ohland
06-29-2015, 09:33 AM
Outer's Book - Recreation, vol 59, No. 4, Oct 1918 page 270
https://books.google.com/books?id=lH07AQAAMAAJ&pg=PA270&dq=ideal+32-40+rifle&hl=en&sa=X&ei=bkWRVeP8CcSvogThlar4Aw&ved=0CDEQ6AEwBA#v=onepage&q=ideal%2032-40%20rifle&f=false
SMOKELESS POWDER CARTRIDGES
EDITOR GUNS AND AMMUNITION DEPARTMENT: Please advise in your "Answers to Gunmen" column regarding the following questions: I notice in the Winchester catalogue (leaving the black powder cartridges out of this) two types of .32-40 smokeless cartridges listed, one as a smokeless cartridge, another as a H. V. smokeless. In their ballistic table they credit these High Velocity cartridges, with a velocity of 1,752.4 feet seconds.
Am I correct in presuming the one listed as just "smokeless" develops the same velocity as the black powder cartridge, 1,427.7 feet seconds?
Now, the Rem.-U. M. C. list in their catalogue a smokeless, and I notice they call theirs a “high power" in their ballistic table; they give the following figures in regard to velocity: .32-40, 165-gr. bullet, black, 1,450 ft. sec.; .32-40, 165-gr. bullet, smokeless, 1,505 ft. sec.; .32-40 high power, smokeless, 2,065 ft. sec.
From a comparison of the two catalogues mentioned there is really three types of .32-40 smokeless cartridges; namely, a bulk smokeless, one that develops the velocity of approximately the same as the black powder cartridge; a “high velocity" cartridge of 1,752 feet velocity, and a "high power" cartridge of 2,065 feet velocity. I was always under the impression that the Rem-U. M. C. “High Power" .32-40 and the Winchester “High Velocity" .32-40 were identical in every respect. I suppose one would be justified in “sticking” to either Rem-U. M. C., H. P., or Winchester, H. V., if he ever expected to know his gun, instead of shooting the both makes indiscriminately, as I think the 300 feet difference in the velocity would make a marked difference in the actual shooting, or wouldn't it?
I also notice on No. 16 Du Pont powder canister they give in their list of cartridges to be loaded with No. 16 powder, .32-40, 16S-gr. metal cased bullet, high velocity cartridge, 25 grains; .32-40, 165gr. metal cased bullet, high power, 29 grains. '
Can I use as soft a bullet, say 1 part tin to 35 or 40 lead, with a bulk smokeless with as good results as I can with black powder in the .32-40?
Is it necessary to have the bullet several thousandths of an inch larger than the bore when using a cast bullet of lead and tin, say 1 to 20, with smokeless powder, in the .32-40 Winchester rifle 16 inch twist, on account of lack of up settage, with smokeless powder, or does this apply only to rifles of a very quick twist, say one turn in 8 or 10 inches?
Will the Ideal tools ordered for the .3240 give a bullet of diameter sufficient to be “gas tight," or should I order them several thousandth: over .319?
Will the Winchester Model 1894 (nickel steel barrel) have ample strength to shoot 29 grains of No. 16 powder, or the Rem.-U. M. C. High Power cartridge of 2,065 feet velocity? A. M. 5., Cleveland, Ohio.
Reply follows --->
[There are three distinct types of .32-40 smokeless powder cartridges as follows: The ordinary .32-40 smokeless, which is loaded with smokeless powder and metal cased bullet, but which is so loaded as to give substantially the same velocity as the black powder charge; the .32-40 H. V., which is loaded by the Winchester company for use in rifles having ordinary soft steel barrels as used for black powder cartridges, and loaded to give the greatest velocity which these barrels will stand, which is 1,752 ft. sec., and the .32-40 high power, made by the Rem.-U. M. C. Co., and loaded up to the same pressures as the .30-30 type of cartridge, and which should be used only in rifles having hard steel barrels suitable for high power work. This latter cartridge gives a velocity of 2,065 ft. sec. If your rifle has a hard steel barrel you will find the U. M. C. high power a fine cartridge, but if of soft steel use one of the others. In any case, it is well to stick to one load as not only does the difference in velocity give a difference in trajectory, but the greater pressure of the high power cartridge makes the rifle shoot to a different zero, so the arm must be sighted for the particular cartridge intended to be used in it. It is this difference in loading which the Du Pont people recognize in the instructions on their canisters. We would consider 1 to 35 rather soft for a .32—40 bullet with any powder charge; 1 to 16 for ordinary pressures, such as black powder, and 1 to 10 for any higher pressures of smokeless would give good results. In using any kind of smokeless powder it is well to have the bullets a trifle oversize to prevent gascutting. The Ideal bullet used without resizing is usually correct for smokeless powder; it should measure about .321 in. to .323 in. in diameter, regardless of the twist. Any nickel steel barrel is strong enough for the high power cartridge. It is not strength, but resistance to erosion, which calls for the hard steel.—Editor.]
