How many bullets can you crank out?

[icor1031]

If you include the time it takes for you to purify the lead, use the resize die, etc; basically, everything involved in getting the bullet ready to be used on your press, like you would with a store-bought one - how many would you average per hour? ( don't assume a session of just 1 hour, lol. if 50 hours total = 5,000 bullets, that's 100 per hour :p )

Potentially, I'll have a decent job soon - I'm trying to decide if casting is still worth doing, after considering taxes etc. - or if I should only reload.

Thanks!

[GoodOlBoy]

hrmmm Dunno really. For example I cast with a OLD Lee SC 454-255-RF (yes 454), and if I use them as dropped (I usually do) and I tumble lube....

Yeah still don't know. It's never been about volume for me. Just like handloading itself, it's always been about the satisfaction of making good reliable ammo myself for my guns.

I can tell you IMHO there is NO shame in buying your bullets for handloading. I did it for years when I was still working. Plus if you have a way to catch and reclaim the lead you can always save it for when you ARE ready to cast again.

GoodOlBoy

[warf73]

Really depends, had a casting buddy come over one morning after work to do a smelting casting session. Fired up the smelting pot around 8am and started making ingots around 9am. Shortly after that he was melting the ingots in the casting pot and pouring 240gr swc boolits. At 2pm when we cleaned up to eat lunch we scaled the work to split up the spoils, he took home just under 25lbs of lubed boolits. And I had right at the same amount in my boolit bucket. So in about 6 hour we went from a bucket of raw clip on WW to about 1500 ready to load boolits.

To be honest that was the only time him and I have ever did that. Most the time we would do a smelting session. Next time we would do a boolit casting and lubing session. Since he went onto first shift I do 90% of my casting solo.

But I cast and reload to be self-efficient and really don't looking at the hobby of smelting/casting/lubing as a job. I would do it as in my spare time (instead of watching TV) as needed.

[Hardcast416taylor]

If you have to get a break down of how many of anything that you can produce in X amount of hours, minutes, days or years for whatever reasons. It is no longer an enjoyable hobby to challenge you, it has become a job.Robert

[Beagle333]

No idea. I never carry one batch of lead all the way through the process. I have smelting day, casting day, sizing/lubing/coating day, and reloading day and it never involves any one particular load of lead. Some of it gets stockpiled in various places and I'll load some of those boolits and some boolits I already had in containers and some of em might sit stored for a year or two/three.
Whatever the number is, it isn't anywhere close to somebody who just reloads. If you're into volume, just keep ordering them by the case. There are a lot of good vendors out there. :grin:

[icor1031]

If you have to get a break down of how many of anything that you can produce in X amount of hours, minutes, days or years for whatever reasons. It is no longer an enjoyable hobby to challenge you, it has become a job.Robert

I never bought the tools to enjoy it, lol. There are very few productive things that I enjoy doing; not woodwork, fixing cars or body, building speakers, building computers, etc.. I do them for the product. :p

[garym1a2]

I can cast 600 to 800 and hour with 6up molds that drop well. I can lube about 400 an hour. Smelting is too labor entensive to seperate zink from lead wheel weights.

I never bought the tools to enjoy it, lol. There are very few productive things that I enjoy doing; not woodwork, fixing cars or body, building speakers, building computers, etc.. I do them for the product. :p

[RobsTV]

This varies too much.

Couple things I've noted, and only timing actual work, not sitting around waiting. This is the very fastest I have been able to run them, when everything is working perfect, and only done during speed test, not normal casting. I would guess double these times for a relaxing casting session:

For 380acp, TL, shoot as cast
- Cast 500 acceptable boolits = as fast as 15 minutes using 6 cavity mold
- Size, Lube / Powder Coat 500 boolits = As fast as 20 seconds

For 300Blk, PC, shoot as cast
- Cast 500 acceptable boolits = 40 minutes with 2 cavity
- Size, Lube / Powder Coat 500 boolits = 230gr shot as cast w/PC, less than 15 minutes (add 15 if sized with Lee push thru)

[41mag]

I usually pour up between 5 and 20# worth of a particular bullet. Then they might sit in the closet for anywhere from a week to several months to a year or more before I ever decide to pull them out to size, lube and load. If I take that into consideration I might as well not even buy factory loads, much less try and handload.

That said though, two weeks ago, I poured up 15# worth of MP 356360's, powder coated, and sized half of them along with some others on Saturday before noon. Then on Sunday I loaded up just a little over 400 of the MP's along with a couple hundred of some Lee 356124 TL that were also PC'ed.

So I really don't look at it as a matter of how much I get accomplished, as much as I figure I get what I want done when I want it, and don't have to sweat driving around town trying to find it, or having to buy one box of an item per day.

[Rustyleee]

If you have to get a break down of how many of anything that you can produce in X amount of hours, minutes, days or years for whatever reasons. It is no longer an enjoyable hobby to challenge you, it has become a job.Robert

I agree, it's a hobby not a part time job. I do it for relaxation, not profit.

[LUCKYDAWG13]

It's a labor of love

[varmint243]

IMO it is much cheaper to purchase bullets that it is to make them if time is factored in
I cast my bullets because it's the only way to get the bullets I like to shoot
If I could purchase bullets that suit my needs I would

If I had to guestimate time it would look something like this
1/2 day to reclaim lead from the backstop (1.5 drywall buckets)
1/2 day to smelt the range scrap (usually nets 100lbs)
2 - 4hrs to setup and cast 500-1000 bullets depending on many variables (uses 25-ish lbs)
2hrs -ish to lube 500 bullets

I can't really say I enjoy casting, I cast so that I can shoot
If I didn't shoot, I wouldn't cast
This is not saying I don't feel good when I have run 500 or 1000 nice bullets
I have gotten more efficient over the years, I definitely prefer 4 cavity or larger molds.
2 cavity molds are easier to get nice bullets with, but it takes a lot more motions to get 500 bullets.

