Gander Mountain, Raleigh NC Is Not Cool At All

[jonp]

I was next door this morning waiting for the FedEx office to open which is another unsatisfying story, and saw a crowd outside of the new Gander Mt. I walked over to see what the story was and heard that 22lr was on sale. Sale? Heck yeah so I waited 5 min until it opened and went on in. 333 boxes were $14.99 which was fine with a 2 box limit so I picked up 2 and walked up front where the problem started and ended.

"Whats your birthday and zip code"? said the young lady.
"Why do you need that"?
"The computer asks me and it's state law"
"No it is not and I'm not giving you my birthday or zip code"
"Well, I need it or I can't sell you the ammo"
"Keep the friggen ammo then." and I walked out

What is going on with this endless data mining stuff? Every store now asks you for your zip code or phone number or birthday or email and all they want it for is to find out exactly who you are so they can spam you on the internet or junk mail you to death. This is the first time someone has refused to sell me something because I wouldn't give them the information.

Gander Mountain has just lost a customer for life.

[Beagle333]

I don't even know how you managed to get any in the first place. Here at Gander Mtn, a line forms two+ hours before the store opens and they hand out numbers and then when the store opens, you and all the relatives that you brought are called back to claim your two boxes. (never waited in line for it though). I figure I'll give it about 2 more years to prove to myself that the .22LR shortage is permanent and then give up and sell my rifles. I have adjusted to just using my 30-30 for whatever I used to shoot with the .22 anyway, it's just that I have a couple of NICE .22's that used to be fun to shoot.

[Duckiller]

Don't care how old you look they needed your birthday to confirm that you are old enough to buy 22 ammo, State and Federal law. Zip code gives them a general idea of where you live so they can put fliers in your local paper pointing out what good deals they have this week. I am sure Gander Mtn will survive without you as a customer.

[SeabeeMan]

The birth may have a lot to do with verification to sell you ammo. Zip code could very well be to understand their target demographics location.

It's get's really interesting/scary when you look at the bigger companies. Some of the biggest tech companies out there don't ever sell you a product. Google's online services, Twitter, Facebook, Instagram, Snapchat, any other social media, online music streaming, etc. None of them ever take any money from the vast majority of their consumers yet can be worth billions. You're probably worth more to many companies as a subscriber from which they can glean information than somebody handing over hard earned cash.

[southpaw]

The birth day is so they know you are old enough to buy ammo (they could card you) and the zip is so they can track where their customers are from (they do this with all purchases). I don't see how they can spam you with any of it. They have been asking for these for many years.

Wow, looks like I wasn't the only one replying.

Jerry Jr.

[NSB]

I guess you showed them. More ammo for someone else. I guess you can do this to every place that sells ammo and in the end you'll be the loser.

[DougGuy]

you can't buy ammo if you are a minor and it is state and federal law against selling ammo to a minor. They were well within the law to establish the fact that you are of legal age to buy ammo. As far as the zip code goes, if they target your local media like newspaper and radio, it saves them money by choosing where to buy advertising rather than buy advertising all over the area which would run the cost of that .22 ammo up another dollar and 39 cents a box.

I don't see that as uncool at all.

[RogerDat]

Age and zip code allows them to profile not only the data they have but to relate it to other data. Zip codes have a lot of things known about them. Average income & home prices, the make and model of the cars registered there. Age demographic also can be tied to other data.

It's not only the fact that you (of certain age & zip code) purchased .22 ammo but the fact that someone of your age, in your zip code matches other people of a similar age in a similar zip code elsewhere in the nation. If they have other data on even 10% of that group they can extrapolate that this data applies to you at the same rate.

Given answers to the questions of what newspaper or magazine you subscribe to or last read, make and model of car you drive, alcoholic beverage of choice (or none), place where you most frequently purchase food, and purchase clothes. A political organization can tell you where you stand on top 5 political issues. Then tailor the flyers they send out to you so that it makes the candidate sound as attractive as possible to people like yourself. Businesses can do the same thing.

Example an anti 2nd amendment politician can send you a flyer with an emphasis on how much they support "responsible gun owners" and having a "balanced approach" to enacting gun laws that "respect the constitution" knowing you purchased .22 ammo but live in an are that leans democratic. To your neighbor that has a profile leaning toward more gun control the message can be entirely different. Emphasis on support of "safe sporting use" and "extensive checks and closing loopholes". Both messages are different aspects of what could be the same position, but worded so that they sound like what that individual voter would most like to hear on the issue.

You better believe it is NOT just spam and junk mail. This is the data used in the computer models that allow politicians to draw districts to pick the voters they want, as opposed to the voters in a natural region picking their elected representative.

[RogerDat]

When I smoked they used to ask my age so they could punch in I was old enough. I'm past 50 so I just lied, picked Jan of some year within 5-8 years of actual year. Clerk never asked for proof. Zip code sometimes I tell them the truth & sometimes I give them a different one.

Oh and shopping online - many stores are tailoring the price to you and your location (zip code) same office supply from Office Max online can have a different price depending on what they know about you. AND how close your computer is to a store that they compete with and yes they can tell approx. location of a computer just from the IP address.

[retread]

I just give them bogus info. Mess up their system. At least you won't get their emails!

[edler7]

I just rattle off any date and give them the zip code of my old home town. If they want a street address or phone number, they get the state Mental Hospital's.

They didn't say it had to be correct...

[DLCTEX]

Radio Shack always wanted phone and area code and promised they never sell or give out information. Now their bankruptsy lists customer information as an asset that is available.

[willie_pete]

I just give them bogus info. Mess up their system. At least you won't get their emails!

Yep, me too. I give them bogus info. The computers can choke on it. I've not been arrested yet. :)

wp

[jonp]

you can't buy ammo if you are a minor and it is state and federal law against selling ammo to a minor. They were well within the law to establish the fact that you are of legal age to buy ammo. As far as the zip code goes, if they target your local media like newspaper and radio, it saves them money by choosing where to buy advertising rather than buy advertising all over the area which would run the cost of that .22 ammo up another dollar and 39 cents a box.

I don't see that as uncool at all.
Yeah, my gray hair and wrinkles are not a dead give away. The State liquor store dosn't card me so Gander Mt has no need to. And it is not State and Federal Law as some have suggested.

