Make a usable alloy out of stick on WW or just sell the lead?

[kryogen]

Make a usable alloy out of stick on WW or just sell the lead?

I probably have 30-35 pounds of stick on WW ingots.

If I wanted to use it, I would

need to mix it a bit with some Super Hard Alloy Ingot (30%-Antimony, 70%-Lead)from rotometal right?

Would you also add a touch of tin?

How would you do it?

Also, I might have some alloy that has been mixed with some pure lead and some stick on WW before I started separating those.
What would you do at this point? Hardness test the ingots and see if they need a touch of antimony?

What BHN is needed in an ingot to have an alloy that will shoot at minimum (usable) to medium velocity in a 9mm with hi-tek?
I will probably heat treat harden those if needed. Just air cooling is still too soft and it leads with a medium load.

Or just sell it to buy more wheel weights because I can get 150 pounds of WW for the price of one ingot of super hard....

[ioon44]

If you can get 30-35lbs of linotype and mix it half and half with your stick on WW, this will be around 6-2-92 alloy when mixed.

The 6-2-92 alloy is around 15 BHN air cooled, I use it with the hi-tek coatings, works great with 9mm, .40 & .45.

E-bay is one source for linotype if you can't find any at local scrap yards.

[44man]

I tried and got a pot full of zinc. Have to find a way to separate the metals.

[ioon44]

Test metals with muriatic acid before you melt if your are not sure of what you have. Zink will bubble and fizz, lead won't do anything.

[Dusty Bannister]

Quote:
Make a usable alloy out of stick on WW or just sell the lead?

I probably have 30-35 pounds of stick on WW ingots.



Clean it well, cast into ingots, mark them well and set them aside. You will end up using them at some point and it will only cost more later to replace it.

[CHeatermk3]

If you can get 150 pounds of WW for the price of 1 ingot of super hard then that's what you should do. Save the stick-on ingots --you probably could blend them 1-1 with WW and have a very shootable alloy, assuming of course you have the time and patience to sort out all the zinc and then smelt into ingots.

[Yodogsandman]

I wish I had some SOWW's stashed away, just found someone with 3000# of 12% antimonial lead for sale. It would be a good alloy mixed with that with a little tin added..

[bangerjim]

Keep them! Clean, sort, cast into ingots.

You will always need ~pure lead.

banger-j

[kryogen]

Already into ingots, 5 ingots of 6 pounds each.
What if I mix 50-50 with WW? or even 25% SOWW for 75% COWW? Would it make my alloy too soft to be heat treated and shot in a 9mm?
I would rather not waste any lead if that's possible... I'm never shooting any rifle, I just want medium loads of 9mm to work.

I need to test my ingots because I have many that were mixed with some pure lead, others with some SOWW and mostly COWW, etc etc. Hardness may vary.
I think that I'll get a hardness tester, test them all, write the number on them, and then re-melt a large batch or something to get something more uniform.
I have 1000 pounds at least of ingots so it's quite a job, if the hardness is kind of even, I would rather just keep those as it is and shoot.

[Yodogsandman]

I like to spray paint the ends of my ingots different colors to tell them apart. A lettered metal punch would be better, I know. I used to just mark the COWW's with a straight chisel and hammer, as all I had at that time was COWW's and pure.

[bangerjim]

I have been using the color coding scheme for years. It makes ID'ing ingots VERY quick & easy....rather than picking them up and reading a metal stamp inprint. I do stamp the alloy ID on the ingots but then spray the ends when stacked. Weight is with a black sharpie.

kryogen.......download the free alloy calculator spreadsheet on here. All you "what if" questions will be answered easily. Bhn cals are pretty close.

banger-j

[Wayne Smith]

Save your pure lead. If you are a shooter you will eventually invest in a cap and ball revolver and you will need it! If I'm wrong, sell it to me!

[Dusty Bannister]

"I would rather not waste any lead if that's possible... I'm never shooting any rifle, I just want medium loads of 9mm to work."


Yes, and I am the guy that would never own a 9MM, never own an AR, and....... Well, that was wrong. Think of your alloy stash as a resource. It might not be exactly the same, but if you just blend a batch of 50 or 100 pounds and cast some sample bullets, you might know what hardness you really have. I know it has been mentioned that testing ingots for hardness gives a false reading. It will give a hardness for all the ingots if they were all cast at similar melt temps, and similar ambient air temps. If you really want to waste all that time, then go ahead, but if you do want to just make a batch and load and shoot, keep in mind that the alloy hardness is secondary to several things, including bullet fit. You are severely over-thinking this hobby. It is unreasonable to worry about the hardness of the WW alloy from many different sources made over several years.

