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firefly1957
08-29-2015, 04:02 PM
I am looking for name and information on an old camp stove . I have a leak in the tank i am fixing to put back into use but would like to know who made it The name is gone but the company logo it still on it. I would also like to know which fuel or fuels it was made for i smells a bit of diesel right now but was told it used gasoline.

RED333
08-29-2015, 04:17 PM
Cedarberg Plumbers Fire Pot
http://classiccampstoves.com/threads/cedarberg-plumbers-fire-pot-is-hot.17664/
http://www.colemancollectorsforum.com/post/Cedarberg-Plumbers-Furnace-5978587
The old stove is talked about in both links, the second link goes back to the first.

GOPHER SLAYER
08-29-2015, 04:20 PM
firefly, to me that looks more like a plumber's melting pot than a camp stove. In either case it burns white gas which is bad news in any case. I was given one just like it several years ago and I quickly passed it on to someone who wanted to hang it up for decoration. Propane is much safer to deal with.

firefly1957
08-29-2015, 04:37 PM
Red 333 thanks for the information you hit it right on.

Gopher Slayer white gas is low octane unleaded fuel modern gas will work fine even with ethanol in it.

firefly1957
08-29-2015, 04:44 PM
Reading on further is says it uses kerosene.

TXGunNut
08-29-2015, 05:05 PM
Reading on further is says it uses kerosene.


That would explain the smell.

starmac
08-29-2015, 06:10 PM
When did white, now unleaded gas suddenly become dangerous. Heck, the gas we get these days is hard to light with a match.

bangerjim
08-29-2015, 07:14 PM
Consign it to the dump and buy a fish/turkey fryer. Better /higher BTU concentration, less time to re-melt, more production, cleaner, cheaper on fuel.

banger

JesterGrin_1
08-29-2015, 10:04 PM
If you can be sure of fixing the leak on that old kerosene burner I would clean it up and use it. But I would stick with burning kerosene. :bigsmyl2:

Sure propane might be easier and faster at times but that old kerosene burner can be used for many things other than just melting lead not to mention it is easy to transport instead of lugging a Propane bottle around and making sure the lines and valve is ok and yada yada yada.

JeffinNZ
08-30-2015, 05:43 AM
Here is a post I put on the blog I share with Jim about my dad's old Kerosene stove.

https://floydpics.wordpress.com/2015/03/16/dads-old-kerosene-stove/

Petrol & Powder
08-30-2015, 09:46 AM
These folks can help you out: http://classiccampstoves.com/

BrentD
08-30-2015, 10:21 AM
When did unleaded gasoline become "white gas". I would not conflate those two ever!

reloader28
08-30-2015, 10:45 AM
Modern gasoline, if you can call it that, works excellent in white gas/Coleman fuel lanterns and stoves.
If that is a kerosene stove though, stick with kerosene or #1 diesel.

Echo
08-30-2015, 10:48 AM
When did unleaded gasoline become "white gas". I would not conflate those two ever!
Brent, you must be younger than I (as are most folks!). Way back, all gasoline was white (clear), and a blend of 2 or 3 fractions of the crude oil distillation process. Then it was discovered that the addition of tetra-ethyl lead increased the no-knock (pre-ignition) qualities, and better pre-ignition quality was cheaper to provide that way rather than using pure iso-octane that sat the standard for 100-octane. To indicate that the gasoline was adulterated this way it was required that if a producer introduced tetra-ethyl lead into their gasoline, they must also put in a red dye. Soon, ALL pump gasoline was 'leaded', some more than others, so all pump gasoline was 'red' - if one wanted 'white' gasoline (for their Coleman lantern, for example - leaded gasoline would clog things up), there was a separate pump, sometime in the back of the station, for 'white' gasoline. I think...

David2011
08-30-2015, 12:48 PM
Huh. And I always thought "white gas" was naphtha, like Coleman fuel. I remember my grandfather buying white gas at a regular filling station when I was a kid but it wasn't gasoline. A quick look at the infallible Wikipedia agrees.

David

zarrinvz24
08-30-2015, 01:15 PM
firefly, to me that looks more like a plumber's melting pot than a camp stove. In either case it burns white gas which is bad news in any case. I was given one just like it several years ago and I quickly passed it on to someone who wanted to hang it up for decoration. Propane is much safer to deal with.

Not trying to be ignorant, but why is propane so much safer? I always prefer the old style liquid fuels because they burn hotter especially when it's cold out.