If no-one here "has no idea how zip code and other information can be used to spam you" then you are just asking for trouble.

[texaswoodworker]

I wish I had been the guy behind you. I would have given them a fake date and zip, and went home happy. :p

[GOPHER SLAYER]

The only time I will stand in line for anything is when I have to renew my drivers license and I have seven 22 caliber rifles and seven 22 caliber pistols.

[rockrat]

I give them false data too. None of their business.

[gnostic]

I always give them bogus numbers. Now, I've noticed they come back and say, 'that date is is wrong.' That's because, I don't remember the fake numbers I gave them last-time. They can stick their 22's where the sun don't shine...

[375supermag]

Interesting...
Nobody has ever asked me for any information when I buy .22LR.
I bought most of it at LGS, but have bought at Wal-Mart and Dick's in the past.

I always pay cash, no credit or debit cards when purchasing firearms, reloading stuff or ammo.

[Fishman]

Jonp, I'm with you. Voluntary release of your data is fine, but to require it of you is foolish. Take my money, give me my stuff, and butt out. Of course, stores can have whatever policies they want, and we can shop elsewhere. My local gunstores have ammo, powder, and primers, and are very friendly.

[big bore 99]

I had to do the same thing when I bought some slingshot bands and bb's at tractor supply.

[gsdelong]

I made to mistake of using a fake year which made me over 70 and you should have seen the amount of aarp and other retirement stuff started flooding my mailbox.

[xtphreak]

You used to have to show ID to buy 22 ammunition.
Why not just lie to them and tell them a zip code next yours.

[jcwit]

I just give them bogus info. Mess up their system. At least you won't get their emails!

This, have done it for years.

Gotta think fast.

[jcwit]

Harbor Freight asks for zip code also, I always tell them I'm homeless and live in a cardboard box.

[Alvarez Kelly]

I'm surprised no one has mentioned this so far... The company makes the clerk fill in the box on the computerized cash register to ensure the CLERK does their job. It keeps the store out of trouble by requiring age verification for certain products.

My birthday and ZIP seem to change...

[Dhammer]

There was an article a few years back about how a zip code and one other piece of info can help them locate you, for advertising purposes without needing or having to ask for all of your info.

[PULSARNC]

Wonder what would have happened if you had requested to see the policy in writing or to speak with the manager?

[jcwit]

Why create a problem for someone following store procedure and trying to make a living.

Just make something up.

[starmac]

I Don't know that there is a federal law concerning 22 ammo. I have never been ask for any birthday. I guess it could be that I have always lived in states where people have enough common sense to look at me and tell I'm not a minor. lol They do ask here (birth date) if buying tobacco.

[jsizemore]

East of Raleigh had a graffiti problem so the solution was to limit spray paint to adults only. You had to give a bday to buy. It didn't last too long but new businesses followed the letter of the law till they got broke in.

Do you show your ID at Bojangle's to get your senior discount? The folks at the cash register are just doing what they're told. They ask for a name and I tell them " Hey You". When they start to laugh I act all huffy about them making fun of my name. They ain't quite sure till I start grinning.

The age is to satisfy local laws for sale of ammo and the zip is for postal service ad campaigns and statistical analysis of the region. Like does it make sense to send gun and ammo flyers to folks inside the beltline or will the folks around Lizard Lick have a use for an open water kayak.

[starmac]

For some reason Lowes here always ask for a phone number of all things, I just tell them they don't need it and it has never caused a problem. So far none of the stores that handle ammo, rifle pistol or shotgun never ask for anything.

[Blacksmith]

Mess with their data if enough people lie they will stop asking because it is useless. Garbage in garbage out.

[lefty o]

gouger mountain is a rip off 99% of the time anyways, so i dont visit often. asking age for pistol ammo is one thing. for the rest of the questions at any store i flat out tell them none of your business!

[bangerjim]

Not an unusual request at all. As said above, all info is used to determine if you can LEGALLY buy the product and the marketing stuff they do with ZIP codes.


I personally would have no problem giving them that info at all. After all the info posted WILLING on here by people bragging freely on how much powder, primers, guns, and lead they have in stock, who cares about a few hundred 22's!!!!!

"THEY" already know what you have and where you sleep!!!!!!!!!!!! [smilie=6:

[Cmm_3940]

Ditto on the spray paint in Columbus, OH. No idee, no paintee at the Home Depot. I REALLY try to avoid going to Columbus. Most likely the ammo thing was store policy to avoid liability issues and the clerk had no choice. If you had insisted on seeing the manager, he most likely would have punched his own bd into the register and smiled a lot. Some stores around here also require ZIP code as a second verification to use credit cards. Phone number, When asked for my phone number, I just sat, "No, thanks," or simply "No" if I'm feeling grumpy. It's never been questioned. I also won't shop at Gander Mtn anymore because of the price gouging I've seen.

[starmac]

Why create a problem for someone following store procedure and trying to make a living.

Just make something up.

Because if enough folks did, instead of just tolerate, they would not have stuoid policies. Why should lowes ask every person for their phone number, holding the line up for the next person.

[texaswoodworker]

Why create a problem for someone following store procedure and trying to make a living.

Just make something up.
This. I used to be a clerk. Every time I sold cigarettes, I had to card the person even if they were 90. They had a camera on me, and I was told not carding someone would result in my unemployment.

Don't be rude to the clerk. They have a crappy job and most likely work for crappy pay. They have absolutely no say in the matter. (Trust me, we'd rather not ask you) Being an *** to them will do absolutely nothing to solve your problem. It only adds to theirs.

Instead, nicely ask to speak to the manager (who probably can't do anything either), or better yet call the company's home office to voice your concerns.

[texaswoodworker]

Because if enough folks did, instead of just tolerate, they would not have stuoid policies. Why should lowes ask every person for their phone number, holding the line up for the next person.
So what is the clerk going to do? Call the CEO? They can't do anything and have zero say when it comes to store policy. If they go against it, they loose their job. No its, ands, or buts.

[starmac]

And that is the reason it will never change. Do you really belive if 50% of folks didn't put up with it that the CEO would not figure it out?

Toleration has gotten many things shoved down our throats over the years, most of which has no benifits and a lot of it has some serious drawbacks.

