20/1 alloy in microgroove

[T-Bird]

I have a 1978 Marlin 336 in .35 Rem that is my favorite deer rifle. I shoot RCBS 35-200 cast of coww over 25gr IMR 4198 with dacron tuft for about 1850fps. Accuracy is as good as I can shoot. Would like to try a softer alloy (20/1). I have used this alloy, and killed a couple deer with the 4198 load under it, but made a bad shot on a deer that should have been drt. This prompted me to shoot the rest of my softer boolits for group the following spring. I found that the load had some boolits that were right where they were supposed to be, and about half were not on the paper (more that a foot out of group at 100 yds.). I guess the two deer that I killed were lucky shots.I was thinking maybe slow the pwdr down and slow the boolit down? I have killed deer with the coww boolits they are about 12bhn according to my Lee tester, but the softer alloy leaves a better blood trail(when it works). Is this doable or should I just shoot coww. Shoot Straight, T-Bird

[geargnasher]

Try using antimony instead of tin, in low percentage, for the same purpose but more consistent effect.

Gear

[Tatume]

Hi T-Bird,

Another alternative is to use a hard body and soft nose expanding bullet. I had never tried this method before yesterday. In anticipation of receiving a new barrel in 348 Winchester for my CPA Stevens 44-1/2 I fired up the pot and cast a batch of bullets from RCBS 348-200-FN. At the end of my session I cast a handful of soft-nosed bullets using the BruceB method. They turned out very nice. I'll shoot groups of four hard bullets and one soft nose to make certain they are working well, and anticipate using them for wild hogs this summer.

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?53234-BruceB-s-Cast-Softpoints-(as-of-MAY-2009)

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?199559-Casting-two-part-soft-nose-boolits-a-additional-newbie-thought/page2

Take care, Tom

[btroj]

Try something with around .5% tin and 2 % antimony. Water drop them and they will be good to go. My range scrap measures a bit under those numbers and does well in my 336 in 30-30 with about any reasonable load.

[Larry Gibson]

In my 35 Rem (M91 Mauser rebarreled) I also use the RCBS 35-200-FN. I use COWWs + 2% tin and then mix that at 50/50 with lead. I let the bullets AC for at least 10 days before doing anything to them. I size basically "as cast", lube with 50/50 (Lar's White Label is excellent) and crimp on Hornady GCs in a .360 H&I die in a 450 lubrasizer. I load them over 37 gr 4895 (no filler needed) for 2150 fps (26" barrel). I then HP with a Forster 1/8" HP tool. I clean the barrel every 7 - 8 shots with that load to maintain <2moa accuracy. If I don't the softer alloy does foul a bit (cleans out easily though with a normal cleaning using #9 and a bronze brush) and accuracy will increase to 4 - 5 moa within a few more rounds. This works out fine for hunting because if I've not got the deer in 7 - 8 shots it's time to go home anyway!

The top target shows 2 groups at 100 yards for zero (using 6 o'clock hold). I then added 3 moa to the rear sight and shot the bottom target at 200 yards. I use the same bullet cast of straight COWWs + 2% tin AC'd over the same load for zero and practice. I can shoot those all day long and maintain 2 moa accuracy w/o any fouling. Got this nice little Texas buck a few years back with this load.

Larry Gibson

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[T-Bird]

thanks for the replies. No one really said that a softer alloy in microgroove was impossible so I'll try. The 20/1 is already mixed, I use it for 330 gould for my 45/70 336CB. It's ballard rifled tho and my velocity is 1350ish fps. Supposedly the 20/1 is 10bnh- just a little softer than coww. Larry,I have seen people talk about mixing coww 50/50 with pure lead then water dropping for hunting. Doesn't that "re-harden" them? I noticed that you air cool yours. Thanks, and Shoot Straight, T-Bird

[Larry Gibson]

T-Bird
Many who mix straight WW with the lead do WQ them. I add the tin which greatly improves the alloy by balancing the tin and antimony in proportion. I do not WQ them as it's then not necessary and they give better and more even expansion with less sloughing off of the expansion petals. It is necessary to clean the barrel frequently though as mentioned to maintain best accuracy but that is not a problem for a hunting load. The COWWs + 2% tin also cast a much better bullet.

I use 20-1 and 16-1 alloys a lot in handguns and rifles. I've found 1350 - 1400 fps to be the change over point between them as the 16-1 alloy is almost always more accurate at higher velocities, especially with PB'd bullets. I push 16-1 to 1600+ fps using GC'd cast bullets with excellent accuracy but for over 1700 fps I've used the alloy mentioned above. I have not thoroughly tested whether that's necessary.....it's just what I've done.

Larry Gibson

[Land Owner]

Larry,

What's "small" about that deer? I would be proud to shoot one so nice down here.

[Larry Gibson]

Larry,

What's "small" about that deer? I would be proud to shoot one so nice down here.

Didn't say "small", I said "little". Mostly that was just a figure of speech. Compared to some of the mule and black tail 4 point (western count) buck deer I've shot most of my life in the PNW it was "little". Now I've seen the size of those "small" deer out on the south eastern coast and down Florida way........the jack rabbits out here could open a can of whup *ss on 'em! That Texas buck is mounted on my wall in my den if that indicates what I thought of him. A nice mule deer is on the right so you see why I used "little" as a description even though the Texas white tail is a very nice one. However, if I hunted deer in Florida and got a buck I'd be just as proud of it. It's the hunt and memories that count to me, not the size of the rack or animal. Some of my most cherished elk hunts have been for spikes or cows........keep the wind to your face and the sun to your back........

Larry Gibson

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[T-Bird]

Went out today, shot 5 20/1 over 30gr 3031 at 80 yds. All 5 were inside 2" with the 1st shot the"flyer". Had 3 in the same hole. They landed in about the same spot that the coww 4198 load did. Looks like I answered my own question. This load should be around 1750fps-I'm good. Shoot Straight T-Bird