BrentD
08-30-2015, 01:27 PM
White gas is not unleaded gas, and anyone that advises people to use unleaded in place of white in a gas stove, esp. in an ancient stove known to leak. That's just not responsible. DO NOT USE GASOLINE OF ANY KIND IN THAT STOVE.

Taylor
08-30-2015, 01:46 PM
I have one just like it.I burn coleman fuel,does a fine job of making coffee or melting lead.

nicholst55
08-30-2015, 02:33 PM
Reminds me of the M1950 Squad Stove, issued by Uncle. It was intended to burn regular old gasoline, but will run on most anything that will burn. Being used by soldiers, I'm sure that they have been used with anything that will burn!

BrentD
08-30-2015, 02:55 PM
Echo, I know exactly what you are talking about, though I may not be quite as old as you. That said, white gas and unleaded gasoline of today are two wholly different animals and if you don't know that you can get hurt.

GOPHER SLAYER
08-30-2015, 03:04 PM
Not trying to be ignorant, but why is propane so much safer? I always prefer the old style liquid fuels because they burn hotter especially when it's cold out.

In a recent thread about having nothing more to say I posted a reply to the effect that I have been casting lead into bullets since the late 1950s and have learned a thing or two. I went on to say that when I offered what I thought was sound advice others proceeded to argue with me. I want to take time to say that I have just had cataract surgery in both eyes and this rather difficult for me so do not expect a reply no matter what you have to say. To get back to the original question. This member asked for help concerning this old liquid fuel burning stove he had acquired. These were my concerns. The tank had a leak. It required liquid fuel. When you buy fuel in a can you have to store it someplace. Will that be in your garage? Now you have two places where this fuel is stored. Will the tank develop another leak? I was also considering the dangers of repeated handling of this volatile fuel no matter what you call it. I also considered how cheaply you can purchase a unit that uses propane. Now someone jumped in saying that using propane is no safer that using liquid fuel. There was many a small cabin burned to the ground when a child dropped an old kerosene lamp. As for the safety of propane, it is contained in a tank with a safety valve and you can leave it outside. Thousand of them are in use for cooking on the bar-b-q. When I want to turn old cable lead into ingots I use a plumber's stove fueled by propane. I bought it in a yard sale for two bucks. I think they are about forty at Harbor Freight. The propane tank cost $25. When you leave a propane tank out side it should be in the shade. If it over-heats from being in the sun the propane is released harmlessly into the atmosphere causing global warming which as you know has made Al Gore rich. The richer he gets the less willing he is to get back into politics. You must admit, that is a good side benefit. All of this was considered when I replied to the question the man asked. I will not make that mistake again. From now on, I know nothing. I said earlier in this epistle that I had cataract surgery. The right eye was done two weeks ago and the left this past Wednesday. I am wearing some cheap glasses from the Dollar Store as my old glasses no longer match my eyes. My eyes are beginning to hurt but I wanted to get it all out since this will be my last advice on any subject. In the future I will stick to questions or compliments on someone's new purchase. I hope all will read this with believe it was written with the best of intentions and not to elicit another argument.

jcwit
08-30-2015, 03:23 PM
Brent, you must be younger than I (as are most folks!). Way back, all gasoline was white (clear), and a blend of 2 or 3 fractions of the crude oil distillation process. Then it was discovered that the addition of tetra-ethyl lead increased the no-knock (pre-ignition) qualities, and better pre-ignition quality was cheaper to provide that way rather than using pure iso-octane that sat the standard for 100-octane. To indicate that the gasoline was adulterated this way it was required that if a producer introduced tetra-ethyl lead into their gasoline, they must also put in a red dye. Soon, ALL pump gasoline was 'leaded', some more than others, so all pump gasoline was 'red' - if one wanted 'white' gasoline (for their Coleman lantern, for example - leaded gasoline would clog things up), there was a separate pump, sometime in the back of the station, for 'white' gasoline. I think...

I live in Amish country, No. Indiana. You want Coleman Fuel, go to the store and pay $12 to $15 bucks a gallon for it. You want "White Gas", there are a few local stations here that still carry it here at a special pump to cater to the Amish trade, about $4 a gallon, it's also called "Naphtha", there also is a local fuel distributor that will deliver it to fill larger tanks or barrels for the Amish trade.