[Garyshome]

My casting sessions run from between 4 to 8 hours. I use 2 pots both Lee, 1 is a #20 ans 1 is a #10. I try to cast mostly with the 20 but once it's empty using the 10 cuts my down time. I don't smelt much, most of my lead is purchased in clean form. I set a goal for how many I need, and usually cast till i'm done with that caliber/weight. I size/lube/PC before I'm ready to load. Along with brass prep, which I try to stay on top of. It may be a hobby but casting is like a JOB to me. Get in Get done Get out [Get paid?]

[bedbugbilly]

I wouldn't have any idea . . . nor would I really care. I cast, reload, shoot as an enjoyable hobby. At the range, I take my time with my shooting . . . I don't "feed and fire" as fast as I can like of lot of folks I observe do so my "need" for large quantities isn't there and thus, I don't find it necessary to "produce" at an efficient rate. I cast the "old fashioned way" and have for 50+ years . . . in a old Ideal 10# pot with a bottom feed dipper over a gas hotplate . . and I've even done it over coals from a wood fire. Sometimes I use a powder measure to drop my loads . . sometimes I dip and weigh . . . sometimes I use my Lee Turret Press, my old RCBS Jr3 single stage . . . sometimes I use my 310 tools or old Ideal tongs. It's a "labor of love" . . . fun and relaxing . . . and I haven't purchased "store bought ammo" for a long, long time . . and I still can produce all that I need. Hmmm . . . reading my post over . . . I guess I'm not really efficient at all and probably shouldn't think about going in to "production" . . LOL

[Handloader109]

If you don't enjoy doing it, I suggest that you should just buy your bullets. I've only smelted once, that was recently and I am going to avoid that work as much as possible. My setup is not ideal, I don't have good source for smelting lead, (thought I did, but is mostly zinc). But casting is great fun. I powder coat some, lube others. I'd tell you that if you can work at your real job and make $ rather than cast bullets, I'd tell you to work, not cast. But if you have in your 40 he's, and are kicked back watching the idiot box on the wall, you are way better casting ad reloading

[Bigslug]

I think the better question for you to ask would have been "What's the best path to volume boolit generation", because if you enter into it with that attitude, you can buy your equipment accordingly.

Serviceable as it is, I'm probably going to retire the Bass Pro turkey burner, 25# Buffalo Arms pot, and ladle in favor of a 65# Satan's Little Smelter with an ingot mold tray under the bottom-pour spout.

More cavities in the mold makes a difference, of course.

Tumble lubing where you can and push-through sizing where you can't might also be a speed asset. From the videos of the bake-on powder coatings, I'm not necessary sold on the notion that it takes less time, although it may take less time with you actively involved.

A Dillon will make more ammo than a Rock Chucker.

And so on. . .

[ioon44]

If I had to worry about all of that it would not be any fun.

[Petrol & Powder]

My hourly production rate to cast, size & lube bullets would likely be pitiful if I checked it. As others have said, if you factor in your time it becomes a losing proposition. As LUCKYDAWG13 said, "It's a labor of love".
I also agree with GoodOlBoy that there is no shame in buying bullets for reloading.
I knew a guy that purchased an extra leaf for his kitchen table and bolted his press to that table leaf. That was his loading bench. He would install the table leaf with the press, place a cover on the table that had a cut-out for the press (I think that was an old shower curtain) and reload. He loaded and shot often but he never cast bullets. He was the most frugal person you could meet and if he thought casting would save money, I'm certain he would have incorporated that process into his reloading.
I've been reloading for many years but didn't add casting to that process until a few years ago. I cast bullets and reload because I enjoy the process and I can make better cartridges than I can buy. However, I still buy some bullets as well.
If you consider the cost of the equipment needed to reload as a one time expense and don't count your time; reloading clearly saves money in the long run.
The cost of casting equipment is similar. Excluding expendable supplies it is mostly a one time expense for the gear. If you have a source of inexpensive lead and you don't count your time, casting saves money. When you get right down to why people actually cast & reload it really isn't about saving money.

[rondog]

I have a lot of purchased boolits, and when I compare them to the ones that I've made, they look rather disgusting. I'm probably going to just melt them down into ingots. I've developed a preference for flat-based boolits over bevel-based anyway. And mine aren't all dented and dinged up.

[mold maker]

If your concern is $ earned working V money saved casting, forget it. Your comparing watermelons to grapes.
How do you justify using a gun to make holes in a piece of paper and throwing it in the trash? You took money earned and bought a gun. If you can find ammo available, and have time to shoot, you should decide iif factory is good enough, or if spending some time casting/loading is in your best interest.
Most here are intrigued by the possibility, of producing better ammo than we can buy. Since no two identical firearms shoot best with the same load or projectile, we strive to control and taylor the ammo to our gun.
It's your time and money. Don't expect us to decide how you spend either.
I personally, consider the investment in lead, brass, molds, and processing equipment, to be an asset. The money I save is a mute point. With the equipment already paid for, I can load my cast in whatever I choose, for the price of powder and primer. You can't buy 22 for that price, if you could find it.
The question now becomes, just what do you value most, money or time?

