38 special

[jack19512]

I'm not sure if this belongs here or in the mold forum but I would appreciate some suggestions for a Lee mold for a good 38 special cast bullet.

I just purchased me a new 38 special revolver with 2 inch barrel and would like to start casting some bullets for it that would be a good compromise between accuracy and a good carry round.

Also, what is considered a good powder for use in a short barreled 38 special revolver? Thanks

[dubber123]

Alot of people speak highly of the 158 RF Lee boolit. I would lean towards the widest nose you can get for a snubbie. You can't depend on expansion in a 2" barrel with cast and most common alloys, so the flat nose has to do all the work.

You may even consider a wadcutter design. I have Lee's wadcutter mould, but haven't shot any yet. I have gotten some good velocities in a 1-7/8" S&W with Unique powder.

[jack19512]

Thanks for the reply. I order just about all of my supplies from Midway and I checked their site but didn't see any Lee wadcutter mold or any 158 grain bullet molds. Can you tell me where you got yours from? Thanks

[JRR]

Almost all the fixed sight snubby revolvers have sights that shoot to point of aim using the 158 grain bullet at approx. 800 - 850 fps. Going to a light bullet won't be benefiicial because more velocity will not be accurate due to the sights plus the positive fps gain will not be very much relative to the flash, noise and recoil. A bullet with more weight would be a better choice than a light one, shooting a bit high.
Jeff

[JIMinPHX]

I think that Dubber was talking about this one -

http://www.midwayusa.com/eproductpage.exe/showproduct?saleitemid=188719&t=11082005

[Shiloh]

Don't be afraid of the LEE Tumble Lube Series.

http://www.midwayusa.com/eproductpage.exe/showproduct?saleitemid=704691&t=11082005
http://www.midwayusa.com/eproductpage.exe/showproduct?saleitemid=953713&t=11082005

Shiloh

[bradh]

For years I have used the LEE 158gr TL SWC. No complaints with 3.8gr W231.
Lube with LLA tumble.

[dubber123]

I think that Dubber was talking about this one -

http://www.midwayusa.com/eproductpage.exe/showproduct?saleitemid=188719&t=11082005

Thats the one I was talking about for the 158 grain. As for the wadcutter, I'll have to check, maybe they don't sell a wadcutter mould anymore, but I'm pretty sure they do.

Added info: I see now that Shiloh has a link to one of their wadcutter moulds, the one on the bottom of his post. If you want the widest nose available, a wadcutter is it.

[Leftoverdj]

No need to compromise. You can't beat the WC for accuracy, and I doubt you can beat it as a stopper from a 2" barrel. Velocity is too low to get reliable expansion from most nose shapes so a full diameter meplat is about as good as it gets.

[jack19512]

Ah, I see why I didn't find the molds mentioned. I was looking in the .356-.357 range and not the .358. Does anyone ever use a wadcutter for a carry round? Thanks for all of the replies.

[dubber123]

Ah, I see why I didn't find the molds mentioned. I was looking in the .356-.357 range and not the .358. Does anyone ever use a wadcutter for a carry round? Thanks for all of the replies.

I did for years, until I bought into the business about getting in more trouble for using handloads in a self defence situation. I am still hearing arguements for/against, so I am currently usng Speers JHP short barrel ammo. I liked my wadcutters much better. Much more power.

[Sherlok]

Hey Jack,
I've shot 2" revolvers for many years mainly S&W Model 10s. JRR and the others are right, use the 158 grainers (or thereabouts) for which the fixed sights are designed. My favorite is Lyman's #358156 Simi WadCutter of Thompson design. With 800X this is a very accurate load.

I had the opportunity to pick two guns out of a batch of 70 used guns that I could try out. The two I wound up with can consitantly hit a two foot target at 100 yards using a bit of sight elevation with that load.

Good Luck, Sherlok

[Dale53]

I am now using the Lee 358-RF and think that it is a superior bullet design. I recommend the six cavity mould:

http://www.midwayusa.com/eproductpage.exe/showproduct?saleitemid=172810&t=11082005

At any rate, you can use Lyman data (same as their 358311).

