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View Full Version : How Do I Tell Beeswax?



1989toddm
02-26-2015, 11:56 AM
http://tapatalk.imageshack.com/v2/15/02/26/0beb8819cefa8ba4ecbd2a0a73264005.jpghttp://tapatalk.imageshack.com/v2/15/02/26/46e65d2d731063503cc890f340a73dca.jpg
I found a few rolls of what seems to be wax, melts like wax with a lighter, and feels/cuts like it. But is there any way to figure out exactly what it might be?

s mac
02-26-2015, 12:07 PM
Smell slightly of honey when warmed?

dilly
02-26-2015, 12:29 PM
If it is beeswax, it's an awful lot of it.

dondiego
02-26-2015, 12:31 PM
Looks like you could make a whole lot of wax cookies out of that!

runfiverun
02-26-2015, 12:33 PM
yep smell it.
that would need cleaned up anyway.

mdi
02-26-2015, 01:24 PM
What do you want to tell it?

Sorry, I had to...:bigsmyl2:

bangerjim
02-26-2015, 01:46 PM
Those look like the wax bases they make "starter" combs out of. That saves the bees all the energy of making the combs for their honey.

Again, melt a bit and smell it. If real beeswax, you will be tempted to eat it! Smells GREAT!

bangerjim

Blammer
02-26-2015, 01:48 PM
tell it like anything else,

with a straight face, stiff upper lip and get to the point, good or bad do it the same way. :)





melt it smell it. if it is, you'll know by the smell and the way it melts.

bedbugbilly
02-26-2015, 02:51 PM
I think bangerjim has it nailed - the color certainly looks like natural beeswax. I've heard a friend of mine who is a beekeeper talk about the "starter" sheets they sometimes use.

Just as a point of information - years ago, we bought sheets of beeswax from a local apiary - the sheets were embossed like honeycomb. My wife taught 3rd grade at the time and her kids made "Christmas candles" (not politically incorrect I guess?) out of it. You took a piece of wick and it was pliable enough to roll around the wick and "wala" - you had a candle. If a person is looking for beeswax, just keep that in mind as I've run across it in that form several times among craft stuff at garage sales & flea markets.

1989toddm
02-27-2015, 02:43 PM
Very good. Well the stuff is sitting in my garage now..waiting for time to perform the tests mentioned. Thank you all! We are headed to portland this afternoon to see family and friends so will be next week before I get a chance to look at it. I just cleaned up my first lubesizer-Lyman 45, and I'm ready to start using it!

hoosierlogger
02-27-2015, 08:31 PM
The starter sheets also known as foundation is an expensive source of bees wax. They cost about a buck a sheet and most have a layer of plastic in the middle. Be careful and make sure you know what you have before you melt it.

TreeKiller
02-27-2015, 11:51 PM
Looks like wax sheete that have not been embossed yet. if you look at the pic close where it has been cut and some of the sheets dropped away and you only see a shingle sheet it has the yellow look of capping wax. At room temp you should be able to smell the bees wax smell if you know how bees wax smells. Go to a store that has candles and smell a 100% bees wax candle and then you will know.

cajun shooter
02-28-2015, 09:16 AM
If it looks like a duck and walks like a duck, then it's a duck. I don't know why I felt compelled to say that. Ha!! Ha!!
It's too cold in most parts of the country at this time but every time I melt my BW to make lube on my back porch, the bees come from everywhere trying to get to my pot. If you do have BW then it does need some serious straining before use.
We have a member by the name of Randy Rat that is a bee keeper and vendor on this forum. Give him a PM and see if he can't help you out. Take Care David

Shiloh
02-28-2015, 09:41 AM
Thats only the second time i've seen it in sheet form. Never knew about "Starter" wax. Bees wax comes in blocks, cones, and slabs.
There is this stuff called imitation beeswax. No were even close to the real McCoy. More crumbly at the same temp, and no pleasant smell.
More like paraffin.

Shiloh

oley55
02-28-2015, 10:12 AM
It's too cold in most parts of the country at this time but every time I melt my BW to make lube on my back porch, the bees come from everywhere trying to get to my pot.

ain't that the truth. hell they even show up when I break out cold already lubed bullets with Ben's Red. You wouldn't think they would want any of that stuff with the ATF n STP smell. Must be some damn hungry bees I guess.

bangerjim
02-28-2015, 01:15 PM
Somewhere I have a 5# box of those "starter" combs, if I could find it.......would post a picture. It actually looks like a bee honeycomb but shorter.