https://books.google.com/books?id=lH07AQAAMAAJ&pg=PA270&dq=ideal+32-40+rifle&hl=en&sa=X&ei=bkWRVeP8CcSvogThlar4Aw&ved=0CDEQ6AEwBA#v=onepage&q=ideal%2032-40%20rifle&f=false
SMOKELESS POWDER CARTRIDGES
EDITOR GUNS AND AMMUNITION DEPARTMENT: Please advise in your "Answers to Gunmen" column regarding the following questions: I notice in the Winchester catalogue (leaving the black powder cartridges out of this) two types of .32-40 smokeless cartridges listed, one as a smokeless cartridge, another as a H. V. smokeless. In their ballistic table they credit these High Velocity cartridges, with a velocity of 1,752.4 feet seconds.
Am I correct in presuming the one listed as just "smokeless" develops the same velocity as the black powder cartridge, 1,427.7 feet seconds?
Now, the Rem.-U. M. C. list in their catalogue a smokeless, and I notice they call theirs a “high power" in their ballistic table; they give the following figures in regard to velocity: .32-40, 165-gr. bullet, black, 1,450 ft. sec.; .32-40, 165-gr. bullet, smokeless, 1,505 ft. sec.; .32-40 high power, smokeless, 2,065 ft. sec.
From a comparison of the two catalogues mentioned there is really three types of .32-40 smokeless cartridges; namely, a bulk smokeless, one that develops the velocity of approximately the same as the black powder cartridge; a “high velocity" cartridge of 1,752 feet velocity, and a "high power" cartridge of 2,065 feet velocity. I was always under the impression that the Rem-U. M. C. “High Power" .32-40 and the Winchester “High Velocity" .32-40 were identical in every respect. I suppose one would be justified in “sticking” to either Rem-U. M. C., H. P., or Winchester, H. V., if he ever expected to know his gun, instead of shooting the both makes indiscriminately, as I think the 300 feet difference in the velocity would make a marked difference in the actual shooting, or wouldn't it?
I also notice on No. 16 Du Pont powder canister they give in their list of cartridges to be loaded with No. 16 powder, .32-40, 16S-gr. metal cased bullet, high velocity cartridge, 25 grains; .32-40, 165gr. metal cased bullet, high power, 29 grains. '
Can I use as soft a bullet, say 1 part tin to 35 or 40 lead, with a bulk smokeless with as good results as I can with black powder in the .32-40?
Is it necessary to have the bullet several thousandths of an inch larger than the bore when using a cast bullet of lead and tin, say 1 to 20, with smokeless powder, in the .32-40 Winchester rifle 16 inch twist, on account of lack of up settage, with smokeless powder, or does this apply only to rifles of a very quick twist, say one turn in 8 or 10 inches?
Will the Ideal tools ordered for the .3240 give a bullet of diameter sufficient to be “gas tight," or should I order them several thousandth: over .319?
Will the Winchester Model 1894 (nickel steel barrel) have ample strength to shoot 29 grains of No. 16 powder, or the Rem.-U. M. C. High Power cartridge of 2,065 feet velocity? A. M. 5., Cleveland, Ohio.
Reply follows --->
[There are three distinct types of .32-40 smokeless powder cartridges as follows: The ordinary .32-40 smokeless, which is loaded with smokeless powder and metal cased bullet, but which is so loaded as to give substantially the same velocity as the black powder charge; the .32-40 H. V., which is loaded by the Winchester company for use in rifles having ordinary soft steel barrels as used for black powder cartridges, and loaded to give the greatest velocity which these barrels will stand, which is 1,752 ft. sec., and the .32-40 high power, made by the Rem.-U. M. C. Co., and loaded up to the same pressures as the .30-30 type of cartridge, and which should be used only in rifles having hard steel barrels suitable for high power work. This latter cartridge gives a velocity of 2,065 ft. sec. If your rifle has a hard steel barrel you will find the U. M. C. high power a fine cartridge, but if of soft steel use one of the others. In any case, it is well to stick to one load as not only does the difference in velocity give a difference in trajectory, but the greater pressure of the high power cartridge makes the rifle shoot to a different zero, so the arm must be sighted for the particular cartridge intended to be used in it. It is this difference in loading which the Du Pont people recognize in the instructions on their canisters. We would consider 1 to 35 rather soft for a .32—40 bullet with any powder charge; 1 to 16 for ordinary pressures, such as black powder, and 1 to 10 for any higher pressures of smokeless would give good results. In using any kind of smokeless powder it is well to have the bullets a trifle oversize to prevent gascutting. The Ideal bullet used without resizing is usually correct for smokeless powder; it should measure about .321 in. to .323 in. in diameter, regardless of the twist. Any nickel steel barrel is strong enough for the high power cartridge. It is not strength, but resistance to erosion, which calls for the hard steel.—Editor.]