Now if you wish unleaded gas I'm sure you know where to buy that, yes it will work in the new dual fuel stoves, but I sure wouldn't recommend it for older stoves.

starmac
08-30-2015, 03:36 PM
Propane has it's uses, but it doesn't make liquid fuel obsolete. One of the loggers I haul for has a propane heater to heat the engine compartment on his loader. When it is cold enough to have to use it, we first have to put heat on the propane tank to get it to burn. GROAN. lol

jcwit
08-30-2015, 03:49 PM
I should have also said for those still using liquid stoves even the dual fuel stoves the generator will last much, much longer if you use Coleman fuel or White Gas/Naphtha.

Just a tip.

DLCTEX
08-30-2015, 06:28 PM
I worked on many M1950 gasoline fueled stoves as I was the only one in our unit dumb enough to confess to knowing how. On the plus side, the Mess Sargent made sure I never pulled KP or guard duty. He was a happy man as long as I kept the stoves and immersion heaters going without blowing anything up.

bangerjim
08-30-2015, 06:59 PM
Propane has it's uses, but it doesn't make liquid fuel obsolete. One of the loggers I haul for has a propane heater to heat the engine compartment on his loader. When it is cold enough to have to use it, we first have to put heat on the propane tank to get it to burn. GROAN. lol


OMG.........that IS cold! Propane boils (turns to gas) at -44F!!!!!! If he has to heat it, you are really cold! That is why extremely cold climates use propane rather than butane, which boils at +30F.

Now I know why I moved from Wyoming and Iowa.

BrentD
08-30-2015, 07:05 PM
Never had problem with propane down to -38 F. Seems like no big deal to me.

RED333
08-30-2015, 07:56 PM
Red 333 thanks for the information you hit it right on.

Gopher Slayer white gas is low octane unleaded fuel modern gas will work fine even with ethanol in it.
Glad I could help, Where is the leak, I missed that part.

ohland
08-30-2015, 08:19 PM
I worked on many M1950 gasoline fueled stoves as I was the only one in our unit dumb enough to confess to knowing how.

Ah, fond memories of my Mess SGT warming up the burners with a blow torch....

Petrol & Powder
08-30-2015, 08:19 PM
I have a fondness for old kerosene stoves and pressure lanterns but I'll admit that I'm a bit old school. If the stove from the first post is in fact designed for kerosene, then that's what you use in it. If I could see the burner I could probably identify it but kerosene burners were once very common.

As for the dangers of liquid/gas fueled devices, that's relative. They all have their pros and cons.

Propane is certainly more convenient when compared to some liquid fuel stove that needs to be pre-heated but I wouldn't say it's more or less dangerous.
One can get into heated (sorry for the pun) discussions about BTU's per volume, cost, safety, smell, convenience, etc. but ultimately it comes down logistics. What's the job, what's available, what's the cost, what are the hazards.

As for the white gas vs. unleaded gasoline argument, I've used unleaded gasoline in Coleman type stoves for years without problems. I've always figured that the very high cost of Coleman fuel outstrips the cost of a new generator. I can't recall the last time I had to replace a gas generator but I admittedly do not use gasoline stoves on a regular basis. Perhaps if I used them more often I would have a higher failure rate but for now I'm coming out WAY ahead.

reloader28
08-30-2015, 11:31 PM
I'll be darned. I guess we must have special lanterns and stoves because they work fine on gasoline. I aint bought Coleman fuel in a long time.

I also never told the OP to put gas in his stove. I said if it was a kerosene stove that he needed to use kerosene or #1 diesel in it.

As for propane, its nice but not at high elevations. Whenever we go hunting or camping it never burns that hot or as good.

jcwit
08-31-2015, 12:20 AM
One of the benefits of living among a large Amish settlement is being able to purchase white gas from the pump just slightly higher than regular gas. Many other benefits also, food,country markets, farmers markets, Amish bakeries, the list goes on and on.

Yes, generators do last longer using white gas, when you have smelted close to 1,000 lbs. with a single burner Coleman stove, then tell me about it.

I get my lead from our indoor range at cleanup time, not hard to get a couple of thousand lbs. of lead, or even more.

firefly1957
08-31-2015, 02:45 AM
I did not mean to light a fire here i did find who makes the stove but am afraid to ask about my 2 burner Kamp Cook stove after this (just kidding when i start fixing it i may post but it is labeled made in Minnesota) Anyway yes white gas is similiar to unleaded gas i have used it in a Coleman stove since the late 1970's off and on to melt lead and cast bullets same generator all this time . I even have some Marvels Mystery oil and Stabile in the gas often it just makes a bit more soot .
I do now know who made the stove and at this time when it is properly repaired plan on using kerosene in it . The design looks like it allows different fuels one valve controls fuel to the generator and another to the burner and it will never be used inside either.

