Selecting a first chronograph

[xsquidgator]

I thought I knew a little about chronographs, but this thread here on Cast Boolits (http://www.castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?t=26863&highlight=chronograph) convinced me to make a chrono my next significant purchase. I understand a little about some of the features one can get, and I don't care too much about that. Convenient features are nice, but if all I had was something that simply indicated the speed of each bullet passing over the sensors, I'd be ok with that even if I had to write each one down on a pad.

So what's the problem? I'm leery of getting a chrono that just doesn't work right. Despite how simple the principle of operation of a chrony is, they don't always seem to be dependable. A guy I know at work got a Shooter's Gamma (I think? I know that "gamma" was in the name of the chronograph, it was a green metal box with screens and a 20' cord linking the chrony with the readout/controls) a year ago. He never was able to get around to using it, so he loaned it to me and I ended up potting around with it over and over for six months until I gave up.

This chrony worked ok with BB guns, airsoft (he tested it), and .22LR (I tested it). With 22's it read out about 1200 fps out of a Ruger 10/22, which is almost exactly what the box said the bullets should be going. No problem, everything's fine, works just like the instruction book said it should.

Well, everything wasn't fine. Throw anything heavier than a 22 over it and weird things would happen. Lots of error messages, like one eye saw the bullet but not the other, vice versa, or "other general error" or "bad light conditions" when it's perfect weather out, with and without the light screens. People with chrony experience would stop by occasionally and try to help me, and we went through every fix we could think of to no avail. Screens on, screens off. Fixing fabric and cardboard shields at various places around the screens to get rid of shadows. Very securely fastening the chrony to tables and tripods. Nothing made it work consistently. The only improvement we got was that instead of reading Error 1 or error 2, it started reporting fps numbers but these were numbers that were just not believable. Like my 45ACP with 230LRNs running at 1400 fps, it said. Uh uh. Try the 22s again and it reads 1200 fps just like it should. Next string it'll say my 45's are going 2000 fps. Crazy. It obviously didn't like muzzle blast or loud noises. (A guy in the lane next to me shooting an AR would make it go bananas too). Tried to make this thing work on 3-4 range visits spaced over 6 months and a variety of weather conditions. Got butkus.

So, sorry for the long winded story, but I really don't want to buy a lemon chrony. No guarantees I know, but surely someone makes a basic chrony for $200 or less which, even if it doesn't have bells and whistles, will let me see how many fps my pistol and rifle boolits are going? I just want something dependable and believable. The guys I talked to who have chrony's all say theirs worked straight out of the box and that there must have been something wrong with the one my friend from work had.

Got any chronys in mind that you'd recommend to me? features are nice and I'll consider paying for them, but something reliable and believable is my main concern. Call it "robustness", that's what I want in a chrony. Any advice?

[NVcurmudgeon]

I like my c. 1980 Oehler. You can only shoot the screens because the rest is safely on the bench.

[Dale53]

Oehler no longer makes consumer chronographs. I purchased an Oehler 35 Chronograph for our club many years ago (right after they came out) and used it with excellent results until our range house burned down. When I went to replace it, I learned that (talked to Ken, himself) Oehler lost their printer supplier and would no longer supply the consumer trade. We got lucky, a fellow member had a nearly new one (used twice) that he let the club have for a reasonable price, so we are again in business.

There are several good ones out there - hopefully, one of the other people with experience with specific chronographs will chime in.

Dale53

[wiljen]

Buy a cheap one as most of us at some point in our career shoot it. This seems especially true for first time users.

Oh, and don't ask me how I know [smilie=1:

[Lee]

I have one of those green boxes and have not had a problem with it. Except when.....I'm too close. The symptom you describe sounds like that. Too close and all sorts of strange stuff happens from the muzzle blast.
I've also had some screwy stuff when the battery is weak, not weak enough to alarm, but not up to snuff. Each spring I turn the clocks ahead and put a brand new battery in the thing.
It's also possible youve got a bad chrony.........................Lee:wink:

[Maven]

xsquid...., The F-1 Shooting Chrony is a dependable instrument if you don't mind it's foibles. To wit, if you can live with writing down the velocity & using a ballistic program or calculator to determine standard deviation; it's somewhat flimsy screens; and its sensitivity to the direction & brightness of ambient light; it's an excellent value. As for the last point, when it's cloudy, you probably won't need the screens (unless it's what Kodak used to call "cloudy bright" in its film exposure guides). When the sun is directly overhead, you tilt your tripod head away from it and it will measure velocity very reliably (I've done this with 87gr. -> 465gr. CB's). If you purchase one, make or buy the clear plastic (Lexan?) shields that cover both the face and sensors of the device to prtoect your investment (Don't ask how I know this!).