[RogerDat]

Lowes can look your return up by phone number if you don't have your receipt. Or any pending order. I think best buy does the same thing. And one of the brick & mortar book stores could add your reward points for a purchase by using your phone number. Phone numbers sometimes change owners but not that often and they are always unique.

The clerk or cashier is just doing their job as required by their employer. I doubt they have any choice on entering the information requested. You on the other hand do have a choice. Shop elsewhere, maybe send the store manager a letter or go talk the manager and explain how you don't plan on shopping in a store that wants to collect that sort of personal information. Letter has the advantage of being something that can be passed up the corporate ladder. Make it easy for them. If they want to collect your money they need to not collect your data. Verify is one thing but enter it and store it is another thing altogether.

[texaswoodworker]

And that is the reason it will never change. Do you really belive if 50% of folks didn't put up with it that the CEO would not figure it out?

Toleration has gotten many things shoved down our throats over the years, most of which has no benifits and a lot of it has some serious drawbacks.
So your just going to be an ******* to the clerks anyway? How about calling the corporate home office instead? That might actually do something. Harassing the poor clerks won't.

[gmsharps]

If you look at the Federal 1968 gun control law it states you have to be at least 18 to purchase rifle or shotgun ammo and 21 to purchase pistol ammo. If you are under 21 but over 18 and buying 22 ammo they are supposed to ask you what you are shooting the ammo in either a rifle or pistol and if you give the wrong answer you get no ammo. Do some of you remember in 1968 you also had to sign for all ammo you purchased until that was rescinded a couple of years later. A clerk is correct to ask for proof of age for ammo purchases and the zip does not tie anything to you personally. Just my 2 cents worth

gmsharps

[starmac]

So your just going to be an ****** to the clerks anyway? How about calling the corporate home office instead? That might actually do something. Harassing the poor clerks won't.

I do not considering telling them they don't need my phone number being an azzhole, if they do, I reckon that is their problem.

[texaswoodworker]

I do not considering telling them they don't need my phone number being an ******, if they do, I reckon that is their problem.
You told them to "keep the frigging ammo then". I call that being rude.

[starmac]

I told them to keep the friggin ammo??????? where in this conversation did I say anything about keep the ammo, as I have never been ask any questions about any ammo. But I have several times left a full grocery cart at the counter at wallmart because they closed the lane after standing in line until it was my turn, or get ready to pay out and they tell me to go to the self serv line. Yea I can be rude when I feel like it, but I figure my time is worth as much as theirs, especially when I am paying them. I have also taken parts back off of customers trucks and left them sitting on the side of the interstate more than once, when they wanted to start haggling over the bill, like I said I can be rude when I feel like it, pr think the situation deserves it.

[texaswoodworker]

I told them to keep the friggin ammo??????? where in this conversation did I say anything about keep the ammo, as I have never been ask any questions about any ammo. But I have several times left a full grocery cart at the counter at wallmart because they closed the lane after standing in line until it was my turn, or get ready to pay out and they tell me to go to the self serv line. Yea I can be rude when I feel like it, but I figure my time is worth as much as theirs, especially when I am paying them. I have also taken parts back off of customers trucks and left them sitting on the side of the interstate more than once, when they wanted to start haggling over the bill, like I said I can be rude when I feel like it, pr think the situation deserves it.

My mistake, that was the OP. But no, there is no excuse to be rude to them if they are just following company policy. Now if they intentionally give you bad service, that's a little different. Then you should talk to the manager.

[jonp]

You told them to "keep the frigging ammo then". I call that being rude.

No, I did. I was about fed up with this endless information grab, a clerk that should have just punched in any birthday before 1970 as my gray hair should have been a clue and Gander Mt in particular which is overpriced and has people that know nothing. I've been in there twice now I think and both times I heard someone behind the gun counter giving wrong information to a customer.

I was rude an probably should not have been but unless people stop putting up with it it will get worse and worse. I love the comments of people that seem to accept Government running every aspect of their lives as if it was never going to change and was in charge of everything and we are just peon's who can't but follow orders of our betters.

[texaswoodworker]

No, I did. I was about fed up with this endless information grab, a clerk that should have just punched in any birthday before 1970 as my gray hair should have been a clue and Gander Mt in particular which is overpriced and has people that know nothing. I've been in there twice now I think and both times I heard someone behind the gun counter giving wrong information to a customer.

I was rude an probably should not have been but unless people stop putting up with it it will get worse and worse. I love the comments of people that seem to accept Government running every aspect of their lives as if it was never going to change and was in charge of everything and we are just peon's who can't but follow orders of our betters.
Being rude to the clerk won't solve you problem. It never will. Your mad at them because they didn't break store policy? Like I said earlier, that could have cost them their job had a supervisor seen it. All you had to do is give them fake info. You had a choice, they didn't. Don't take your frustration out on the poor clerk. Right or wrong, they have to do what they are told if they want to keep their job.

Call the company's home office instead.

[jonp]

Being rude to the clerk won't solve you problem. It never will. Your mad at them because they didn't break store policy? Like I said earlier, that could have cost them their job had a supervisor seen it. All you had to do is give them fake info. You had a choice, they didn't. Don't take your frustration out on the poor clerk. Right or wrong, they have to do what they are told if they want to keep their job.

Call the company's home office instead.

You right, of course

[Blammer]

I think we should all pick the same birth date and zip code and just give that.

Like 2/29/88 :)

50546

[dragon813gt]

Most registers have a prompt asking if you're of legal age to buy the product. Walmart has this prompt come up for every single box you buy. It's simply yes or no. And I've seen the clerks card young looking people to prove their age. The odd one for me was Liquid Wrench. You have to be an adult to buy it at Walmart.

I never answer marketing questions. Harbor Freight asks for zip code and they never get it. Cabelas always asks for phone number and they never get it. I understand what they're doing but I won't give them any information. They have all they need because I pay w/ a credit card.

[Geraldo]

I was asked for my birthday buying teak oil, and my wife was asked when buying compressed air to clean computers. Apparently it's related to kids huffing propellant. We provided random days and years that satisfied the clerks and went on our way.