Petrol & Powder
08-31-2015, 08:02 AM
I did not mean to light a fire here i did find who makes the stove but am afraid to ask about my 2 burner Kamp Cook stove after this (just kidding when i start fixing it i may post but it is labeled made in Minnesota) Anyway yes white gas is similiar to unleaded gas i have used it in a Coleman stove since the late 1970's off and on to melt lead and cast bullets same generator all this time . I even have some Marvels Mystery oil and Stabile in the gas often it just makes a bit more soot .
I do now know who made the stove and at this time when it is properly repaired plan on using kerosene in it . The design looks like it allows different fuels one valve controls fuel to the generator and another to the burner and it will never be used inside either.\

The "valve" on the generator is possibly a control for a needle to clean the jet. Lots of those old kerosene stoves had that feature. If that is what it controls then it is only used to prick the jet when the jet gets dirty. Do not use the needle to control the flow of fuel. It is withdrawn from the orifice of the jet during operation and only used intermittently to clean the jet. The pressure in the tank or the main valve is used to control the flame, not the needle that cleans the jet.
Kerosene burners require a fair amount of pre-heating in order to function. Typically alcohol is used in a "spirit" cup under the burner to get it hot enough to vaporize the kerosene until the burner is hot enough from the kerosene to be self sustaining.

What we call kerosene the Brits and most of the former British colonies call Paraffin. This causes some confusion from time to time.
There's something magical about a pressurized kerosene stove running perfectly. You get a wonderful blue flame, no smoke, lots of heat and it smells like the ramp at an airport when you turn it off ;).

jcwit
08-31-2015, 08:43 AM
White gas versus unleaded. Unleaded gasoline is typically the stuff you buy at the service station to put in your car. It usually contains dyes (undyed gasoline is clear or "water white". Unleaded gasoline may also contain other compounds such as alcohol or ethers. White gasoline is just what it says: gasoline that is undied, unleaded and free of other compounds. This used to be sold for use in high performance two stroke engines (mostly outboard motors). Coleman fuel is different still, it is actually heavy naphtha, similar to lighter fluid. It is less volatile than gasoline, but more volatile than kerosene. The dyes and addivies are what glogs the generator.

All this in of no importance actually as the OP has a kero burner. We used to use those when deer hunting in the Black Hills of WY, also used kerosene lanterns.

Geezer in NH
08-31-2015, 04:09 PM
Never had problem with propane down to -38 F. Seems like no big deal to me.
His provider was screwing him and giving him butane instead of propane

Geezer in NH
08-31-2015, 04:19 PM
45-50 years ago Atlantic Gasoline was advertised as "white gas" some folks used it in their Coleman stoves and lanterns but My family thought the Coleman fuel (naphtha) did not stink as bad. The diff was less than a dollar per gallon and the Coleman fuel came in it's own metal can.

mold maker
09-01-2015, 05:41 PM
In the SE it was AMACO Premium. Cost a little more but worked great. It was the only UN leaded gas available.

Geezer in NH
09-01-2015, 08:25 PM
In the SE it was AMACO Premium. Cost a little more but worked great. It was the only UN leaded gas available.Now we who use small engines go to extremes to get LL avgas as it's way better than this ethanol ****. :confused:

jethunter
09-02-2015, 08:56 PM
White gas is not unleaded gas, and anyone that advises people to use unleaded in place of white in a gas stove, esp. in an ancient stove known to leak. That's just not responsible. DO NOT USE GASOLINE OF ANY KIND IN THAT STOVE.

Naptha is no less dangerous than gasoline. Very nearly the same stuff. Gasoline will work fine - at least for a while. There does tend to be some additives in gasoline that can gum up the works on a stove or a lantern. In a pinch unleaded gasoline can be used and is no more dangerous than natha. The worst thing about using gasoline is it stinks if you spill any or get it on your hands and clothes.

Personally I think gas/naptha stoves are safer than propane. When propane leaks and ignites it causes an explosion. Pressurised containers and lines do tend to leak more often than a non pressurised fuel tank. in my experieince anyway.

ohland
09-04-2015, 07:30 PM
Now we who use small engines go to extremes to get LL avgas as it's way better than this ethanol ****. :confused:

Lookit pure-gas.org to find ethanol free gas in your state. Here in Wisconsin, Casey's General Store and Quick-Trip sell straight gasoline, unfortunately only 91 octane, but way better than jacking up your carburetor...
http://www.pure-gas.org/index.jsp?stateprov=NH