Natural gas burner for melting lead

[Debo]

I have an exterior natural gas hookup for the bbq grill. Has anyone set up turkey fryer type burner on natural gas to melt lead? Is it worth the effort? It seems to me that natural gas burns woth less pressure and intensity than propane. Thanks

[Debo]

Additionally, this will be for melting wheel weights, plumbers lead, etc....Into ingots.

[bajacoop]

There are more BTU's in a given amount of propane than in natural gas but if you have a natural gas hookup already it should be a lot cheaper even if you are using more gas.

The only potential issue would be what CFM and pressure is your natural gas hook-up?

[Bird]

I use natural gas and a wok burner. Try CSW warehouse or on ebay for a bit more money. I use the 100,000 btu unit with an iron pot on top. It gets the job done real quick and more cost effective than propane.

[Debo]

Do you have a link for CSW Warehouse? Thanks

[Bird]

Do you have a link for CSW Warehouse? Thanks
http://www.gsw-usa.com/wok-range-accessories/223-burner-accessories.html
Sorry it was GSW. I think they are around 25 bucks. Make sure you get the right one for natural gas. I may have got mine from another kitchen supply company that actually gives the prices online. I will take a look later.

[Bird]

I found the site where I got mine at a better price.
http://www.lonestarrestaurantsupply.com/restaurant-equipment/cooking-equipment/ranges/chinese-wok-ranges/23-tip-round-nozzle-jet-burner-natural-gas
You will want the 23 tip with the 1/2'' fitting. That will be more than enough btu's. I made an angle iron frame for the burner to sit under and rest the pot on top. You can regulate the heat output with a plain gas valve.

[Debo]

Thanks, I'll check it out.

[NavyVet1959]

I use one of the "banjo" type burners and a cast iron dutch oven for smelting. Since you don't have a lot of pressure with natural gas, the jet type burners (http://www.academy.com/shop/pdp/king-kooker-12-tripod-propane-jet-burner?repChildCatid=27736) do not work that well.

http://www.academy.com/shop/pdp/king-kooker-6-low-pressure-replacement-burner?repChildCatid=27354

http://assets.academy.com/mgen/37/10045037.jpg?is=150,150
You might need to increase the orifice size on the gas jet in the mixing chamber. A 1/16" drill seems to be about the right size. I've converted burners and BBQ grills to natural gas this way.

[cajun shooter]

You are dead on with the pressure problem when trying to use natural gas vs propane. A propane bottle with a high pressure regulator will put out a flame that has the sound of a jet fighter but the natural gas has a very low pressure system and the only way to overcome that is to use a large surface burner with plenty of burner area.
I would prefer to use a 20 lb bottle of propane to smelt with.
A lot of people who come to Louisiana and want to take part in our outdoor cooking of Turkeys, ducks and the boiling of crawfish, crabs and other seafood will purchase a low pressure set up used for frying instead of a high pressure one for boiling. Later David

[bangerjim]

Turkey fryers and plumber's furnaces are the standards 'round here. High pressure propane and tons of BTU's! Fast & efficient.

A gas cooking burner (even modified) will be rather low BTU on natgas and will work if you have lots of time on your hands! My propane plumber's furnace will melt 100# of lead in a matter of just a few minutes. Sounds like a jet engine but gets the job done fast! No regulator needed with this one. Nat gas in you home is around 6-9 inwc and will not run one. Get a propane tank at Costco and do it right.

banger

[NavyVet1959]

You are dead on with the pressure problem when trying to use natural gas vs propane. A propane bottle with a high pressure regulator will put out a flame that has the sound of a jet fighter but the natural gas has a very low pressure system and the only way to overcome that is to use a large surface burner with plenty of burner area.
I would prefer to use a 20 lb bottle of propane to smelt with.
A lot of people who come to Louisiana and want to take part in our outdoor cooking of Turkeys, ducks and the boiling of crawfish, crabs and other seafood will purchase a low pressure set up used for frying instead of a high pressure one for boiling. Later David