And there is the 7# box of sheets of colored beeswax I found at a junk store for making candles. Just lay a wick down and start rolling! All colors of the rainbow in that box.

But smell is the fastest way to know you have REAL beeswax. I have an 8oz square molded hunk my uncle gave me back in 1962 ( has a hive impression in the mold!) and if you scratch it, it STILL smells like honey.

banger

1989toddm
02-28-2015, 04:05 PM
Well the weekend trip got cancelled so I melted down a bit last nite, no hint of honey that I can detect but everything else points to its being beeswax. Melting point (by thermometer in double boiler) was 145-150, which is the range I found for beeswax. It cuts with a knife easily, peels off in curls instead of breaking like candle wax/paraffin. Not crumbly at all, but soft and pliable. It is darker than beeswax I've seen in craft stores but not by a lot. I poured what I melted into a homemade jig so I can drop it in my lubesizer. However after doing so I remembered that straight beeswax should be softened a bit..may use a small chunk and warm it with a hair dryer to try it.

geargnasher
02-28-2015, 04:13 PM
Um, yeah, you'll need to add stuff to it to make bullet lube. Filter it though fine cotton cloth like an old dress shirt, thin cloth dish towel, or threadbare skivvies. Purchase same from thrift store if you don't have any on hand, 100% cotton dress shirts with ring-around-the-collar make fine filters. While unnecessary to do this for bullet lube, filtering like this several times should prove it to be beeswax if it comes out a rich yellow after filtering. Brown petroleums don't filter out as easily. The brown stuff is old pollen, bee parts, and chitin.

Gear

Eddie2002
02-28-2015, 04:27 PM
Looks like a bunch of foundation that hasn't been run through a machine that imprints the honeycomb onto it and cuts it to size. I'm a hobby beekeeper and it sure looks like bees wax to me. Heat a little up and see if it smells like honey. Too bad it is so cold outside, when it warms up come spring put some out in the sun on a cookie sheet and see if it draws bees, they can tell. Bees wax melts at 151 degrees so looks like you got a good score. Don't worry about the color, it comes all shades from bright yellow to brown depending on where the wax was harvested from.

1989toddm
02-28-2015, 07:20 PM
http://tapatalk.imageshack.com/v2/15/02/28/0612b0adbfcd7b9ab6e889906ee91047.jpghttp://tapatalk.imageshack.com/v2/15/02/28/351ddfb9c7d5db8ceb6886f253c329fe.jpg
After melting and filtering through a paper towel.
http://tapatalk.imageshack.com/v2/15/02/28/ab71eb879774413e5f70666c163bc308.jpg
I don't know why I didn't think to look at the box before now, but here's what it says..I've tried googling the company name along with other info there, and only come up with company info, not product info.

1989toddm
02-28-2015, 07:22 PM
It's just a smidgen harder than Rcbs lube sticks.

bangerjim
02-28-2015, 07:49 PM
from 1969????????????

Could be any form of wax. Beeswax was a whole lot cheaper back then.

You will probably need to brew up some lube with that if you plan on using it in your lubramatic.

LOTS of formulas abound on here.

banger

Dusty Bannister
02-28-2015, 08:20 PM
http://www.techstreet.com/products/1507771

Still looking for the contents sheet, but this is getting closer.

randyrat
02-28-2015, 08:42 PM
I'm not a bee keeper but I handle a Ton (literally 2,000lbs) per year of beeswax and process it for you guys and my bullet lube (TAC 1, TAC X) guilt free plug:razz:.

There are many variations of color for beeswax...Smell is the best way as stated earlier. You could find a local bee keeper, see if he can identify it. Melt temp is the other way, but that takes comparisons and careful measurement. I don't mess with that, time is too valuable. Of course, there are are other ways, but not worth the money.

jpsgunworks
02-28-2015, 08:54 PM
If you google 'sealing compound dipcoat', the vv s 190 fed spec number comes up . From more searching it appears this was a compound used to dip coat wrapped parts to preserve them in storage . Can't find any specs as to what it was made of.

bangerjim
02-28-2015, 09:04 PM
It looks like stuff used during the Vietnam war to coat stuff with, like Cosmoline, to prevent rust when shipped "over there".

Doubt it is beeswax. Only your research will tell. I for one would not waste time and money on it. Buy some beeswax from Randyrat!

banger

1989toddm
02-28-2015, 09:09 PM
It looks like stuff used during the Vietnam war to coat stuff with, like Cosmoline, to prevent rust when shipped "over there".