The RF design has an advantage over a WC if you need a reload (they will drop in under stress where the WC's must be "fiddled with" when reloading with a speed loader).

Either bullet should do fine at standard or +P velocities.

Jim Cirillo favored a full velocity wad cutter for "serious" work.

Dale53

[WyrTwister]

I'm not sure if this belongs here or in the mold forum but I would appreciate some suggestions for a Lee mold for a good 38 special cast bullet.

I just purchased me a new 38 special revolver with 2 inch barrel and would like to start casting some bullets for it that would be a good compromise between accuracy and a good carry round.

Also, what is considered a good powder for use in a short barreled 38 special revolver? Thanks


Powder -> Bulleseye .

Get the Semi-Wad Cutter to shoot .

Buy a box of 100 soft swagged Hollow Base Wad Cutter . Load these backwards for carry .

God bless
Wyr

[jack19512]

Well, no sooner I order the 158 gr. Lee mold my wife looks at the new 38 special revolver I just purchased and she wanted it. She carries a .25 auto, yes I know, I know, I tried to tell her to start with but she wouldn't listen.

So I tell her that if I give her the 38 I would have to have something else so she says go ahead and get it. I go back to the gun shop and get me a new Ruger GP 100 .357. Nice looking revolver.

Now this mold won't go to waste as I can load her some ammo to practice with but will this cast bullet shoot good in the Ruger as well? I do appreciate your Patience. :)

[JIMinPHX]

will this cast bullet shoot good in the Ruger as well?


You bet!

[Dale53]

The Lee 358-158-RF works extremely well in the .357 Magnum AND the .38 Special.

Dale53

[cbr]

+1 on the lee 358-158-rf. Shoots great in my model 10.

[Bret4207]

I have carried WC in my 38. I never felt under gunned.

[oso]

I have been disappointed in the performance of reversed hollow base wad cutters as far as accuracy and expansion are concerned, but if a keyhole in some general direction is what you want go ahead but actually try them before you rely on them.
The Lee 358-158-RF is a slick loading boolit with a great meplat. Try loading wad cutters and even semi-wad cutters in a hurry.
I've had good results with the 38 Special snubbies getting various hollow points to expand in wet newspaper using HS6 about max loads.

[Dale53]

Most carry guns have rather short barrels that do NOT allow you to realize factory velocities (often taken in a closed pressure barrel 6" long). I do NOT expect a .38 snubbie bullet to expand. What is doable, however, is to get decent penetration with a large meplat. Wadcutters have the maximum meplat but have the distinct disadvantage as being VERY hard to load fast under stress (that has been mentioned but needs to be emphasized). You could load full factory velocities (NOT target factory velocities) and then have your reloads something else that allows quick loading. I do NOT favor that practice. I want to simplify and use ONE load in the gun and the exact same load in my speed loaders. The LEE 358-158-RF gives maximum "smack" with it's large meplat and good penetration with its weight AT THE VELOCITIES ATTAINABLE IN A .38 Snub nose revolver.

Now, I have a couple or three 1911 platforms that will absolutely do a better job "on target" than any .38 load. However, they also tend to "pull my pants down" when carrying concealed. They are hardly pocket guns. I find myself carrying a 642 and a speed loader in my pockets. That is what works for me.

I would suggest that ability to hit where you need to hit, under stress, in short time periods is far more important than what caliber you have.

If you subscribe to the notion that you should only carry factory loads, then the Speer 135 gr "short gun" load or the FBI 158 gr HP should do the job for you, IF YOU DO YOUR PART (emphasis intended).

Dale53

[Sprue]

Here's a couple examples of what I shoot for target and plinking. Uh, ccw for that matter for the swc. I think it would take too much time to re-chamber the wadcutters under stress.

Theses are straight wheel weights and no fluxing after becoming ingots. Am a bottom pourer as of a month ago. I only tumble my brass for a couple hours, nothing more so these are not extra shiny clean brass...
http://i258.photobucket.com/albums/hh266/spilihp_2007/SWC_WC.jpg

[fireflyfather]

For years I have used the LEE 158gr TL SWC. No complaints with 3.8gr W231.
Lube with LLA tumble.