It's all about BTUs. If you have the BTUs, it will work. With a low pressure system like natural gas, you need a lot of small flames whereas with a higher pressure system like LPG, you can get by with a single flame. I suspect that the smaller flames are more efficient though. I've used my banjo-type burner with high pressure LPG. I've even used it without a regulator at all, just controlling the flame height with the tank valve. It's easy to get a 6-8 ft high flame if you do that by just giving a quick partial turn of the tank valve and then shutting it back down. It looks like a jet on afterburner. :)

With natural gas, your limiting factor is going to be your supply line's inside diameter, regardless of how much you increase your gas orifice size. It is possible to melt zinc with a natural gas system. I've tried it once on the wheelweights that I had previously skimmed during a smelting session. It does take a bit longer though.

[NavyVet1959]

Maybe the LPG jet burners are a bit quicker, but with natural gas, you don't have to worry about running out of fuel in the middle of a smelting session. With the higher pressure LPG, I suspect that a lot of the heat is being wasted and being blown past the top of the pot. With the banjo type burners, you can use them with either LPG or natural gas, but with the jet type burners, they don't work so well with just natural gas. That is something to consider.

If you already have natural gas at your house and you are not using up the minimum cu-ft for the basic service charge, it's possible that running the burner on natural gas could cost you *nothing*.

[Bird]

Natural gas supply to household appliances is set at no more than 1/4 psi. The volume of gas controls the btu output, hence 1/2'' pipe, 3/4'' pipe etc, is what determines the volume of gas flow. A btu is a btu whether it is from natural gas, propane, electricity, gasoline or whatever fuel. No need to mdify a propane burner, just get the 100,000 btu unit I mentioned in my last post.
The lee 4-20 pot is rated at 1000 watts I believe, and that will melt 20lb of lead in 20min or so, and 1000 watts is the same as 3,400 btu's. 100,000 btu's will melt 200lb of lead no sweat. Actually there will be plenty of sweat if you stand too close to the heat.

[NavyVet1959]

Some of those restaurant burners are designed to operate on higher pressure though. Commercial natural gas service can be quite a bit more than residential.

[Bird]

Some of those restaurant burners are designed to operate on higher pressure though. Commercial natural gas service can be quite a bit more than residential.
Yes I agree. The 23 tip burner I use works well though, and it doubles up as a garage heater as well. I crack the garage door open when I use it for drying paint and curing various finishes.

[bajacoop]

Lee 20 lb pot is 700 watts.

[zanemoseley]

I use a hurricane burner with an orifice made for natural gas. I had someone install a qd fitting and valve directly next to my meter so I can smelt out next to my garage. I used to use it for brewing, it would easily boil 15 gallons of liquid even in winter.

[NavyVet1959]

I use a hurricane burner with an orifice made for natural gas. I had someone install a qd fitting and valve directly next to my meter so I can smelt out next to my garage. I used to use it for brewing, it would easily boil 15 gallons of liquid even in winter.

Those are a similar design to what I was calling the "banjo-type" burner.

http://stores.hurricaneproducts.net/63-6000-60-000-btu-cook-center/

http://cdn1.bigcommerce.com/n-yp39j5/e3akn0/products/88/images/275/6000-72__31384.1382642520.1280.1280.jpg?c=2

http://cdn1.bigcommerce.com/n-yp39j5/e3akn0/products/92/images/279/63-5165__92066.1382642520.1280.1280.jpg?c=2

[quack1]

I use a burner scrounged out of an old natural gas hot water heater. I welded up an angle iron frame and smelt in a stainless bowl. I cut down a steel 5 gallon bucket for a wind screen for the burner. Nothing fancy, but it has melted a lot of lead over the years
http://i291.photobucket.com/albums/ll300/1quack1/IMG_0001.jpg

[Dragonheart]

Built my bottom pour pot out of an old propane tank. Tank sits on a modified propane turkey fryer (modified just with a shelf to hold my ingot molds). The skirt around the pot hold the heat in and can easily melt and pour over 200 pounds of lead
from range scrap.
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