[lightman]

I never gave this much thought. Let me think for a minute;

1. I may spend a couple of hours sorting a 5 gallon bucket of wheel weights.
2. Maybe 2 or 3 hours to smelt. I smelt in batches of 300-400#. The time depends on how dirty the lead is.
3. With a 2 cavity mold, I may cast 8 bullets a minute.
4. I probably can size 10 or 12 bullets a minute on my Lyman sizer.
5. I probably can load 200-300 shells an hour on my Dillon at a sustained rate, and more than that on short runs.

I've never really timed any of this, except for smelting. Not really timing that, I just know about how much time I spend in the shop on those days. The sorting, smelting and casting time depends on the type of lead, (how dirty it is) type of bullet and the mold. The sizing and loading probably vary less. Like others have said, its a labor of love. If you count your time, don't do it! Like many others, I get a lot of satisfaction of seeing a nice bullet come from a pile of dirty lead and the journey from one to the other.

[robg]

I do it because I hate to rely on someone else & I like being one of very few who cast their own over this side of the pond

[osteodoc08]

It doesn't matter how long it takes me. I use it to relax and get away from the world for a bit. That is priceless and one of many reasons I enjoy this hobby.

If you're contemplating time vs money, you'll be better off buying in bulk and reloading on a progressive, of course if only shooting 100 a month, just get store bought. YMMV

[country gent]

The bullets I cast are ones I cant buy easily for by BPCR rifles. I cast for accurate and consistant bullets not speed normally. I ladle cast all of these too.

[runfiverun]

I run a small casting business for quite some time, speed and quality is a prime concern when doing this.
try filling an order of 5-k boolits [and get your other stuff ready to ship out too] you figure out speed pretty quickly.

a 4-6 cavity mold hand poured from a 40# pot is infinitely quicker than a hand operated master caster.
and punching boolits through a star will produce a pile of 500-1,000 in under an hour if you have your act together [use the tubes and boolit feeder]
20 tubes and 1-2 people filling them for you will really speed things up if your shoulder is up to the challenge.

speed in casting is just like speed in everything else, how fast you wanna go depends only on your wallet for the most part.

[mdi]

I never bought the tools to enjoy it, lol. There are very few productive things that I enjoy doing; not woodwork, fixing cars or body, building speakers, building computers, etc.. I do them for the product. :razz:
I think you may be missing out on a lot of fun (it's the journey that's important, not so much the destination). But, without the proper tools, any task can become a drudge/job and wears one down. If you are looking at cast bullet making, perhaps you make it more fun if you broke the task down into easily handled steps. Sometimes I smelt (just melt a bunch of lead together and skim off the junk. Other times I'll take m "remelted" chunks of lead and flux/clean real good and mebbe "fix" the alloy (add tin. linotype, etc.) and make ingots. Another time I'll cast up some bullets, but not so many it tires me out or becomes work. Then at another time I may attach gas checks and/or lube. Just enough at one time to keep it fun...

BTW; I have no idea what my BPH (bullets per hour) is, nor do I care. Im in it for fun and I have no quota.:lol:

[rancher1913]

for me as a newbe to casting my own, its not boolits per hour, rather more like hours per boolit.

[pjames32]

I guess my answer is "enough". Most of my casting is 2 or 4 cavity molds. If I have a pretty good pile after 2-3 hours I'm happy. I cast to relax and my casting and reloading is not so much "production" as it is enjoyment. I really got into casting and reloading in the 70's when shooting bullseye matches. I could not afford ammo and teamed up with 2 other guys to produce ammo. It worked, but it was work. Now my casting and reloading is for relaxation.
I do not save any money. I like buying equipment too much. It is a hobby that I really enjoy.
YMMV
PJ

[1911KY]

I don't ever do it all on the same day, I don't have that kind of time. A 50 lb melt will take me about 2-3 hours in total. I usually only cast for 2-3 hours and get on average 500 bullets or 14 lbs. Do you consider the time tracking down lead? That is the biggest pain.

I also powder coat so you have 10 minutes to coat and prep for baking per batch, 12 minutes to bake 70 or so bullets and then sizing them all.

All told to make 500 bullets ready to load I have about 8 or 9 hours invested. That is only about an hour or hour and a half of casting time.

[dragon813gt]

None, I lost everything in a tragic boating accident :(

[wistlepig1]

I agree, it's a hobby not a part time job. I do it for relaxation, not profit.

one +

[jsizemore]

I sort while I smelt but we'll figure it as a separate operation.

This is time per 200gr. boolit:

1/2 second to sort WW's
1 second to smelt
10 seconds to cast
3 seconds to size and lube

Out of pocket cost is 1.2cents/boolit. It does cost time/money to provide gas to smelt and Glen's fine lube. I stop at the scrapyard on the way to or from a job so no cost in it.

[C.F.Plinker]

It takes me about 3 hours of active work to cast, size, and lube 500 boolits. The going price around here is $50-$65 per 500. So my labor doing this is "worth" $15-$20 an hour. I've never worked anyplace where the boss would let me work extra whenever I wanted. This meant that I couldn't work a Saturday when I needed to get some boolits. So I fired up the pot and made whatever I needed and in the quantity I needed. Since I have the pot and molds I don't have to worry if the LGS will have the boolits I need in stock. Weather in the spring is nice enough that I could come home, put the sprues from the last session in the pot and turn it on. By the time dinner is done they have pretty much melted and I can top the pot off with ingots. When they are melted it takes just over an hour to cast up either 500 158 gr .38s or 400 185 gr .45s. The rest of the evening is free for other activities. I could build up a reasonable inventory doing this for a week or two. Store them in coffee cans and lube and size them as needed. That would last me a year, sometimes two.