I use it as well, though I put it over Red Dot. For a short barrel, you would want a quick powder, since you aren't going to have much time to accelerate it. I also favor the SWC over the wadcutter for ease of loading, good meplat, good penetration, and it's about as generic of a projectile as possible except maybe LRN or RNFP. Good stopper without being an "evil" hollowpoint. The TL design is convenient, and there's lots of good data for 158gr SWC.

[Cherokee]

Lee 358-158 RF is great bullet. Highly recommend it in the 6 cavity mold version.

[Bret4207]

I think I use the Lyman 358477 over a medium Unique load with good results. I don't worry about expansion. You poke five 3/8" holes in someone and they should stop doing whatever irritating thing they're doing.

[Spud]

Although I don't shoot a snubbie, I'm of the heavy bullet school for 38 Spec. I shoot a 358429 (168 gr.) in my loads w/Unique. Many 38 loads don't expand anyway, so I want penetration to perforate the creep. JMHO, but YMMV.

[Black Jaque Janaviac]

I get good results with both the Lee .358-158-RF and the Lee TL358-158-SWC.

I load the SWC to .38 spl velocities and the RF to somewhere between .38 and .357 mag velocities. I have had problems with the RF at lower velocities out of my '92 lever action, hence I got the SWC and have had good luck with that.

I would like to see Lee make an RF with the TL grooves.

One word of advice - Now that you have both a .38 AND a .357 in the house DO NOT LOAD A .38 SPL CASE BEYOND .38 SPL SPECS!!!! Many reloaders (myself included) who have .357s will hot-load .38spl cases since the .357mag can tolerate such loading. But if those hot .38 spl cases ever found their way into your wife's gun - you'll be sorry. I only hot-load .38 spl cases because the only guns in my house are .357 magnums. If I ever got a true .38, I'd go fire off all the .38s in my house with a .357magnum and never hotload a .38 case again.

[centershot]

Jack19512,
Before you settle on any carry load for your gun, please take a moment to read the information in the attachment below. The author is a recognised expert in the field of defensive shooting and he is reporting results of actual street shootings! These are the facts of what was used and what works, as documented in the reports of hundreds of police and civilian shootings. I think you'll be surprised at what the .38 Special can do when fed properly!

http://www.encyclopedia.com/doc/1G1-82551648.html

Also, before anyone decides to use handloads for defensive purposes, consider this: I, personally, have NEVER had a misfire with any factory load I have EVER fired. The same can not be said for my habdloads, on occasion I get a dud. Not many of them over the years, but it happens. Also, try to answer this question from a district attorney when you are on trial for wounding, or possibly killing, someone with those handloads without making yourself sound like a bloodthirsty savage to the ever-more-liberal jury you will face:

"Mr. Jones, the evidence shows you did not load your gun with ammunition that was supplied by any of the ammunition companies. You chose to use ammunition that you, yourself, created. Why in the world did you feel you needed to create ammunition that was more devastating, more deadly, than that supplied by the ammunition companies?"

I sure don't want to be there!


centershot


OK, I don't know what happened to that link, the one that's up now will take you to the article! Sorry!

[Bret4207]

The writer is the guy who started the whole "handloads will get you in trouble" idea as far as I can tell. He's also the guy I asked specifically to supply me with case law showing this was an issue. He refused to supply any case law and also refused to tell me just how much time he had on the street as a cop.

While I enjoy his writing, admire his shooting and marvel at his abilities as an expert witness these skill pale in comparison to his skill at dodging a question. Because of this I can only put so much faith in his opinion.

This is a risk saying this. The last time I ventured this opinion on another board "his" followers got me banned from talking about it anymore.

[OBXPilgrim]

Thanks for the opinion Bret.

I've heard those quotes spoken as gospel for years, but never heard of it being an issue, but not being around the courts or legal system, never would.