[pdawg_shooter]

I have a Pact that I use maybe once a year. Thought I really need one, shot everything over for a few months, now hardly ever get it out any more. Guess accuracy is more important to me now. Paper patching kinda removed the need for one.

[Larry Gibson]

As screens do get shot eventually it is best in the long run to have a chronograph with just screens out front and the electronic hardware on the bench. They are nore expensive initially but less so in the long run. Also they do give ES and SD etc.

I'd suggest an Oehler M35P to even if they are out of production. The skyscreens are still being made as they are used on the M43 Oehler which Oehler is still making. I talked with Dr. Oehler yesterday and he said the problem with producing the M35P is he and his small staff are trying to retire. He would really like to turn over production of the M35P (and probably the other equipment in a short time) to a young electrical engineer who is not afraid of "hands on work", i.e. actually building things himself. Anyways if you can find a 35P they are excellent. You might look in Midway's catalog. They have a decent selection and give info on each chronographs capabilities. I'd lean toward the Pact Professiona XP and get the extra Mark 6 Skyscreens for indoor use.

What ever chronograph you get you will find the information provided to be valuable once you learn what it is telling you.

BTW: it also sounds to me like your problems with the Gamma were you had it to close to the muzzle. I have found that inaccurate readings with any unshielded chronograph can happen if the start screen is closer than 15 feet.

Larry Gibson

[woody1]

I have a Chrony Beta Master. I know, I know. it's cheap. But by golly it works for me. I don't have to write stuff down, although I usually do because I HAVE had it lose stuff. Not very often and it was my prob'ly my fault. I check it with a 22 if I don't believe the readings. (Make sure you've got it opened up all the way or you'll get readings that are too fast...yeah I've done that) It will occasionally not read right with certain light conditions, usually early or late and bright sun. I almost always use the light screens and I've even used it indoors with a halogen work light for "sun." Don't shoot too close as muzzle blast will cause problems and make sure you're shooting across both sensors. Prob'ly part of the reason I use the screens all the time is that forces me to pretty much shoot where the thing is lookin'. I've even used it with shotgun loads and haven't killed it YET but when I do I'll not be cryin' too much. It does have some dings and dents from flyin' gas checks. Oh, what'd I recommend? Nothing, but if I was to buy one again it'd be another Chrony Beta Master. Regards, Woody

[Whitespider]

I would suggest the “Pact Model 1 XP”, includes skyscreens with mounting bracket (you’ll need a tripod for the bracket). The “box” sits on the bench out of the line of fire, only the relatively cheap skyscreens are in the danger zone. It reads out individual velocity, average velocity, ES, SD and MAD. The data is recallable and it even lets you edit out bad or suspect readings. If it’s like my old (really old) Model 1 it runs from a 9-volt battery.
Order it direct on line at http://www.pact.com, one heck of a buy at $129.95.

[Dale53]

While I have experience with only the Oehler Chronographs (Models 33 and 35) I would strongly suggest that you NOT settle for less than:
1 - Separate external screens so that if you make a mistake you don't destroy the electronics.

2 - One that records the information including single round velocity, average, high and low, and Standard Deviation .

3 - One that uses commonly available batteries (most use the standard 9 volt battery, I believe.

4 - You can buy an inexpensive camera tripod that supports most of the external screens.

Dale53

[pearson1662]

My first Chrono is a Competition Electronics ProChrono Digital ~$100 and it works fairly well most of the time. It does not work well without good lighting. My next chrono will be the CED M2 with IR Lighting upgrade. ~$290 (It also employs a rechargable battery)

http://www.midwayusa.com/eproductpage.exe/showproduct?saleitemid=773378&t=11082005

(10 ft. from the muzzle to center of the sensor bracket is industry standard.)

Good luck with your purchase,

Jay

[TCLouis]

it sounds like it is too close to the muzzle. I had a chrony and it did well for me and now I have a Pact and it has features I NEVER use.

[HORNET]

If it helps, Shooting Chrony does sell rebuilt ones (they do repair the ones that are sent in). The availability is variable but they're about half the cost of new. My latest F-1 seems to work alright. They are NOT bullet resistant.