[garym1a2]

Stores like autozone track your purchase for warrenty reasons by your phone number, beats keeping the rcpt that has dissappearing ink.
what's wrong with giving Gander your birthdate and zip code. They can't track you down with that.

[WILCO]

What is going on with this endless data mining stuff?

I understand JonP. You voted with your wallet. That's more than most folks will ever do.

[mjwcaster]

The best is the places that want to scan you ID.
Target does that for the good cold/allergy medicine and some stores tried that in town for smokes.
And most people must go along with it, at least at target because they have to get a manager for me every time I tell them no. The clerks seem to not know how to over ride it, and they can because the managers show them how.
So I must be one of the few who refuses.

The stores around here stopped the scanning ID policy real quick for smokes, I must not have been the only one in town, plus it wasn't all stores so you could go next door and buy without scanning.

Another favorite is the local grocery store's policy of carding everyone for alcohol, even the 90 year old lady in front of me.
The clerks normally apologize every time.

Many years ago I used to have it out regularly with Radio Shack managers who insisted on getting personal information, corporate had told me it was optional for the store, and I held the manager to it, not letting them enter fake information, even if I was in a hurry to get back to work.

Another trick I used in the pre-internet days when filling out forms was to use slightly different info, so I could track who was selling the information by the incoming junk mail.

I finally stopped getting mail for Reverend Matt Wehland just a few years ago.

Sometimes I fight it, sometimes I have fun with it and sometimes I just break down and give them the correct zip code. Depends on my mood and the store.

[DR Owl Creek]

If you look at the Federal 1968 gun control law it states you have to be at least 18 to purchase rifle or shotgun ammo and 21 to purchase pistol ammo. If you are under 21 but over 18 and buying 22 ammo they are supposed to ask you what you are shooting the ammo in either a rifle or pistol and if you give the wrong answer you get no ammo. ...

gmsharps

Bingo!

Most of the bigger stores of any kind have their registers programmed by the corporate offices to all operate the same way. The clerks at the store level have no control over this. They do what they're trained to do.

Have you ever tried buying either alcohol or tobacco products anywhere recently? Most of the "convenience" store won't sell you anything without showing proof of age either.

Dave

[starmac]

If, and I'm not saying they don't, corporations program all cash registers the same, why is it that is no questions ask when purchasing 22 lr at sportsmans or even wallmart here. I have not purchased any for a year or maybe a little more, but no questions the last time I did.
Some stores require id for smokes, and some don't, I just deal with the ones that management uses a little sense myself.

[bangerjim]

You need ID & personal info to buy ammo, booze, tung oil, and most other stuff.

BUT..............you need NO ID to vote.........thank you Obummer!

[oldred]

Just a comment on being rude to a clerk or anyone else just following store policy, it makes no sense what-so-ever! Those people are just there to earn a buck and don't make or necessarily agree with store policy so why give them a hard time? Ok call the headquarters and give them a piece of your mind? Nope that won't get it done either because you will only get someone else on the phone waiting on quitting time that don't give a rats behind about your complaint and couldn't do anything about it even if they wanted to! The fact is there is absolutely no one to complain to outside of just emailing or otherwise registering a complaint through employees who are only there for a paycheck and likely even agree with you but can't do a darn thing about it! I had a family member who quit a good paying job with the power company because of idiots taking out their frustration over bill complaints on her when she answered the phone, people would yell and call her names as if it were her fault their bill was too high or whatever it was that them upset! Why don't people stop and THINK? With a company like GM or that utility company there is no one person responsible and no one person who might be "guilty" so taking out frustrations on employees is just plain rude and in fact simply a stupid thing to do!

This is not in any way meant to point at the OP and I understand where he is coming from on that one so please don't take it that way, it's just that the subject kind of took a turn in a somewhat different direction and hit a sore spot for me due to what happened to a close relative of mine who happens to be one of the nicest people you could ever hope to meet!

(Guess maybe she didn't take much back after me! :rolleyes:)

[Blacksmith]

Come on this is the modern age with cell phone selfies and digital printers. Make you own fake ID as long as you don't use it for "illegal porpoises" no problem. Use your picture or someone else (how about a monkey to see if they are paying attention), a nom de guerre (I would label it as such because they won't know what it means), some inventive dates and addresses and print it out. Add some "security features", random bar codes a fingerprint and some "official stamps", laminate it and you can go anywhere. Celebrities do it all the time it is called a stage name.

[BwBrown]

Do just a little homework. I found a nice young local dealer here who is honest as the day is long - not a big retailer/box store. I've bought several guns from him, and the couple gunbroker deals I've made, I paid him well to be my local receiving dealer.
Throughout the "ammo shortage" (I'm personally convinced it is a result of a little bit of gov't tightening and a lot of prepper hoarding) he would call me a couple times a month and say "just got a shipment of 22's how many do you need?" He knows me, I have over the years filled out the forms to establish the legal stuff, but I don't get carded for ammo.
Fair prices too.
Bottom line, befriend a local dealer. It is his/her best interest to keep you happy and coming back.

[Minerat]

Standard answer 12-3-45 - 67 890 it ain't close but it satisfies them. Most have no clue.

[jcwit]

Does it REALLY bother you for a merchant to know your zip code and birth date and still have no idea who you are?

Are you guilty of something and needing to hide it?

[Minerat]

I was kinda miffed at your response. Since it was a kinda like "When did you quit beating your wife." Question. Then decided you probablly didn't mean it that way so a civil response is: No! it's just non of their business.

[jcwit]

But it is if it is a chain merchant. How else are they to make allowance at which area to hit with sales flyers, or flyers in the Sunday paper. It's only part of merchandising, ever wonder why the milk is in the back of the grocery? The retailer is only trying to help their sales and help their customers having what they want to purchase and at the prices that will be advantageous for both.

Don't like it, screw with the with fictitious numbers, there will likely be enough giving the correct info that the one or two that wish to fight the system won't make a bit of difference.

[jcwit]

The one thing that I have wondered is with all the tracking that WalMart has available both in sales and what sells where, they have never gone after the small town market like Dollar General & Family Dollar.

[mozeppa]

i don't care they know my birthday...but when they ask for an address...i always say "1600 Pennsylvania avenue, Washington d.c."

always.

[jcwit]

i don't care they know my birthday...but when they ask for an address...i always say "1600 Pennsylvania avenue, Washington d.c."

always.