I've wondered how the tooth gnashing DA would feel if the answer was just , "it was cheap & shot good in my gun". After looking over the details of the article that Mas wrote (again), how could anyone argue the lead Lee 158 RF or a wadcutter "target" load "was more devastating, more deadly, than that supplied by the ammunition companies"

Just hard for me to believe that's a valid argument, but it's been enough to keep me from carrying my own for years.

[trickyasafox]

I'm with bret 100% on this. A strong and authoritative opinion is not fact. I'm not a big fan of ayoob. no reason- I just think he's silly

[jack19512]

Thanks to all that have replied. I have ordered all of the materials that I need to cast for the .38 and .357. I think I will stick to commercial ammo for personal defense purposes and the cast for practice. Thanks again. :-D

[MT Gianni]

In an old Handloader, late 70's early 80's, he writes that this hasn't happened yet but it will soon. I don't have the qoute near me but read it in a pile I bought this winter. I don't know that it has happened yet. I'm still going with I didn't plan to shoot anyone, that was what was in the gun. Gianni

[Bret4207]

Dan and I were talking about this the other day. I load hunting and target loads. Thats it. Some hunting loads use HP, some not. Same with target. I don't load for self defense. I load "cheap, home made lead bullets" and reload because "it's too expensive to buy factory stuff". I could go on but thats the idea, and it's the truth and the chances of it ever becoming an issue are so incredibly small as to be of no concern to me.

[carpetman]

wadcutter? Semi wadcutter? Here we go again someone wanting us to pick their nose.

[Leftoverdj]

I can just remotely see ammo being an issue were it truly exotic stuff like Glasers, the tubular copper bullets of some years back, inverted wadcutters, or multii-ball loads. I can see huge problems with snakeshot or .410 used to blind without killing. Reasonably normal ammo is not going to be a problem even if handloaded.

The odds are against the cops even noticing they are handloads. Remanufactured ammo is common, and the real world is not CSI Miami. Run of the mill self defense shootings do not get the full lab treatment. There might be an extremely rare exception, but most such cases are to tried, as they should be, on the question of self defense.

If anything, this strengthens the case for WCs. Any cop of the revolver generation is going to think target loads.

[testhop]

got to agree with wyr
loaded backwards thehbwc is a great stopper
but if you cast i would very soft lead mix so it will expand
it may lead the barrel but +it is worth the extra work

[Bret4207]

I can just remotely see ammo being an issue were it truly exotic stuff like Glasers, the tubular copper bullets of some years back, inverted wadcutters, or multii-ball loads. I can see huge problems with snakeshot or .410 used to blind without killing. Reasonably normal ammo is not going to be a problem even if handloaded.

The odds are against the cops even noticing they are handloads. Remanufactured ammo is common, and the real world is not CSI Miami. Run of the mill self defense shootings do not get the full lab treatment. There might be an extremely rare exception, but most such cases are to tried, as they should be, on the question of self defense.

If anything, this strengthens the case for WCs. Any cop of the revolver generation is going to think target loads.

Truer words were never spoken!

[Black Jaque Janaviac]

"Mr. Jones, the evidence shows you did not load your gun with ammunition that was supplied by any of the ammunition companies. You chose to use ammunition that you, yourself, created. Why in the world did you feel you needed to create ammunition that was more devastating, more deadly, than that supplied by the ammunition companies?"

The answer could be as simple as, "I don't feel such a need."

If anything I would think the lawyers would have an easier time making the defendant look bloodthirsty by using the commercially manufactured ammo advertisements. They can't do that with something as ho-hum as Lee Precision molds.

[Sherlok]

I think the important concern will be if you were proper in using deadly force in the first place. Won't matter if you used a club.

Sherlok

[Wayne Smith]

Jack19512,


"Mr. Jones, the evidence shows you did not load your gun with ammunition that was supplied by any of the ammunition companies. You chose to use ammunition that you, yourself, created. Why in the world did you feel you needed to create ammunition that was more devastating, more deadly, than that supplied by the ammunition companies?"

I sure don't want to be there!
!