The clubs I shot at or belonged to needed help cleaning out the traps. They said you could use the lead for your own use so long as you didn't sell either the lead or the boolits you cast. So for over 4 decades my only cost for boolits was the energy to melt the lead and the lube for them. My pot and molds paid for themselves many years ago.

Casting and loading are not work, they are just part of this hobby we all enjoy. By doing it yourself you help insure that you will be able to do it when you want because you are not dependent on the purveyors of ammo.

[shoot-n-lead]

As suggested, if you are looking at this from a production standpoint...you might have missed the point. Although, it is certainly more productive than watching tv or surfing the web.

[icor1031]

It takes me about 3 hours of active work to cast, size, and lube 500 boolits. The going price around here is $50-$65 per 500. So my labor doing this is "worth" $15-$20 an hour. I've never worked anyplace where the boss would let me work extra whenever I wanted.


I'd be able to do 80 hours a week, if I wanted to. :) (programming)

Thanks for the numbers, mate - and all other gents.

[fredj338]

Many that want to figure time into their cost, look at it a bit skewed. You always need to figure net hourly cost. If you make say $30/hr, your net hourly is closer to $21 after all the taxes. The other issues; casting is a hobby, you don't pay yourself to shoot. Alloy cost is a bigger component than time value IMO. If I have to pay more than $1/#, I am not casting my plinking bullets.
WIth a 6cav mold, I can do an honest 800/hr, my Magma caster, about 500/hr. Then it takes me another 40min to lube & size those 800, so if the alloy is free, that is 1000K bullets done in a little over 2hrs, 3hrs on the Magma. If the alloy is free, lets say they are 45acp, about $90/K worth or $45/hr net, $30/hr net on the Magma. That means to buy the same bullets I would need to make about $65/hr gross & I don't. If you are going to coat them, more time & a little more $$$. So it just depends. If you enjoy casting as I do, then it's worth your time, just like shooting. I don't really enjoy reloading anymore. I do it to make ammo to shoot & use a progressive to do it as fast as possible.
Smelting can be about 2hrs actual time for 60# of alloy. I don't count the time the pot is ehating up, I can do something else, nor the time to add more metal, again, I can do something else.

[Blammer]

I get about 10 boolits per hour for an hours work for the day.

I shoot about 2 rounds a day. :)

so far I'm ahead!

[GhostHawk]

For me it is not about how fast.

I don't have a progressive press, don't want one.

I don't cast in a hurry, warm up the pot, the mold, the dipper and in a couple of pours it is making good bullets.
I cast for as long as I feel like casting. Most days less than half an hour. Day or 4 later I will do it again with a different mold. Not every bullet I cast gets sized, but I have been leaning more and more that way.

It is a hobby, it is something to do with my hands. If I get 50 rounds of a given caliber loaded on a given day it was a good day. That is 50 rounds I don't have to buy, plus it keeps me at least somewhat independent.

Sitting on 20 some pounds of powder and some 7k of primers. Once I get my funds built up a bit I would like to put another 4-5k of primers into storage. I'm shortest now on small rifle but only shoot 1 (.223) I only have one that takes large pistol, .45acp, but I shoot it more than the .223.

I'm sitting on enough now that I don't feel like I need to cast or load on any given day to keep up.
I can be a little lazy and just replace what I shoot up. Although I maybe should do some .300 Blackout next, I'm shortest there with some 100 rounds loaded. Cutting brass, sizing it, trimming, repriming, casting, sizing, yeah, maybe next week.

[David2011]

About 8-9 years ago I looked at the time involved. As with reloading, I divide casting into 2 areas. One is necessity and the other is pleasure. I cast and load for USPSA because boolits have gotten expensive. At one time I quit casting for USPSA because I could buy 180 grain .40 cal boolits for $36.00/thousand. When they went up to $80/K I re-evaluated and started casting again. Some of the suppliers I used produced pretty nice boolits. Others were dark, ugly and strange and increased my velocity by about 100 fps.

None of the commercially made boolits look as good as my own. Most, however, shoot as well. Most USPSA shots are at 25 yards or closer and all shots are offhand in rapid succession so it's not benchrest shooting.

For other calibers I cast for fun. My favorites are .38, .44, .45 Colt and .45ACP.

From wheelweight to loading bench I figured about 6 hours for 1000 boolits in .40. THAT is a job.

Never gave it a second thought for other calibers. They're for fun and relaxation. I'm still using a small batch of straight linotype .44 Mag boolits that I cast and loaded about 6 years ago. They're only used in a Contender for hunting and a little practice so I may only shoot 20/year.

David

[wv109323]

I cast about 400 boolits today, mostly with a two cavity mold. A few with a 4 cavity. I cast for about an hour and 45 minutes. That does not include the time for the pot to melt the lead. I plugged it in and was busy with other chores til ready to cast. That time does include time to refill the pot with lead and wait til it came up to temp.
I can lube those in a Star in 30 minutes or so. With a 4 or greater cavity casting time can be reduced quite a lot.
I can average 200 cast and lubed boolits an hour with a 2 cavity and 3-400 with a 4 or 6 cavity mold.
I do have more time than money so I cast.

