increase the boolit is designed for.
the oven treated alloy should allow it to work quite nicely up into the 2200 fps area without any excess drama.
the alloy Tony shows above is similar to mine except for the extra Tin he uses and I heat treat to 400-f.
I generally get a bhn in the 24 range.

[TenTea]

I now have additional reason to collect more gun-related somethings: dog towel dryer lint

Thanks much! [smilie=p:

[Friar_Tuck]

In my various 308s over the years, I always seem to end up back at 165 grain.

[Randy C]

168 gr burger VLDs shoot good in my browning BAR 2 Safari, but it likes the 165gr Core lock style bullets also. It has a 1-10 twist

[CraigOK]

I like A-max in 168, followed by Hornady Hpbt in 168 for my 1 in 10 308s

[Mk42gunner]

Heavier boolits have always been easier to get good groups from for me than lighter ones. I admit I have not tried the mid weights, if you already have them, try them. We may all be surprised.

Robert

[mdi]

Parameters too wide. I bet if you separated out another couple weight categories, mebbe 150-160 and 160- 180 you'd get a lot more pertinent info...

[BCB]

Thanks for the info...

Started a new thread...

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?303647-Decision-308-Winchester-But&p=3598464#post3598464

BCB

[OS OK]

I didn't take the poll because without specifying barrel twist this is more or less…"Which boolit weight do you like to shoot in a .308?"

My 700 varmiter with the 1:12 twist will not spin the 175+g. j-variety at extreme range as well as a 1:10 so I am stuck with the 168g. BTHP. No objections there but I'd rather lob a heavier round at extreme…they (all weights) fall in like mortar rounds but if 'spun up' correctly they come in making round holes. On the other side, if a round is 'over spun' at extreme it doesn't want to go nose down due to the gyroscopic stabilization overpowering its trajectory on the down end of the line of the bullets path.

TiborasaurusRex…in his 'sniper 101 series' of vids goes into more depth of physics and application than most people ever wanted to know…it's truly for the 'enquiring minds want to know crowd'. He is a shooter and backs up everything he teaches with vids of himself shooting beer cans off a post at 1,100 yds. No joke! … https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCqymwlCbVwpMnSLrd-NAQJQ

[flint45]

My old 98 mauser vz 24 convertd to .308 shoots the lee 185 gr. sized .312 and 18.5 gr. 2400 great and my Rem 600 and my M1A shoot the 168 j-word like no tomarrow.

[Don Fischer]

I've tried 150 to 200gr jacketed bullet's in 308. Best shooting were the 165gr and 180gr. 150 and 200 didn't shoot as well, but both would be adequate accuracy wise.

[trapper9260]

I didn't take the poll because without specifying barrel twist this is more or less…"Which boolit weight do you like to shoot in a .308?"

My 700 varmiter with the 1:12 twist will not spin the 175+g. j-variety at extreme range as well as a 1:10 so I am stuck with the 168g. BTHP. No objections there but I'd rather lob a heavier round at extreme…they (all weights) fall in like mortar rounds but if 'spun up' correctly they come in making round holes. On the other side, if a round is 'over spun' at extreme it doesn't want to go nose down due to the gyroscopic stabilization overpowering its trajectory on the down end of the line of the bullets path.

TiborasaurusRex…in his 'sniper 101 series' of vids goes into more depth of physics and application than most people ever wanted to know…it's truly for the 'enquiring minds want to know crowd'. He is a shooter and backs up everything he teaches with vids of himself shooting beer cans off a post at 1,100 yds. No joke! … https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCqymwlCbVwpMnSLrd-NAQJQ
I seen most of his vids and i seen that one and I was thinking this guy is really good at what he is doing and for posting how to do it also.

[OS OK]

I seen most of his vids and i seen that one and I was thinking this guy is really good at what he is doing and for posting how to do it also.

I love that kids approach in life…he's young and informed but he has some 'old school' qualities that I enjoy…he is all 'up front', been there…done that just as a matter of fact…no brag.

charlie

[dh2]

I am using a Accurate mold 31=180B as my 30cal. multi purpose boolit I use it for .308 Win, 30=06 Spr. and .300 Win. Mag. and push it with IMR 4198 out of all of them

[Lloyd Smale]

ive killed quite a few deer and black bear with cup and core 150s. For the last few years ive used 130 speer hps in my Kimber because that's what it shoots well and with anything else its mediocre at best. 7 deer with that bullets so far and the most ive seen one take is two leaps before piling up. Shots out to 250 yards. I had exit wounds on every deer and some impressive damage inside. I do wish it would shoot a 150 well though. Id just feel better about it. If your just talking cast heavier is about allways better. You cant push them much more then 2000fps anyway so you might as well have metplat and weight. personaly for big game id feel much better about 35 cal rifle then a 30. Shot a few deer early in my casting hobby with a 3030 using cast bullets and they didn't impress me much.

[Bigslug]

Back in the day, black powder was the limiting factor to velocity, and the answer for long range was bigger bullets with greater momentum.

Today, cast bullets are your limiting factor to velocity, but bigger bullets are still the answer.