"Your Honor, the ammunition I created is not more devistating or more deadly than that supplied by the ammunition companies. In fact the standard for stopping an attacking person has not substantially changed for the past 130 years. It is a bullet of 200-250grs going between 650 and 900 fps. This is proven by USArmy tests dating back to the 1890's and British Army tests dating even earlier. The load I created is ... in relation to that universal standard. Ammunition companies now attempt to create ammunition that is even more deadly than that standard and, at least in their advertising, they have."

That is all the answer you need. It will take a very prepared lawyer to even question it. If I knew I was going to be asked this I would have the revelant research at hand to present to the judge.

PS You testify to the bench, not the the lawyer asking the question. It's true in law and lawyers hate it when you do it and judges love it.

[wills]

[QUOTE=centershot;306236]

"Mr. Jones, the evidence shows you did not load your gun with ammunition that was supplied by any of the ammunition companies. You chose to use ammunition that you, yourself, created. Why in the world did you feel you needed to create ammunition that was more devastating, more deadly, than that supplied by the ammunition companies?"
QUOTE]

Other lawyer: "Objection: Assumes facts not in evidence."

[Ron]

In the days when my department issued lead r/nose 38 cal ammo for us, I choose to carry personally bought hollow points and speed loaders which were not issued. Not only were they a better man stopper but also reduced injury to by standers in event of a richochet. My other thought was that If I was justified in using my firearm, then it didn't matter what it was loaded with. I would explain any concerns the Coroner might have.
Eventually, my department did issue factory hollow points which is still the standard issue. Just took them a bit longer to wake up. I understand that the reasons of course were safety issues, for both the officers and the public.

[jack19512]

I cast my first bullets for my 38/357 today. I ordered the two cavity mold and cast 236 of them. The mold worked great and the bullets look real good. I have a couple of questions though, do those of you that cast for the 38/357 shoot them as cast or do you size them?

I use straight wheel weights and would like to know if you would recommend shooting these 158 grain bullets soft or would I be better off shooting them after water dropping them to harden them?

I should clarify, when I said soft I guess that is not correct, I mean shoot them as cast without trying to harden them in any way. I have two powders that I am going to try, Unique and 4227. Thanks

[Ricochet]

You'll be fine with air cooled wheelweights in both .38 and .357.

[8mmshooter]

I think I would use what ever I have that I can shoot accurately; and worry about the legal stuff after I had survived the incident. A good 158 grain or even 148 grain wad cutter is better than a knife in a gun fight. Use what you have and feel comfortable with.

[Bret4207]

"Your Honor, the ammunition I created is not more devistating or more deadly than that supplied by the ammunition companies. In fact the standard for stopping an attacking person has not substantially changed for the past 130 years. It is a bullet of 200-250grs going between 650 and 900 fps. This is proven by USArmy tests dating back to the 1890's and British Army tests dating even earlier. The load I created is ... in relation to that universal standard. Ammunition companies now attempt to create ammunition that is even more deadly than that standard and, at least in their advertising, they have."

That is all the answer you need. It will take a very prepared lawyer to even question it. If I knew I was going to be asked this I would have the revelant research at hand to present to the judge.

PS You testify to the bench, not the the lawyer asking the question. It's true in law and lawyers hate it when you do it and judges love it.

If you ever find yorself in this position and have a lawyer dumb enough to put you on the stand, find another lawyer QUICK!!! Unlike TV and movies defendants are seldom put on the stand for the simple reason that it gives them the chance to screw up during testimony. A single misplaced word or inaccurate phrase can open a can of worms. What was a verboten area can be opened to examination if the defendant goes there willingly or even mistakenly. Same thing applies during the investigation. While I will never encourage anyone to be less than truthfull, should you feel that an action you took might be questionable you are well within your rights to ask for legal advice or representation prior to completing a depostition or statement. Things like this are why I say discretion is the better part of valor when it comes to guns.