[Le Loup Solitaire]

I have always been more concerned with the quality of my casts rather than the speed or the volume produced. Its a question of personal priorities and not one of right or wrong. Loverin once wrote, "watch the quality and not the clock". If you need to speed cast and it works for you and you are happy then go with what you are doing. Of course a multi-cavity mold will produce larger quantities; a six or a ten holer will do that. LLS

[reloader28]

Its definitely not about how fast for me. I RARELY buy bullets because I have way to much fun shooting home cast in all my guns.
I cast for about 3 hours a night in the winter time until I have 2 or 3 coffee cans full for each boolit. I always keep about 300 lubed for my most used calibers so I dont have to set up the luber every time I need boolits. I lube more as I need them.

I didnt actually do it, but I did take the time a couple years ago to figure it out though, and not counting the smelting time, with a 2 cavity mold I could cast, lube/size and load 100 rounds in 1 hour. I also didnt figure in the pot warm up time so I guess that would be another 20 minutes, but I could set up the press and luber and have everything ready to go while waiting for that.

It might be interesting to try once, but I think that would take the fun out of the whole process.

[MBTcustom]

I have a suggestion that will settle the question for the OP.

Take all of your casting equipment, and box it up into flat rate boxes and store all of it in the attic. Bullets, lube, ingots, everything. Clean house as it were.

For the next six months, buy your bullets from other sources (jacketed or commercial cast), or quit reloading altogether and buy factory ammo.

At the end of six months, answer these questions as truthfully as you can:

1. Did I enjoy my firearms as much? (Y/N)
2. Did I shoot as much? (Y/N)
3. Did I occupy all the saved time with something worthwhile? (Y/N)

If you answered yes to these questions, then sell all your casting stuff. After all, it's already boxed up and ready to go.

[mongoose33]

What Tim said above.

I see it as similar to reloading pistol rounds on my progressive press. A comfortable pace for me is 300-350 rounds per hour. I can exceed 450 per hour if I really want to push it, but then it ceases to be an enjoyable pastime and becomes work.

I was casting boolits from a 4-cavity mold weekend before last. I occasionally will see what my throughput is, and I was dropping about 10 boolits per minute. Times 60 minutes in an hour, I'm doing 600 per hour. Running them through my Star which lubes and sizes in one motion, I can do that in about half an hour, maybe longer. Again, I don't push it.

So is it worth it? If I buy similar boolits from Missouri Bullet, in a bundle of 3000 bullets, it works out to about 6.9 cents apiece. If I use alloy for which I paid $2 on average, plus a smidge for lube, it works out to about 3.9 cents each. Is it worth saving 3 cents a boolit? Only you can decide that.

For me, it isn't just about money saved--it's about how much I enjoy the process, it's about controlling my own supply of boolits instead of being dependent on others whose reliability may be suspect, it's about being able to try different approaches and recipes and tune them to my own guns.

You'll have to decide if the non-monetary rewards, in addition to the savings, add up to make it worth it for you.

[44man]

I am a piker compared! I might get 100 in an hour or so from my two cavity. Then many times I smear Felix in the grooves with fingers to run through a Lee so it might take an hour or more to lube.
I just don't like the repetition, hate to cast and prepare piles of brass.
I handload and might load just enough for deer season. Or 20 for practice. But if I take a revolver down and put up a small water bottle at 100, it should only take one shot per. Any more is just ME. Might take a few more at 200 because I don't adjust my red dots, I hold over and try to judge drop.
I am slower then anyone but I do clean brass, size, expand and flare, seat primers and put them in the MTM box so when I do cast, I don't have to go through the whole process.
To save money and get what I want I make my own molds and still have a few blocks ready to go but need cherries to make for other calibers. I should make a 7MM and a 6.5. I also want a better 12 ga slug.

[mdi]

My last job before retirement paid me $42.12 per hour plus perks (now, I didn't say I was worth it, but that's what they gave me!). There is no way I could add my time into casting costs as the cost per bullet would be a heck of a lot more than jacketed or commercial cast bullets. Besides, it I were to figger all the costs, I'd have to add fuel for my truck to drive around looking for lead, the utilities for my shop (elect. for lights, heater, Stereo, etc.), the CDs that are necessary when casting, coffee (yes I drink coffee when I cast), and amortising 12 molds two pots and 1.65 tons of other equipment. I'd rather just count it all as fun, relaxing time that gives me some stuff to shoot outta my .44s...:wink:

[44man]

Once retired time does not count anymore. get up at first light, spin twice and the day is gone. Clock watching at work extended the day to a WEEK!
I made $17 before I retired and was responsible to load planes for safety of passengers. PBGC took over my retirement. I lost near $7000 a year. SS is most of my money so to load the .44 for a dime a shot precludes buying much of anything. But the 10 cent shot hits where I aim.
I worked side jobs, fixing TV's and gunsmithing, custom rifles and checkering, carved flint locks, etc. Concrete and construction, roofing, electrical, you name it and that is what bought guns and equipment. I built my own addition from footer up, never laid a block but did over 300 and was 1/8" out of square when putting drywall up.
I worked so hard I still can't figure how when I had to go to work. At one time $300 to $400 in my pocket was nothing but now $2 is a joy.
I still get work and it is from aircraft mechanics mostly. WHY???? Had to go over and fix all the plumbing in ones basement NO, make that more then one. can't solder copper for cripes sake.
Now I spend more time with you fellas.
Just fixed an RC float plane for one. Weak spot that wobbled. Laid up fiber glass inside where I could barely reach, Yes I can glass too. They bring me RC planes to build now and then.
Maybe you should ask what I CAN'T do.