Heat treat and quenching for hardness of cast bullets is temperature dependent more than alloy dependent, within reason.

Please do not get lost in the weeds over these nearly insignificant details. I guess the most important question might be are you good enough shot, with good enough equipment that you can tell the difference between a bullet hardness of 12 BHN as compared with a hardness of 14 BHN?

[bangerjim]

Even if you think you will never....ever....shoot BP and pure, having pure is nice. I have many hundreds of pounds of it in 1# ingots (easty to add to the casting pot as needed for dillution) and you will always need it sometime. Don't just think of it as pure lead. Think of it as part of the aloy you want to make for what you are shooting.

Having it in huge 5-10# ingots is not my thing. I never need it in those quantities, so 1 pounders are perfect.

You should, as most of us do, shoot for 2% Sn for excellent mold cavity fill-out in your alloys. So yes, add Sn. COWW's only have 0.5% and SOWW's normally have ZERO.

Have fun casting!

banger-j

[kryogen]

whats your cheapest source of tin?

[Wayne Smith]

Old, bent up pewter, if you can find it.

[bangerjim]

whats your cheapest source of tin?

For me, it is the 450+ pounds of ingots of the stuff I hauled home last year. If I did not have that, I would be scrounging for modern service pewter ware to melt down.....if you can find it. I looked for years and could only find antiques (which I bought for my collection!).

Sn goes for about $10/# these days. You only need, at max, 2%, so it goes a long way.

PM me if you are interested in some Sn.

banger-j

[Foto Joe]

One of these days you'll probably pick up something that shoots 45 Colt, 45 ACP or maybe 38 Special. When you do you'll find that you can run COWW:SOWW at 1:1 adding 2% tin to the COWW's only to yield a hardness that will perform well in low pressure rounds like the ones mentioned above. You also might want to try this alloy in your 9mm after water dropping, you might be surprised that it works there too as long as you harden the boolits. I don't shoot 9mm anymore but I use this alloy in everything except magnum and 30-30 with very good results.

[mdi]

Here's an idea; cast up a few bullets and coat them then shoot them. You're going to Hi-Tek coat them so no need to worry about leading. I have a hardness tester and I often mix some of my pure lead with scrap and mystery metal and run a test on it. Junk/scrap/range lead seems to be easier to find than pure ($$$ wise too), so I keep my SO WW lead separate so I can mix if I wind up with some too hard lead...

[jkcerda]

One of these days you'll probably pick up something that shoots 45 Colt, 45 ACP or maybe 38 Special. When you do you'll find that you can run COWW:SOWW at 1:1 adding 2% tin to the COWW's only to yield a hardness that will perform well in low pressure rounds like the ones mentioned above. You also might want to try this alloy in your 9mm after water dropping, you might be surprised that it works there too as long as you harden the boolits. I don't shoot 9mm anymore but I use this alloy in everything except magnum and 30-30 with very good results.
so WW's and pure lead are fine for .45 ACP? I water drop mine, no clue as to the hardness of my lead .

[Foto Joe]

Clip on WW's which run 12-15 BHN and pure yes. I sent you a pm so we don't hijack the thread.

[chboats]

Are you sure it is pure lead? I melted down some SOWWs that tested at 8 to 9bhn. My tester shows pure at 5.5 to 6bhn.

Carl

[bangerjim]

There was a thread on here several months ago where a kind sole did extensive testing of various weights and had a picture of them with the resultant hardness measurements.

bottom line, all............save up some money and buy a tester if you are THAT concerned about hardness! You will not be sorry if you acquire a Cabine tester.

From what I have seen, do not rely on the TYPE of WW for accurate hardness.

banger-j

[Yodogsandman]

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?229666-Stick-On-WW-XrF-Data

[bangerjim]

That's it! Most of the ones I have been "cursed with" were of the 1st row flavor.

There are others!

[RogerDat]

SOWW's are a known commodity. You know what the lead is so you can plug it into a casting "recipe" and know what the results will be. That has value for you or for someone else that may have something to trade. I once swapped some plain lead sheeting for Lino. Not even up trade but the deal worked for both of us.

Notice Foto Joe is saying the tin is added to get 2% of the COWW portion of the mix only. Then feed in the SOWW's to get 50/50 COWW/SOWW mix. If that is not hard enough then water dropped to quench will kick the hardness up.

[Yodogsandman]

Great info here... http://www.lasc.us/HeatTreat.htm