[wills]

1. In civil litigation you can be called by the other party.

2. Some jurisdictions have "wide open cross" which is not limited to matters raised on direct.

[jack19512]

It sure would be nice if I could get this thread back on topic. [smilie=1: Please, enough about the hypothetical self defense scenarios. I would like to ask what everyone is having to pay for small pistol primers in their area if it won't start another debate about something else, I had to pay $3.70 including tax for a pack of the CCI in my area. :(

[Dale53]

Actually, THIS topic is what Lee mould is recommended for a bullet to be used in a .38/.357[smilie=1:.

I stocked up on primers from Powder Valley last fall. I just checked their web site and Federal Small and Large pistol primers are going for $25.00 a thousand (I paid considerably less last fall). Everything seems to be jumping sky high right now and I mean everything (no doubt the excuse is the high gas prices - with some justification, of course).

Dale53

[trickyasafox]

I haven't bought primers since summer- I'm nervous to even look by me.

for what its worth- as of late august- they were 16.50 per K by me for the cheapest sale price (mag techs and CCI)

[jack19512]

Actually, THIS topic is what Lee mould is recommended for a bullet to be used in a .38/.357[smilie=1:.


Dale53






Dale, with all due respect I am the one that started this thread and I know what I had in mind when I started it and most of what has been added isn't it. Gentlemen this is the first time in my life that I have objected to one of my threads being hijacked. Theres been very little discussion or comments on the few questions I have asked and still have not had a simple reply to all of them. I would still be interested in hearing from some of you that cast for the 38/357 do you shoot them as cast or do you resize them? Thanks

[Bret4207]

Dale, with all due respect I am the one that started this thread and I know what I had in mind when I started it and most of what has been added isn't it. Gentlemen this is the first time in my life that I have objected to one of my threads being hijacked. Theres been very little discussion or comments on the few questions I have asked and still have not had a simple reply to all of them. I would still be interested in hearing from some of you that cast for the 38/357 do you shoot them as cast or do you resize them? Thanks

Well in that case, replies 2-13 answer your question. Any 140-160 gr with a fn or swc design propelled by a medium fast powder to 750-900 fps will work fine. I use the Lyman 358477, 358156, Lee 358-180FN and several others, along with an H+G 148 gr wc. I use some of them as cast, just tumble lubed if they fit the cylinder, with success. Others require a GC and I think they get sized at .359.

If you look in the Wheelguns section and do a search on 38 loads you'll find a long thread on this very subject that doesn't wander quite so much.

I just bought 1K of LR for $27.00+tax at a local shop, CCI.

[Bret4207]

1. In civil litigation you can be called by the other party.

2. Some jurisdictions have "wide open cross" which is not limited to matters raised on direct.

I was thinking criminal court. I' fairly sure civil rules vary from State to State and wouldn't hazard a guess about other States, but I think the non-self-incrimination rules would apply.

[waksupi]

Just hang in there, Jack. Topics wander here, but somehow seem to have the ability to give a person answers to thier original question, plus a lot of other information they hadn't thought of, if you give it time. If the replys aren't on topic to you, they must be interesting to someone else, if they are generating comments.

As far as shooting them sized, or unsized, it depends!

[Dale53]

Jack;
Here is the entire first post in this thread:

>>> 38 special
I'm not sure if this belongs here or in the mold forum but I would appreciate some suggestions for a Lee mold for a good 38 special cast bullet.

I just purchased me a new 38 special revolver with 2 inch barrel and would like to start casting some bullets for it that would be a good compromise between accuracy and a good carry round.

Also, what is considered a good powder for use in a short barreled 38 special revolver? Thanks<<<


We have answered your question about which bullet, at least in our opinion (and I believe good suggestions).


As to powder - In the .38 Special, Unique is the traditional standard for full loads not exceeding SAAMI pressure standards). Win 231 would be a good choice also. Frankly, there are a number of powders that would work quite well. Those are just the ones that I have used extensively and they have worked well for me.