And that starts a whole new ball game!

[Rustyleee]

So you couldn't play the game and give them someone else's information??

[dragon813gt]

Why do I care one bit about their marketing? Yes, I realize this cost is built into their prices. But I don't care about their marketing strategies. I don't care if they want to know what area I'm from. They don't NEED this information. Yes, they want it. But a want is vastly different from a need.

I've left products on the counter at a few places when they ask for to much information. Petsmart was the last place I remember doing it. Used to be the frequent shopper card was tied to a phone number. I gave them my work number since it's not mine. When they wanted all sorts of personal information I left a few hundred dollars of merchandise on the counter and walked out. Now the locally owned grocery store gets my money for dog food. I don't mind paying a few dollars more per bag.

[jcwit]

Bet you'd care if they don't carry what you wish to buy?

One aspect of marketing is carrying what customers wish to purchase.

Never had a retail business ask for "personal" info.

Again another reason not to live "out east".

I sure don't consider my birth date or zip very "personal".

Heck my phone # is even listed in the phone book for all to see, along with my street address.

Hey, world here I am!

[jonp]

Bet you'd care if they don't carry what you wish to buy?

One aspect of marketing is carrying what customers wish to purchase.

Never had a retail business ask for "personal" info.

Again another reason not to live "out east".

I sure don't consider my birth date or zip very "personal".

Heck my phone # is even listed in the phone book for all to see, along with my street address.

Hey, world here I am!
Identity thieves just love people like you. I bet you have not problem with cops randomly stopping your car and searching it or the Government recording all of your phone calls or keeping track of your email either. Hey, you got nothing to hide, why not let the cops show up unannounced at your house and search it when they want to.

How easily people give up there God Given rights and those guaranteed under our founding documents.

[bangerjim]

Now we are getting totally paranoid!

[dragon813gt]

Living in the North East has nothing to do w/ corporate policies. Companies managed to do just fine before they started to track individual customers shopping habits.

One of the few things I do participate in is the Pump Perks card from the local grocery chain. They don't require any personal info but your order is tracked by the card. They've actually stopped carrying a good portion of what I used to buy weekly. I now have to go to multiple stores to get what I want. So much for tracking orders to make sure they sell what I buy ;)

[RogerDat]

Now we are getting totally paranoid!
??? Getting ??? I thought one had to already BE paranoid to even consider purchase of a firearm let alone hold a loaded one ;-)

Some people have weighed out the advantages/disadvantages of sharing identifying information with stores, typically in the form of loyalty or rewards card. Some folks find that they are not comfortable with all that sharing. Other folks are fine with it considering the advantage of targeted discount sales or marketing of items they are more likely to be interested in outweigh the risks. Then there are those that have no clue about the risks and make one of the same two choices. Difference is the second group is either being paranoid or foolishly naïve in their ignorance. Fun part is it makes no difference to the vehemence with which they will defend their decision.

The one overarching risk is right now identity thieves go after personal information and credit card information. Or target online banking/shopping credentials through phishing emails or getting a keystroke logger on you computer. These are the big payoff & easy to use data. Eventually the scammers will target the broader metrics that will allow them to "market" a scam targeted directly at you.

If you want to get freaked out and are not married have the person you do have a relationship with do some really odd item searches using Google and Amazon. See how long it takes before you on a totally different computer get targeted advertisements related to their search. She searches on her laptop for romantic weekend packages, he on a different computer gets ED medicine and lingerie advertisements. Married? Takes even less time. I can search for specialty camping items on my laptop and an hour later wife is getting camping equipment ads wherever she goes. Despite using totally different internet connections. My search for solar panel has wife seeing ads for deep cycle batteries, charge controllers and solar panels. Sort of scary, you plan a weekend "business trip" with a mistress and wife gets wise because of the ads that she is seeing all over Facebook. I predict it will bust more infidelity than redial.

[bassnbuck]

Back when the stores asked if this 22lr would be shot in a rifle or handgun, I never needed any handgun 22lr.:grin:

[jcwit]

Identity thieves just love people like you. I bet you have not problem with cops randomly stopping your car and searching it or the Government recording all of your phone calls or keeping track of your email either. Hey, you got nothing to hide, why not let the cops show up unannounced at your house and search it when they want to.

How easily people give up there God Given rights and those guaranteed under our founding documents.


Because I'm listed in the phone book?

Good thing I have a valid tinfoil hat. LOL

I live in a town of 3,000 folks. I know all the Officers in our town. I personally know our County Sheriff.

Ya right, the gov. is recording my phone calls, hehehehehehe.

You are really getting paranoid to say the least!

[jcwit]

Living in the North East has nothing to do w/ corporate policies. Companies managed to do just fine before they started to track individual customers shopping habits.

One of the few things I do participate in is the Pump Perks card from the local grocery chain. They don't require any personal info but your order is tracked by the card. They've actually stopped carrying a good portion of what I used to buy weekly. I now have to go to multiple stores to get what I want. So much for tracking orders to make sure they sell what I buy ;)

Yup, life's tough.

Get out your TS card!

[Cmm_3940]

An acquaintance - I won't say friend - had his grocery loyalty card subpoenaed by his wife's attorney during divorce hearings to prove how much beer he'd been buying. The store was willing and able to comply. So, there Absolutely IS a record kept of everything you buy when you use one of those cards.

[jcwit]

Because I'm listed in the phone book?

Good thing I have a valid tinfoil hat. LOL

I live in a town of 3,000 folks. I know all the Officers in our town. I personally know our County Sheriff.

Ya right, the gov. is recording my phone calls, hehehehehehe.

You are really getting paranoid to say the least!

I'll go a little further. You do realize all of the above is public record. Don't know about where you live but here one can go on the county map and check out every ones property taxes, how much, did they pay, look at their property from the air, from the street view, check out the house number, license plate number if a vehicle is in the drive or street, all kinds of stuff.

It's all public record folks.

[Cmm_3940]

I fail to see how any of that is relevant. We are talking about a company tracking and keeping records of your personal habits and behavior, not matters of public record.

[dtknowles]

Identity thieves just love people like you. I bet you have not problem with cops randomly stopping your car and searching it or the Government recording all of your phone calls or keeping track of your email either. Hey, you got nothing to hide, why not let the cops show up unannounced at your house and search it when they want to.