Doubt it is beeswax. Only your research will tell. I for one would not waste time and money on it. Buy some beeswax from Randyrat!

banger


If you google 'sealing compound dipcoat', the vv s 190 fed spec number comes up . From more searching it appears this was a compound used to dip coat wrapped parts to preserve them in storage . Can't find any specs as to what it was made of.

I found it in an area that would have been mostly military controlled during that time I believe. Google Umatilla Army Depot. So that makes sense!

Dusty Bannister
02-28-2015, 09:54 PM
If it is cosmoline, then you might want to use this recipe by E H Harrison as listed in Cast Bullets.


Police Department, 1962

1 beeswax, 1 paraffin wax, 1 cosmoline (CB 43)

This is also located in Ralph Schneiders bullet lube list of recipes.

prs
02-28-2015, 11:01 PM
Well I googled that Fed Sec and it seems to be something like kosmolline, the gunk that used to come slathered on firearms.

prs

BDJ
03-01-2015, 10:37 AM
Years (1970's) ago some of the natural gas company's useda bees wax based coating on weld joints to protect them from moisture /rust.


Sometimes the wax was in five pound blocks that had to be melted and poured on welds and wrapped with a wax covered paper, this was the most common way of using the wax.

The other way to apply wax to gas line was using the sheet wax on a still warm,not hot weld. We would apply the wax to the weld and use a hand torch to melt it enough to stick to the steel, then wrap with the waxpaper.


When I first seen your picture ---------- Flashback to the early 70's.

I hated that job; everyone involved was covered with wax and mud at the end of the day.


The stuff you have looks like the sheet wrap we used on pipeline work.
I hated that job --- but liked the money.

w5pv
03-01-2015, 01:47 PM
It looks like Army-Navy paper to me,cosmoline wraping paper.Good product for preserving metal,it is melted and the parts dipped in it or the paper just wrapped around tightly.

mold maker
03-02-2015, 11:38 AM
There is a sheet wax used in the pattern and modeling ind that looks like that. I bought it in thicknesses from 1mm to 3/8".
I think the source was Kent Collins. I always saved the small scraps to use as flux.

bangerjim
03-02-2015, 04:04 PM
There is a sheet wax used in the pattern and modeling ind that looks like that. I bought it in thicknesses from 1mm to 3/8".
I think the source was Kent Collins. I always saved the small scraps to use as flux.

That wax sheet you are referring is for "lost wax investment castings". I have several boxes of it and it is used to make unique shapes and forms for molding....normally in plaster. Once the wax form is carved/formed by the artist, it is cast into the plaster and after the plaster is dry and hardened, the mold is heated up to melt the wax out. Then gold or silver is poured in to make the shape left where the wax was. Once the metal is cool the mold is broken apart (litterally) and the metal piece is retrived for final finishing. Excellent for making custom jewelry! No mold parting lines....extremely high detail......used ONLY once!

That wax I have is very hard, carvable, and is high in carnuba content. It can vary in color depending on the hardness, so I have been told.

Mitch
03-03-2015, 02:04 PM
Looks like something used to dip cutting tools in to protect the edge.Sure dont look like any beeswax i get from my bees.bees wax should melt at very low temp like 140.is the stuff oily to the touch?
The pic you have of the stuff you meted dont look right beeswax will not layer like that.just my 2 cets worth.

JonB_in_Glencoe
03-03-2015, 02:26 PM
one thing no one mentioned, and I thought Randyrat would have said...
besides smelling like honey, Beeswax is sticky...very sticky
petroleum based waxes are slippery.

But, it appears to be a blended product for metal preservation, as your box indicates.

Kirk Miller
03-03-2015, 10:11 PM
Just a dumb guess; Could it possibly be a form of the mysterious and unobtainable NAVY wax?
Kirk

1989toddm
03-04-2015, 03:14 AM
Looks like something used to dip cutting tools in to protect the edge.Sure dont look like any beeswax i get from my bees.bees wax should melt at very low temp like 140.is the stuff oily to the touch?
The pic you have of the stuff you meted dont look right beeswax will not layer like that.just my 2 cets worth.

The layered look may be due to the fact that it solidified in a piece of steel pipe. Definitely not a perfectly smooth surface.

I haven't had any time, but I am planning to mix in a little grease and maybe try a batch mixed with JPW since I have a bit left. Then perhaps I will get a little better idea, but I expect it to work fine. What I found added up to 100 pounds of the stuff. I wonder how long it'll take to go through that much.