[Harter66]

I could buy commercial bullets but I'd have 3 or 4 choices for 45 instead of 5 moulds that work well . Same goes for the 9mm/38/357.

I'd guess in a full day of work I could smelt 300# of lead . Cast 3-500 of 5-6 cal and put up 150# of ingots . Sort cull and lube ending up with 2000 bullets less in smaller cal more in larger cal. So that's 4 boxes at $35 a box . I've been known to spend a whole Saturday morning shaking down a sand dune for 100# of metal.
45 Colts is where I really make my money these days. They sell at $78/100 my cost to load them (I paid for lead ,electricity ect for calculations) is $12/100 but now I have to add an hr for casting so call it $18/100 . Even at $38/100 for my wages in trade for loading time they're half price . With common rifle ammo hovering around $70-140 /100 and coming in around $40 /100 I feel good about the "hobby" . Take my wages out cause its a hobby and every load knock off lead prices because it's all free ww and range metal and every cartridge drops to $10/100 for most rifles and around $6/100 for pistols. $6-8 is a long way from 78 . Even at cost numbers and sacrificing 12-18 days per year it's way worthwhile to me especially when the kids get involved.

[RogerDat]

If I figured the cost/benefit ratio of everything I would probably be an over 50 virgin! I know I wasted some money and time dating ladies I did not marry. Was that unproductive? No it was an education in what doesn't work.

The thing for me is looking at the supplies I have "put up" and knowing I can shoot when and if I want to. I don't have to ration myself to 1/2 box due to cost. Looking at a bread loaf pan full of ready to go boolits is full of possibilities. I might load them hot, or with that new powder, or try to nudge some part of the process to yield just a little better accuracy. If I were to calculate the "cost" sunk into that loaf pan..... Missouri Bullets would probably be cheaper up front but long term? I don't think so, Equipment gets paid for then amortized over hundreds and then thousands of bullets. I doubt I will every need to worry about plinking ammo again. And for me that has as much satisfaction as getting the lawn mowed, that lawn tractor engine fixed, or the porch painted.

That said that is me, not you. I will also happily shoot Laser Cast, or some swaged HBWC I purchased or whatever. I just like having hundreds that I made and knowing I could make hundreds more when the notion strikes (or there is nothing on TV, wait there is never anything on TV, that explains all that time at the bench!)

[Springfield]

Doesn't matter, being mostly a stay at home dad I can't afford to buy much. No way could my wife, kids and I all shoot cowboy shoots every month if I had to pay for loaded ammo. But FWIW, I can smelt 200 lbs an hour with most scrap, cast about 900 an hour for most of my pistol bullets, size about 800 an hour, and load 400 an hour. You do the math! I tend to have more time than money, but not enough of either.

[Harter66]

Well it depends heavily what you have too . I have 2 that would be completely cost prohibitive to shoot . 1 hasn't had commercial ammo loaded since 1964 the other I have seen 3 boxes of shells for in 2 yr in 7 states and those were $48 for 20.
I guess it could be broken down to hours worked to pay for bought ammo over hours spent making it.

[RogerDat]

Well it depends heavily what you have too . I have 2 that would be completely cost prohibitive to shoot..........
............I guess it could be broken down to hours worked to pay for bought ammo over hours spent making it.

Those statements are the two key factors from a cost benefit perspective.

Does the reduced cash one has to put out allow one to shoot more than one could if purchasing ammo? For many yes but the more equipment and tools you purchase and at greater cost the more rounds you have to shoot to absorb that equipment cost. A $100 mold + $100 die set = cost of $2 per bullet for the first 100 made. But cost is only 4 cents per bullet at 5000 made.

Does the time + cash for materials equal more or less bullets than you could purchase with pay earned in that same amount of time. With even cheap 38 special running about $40 per 100 and higher priced stuff such as 45 and 44 running close to $100 per 100 this provides the store bought side of the equation. Store bought per 100 <=> cost of materials + hourly labor rate.


Why is Lee equipment so popular? The $20 mold + $40 die set = cost per bullet of only 6 cents each at 1000. A touch over 1 cent each equipment cost at 5000 made. Compared to 20 cents each for first 1000 using the high priced stuff. Hmmm 20 cents + materials + labor to make a 50 cent bullet VS. 6 cents + materials + labor to make a 50 cent bullet. Throw in scrapping and scrounging for lead and shooting can get inexpensive again.

Not to be discounted is the fact that once the basics are purchased (press, scale, pots etc.) one can add a caliber for less than $100 which offers a whole new set of things to fiddly fart around with trying to make "perfect" ammo. That entertainment can easily last a month.

[44man]

I have tried many Laser Cast and all were too small for my grooves. I bought many boolits over the years and never got what I wanted except for Cast Precision, and the other top makers. Bulk boolits are just that.
But buying boolits gets costly and can raise prices. Some are exceedingly good.
But my equipment has been long paid for so it does not factor in at all.
Buy a new Dillon and learn it, GOOD product but cost increases. So does your learning curve.
It is like buying a new puter or printer. A manual 1" thick where you do not understand a single thing.

[Ranger 7]

I actually enjoy my sessions of: Casting, reloading and shooting!

I did not see anyone mention: By casting and reloading (And maintaining a sufficient stock pile of components, a lesson I learned from Slick Willie's term in office) you will always be prepared to defend you and yours and will always have ammo to spend an enjoyable day at the range.