How easily people give up there God Given rights and those guaranteed under our founding documents.

There is a big difference in freely given and theft. I had my phone number listed for as long as I had a land line. It had my address as well. Same with my parents when they were alive. I was on the do not call list almost as soon as it came about. Not a big deal. The gov checking my e-mails or phone records, that is theft unless they have a warrant and then my beef is with the judge. Search my car, I don't think so, if you don't have the probable cause why would you even want to, again go see a judge. If a cop comes by the house to talk, I would probably let him in but there would be no reason for them to leave the room I am talking to them in. Cashier asks for my date of birth, I would probably tell them, it is easier than having to show them the ID so they can read it for themselves, they ask for my phone number I just tell them I am not giving it to them. They ask for my address, they don't get that unless they have to deliver something to me. I don't really mind them having the info but sort of on a need to know basis. When I order a pizza to be delivered I expect to give them both phone number and address, what is the big deal. Zip code, snip code, they can have that everyone can have that as far as I am concerned. If someone can steal an identity with name, address and phone number then they are really good.

Tim

[jcwit]

I fail to see how any of that is relevant. We are talking about a company tracking and keeping records of your personal habits and behavior, not matters of public record.

Just what habits and behavior are they keeping track of by me buying store brand instead of Charmin Tissue?

Furthermore who cares other than me and the retailer so they can reorder?

[Cmm_3940]

So tell us all,

How much TP HAVE you bought in the last six months? Was there a sudden increase or drop in usage?

[RP]

Just a bit of info all the apps that are free are data collecting think about that the next time you click on one.

[jcwit]

So tell us all,

How much TP HAVE you bought in the last six months? Was there a sudden increase or drop in usage?

Huge drop, Dr. put me on a diet. Gotta lose weight. No more donuts with the local Peace keepers.

[CLAYPOOL]

I take a new copy of my info every 3 years to my local Police chief for my F.F.L. Now they done ran a back ground check on me and I guess do every 3 years too. I don't know. I guess if things "GO SOUTH", I won't die in a nursing home -- EH!

[jcwit]

Hey, I forgot all about my "License to Carry" and the fingerprints, and background check, not only with the local Police but with the State Police, and the FBI, must have passed them all as I have the License. Have heard the State may do a random check with the FBI now and then. Been doing that ever since I was in the military working in The Pentagon, 50 years ago.

[alamogunr]

How many forums do you sign up for that require a birth date? I don't keep track but am surprised when I get an email from one, usually one that I don't frequent, wishing me a happy birthday. I've often wondered what else they could be using that bit of info for.

[JSnover]

Hey, I forgot all about my "License to Carry" and the fingerprints, and background check, not only with the local Police but with the State Police, and the FBI, must have passed them all as I have the License. Have heard the State may do a random check with the FBI now and then. Been doing that ever since I was in the military working in The Pentagon, 50 years ago.
Precisely.
The store is not a government agency and can do NOTHING to you, no matter what information they have.
Big Brother, OTH, already has more than enough. Anyone who worries about Gander Mountain or Wal-Mart is looking over the wrong shoulder.

[texaswoodworker]

How many forums do you sign up for that require a birth date? I don't keep track but am surprised when I get an email from one, usually one that I don't frequent, wishing me a happy birthday. I've often wondered what else they could be using that bit of info for.

Most gun forums, along with a lot of other types forums have an age requirement. They don't want an 8 year old coming on and causing trouble. You can enter in the right date or not. They have no way of knowing either way.

[Cmm_3940]

Precisely.
The store is not a government agency and can do NOTHING to you, no matter what information they have.
Big Brother, OTH, already has more than enough. Anyone who worries about Gander Mountain or Wal-Mart is looking over the wrong shoulder.

I prefer to look over both. Just because one is worse doesn't mean the other isn't also bad. The info collected by stores is only a subpoena away if BB ever decides they need it.

[jcwit]

Any of you folks ever buy a hunting or fishing license?

[dragon813gt]

Any of you folks ever buy a hunting or fishing license?

So please tell me how this has anything to do w/ data mining from a private company.

[jcwit]

Any of you folks have credit cards?

[dtknowles]

Any of you folks have credit cards?

Funny!!!!!! I think they might be too paranoid to use a payment method with a permanent record of their purchases. Someone might find out how much toilet paper they use.

Tim

[Cmm_3940]

CC purchases aren't itemized when they get sent to the card issuer. All that's sent is an amount and a request for authorization. Of course, the name of the seller is recorded, which depending on what you've been up to, might be a bit embarrassing.

[dragon813gt]

You also voluntarily pay w/ your card. You have the option of paying w/ cash just like you have the option of not giving them any personal information.

[RogerDat]

CC purchases aren't itemized when they get sent to the card issuer. All that's sent is an amount and a request for authorization. Of course, the name of the seller is recorded, which depending on what you've been up to, might be a bit embarrassing.

Reminds me of the news story about how some of the shall we say "female professionals" working in New York took credit cards and the card statement would have the "purchase" as being from Joe's Electronics or some similar named shell business. Wondered at the time how many hard looks it generated in front of TV's across the country.

"Oh that, bought a Walkman on that business trip but it was stolen. Right out of my bag. No dear I figured not worth the hassle of a police report". Me I'm thinking that guys living room temperature dropped 15 degrees when that news story aired.

[jcwit]

Besides being watched at every corner, we've created a land where some folks are afraid of every honest move they make. Why? Who knows, mayhap they just feel guilty for no reason.

[Dan Cash]

Lie. lie, lie

[jcwit]

Lie. lie, lie

Explain.

[texaswoodworker]

Besides being watched at every corner, we've created a land where some folks are afraid of every honest move they make. Why? Who knows, mayhap they just feel guilty for no reason.

More likely, they just want their privacy. Just because the feds do everything they can to pry into our lives, doesn't make it right. If a store requires personal information like that, then I fully support boycotting that store. They may have a right to require anything they want in their own store, but we have a right to shop elsewhere.

[Alexn20]

Bottom line, befriend a local dealer. It is his/her best interest to keep you happy and coming back.

Support your LGS! If you dont we will all lose the option.

