Anyone Using Lee 41-195-SWC?

[Alan in Vermont]

I'm trying to get the Lee 195 gr., .41 caliber SWC to work in my 4 5/8" Blackhawk and first results were worse than miserable.

Alloy is range lead with 1% added tin which I have been using extensively in other designs with good results. Lube is NRA 50/50 which also does well in anything I have cast over many years.

Boolits are coming in at 198-199 grs., sized to .410"

I don't have much of a selection of powders available at this time, IMR-4227 being the one I have the most of for full power loads. In this case I was using 20.0 grs of that ahead of CCI-300 primers. Other options are Blue Dot and a limited quantity of WW-571.

I don't have much option to load lighter as the gun has a history of running out of sight adjustment, shooting high with the sight bottomed with lighter loads.

In the past I have loaded the 41 with the old-school Speer 200 HP, the one that looks like a SWC with a half or three-quarter jacket over a load of IMR-4227 and it shoots great with that load and still has a little down adjustment in the rear sight.

So, first try with the Lee gave me patterns that were on the order of 5x8" at only 50 ft. (indoor range). Nothing visibly wrong with the boolits, no evidence of any lead in the bore.

I didn't have any of the jacketed loads with me as a control, I will have some with me the next time I go to the range. What I did have was some rounds loaded with SWCs of around 210 grs with a hollow point which I got from a member here. NOT good boolits, over half of them have voids at the bottom of the HP where you can literally look right into the interior of the boolit. I didn't expect much of them and that was what I got but even then they shot into about half of what the Lees did.

Does anyone else use this boolit and, if so, what do you get for results with it?

[gwpercle]

According to Lyman Cast Bullet Manual #4, 20 grains of 4227 will be getting you nearly 1260 fps, that might be too fast for range lead. My general use load is 8.0 grains of Unique with the Lee#410-195-SWC. It is probably moving around 850 to 900 fps. Cast from straight clip- on wheel weights and air cooled. I have some cast from 50/50 range lead/cow w, but have not had the opportunity to try them out yet. It's cold and rainy. Forgot to mention , it shoots as nice a group as I can manage with "old eye's"
All were sized .410 and lubed with Lithium/Bees wax .
I think the problem might be two fold.
1.) Boolit too soft- range lead is not much harder than scrap lead and tin doesn't harden.
2.) Boolit going too fast for soft alloy.
I would back the charge down to 15 grains and try it with those boolits. That may still be too many fps. With that soft boolit you need to be under 1000fps at least.
Gary
One of the biggest mistakes I ever made was not buying a used 41 magnum Blackhawk for $75.00 I was young/foolish and thought only a 44 magnum would do. It was 1972 , we had just seen this movie , " Dirty Harry" and everybody had to have "the most powerful handgun in the world". Talk about regret that lame brained move!
I did manage to get the S&W model 58 , 41 mag. in my avatar

[jonp]

"20 grains of 4227 will be getting you nearly 1260 fps, that might be too fast for range lead."

You might be going too fast with that lead. I'd try that alloy at 800-850 and work up from there if you can.

[cajun shooter]

I saw your problem as soon as I read your load listings. Why try to shoot maximum loads with everything you shoot. I purchased a 41 mag Ruger when they first came out. I'm sorry that gun is not with me today. Over the years I had the S&W models 57, 58 to go along with my Ruger. I used my 41's to shoot the first IHMSA matches in Louisiana.
As was posted earlier, my most loaded and shot load was the 210 grain with 8 grains of Unique. That load shoots the center of the target out in the 41,44, and 45 Colt calibers.
You will start enjoying your shooting a lot more when you cease trying to push each loading as fast as it will go. The negatives to that type of loading far outweigh the positives if there are any. You are putting hard wear on your gun, using much more powder, cutting down on the life of your brass, and putting up with recoil that is in the not fun group. Very few max loads are ever the most accurate. A hit with a bullet moving at 800-900 FPS is much more effective than a 1200 FPS bullet that misses the target. Take Care David PS Yes I'm an old man who has done all the wrong things in my youth

[Alan in Vermont]

I don't have much option to load lighter as the gun has a history of running out of sight adjustment, shooting high with the sight bottomed with lighter loads.

If anyone was paying attention to my OP (see above) you would understand why I'm seeking to keep velocity up. Cajun,
I saw your problem as soon as I read your load listings , nowhere did I imply that I run everything hot, So far this gun has required that to get POI down to the sights. (Does anyone know if Ruger has different height rear sights? A lower rear blade would make a world of difference in this case.)

Sadly, this Lee is the only commercially available mold I can find, short of Accurate, that is on the low end of weight-for-caliber. I can't justify buying molds by the score to try to find a (relatively) lightweight bullet. Only way I'm familiar with for getting POI to drop is either lighten the projectile or increase velocity. I'm going to try a harder alloy next, if I can find a formula that works I'll cast up a big batch and never have to cast for this gun again.

What's really sad is that this is the best "feeling" SA I have ever owned. Everything else has been 5 1/2" or 6 1/2" barrels. The 4 5/8 seems to balance better and point faster than the longer ones.

[Piedmont]

Alan, I ran into the exact same thing with an Old Model .41 and even bought this same mold to get it to shoot lower. Still shot high, so I filed down the rear leaf and filed a deeper notch. That worked.

You can just water drop that same alloy from the mold into a 5 gallon bucket of water and if they sizzle when they hit (meaning your mold is up to temperature--throw them back in the pot until it is hot then go into the water. Don't put wet bullets back in your casting pot or it will go boom.) they will have gotten much harder.

[dondiego]

It might be easier to get a taller front sight.

[JonB_in_Glencoe]

It might be easier to get a taller front sight.
that was my initial thought when I read the OP
I'm sure there are some 'tall' replacement blades available out there somewhere,
Here is instructions how to make your own, if you have the equipment.
http://www.ktgunsmith.com/bisley_sight.htm

[Alan in Vermont]

It might be easier to get a taller front sight.

It might be easier but probably not easier on the wallet. (A) The Blackhawk front sight is not easily replaceable, it is attached either by a brazing process or by electron beam welding. (B)Because it is factory attached to the barrel it is probably not a service part, hence NA from Ruger. A new one could be made but not cheaply. (C) a new front sight blade could be made and the base of the original sight be machined to allow the new blade to be pinned in place, but that is not cheap either. (C) Option B would likely require complete finishing of the gun.

[dondiego]

Take a thin sheet of brass and fold it over the existing sight and pin.