[gwpercle]

I cast for quality, perfect bases, filled out no wrinkles. Everything else goes back in the pot.
Saturday, one double cavity Lee #356-120-TC, full Lee Magnum Melter , Lyman dipper with side spout. Casting at a leisurely rate to allow the sprue to harden and not get smears, galling etc.,
One hour of casting produced 250 excellent bullets. I didn't count the 15-20 minutes for the pot to heat and melt . And another 15-20 mins. to run through my Lyman 450 lube/sizer. All total about two hours for 250 boolits.
I have found that trying to go too fast just causes problems, I get more and better boolits working slower than going as fast as I can.
My Mom was right when she used to tell me " son, haste makes waste."
Gary

[MarkP]

Exactly --

You can load what is not available and never will be (3/4 oz 8-1/2 shot in 12 ga, 247 gr cast in 300 SAUM, 77 gr 38 SPL, and so on)


I actually enjoy my sessions of: Casting, reloading and shooting!

I did not see anyone mention: By casting and reloading (And maintaining a sufficient stock pile of components, a lesson I learned from Slick Willie's term in office) you will always be prepared to defend you and yours and will always have ammo to spend an enjoyable day at the range.

I made a comprehensive spreadsheet about 6 years ago, the sheet calculated costs based on variable inputs and made comparisons to commercially available alternatives. When backing out an equivalent break-even hourly rate, the rates were much lower than my payrate. I am very busy with work and family but still find time to cast, mow my grass, and maintain our vehicles.

[Don Purcell]

On one rendering session I can smelt @ 350 lbs. at a time takes about an hour. Then casting with 4, 6, or 8 cavity molds speeds up the casting, then tube feed on the star and I'm set for a while. While casting I use my rendering pot to keep the casting pot full to avoid melt time, a big time saver.

[Landshark9025]

So, for me it isn't about raw production, but I have mentally figured rates in my head and realized I had to increase volume.

I load on a Lee Turret and it is good for about 150 round/hour.
I casted with a two cavity mold- which was good for about 150 rounds/hour.
When pan lubing, I can do about....you guessed it....about 150-200 rounds per hour.
I'm usually good for about 3-4 hours before my back starts to cramp up, so I can usually do around 500 of anything in a sitting.

That means that if I am buying lead, it takes about three hours work to make 150 completed cartridges. In reality, that's fine as the time spent doing these things would only be lost to Youtube or the TV, so there was no value to it anyway. It's not like I am taking unpaid leave from work to cast and reload.

The problem comes in when the wife and I hit the range. Three hours to manufacture 150 rounds that get chewed up in the first 15 minute relay. May make it to the second relay, but that is it. Then we started bringing friends to the range. We went through 1200 rounds of pistol ammo in one day! THAT'S why I had to think about upping the production. My dream is to have a couple thousand just ready and waiting so I can do it when I want, not because I have to so I can go to the range tomorrow.

Six cavity molds- Check.
Star Lubesizer- Check. (Just got it so am trying to figure it out. However, I timed it last night. In five minutes I ran 102 through it including sending every fifth one through twice to keep the die lubed.)
Progressive Press- Not yet.

I started smelting and can convert about 55 lbs of range scrap to 36lbs of ingots in about an hour and a half.

So for me, it isn't about competing with store bought in a time/dollar equation. It's just trying to stay ahead of my trigger finger!

[Blackwater]

When I first started casting, I was in college, or working to put my wife through so I could get back to my own pursuit of that. I was married and had a son who I tried to spend as much time with as I could and seemed to need to. Thus, time was precious and speed of production was a big consideration, so I paid close attention and found what would let me get the greatest speed I could get, like hotter metal temps, aluminum molds, breaking the sprue probably just a mite before I really should have, etc., and quality was still good enough to suit my purposes for most of my shooting. I hadn't yet begun my pursuit to see just how good my bullets, loading and shooting could be.

Now, after seeing what a little extra care and a slightly slower pace, and a different attitude about the operation, I can cast some pretty good boolits, and they definitely shoot better, and along the way, gave me access to the precision I needed to GET better. One can't get a lot better if his boolits and loads and guns don't tell him EXACTLY where his sights were when the hammer dropped.

So I guess you could say I've sort of been in both worlds. Speed casting CAN be done and most excellent bullets produced rapidly, and I wish I'd known those techniques way back when. In their absence, I did pretty darned good, though, just by paying attention to the basics, and learning as I went along. We also remember those lessons we learn ourselves MUCH better than those we're merely told about.

[THerbert]

Here in the Houston area it's pretty warm for about 7-8 months of the year (this year had been an exception so far), much too warm for me to enjoy casting bullets in the un-air-conditioned garage. So my casting mostly takes place during the 4 months of the year (November through February) when it's cool outside. Also, I don't cast for the calibers that I shoot a lot of volume in, especially over smokeless powder, as I only have one lubrisizer, and changing lube is a PITA for me.

So, generally I cast enough boolits during the winter for the calibers I shoot black powder in (.44-40, .45 Colt and .45-70 primarily, and some .50-70) and for those that it's just not feasible from a cost perspective to shoot if I don't cast for them (like .500 S&W). The rest, like .38 Spl and .357 Mag, and .44-40 smokeless, I buy commercial cast bullets.

I don't cast for speed, I cast for either need or enjoyment.

[montanamike]

For 45acp 200+ bullets an hour including initial melt (100lbs/hr), casting (750 rds/hr), sizing (750 rds/hr) and loading(600/hr). That's running 2 six cavity molds at once using a star sizer and loading on a 650. For different calibers the time will vary greatly (running 1 or two cavity molds, prepping rifle brass...) but the cost savings on some of those such as 500s&w or 45/70 is substantially higher even tho I'm reloading at a slower rate.