Dale53

[jack19512]

Thanks for the replies. I shot my first 10 rounds today. I used the Unique and 4227 powders and Lee alox lube. They both worked well but the Unique grouped a little better. When I cleaned the revolver there was no leading that I could tell. I will set up my chronograph and work on the load and get it where I want it. Thanks again

[johnho]

Regarding questioning Ayoob's credentials: No one should question his credentials and knowledge of legal proceeding regarding self defense. He writes every month in American Rifleman, teaches self defense from both the shooting and legal aspect, has written several books on legal decisions, produced a great DVD for handling the legal aspects before you shoot and after (highly recommended to get if anyone as a CCW), and has testified as an expert withness in court numerous times on behalf of the shooter.

I would definetly listen to his comments and recommendations without failure. I suspect he was reluctant to proceed with any of his credentials as it is obvious to anyone who knows of him, and those that don't, well he's just not going to go into it. the courts recognize him as an expert witness and i would too, especially if I needed him on my case, which I hope to never have to go through. For the pennies you save it is not worth the lengthy arguments before a lay jury who probably knows nothing about handloading and shooting and might just by his characterization of a handloaded round and it's purpose. Why walking into that trap?

John

[Leftoverdj]

On topic, it's going to be hard to do better than the Lee TL DEWC 148 grain in a snubby. You simply cannot boost velocity significantly from a short barrel so take the biggest meplat you can get. The DEWC casts and loads easily, shoots accurately, and is well suited to the various tumble lubes.

I favor WW 231, but I am not nearly as dogmatic about powder choice. All of the fast pistol powders work well so my choice was made mostly on ability to meter consistently. My usual charge is 3.1 grains of WW 231, but the Lyman Cast Bullet Handbook shows loads up to 4 grains.

[redbear705]

Wadgutters (Ha! after posting I see I miss spelled wadcutters but I like IT! :) )shoot accurately and pack a punch but reloading the cylinder under stress will be a problem ...the Lee 158RF shoots great in 38spl and will shoot great out of the ruger gp100....as it does out of mine.

The 158rf makes nice clean holes when used for cardboard targets such as IDPA,IPSC,PPC shooting....and should work good for self defense/hunting purposes with that big meplat.

Somewhere on this board are some photos of this bullet that were recovered after shooting and shows how they deformed on impact...impressive!

Oh Yeah!!!!! they are very accurate! :) ...out of 38spl/357mag handguns as well as out of the 357mag rifles!

JR

Here are the pics...

[Dale53]

I am so enamored of the Lee 158 RF that I wished that they made it in .44 and .45 also. This is an EXCELLENT design in general for all 'round use, in my opinion.

Dale53

[jack19512]

Up until recently the only revolver I had was my Ruger SingleSix 22 cal, the rest of my handguns were semi-autos. Since I got the 38 special and now my wife has it I got me a new Ruger GP-100 .357 and just the other day I purchased me a new Ruger New Model Blackhawk .357.

I hope the loads that work in her snubbie will work well in both my Rugers also. I have loaded up 10 more rounds for tomorrow and will set up my chronograph to see what the velocities are.

[OBXPilgrim]

I am so enamored of the Lee 158 RF that I wished that they made it in .44 and .45 also. This is an EXCELLENT design in general for all 'round use, in my opinion.

Dale53

I completely agree. I got the 44/200 RF, 45/200 RF, & 45/255 RF Lee molds thinking they were upsized duplicates of the 357/158 RF - not so.

The 44 slug is much more of a RN. In most of the photos from the catalog, the 45/200 looks like it has a smaller meplat than the 45/255, that's not the case either - the 45/200 RF has a big, honkin' FN. The 45/255 is a good slug, but I wish it had a little larger meplat.

That Lee 357/158 RF is one good shootin slug.

[redbear705]

The Lee 158rf shoots equally well out out my security six2 3/4" and my gp100 4" and my s&w 65 4".

The lead gets out at 1048 fps avg out of the security six and at just over 1100 fps avg out of the 4"ers both the smith and ruger.

all the guns are 357 mag and I use 38spl cases using 4.2gr Titegroup....when done shooting an IDPA match they are sooty but the load works well out of all guns and very little leading...I think that most of the smoke and soot is off the bullet lube as I have used some berry bullets and the clean up was alot easier!

Have fun!

JR