[mike in co]

i believe this is THE chrono for the bucks. with oelher off the market, this is what i would buy.
you have seen what happens when you SETTLE for a low dollar chrono. i had a pact..it spent more time in texas getting fixed than on the range.
wait a little save some more bucks and only cry once.
mike


My first Chrono is a Competition Electronics ProChrono Digital ~$100 and it works fairly well most of the time. It does not work well without good lighting. My next chrono will be the CED M2 with IR Lighting upgrade. ~$290 (It also employs a rechargable battery)

http://www.midwayusa.com/eproductpage.exe/showproduct?saleitemid=773378&t=11082005

(10 ft. from the muzzle to center of the sensor bracket is industry standard.)

Good luck with your purchase,

Jay

[softpoint]

You can weld a piece of heavy plate to a rod or a piece of re- bar and drive it in the ground to the height where it just protcts the skyscreens. At 12- 15 feet you might get a little spatter back on you , but it will save chrono.
Watch those ar 15's with the scope way over the bore!

[brshooter]

I have a Oehler Model 33 for sale, excellent shape, with glint screens and a spare skyscreen. Oehler Chronographs are a standard by which all others are measured. Send me a message if you are interested. Jon

[4570guy]

+1 for the Pro Chrono Digital. I wish I had the remote, but a long stick serves just as well. The only time I've ever had accuracy or "error" issues with it was when one sensor was in sun and the other in shade. Simply moving the unit to full sun or full shade solves this problem.

[HABCAN]

The only times my PACT won't function is when it's too cold: the printer uses 'thermal' printing tape, and the 9V battery isn't up to it. I like being able to play 'what if' on it in calculator mode. Years ago it cost ~CDN$600 delivered in my hands, but it has been worth it.

[montana_charlie]

xsquid...., The F-1 Shooting Chrony is a dependable instrument if you don't mind it's foibles. To wit, if you can live with writing down the velocity & using a ballistic program or calculator to determine standard deviation;
If you are seriously considering the products from Chrony, here is a little general guidance about 'models'.

As you go up in price range, you get more bells and whistles, but each model has it's 'master' counterpart.
So, you might like the Chrony Beta...which has the readout on the front of the unit. Or, you may prefer the Beta Master which has the little module on the wire that brings the readout up to your bench.

As it happens, I bought the Chrony F-1...their most basic model.
Like you, I figured I would be satisfied with writing down the velocity of each shot, and doing the math later to figure AV, SD, and ES.
But guess what! The F-1 will do that for you if you connect a simple switch to the little plug-in on the side of the faceplate.

Yeah, the memory only holds one string of shots...and the memory is lost if you turn the machine off...but you don't have to do all of the math, after all.

The switch makes the F-1 do all the things the F-1 Master can do...without the extended readout for your bench.

All you need is a small phone plug (to connect to the Chrony), a piece of two-conductor wire (length is up to you), and a switch on the other end of the wire (a spring loaded push button is most intuitive).

I was in Radio Shack to look at switches, and the clerk was trying hard to find something that suited me. He had a better idea of what to show me when I said I wanted a switch mounted on the end of a round handle, that I could push with my thumb to make the connection.

Actually, he had just what I needed, and I mounted it in the end of a small piece of copper tube.

But when he was visualizing my description, he started looking at me sideways...and began asking leading questions about what I needed this switch for. When I explained, he was satisfied.
But I think he was envisioning how nicely my 'thumb switch' would activate something like a suicide belt...therefore the funny questions.

CM

[standles]

CED with the IR upgrade is a fantastic Chrony. Probably more than your going to need to start but you will get around to using its features sooner rather than later.

Great service and support from thsi company,


The IR upgrade is great as cloudy, overcast, sun angle do not matter. Hell shoot indoors if you want. Regardless of brand I now view that option as a must have.


Also the unit sits away so if you shoot a creen you not replacing the guts of the unit.


No affiliation other than an extremely happy customer.


Stveen

[xsquidgator]

Just got back from a few days out, thanks very much everyone for the advice. I'll be thinking it over and hopefully buying soon.

[mbk]

One more suggestion if you get a chrony, I have seen more of them damaged from the skyscreen rods getting hit by a bullet than them taking a full frontal in the box with a low shot. Spend a couple of extra bucks and get some small wooden dowels from the hardware store the same size as the metal skyscreen rods. The hold up the skyscreens just fine but will splinter if hit by a bullet and not break out the plastic on the sensor that they mount in to. It might work on others the chrony's are what I have seen most around here.

Mike

[xsquidgator]

Well, I just pulled the trigger so to speak and ordered a PACT 1-XP over the phone, we shall see how it goes. mbk, thanks for reminding me about the wooden dowel trick, I'd heard of that but forgot about it. Now that it'll be my own property out there in the line of fire I will probably take a little extra care with it and put the dowels on!