[dtknowles]

Support your LGS! If you dont we will all lose the option.

I would but don't really know what to buy there. They don't have reloading supplies and never have any guns I would buy. I do buy some .22 LR even though they are over priced and I pay to use their range sometimes but it is only 25 yards. I use them for the occasional transfer if I find I gun I want to buy from a third party, they want a lot for the transfers. They get what business I can throw their way but it is not enough that they even remember my name.

Tim

[dragon813gt]

Support your LGS! If you dont we will all lose the option.

Hard to do when they have no firearms you want and all items are over priced. Unfortunately has made it hard for physical stores to make money. I don't mind paying a little more to support them. But when it's upwards of twenty percent more I'm not buying.

I've stopped using them for transfers as well. I understand they want me to buy firearms from them. But I can't do that when they have nothing I want. Local guy charges $20 a transfer compared to the $40 they want. Guess who gets my money in that scenario.

[white eagle]

I have also in addition to age and zip been asked for phone number
never give the correct intel either

[JSnover]

I prefer to look over both. Just because one is worse doesn't mean the other isn't also bad. The info collected by stores is only a subpoena away if BB ever decides they need it.
But if all the store asks is name, age, zip code, Big Bro already has all that.

[jcwit]

Being as where I worked at the Pentagon I'm guessing big bro. knows more me than I do.

As far as WalMart asking me my age when I buy a can of spray lacquer, I could care less. For Heavens sake what does anybody think they could possibly do with that anyway?


Come after me because I was born on 10/1/43? Ya right!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[happy7]

If I am not mistaken, it is not illegal to sell ammo to someone underage, rather it is illegal to purchase ammo if you are underage. So the store doesn't have to ask you, I think they just choose to.

[johniv]

When asked if I have proof of my age, I usually say"I'm wearin it" if pressed for a date , 1492 or 1066 . I have been "carded" buying pipe cleaners , fer gosh sake. I am 69 YO and will not drag out a DL for pipe cleaners.

[jcwit]

When asked if I have proof of my age, I usually say"I'm wearin it" if pressed for a date , 1492 or 1066 . I have been "carded" buying pipe cleaners , fer gosh sake. I am 69 YO and will not drag out a DL for pipe cleaners.

Then go elsewhere to buy your pipe cleaners.

[dtknowles]

I have also in addition to age and zip been asked for phone number
never give the correct intel either

What do you do when you order a pizza to be delivered.

Tim

[gunoil]

I just give them bogus info. Mess up their system. At least you won't get their emails!

Above & i dont think thats nc law. Call attorney general

[jcwit]

Birth date and zip code will put you on an E Mail list. OOOOOOOOOOOOOKay!

[David2011]

But it is if it is a chain merchant. How else are they to make allowance at which area to hit with sales flyers, or flyers in the Sunday paper. It's only part of merchandising, ever wonder why the milk is in the back of the grocery? The retailer is only trying to help their sales and help their customers having what they want to purchase and at the prices that will be advantageous for both.

Don't like it, screw with the with fictitious numbers, there will likely be enough giving the correct info that the one or two that wish to fight the system won't make a bit of difference.

Just because they WANT the information that is not a RIGHT to your/my information.


Just a bit of info all the apps that are free are data collecting think about that the next time you click on one.

If you have a smart phone keep the Location Services or GPS function turned off. Otherwise you ~could~ end up getting soft drink ads popping up when you go to the soft drink aisle. Cell phone service providers and app designers can see where you are over a broad area by triangulating cell towers but with GPS enabled they can tell where you are in a shopping center or grocery store- or anywhere else for that matter.


The best is the places that want to scan you ID.

Another favorite is the local grocery store's policy of carding everyone for alcohol, even the 90 year old lady in front of me.
The clerks normally apologize every time.



In many states the magnetic strip on the driver's license contains quite a bit of information according to things I've read; certainly more than any retailer needs to know. I hand them a CHL that doesn't have the magnet strip; just a barcode. They balk but I remind them that the law is to show a valid government issued picture ID. It gives no useful information to them since they don't have a way to scan it. I had a bank teller run my driver's license through a magnetic card reader ONCE. I told him to cancel the transaction and start over. Might have been too late but they were never permitted to scan it again. I could give a rat's rear end less about it being convenient for them. Store clerks are apparently not allowed to apply common sense or judgment and recognize that a person is of social security age when selling alcohol.

Sometimes the zip code data backfires. Years ago Boat U.S. opened a store in Houston. To determine where the store should be they looked at the zip codes of their existing mail order customers. They failed to determine where the rest of the chandleries were located. The others were all located 35 miles away, near the water and the marinas. It wasn't long before they opened a second store near the water.

David

[jcwit]

Just because they WANT the information that is not a RIGHT to your/my information.

David

Never claimed it was a RIGHT. Funny, I have no fear of them having my birth date and zip code, doesn't keep me awake at night at all.

[texaswoodworker]

Never claimed it was a RIGHT. Funny, I have no fear of them having my birth date and zip code, doesn't keep me awake at night at all.

Just because your fine with giving your information away to companies, doesn't mean everyone else is. You giving people a hard time over their choice to not give them the info doesn't change their mind.

[jcwit]

What's he say?

[jonp]

If you were born on the date you said in an earlier post, jcwit, you are probably of a generation that see's no harm in giving out all of your information to anybody that wants it. I just had an elderly lady at a Kiwana's Azalea Sale while discussing the bushes not only give me information on the plants as she was in the garden club but her name, address, directions to her house to look at the azalea's she had in the yard, tell me she lives alone as her husband passed away a number of years ago.

Giving out your information to whoever you please is your prerogative. Businesses demanding it to purchase their products is not a right and I vote with my feet.

If you see no problem with giving out your stuff I'll leave you with this little story: A number of years ago I ended up in Miami over Christmas. As a truck driver there was no freight being shipped but I could have been stuck in a far worse place. I parked the truck, got a cab to Enterprise and rented a car then cruised South Beach and went up to Ft. Lauderdale to go diving. All good.