Your TC has a 1-10 twist which was born for the 220 round nose of the .30-40 Krag. Give the 202 grain Lyman 311299 a try. NOE makes a copy, which they call the .311-202, that was my easiest cast accuracy workup in a .30-06 to date. They also make a 195 grain flat nose which shoots almost as well if you intend it as a meatgetter.

[robg]

For lead I recon if its going slower it should be heavier.

[HangFireW8]

So the OP posts a wide-open vague question, abandons the thread without supplying specifics, and discussion goes on without him... what is wrong with this picture?

[BCB]

So the OP posts a wide-open vague question, abandons the thread without supplying specifics, and discussion goes on without him... what is wrong with this picture?

I’m uncertain as to what your post means…

I look at this thread every time I get notification of a post. I have been looking at the poll results…

I realize the poll is a bit vague, but it has shown the vast majority believe the mid-range weight to be possibly the best. I sort of did that on purpose as listing too many boolit weights would cause even more decisions to be made as the results might be more evenly spread…

I try to evaluate each comment…

I think many threads go on and on without the original poster making comments, but maybe sitting back and observing as I am. Other people reading the thread subject might pick up a tip or two also…

In post #26 I thanked those who took the time to post so I have a good representative amount of information to choose from…

Sorry if I am doing something wrong…

Good-luck…BCB

[HangFireW8]

I'm glad you got something out of it. All I see is a very vague question, no clarification, a thank you and a meandering bunch of replies grasping at straws.

[Butchman205]

Hey BCB...
I cast several different weights for .308...but I'm liking this NOE mould I just got. It's a 3 cavity 195gr, and drops at @ 198gr with coww.

Hit me with a pm if you want to try a few of the cast 195's 165's, or 150's I'm making. If you like one of them, it'd save you some $ determining a good weight/design projectile for what you're doing.

-Butch

[BCB]

Hey BCB...
I cast several different weights for .308...but I'm liking this NOE mould I just got. It's a 3 cavity 195gr, and drops at @ 198gr with coww.

Hit me with a pm if you want to try a few of the cast 195's 165's, or 150's I'm making. If you like one of them, it'd save you some $ determining a good weight/design projectile for what you're doing.

-Butch

I greatly appreciated that offer...

Another poster on this website sent me a couple different designs also--So far, I am having some success with the first "heavy weight" I tried. I am now working on the 2nd boolit design he sent...

I'll send you a PM...

Thanks...BCB

[BCB]

A bit of an update, as I CERTAINLY HAVE NOT ABANDONED this thread. Been reading here and looking at all the groups I have shot so far and comparing and everything else that goes with this “dang” hobby! Many many variables as we know…

To date, I have tried 4 different boolit designs, with another 2, maybe 3 in the future. I have used 14 different powders…

With the boolits I cast, I could be “free-wheeling” and shoot as many as I pleased. The 311041 that I use in all my 30-30 Winchesters with WC-860 or WC-852, is sort of O.K. in the 308 using IMR-7383, yet it can be a bit erratic at times. It is the one that I have accepted as best for that boolit—but it is not a “beer can killer” at 150 yards by any stretch of the imagination. With the donation of the boolits a member of this site sent me, I had to do some thinking and use them wisely. With the 311299 (sized 0.311”) he sent me, I have fired a dozen 3-shot groups. I picked the best 2 groups at 50 yards (that is where I started the group process) and then fired them at 100 yards. Now I am down to one group at 100 yards that shows some pretty good promise. I have saved 8 boolits to do my final testing of the 311299. So far, IMR-4227 is the winner—I must say I am a bit surprised…

I am glad I purchased the QuickLoad program some time back as it includes another program called QuickTarget. With the known impact of the boolits at 50 yards, I can have it calculate where impact might be at 100 yards. That way I don’t have to fire a round for effect to see if I am even on the paper. That saves me a “precious” boolit from the donors! So far, the program has kept me on the paper at 100 yards when P.O.I. is known at 50 yards and velocities are calculated by QuickLoad—even though they may not be completely correct they are 8.5”x11” of paper correct at 100 yards. I can fire a 3-shot group and not have to waste a boolit…

I am now working with the RCBS 30-180-SP (sized 0.311”) the donor also sent me. I have only fired 3 different groups with it. So I am yet certain of what powder might be the “magic bullet” so to speak. SR-4759 put 3 into a bit less than 0.6” so it might be a contender…

I was hoping for 75% one-inch groups at 100 yards with this Encore, but that may be too much to expect—or at least now it seems…

I must say that this has been a “bad dream”. It hasn’t reached the nightmare stage yet, but who knows!...

There is no doubt that the barrel on this Encore is over-sized as some of the bore riders will fall into the muzzle end. They will also enter the end of a 30-30 Contender, but it does take very minimal push to get it there. So, there is some resistance. Interesting, an old Marlin 336’s muzzle won’t even let the bore rider enter—must be a dang tight bore—a pretty good shooter for me and open sights…

So that’s the way it is today. Hopefully something will be found that will work as I hope. If not, the entire firearm might need sent back to T/C…S&W—this I dread and hope doesn’t happen…

Thanks all…

BCB