[JonB_in_Glencoe]

How many bullets can you crank out?

If you include the time it takes for you to purify the lead, use the resize die, etc; basically, everything involved in getting the bullet ready to be used on your press, like you would with a store-bought one - how many would you average per hour?

...snip
Many others have already said this same thought, but I'll say it again, in my our words. If your time is more precious than money, casting is not for you

My guess at total time for pistol boolits is probably around 4 or 5 minutes each. (that'd be about 20 per hour)

Rifle boolits would take about twice that...or about 10 minutes each.
(that'd be about 6 per hour)
Some reasons for extra time for rifle boolits is inspection/size of mold/seating GC/sometimes there is pre-sizing.

[44man]

So true, I cast for the best of the best. Each boolit is a wonder to me. Loving care does pay off over quantity.
What shot counts? First one every time.

[10mmShooter]

Shooting is something I love, reloading allows me to shoot more, casting allows me to have the bullets that I want, made to the quality level I want to feed my reloading needs which in turn allows me to shoot more. Like most of us here, casting and reloading have become just as enjoyable as actually sending lead down range. To me I'm just as happy a the pot casting, as I'm at the bench reloading or on the firing line shooting. Cost for me across the 9 common pistol calibers I shoot averages to about .11 cents(labor not included) even given inflated lead/powder/primer costs. Some I reload for would be impossible to shoot without casting/reloading, like 32-20 and 10mm and even .41 are near impossible to find and ridiculously expensive if you were to find them.

[44man]

Every gun I had on order my entire life had the dies, molds or bullets at my bench before the gun showed up.
Back then it was not cost but I could make any gun shoot better.

[David2011]

Many refer to casting and reloading as a hobby. I suppose for the most part I consider shooting to be a hobby but to me reloading and casting is a necessity. I've had most of my casting and reloading equipment for a long time so the purchase prices were absorbed long ago. It's a necessity because quality commercial cast boolits are rare. It's a necessity to assure that what I load works as well as I want in the guns I own. Pretty much all commercial cast boolits and ammo is "one size fits all." Mine is all tuned to the application. My .45 Colt is loaded up (Ruger loads) to put down just about anything short of the biggest mammals in North America. I have put down countless feral pigs that didn't die immediately from friends' rifle shots. The .40 S&W loads I make are solely got USPSA so the velocity to make major power factor with a little to spare is about 100 fps below factory loads. Most of my .38s are light plinking loads. My 6.5x55 is a custom rifle shooting primarily 120 grain Nosler Ballistic Tips at 2875 fps for best accuracy and effect. My AR-15 shoots quality bullets in handloads well but shoots inexpensive ammo like the low end Remington and Winchester poorly. I'm sure it would shoot the premium Hornady ammo well but I don't care to pay over $1/round for .223. My .45ACP is mostly a competition load that won't even move the slide of a stock 1911.

I can't buy any of this ammo other than the Hornady .223 so in order to shoot the guns I have to their capability custom casting and loading is a necessity. I enjoy it or I wouldn't do it but it's kind of like washing a car. It's something that needs to be done but I don't consider it a hobby. Astronomy and RC airplanes are hobbies for me. I do feel like it adds to my self sufficiency in an insurrection situation.

David

[rintinglen]

And how many of us have some one who will pay us to cast boolits? I buy my lead in ingot form--where I live the neighbors would get annoyed were I smelting. I could buy my 9mm's, and maybe some of the other "commons." But I haven't seen a box of 32-20 on the shelf in a coon's age. I rarely see any 32 other than ACP. Likewise 44 Specials, and don't even mention stuff like 44 Colt, 9mm Largo, 357 Automag and assorted other oddball cartridges. Sometimes, if you don't reload, you don't shoot. Remember 2012? Empty shelves and scalper prices were the norm. If I was not a reloader, I'd have been hosed.
Ultimately, it boils down to two things: How much money do you have to spend on your hobby, and how much time do you have to spend on it?

[Landshark9025]

Ultimately, it boils down to two things: How much money do you have to spend on your hobby, and how much time do you have to spend on it?

Agreed. And for me, I have more time than money and I'd rather convert that time into lead and boolits than try to chase more dollars working.

[FISH4BUGS]

I'm trying to decide if casting is still worth doing, after considering taxes etc. - or if I should only reload.
Thanks!
I don't take into consideration the time involved. That is all part of the process, and that's why they call it a HOBBY. From sorting WW's, to smelting, to casting, to sizing & lubing, to reloading and finally shooting it up and starting over, that is the idea of the whole thing.
There certainly is no shame in buying your bullets cast. Personally I LIKE the whole process and it is my source of relaxation. I murdered my TV 25 years ago so I have some spare time (after gardening, yard work, painting on the house, etc.) to use for casting/reloading. I don't spend any time whatsoever sitting in front of the TV.
As for output, I can cast a TON with some H&G 10 cavity moulds. Most of my moulds are 4 cavity H&G with a few old 4 cavity SAECO's.
My guess is that I can do 600-1000 per hour with a 10 cavity mould as long as the 20 lb pot keeps getting fed. The Star sizer can do 1000 per hour. Reloading is an easy 400 per hour taking my time on a Dillon 550.
It is worth it? You bet it is....at least to me it is. Winters are long and cold here in New Hampshire. I tend to cast/size/reload in manic sessions thousands at a time.
It is nice to have a closet full of loaded ammo. Going to the range? Just go pick out what you want to shoot. Just like going to the grocery store.
Your milage may vary.