Heavy boolts for 38/357

[Driver man]

Ive been shooting mainly 148 and 158 grain swc in my GP100 with reasonable accuracy. Ive been wondering if anyone shoots heavier boolits and if so with what sort of accuracy. I'm thinking along the lines of 200grain using a soft alloy .Only molds I can see are for rifle and are GC types.

[Scharfschuetze]

I sometimes use a 180 grain truncated cone design in my Model 28 Smith, but only because I load it for my Marlin 1894 rifle and I often have a bunch of the rounds loaded. Other than using a round that'll work in both the revolver and rifle, I'm not sure that it has any advantage over 158 grain boolit in the revolver.

At one time I tried the RCBS 35-200 GC design as an experiment in a long cylinder K Frame smith with good results, but again, I'm not sure it was worth the effort other than checking the block and saying that I did it.

I don't know what your cylinder length is, but some of the rifle design boolits may require you to use 38 Special brass in order for the meplat not to extend past your cylinder face.

I'll bet the heavy boolit concept would work well in the old 357 Maximum cartridge.

[P Flados]

I am in the half that finds Lee molds quite functional.

It is hard to beat the production vs. cost factor of a Lee 6 cavity. The 2 cavity is also a real cheap "lets try something new" choice.

I shoot the new C358-200-RF as "checkless" and I push it pretty hard in my 357 max.

I think I can get away with BLL only in my TC, but my Dan Wesson will probably not be happy without my ASBB HF red PC.

A web search says a GP100 has a cylinder length of 1.61".

The spec for a 38/357 rim is 0.060"

This indicates your max OAL 1.67".

You can crimp in the groove with a 38 case and get OAL in the 1.63" - 1.64" range (post 41 in the thread below has more OAL info).

The 38 case can handle the pressure of a full power 357's fine, but you need to keep hot loads away from any 38 special guns.

The safest approach is to shorten some 357 cases just enough to use the 200 gr while crimping over the front band.

The C358-200-RF is discussed at the link below. See post 50 for the 200 gr 38 & 357 load data I found:

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?283606-New-LEE-design-358-200-RF (http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?283606-New-LEE-design-358-200-RF)

[Lead Fred]

Elmer Kieth's 358439 (HP) 358429 (FN) are all I use now for the 357.

[Bzcraig]

I shoot the NOE 360180 with great accuracy using 2400 and 4227 out of my GP100 6"

[dragon813gt]

MP 359640 which is 170 gains and NOE 360180 which is 180 grains. Anything heavier and you get into longer rifle bullets. I will get a bigger gun if I need to shoot bullets heavier than 180 grains.

[fecmech]

If accuracy is what you are looking for take a look at the lighter bullets such as the Lee 125 rf or the Lee 120 tc. Both are very accurate bullets in both .357 pistols and rifles. I have had better luck with them than the 158's.

[Scharfschuetze]

As a follow up to my original post using a heavy 200 grain rifle boolit, I took this photo to demonstrate the possible length issues you may run into using a longer rifle type boolit.

With a 38 Special case, OAL using the crimp groove is about: 1.655"
With a 357 Mangnum Case, OAL using the crimp groove is about: 1.785"

It's been years since I checked the block with this boolit in a revolver, but if memory serves me, I used a 38 Special case and crimped the lip of the case over the top driving band above the crimping goove of the boolit. Doing so, let me shoot the concoction out of magnum S&W K Frame revolvers with their fairly long cylinder.

Like I said earlier, checked that block, and I don't need to do it again, although at moderate velocities, it shot directly to the sights on my fixed sight Model 65 service revolver at 25 yards which was nice. The gas check was superfluous as I really never got the boolit going fast enough to need it.

Keep in mind that long for diameter boolits at lower velocities require a fairly fast twist (rifling) rate to stabilize a projectile. My S&Ws with their 1 in 18 1/2 twist were probably only marginal in this regard, although they shot the long boolit well enough at 50 yards on the police range.

At one time, there was a 200 grain 38 Special load that was popular in snub nose 38 Specials. It was called a Police Special load or something like that. Perhaps if you find a mould for that design, you'll not have to worry about OAL issues and still shoot the heavy boolit that you want to.

RCBS 35-200 (210 grains with lube and GC) between a 38 Special on the left and a 357 on the right. As an aside, this is a great boolit when used in the 358 Winchester or 35 Whelen.

[gunarea]

Hey Driver man
The 200gr RCBS and Saeco both are employed down here in Florida playing Lawnsteel. Stabilizing the slug from Ruger, S&W and Uberti has been no problem. This is empirical information derived from actual usage. Myself personally, utilize the Lee factory crimp die and set depth with no regard to bullet crimp groove location. At 75yds I am capable of -1" MOA accuracy with subsonic velocity. My accuracy level is duplicated throughout the shooting circle I am privileged to be in. My mould is presently on loan to my direct competition for their use in stockpiling enough of the projectiles to render it commonplace. Although it was originally purchased to compliment a 336 in 35 Rem, knocking down steel silhouette targets with a 38/357 makes it a very competitive "small caliber" for use in "large caliber" competition. Some of those who use this bullet apply a gas check but there has been no apparent advantage in our arena. A #2 alloy has served me well in a rifle but I go softer for handgun application at speeds less than 900fps. In my Uberti rolling block, 2.65gr Alliant Promo yields same POI as my standard target load with no sight adjustment. Contact any Lawnsteel shooter for different specific load information as most all have a pet load for this steel target gitter. Get this projectile and join the group who know how good it is.
Roy

[Outpost75]

Tom at Accurate molds has several good heavy bullet, plainbased designs which work well in .38 Special and .357 Magnum for rifle use at subsonic velocities. I load 4.2-4.5 grains of Bullseye in my Ruger Vaquero and Marlin 1894 Cowboy and have great fun ringing the gong with these.

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[paul h]

My 200 gr WFN's shoot great out of my 357 blackhawk. They've also been extremely accurate out of my 357 contender in both 357 max and 357 Herrett barrel and my 35 Rigby rifle as well.

I haven't tried the 200's in 38 special, 170 gr is as heavy as I go in the 38. I only use the 200 as a heavy load in the .357 with a max dose of H-110.

[MBTcustom]

Try the Lyman 358430 in 38 special over a medium/hot charge of Unique. My old accuracy load in the S&W model 19. It was superbly accurate and I could break small balloons 50 yards away with it. Nice thing was, the bullet was heavy enough to really smack something even at reduced velocities.
Load them hot in 357 Magnum and hold on. Works good that way too.

[Driver man]

Thanks for your info guys. I will try to get some samples of each and try them out. I think this will keep me occupied for a while.

[P Flados]

Driver man,

I was about to make an offer and then I noted the "New Zealand" location.

[Driver man]

Yes, Its a long way. Might have to spend a bit of time getting some together.

[paul h]

USPS flat rate mailers can be used internationally, it just costs a bit more.

[Driver man]

If I cant find any locally Id be happy to buy some and pay postage from the US