Several days later I got a call that went something like this:

"Hello, this is "Vera" from Visa is this jonp"?
"Yes"
"We saw some unusual activity on your card and are just checking to make sure you made the charges. Do you have a minute"?
"Sure"
"On Monday we show a charge of $xxx in Miami, FL at Exxon Mobil for gas"
"Sounds about right"
"On Wednesday we show a charge of $xxx in Philadelphia, PA at Home Depot for 5 snowblowers, 2 chainsaws and a weedwacker".
"Uhh...I don't think so."
"We thought it was an odd purchase. Can you show you were not in PA so we can start a fraud investigation"?
"Of course, I'm an OTR Driver, I can copy you a logbook sheet showing me in Florida at the time."
"That's fine. You won't be liable for the charge".....

[jcwit]

If you were born on the date you said in an earlier post, jcwit, you are probably of a generation that see's no harm in giving out all of your information to anybody that wants it. I just had an elderly lady at a Kiwana's Azalea Sale while discussing the bushes not only give me information on the plants as she was in the garden club but her name, address, directions to her house to look at the azalea's she had in the yard, tell me she lives alone as her husband passed away a number of years ago.

Giving out your information to whoever you please is your prerogative. Businesses demanding it to purchase their products is not a right and I vote with my feet.

If you see no problem with giving out your stuff I'll leave you with this little story: A number of years ago I ended up in Miami over Christmas. As a truck driver there was no freight being shipped but I could have been stuck in a far worse place. I parked the truck, got a cab to Enterprise and rented a car then cruised South Beach and went up to Ft. Lauderdale to go diving. All good.

Several days later I got a call that went something like this:

"Hello, this is "Vera" from Visa is this jonp"?
"Yes"
"We saw some unusual activity on your card and are just checking to make sure you made the charges. Do you have a minute"?
"Sure"
"On Monday we show a charge of $xxx in Miami, FL at Exxon Mobil for gas"
"Sounds about right"
"On Wednesday we show a charge of $xxx in Philadelphia, PA at Home Depot for 5 snowblowers, 2 chainsaws and a weedwacker".
"Uhh...I don't think so."
"We thought it was an odd purchase. Can you show you were not in PA so we can start a fraud investigation"?
"Of course, I'm an OTR Driver, I can copy you a logbook sheet showing me in Florida at the time."
"That's fine. You won't be liable for the charge".....

Well no, not really, I do not give out ALL info. Date of Birth? Thousands were born on that date, means little. Zip Code, heck that means little. My name and address is in the phone book, so what, gives little info to anyone, unless they are looking for me, and then here I am.

But then I deal with cash, usually carry in 4 figures. Only credit card I carry is a card I use for gas and PayPal, which is tied to a separate checking acct, most anyone could ever get is $150.00.

[mold maker]

If you were born on the date you said in an earlier post, jcwit, you are probably of a generation that see's no harm in giving out all of your information to anybody that wants it. I just had an elderly lady at a Kiwana's Azalea Sale while discussing the bushes not only give me information on the plants as she was in the garden club but her name, address, directions to her house to look at the azalea's she had in the yard, tell me she lives alone as her husband passed away a number of years ago.

Giving out your information to whoever you please is your prerogative. Businesses demanding it to purchase their products is not a right and I vote with my feet.

If you see no problem with giving out your stuff I'll leave you with this little story: A number of years ago I ended up in Miami over Christmas. As a truck driver there was no freight being shipped but I could have been stuck in a far worse place. I parked the truck, got a cab to Enterprise and rented a car then cruised South Beach and went up to Ft. Lauderdale to go diving. All good.

Several days later I got a call that went something like this:

"Hello, this is "Vera" from Visa is this jonp"?
"Yes"
"We saw some unusual activity on your card and are just checking to make sure you made the charges. Do you have a minute"?
"Sure"
"On Monday we show a charge of $xxx in Miami, FL at Exxon Mobil for gas"
"Sounds about right"
"On Wednesday we show a charge of $xxx in Philadelphia, PA at Home Depot for 5 snowblowers, 2 chainsaws and a weedwacker".
"Uhh...I don't think so."
"We thought it was an odd purchase. Can you show you were not in PA so we can start a fraud investigation"?
"Of course, I'm an OTR Driver, I can copy you a logbook sheet showing me in Florida at the time."
"That's fine. You won't be liable for the charge".....

Had a similar call about 6 years ago. Appears someone had the numbers and code from a purchase made previously. Visa immediately issued another card and questioned me about every outstanding charge.
Until caught, all that's needed is the numbers, to run up a quick fortune in services and merchandise.
As to info, have you ever filled in your email address for a chance at WINNING? Have you ever filled out a customer survey? You are guaranteed of winning a physical and e mail box full of junk mail.
When you pay, do you refuse to give your phone # or age and then charge your card?
At the Dr office do you give your SS #? Do you avoid the SS # question, and give them a medicare card?
When all records were kept with a pencil and the paper, stored in a file with your name and or customer #, someone had to physically go and retrieve the info. Now it only takes a couple clicks on a laptop by anyone, anywhere in the world, to know your life history.
Being paranoid, and refusing to give a clerk answers is just making their job as miserable as you feel. You're only dealing with one of them, while they deal with thousands of hard cases like you. in a day. The info they are required to obtain for whatever reason isn't classified info. It just adds a click to a counter, with only statistical info, in some bean counters numbers.
If big Bro wanted to know anything about you, they already have a million sources, and at a click, they can tell how many tooth brushes you have and what color. They can track you where ever you go.
Remember the mad cow disease scare? They could track every cow from a farm and all their offspring. Cows don't even have a SS #.

[texaswoodworker]

What's he say?
You know, for an old man, you sure do like to play games that a 5 year old would play.

Go on ignoring me. I try to have a civil conversation, and you play childish games.

[jcwit]

Whatever you say texaswoodworker, I guess, didn't bother to click the read option, no longer worth my time or to concern myself with it.

mold maker pretty much has it nailed folks.

[texaswoodworker]

Whatever you say texaswoodworker, I guess, didn't bother to click the read option, no longer worth my time or to concern myself with it.

And my point is proven.

[Alvarez Kelly]

And he just keeps spewing forth.

[jcwit]

And he just keeps spewing forth.

Spewing just what?

Just what do you mean, am I not allowed to post?

Do you have a problem with me?

The ignore option is available to you as well as everyone else, is it not?

Are you stalking me?