Building a workshop and/or man cave

[snowwolfe]

Our new house is scheduled to be built on the land we purchased in Tennessee this fall. It will be about 2,500 square feet and have an attached oversized 2 car garage.

Wife and I decided to have another "garage" built about 30 yards away. This building will mainly be used as a workshop/storage/reloading/casting place and general oil changes, etc.


So far we have decided on:

32x32 built on concrete foundation
One 10 foot wide garage door in the front, 8 feet tall.
One side entrance door
10 feet ceilings with 25, 4 feet long dual bulb florescent light fixtures (5 rows of 5)
walls and ceiling insulated and sheet rocked
3 electrical outlets on each wall, about 40 inches up
Cable TV and telephone jack
Modine 75,000 btu gas fired heater
HD ventilation fan on one wall
No windows as we don't want anyone who sneaks onto to the property being able to see inside
James Hardie siding on the outside

Any other low cost suggestions we should consider during construction? We are close enough to the house we don't want a toilet or water as this would require us to run the heater more than we want.

[C.F.Plinker]

If you are going to be that far from the house I would run a 100 amp 120/240 volt circuit from the main panel and put a sub-panel at the workshop.

A strip of 2 tube fluorescents down the length of the center of the building and strips of 4 tube fluorescents down the walls where you will have work benches about 2 feet out from the wall.

More outlets. My benches have outlets built into the bench that plug into wall outlets. I like the idea of a 10 foot ceiling but the 8' high garage door will limit the size of the vehicle you can get into it. If you have (or have considered getting) a tall van or a pickup camper it would be nice to be able to get it inside for both storage and working on it. Since you are 32 feet wide consider two 10' wide doors, one 8 feet high and the other 10'high.

Put the side entrance door on the end of the building away from the garage doors for quick exit in the event of a fire.

[montana_charlie]

Unless you have translucent panels in the roof ... having no windows will make one dark son of a gun, which will need to have the lights on just to put away a screwdriver.

There are ways to keep people from looking through windows ...

CM

[Duckiller]

Double up on two or three rafters so you can attach a hoist to lift heavy things. Cheap to do now hard to add in the future. Reconsider you ceiling height. 12 feet would be better and would let you extend the roof to cover an eight foot wide slab along one side of your building. A good place to go when you are having guests over and it rains. You may also want to rethink your "No Windows". If you are working in this building and the weather is too bad to leave doors open it would be nice to be able to look outside once in awhile. You don't want a bunch of windows and the window(s) should be placed so you can see it/them from the house. Are you going to do wood working in this building? If so consider a wood burning stove. Yesterday's mistakes keep you warm today. Motion activated lights or a TV security system would give you some elevated safety. Just rewired my garage. You need many more electrical plugs and you also NEED 2-3 220 volt plug in spots. A compressor with air line(s) and tap in points on several walls is nice. You may want to talk to your builder about things to add. If he has built several such buildings for other people he can mention things that others have added or things that should have added but didn't until later. I realize that every project has a budget. Talk to your builder. Include those things in the original construction that you and your wife really want or need that would be hard/expensive to add later. Also you may want to look at what sort of building people in your area have built. They may gic=ve you ideas of what they wish they had done. Enjoy your new home.

[freebullet]

I wouldn't have any doors you can't see from the house. That's where they'll break in.

I'd make it 40 foot length or deeper and go with a 12 foot high door. 30x40 is a popular and very useful size shop.

You'll regret not having windows unless your a vampire. Put some small windows high enough to make it hassle for anyone who thinks their gunna climb through.

220v power would be helpful.

Congratulations! I hope it's everything you want.

[country gent]

I would add that windows are a big plus as is the taller garage door. One door is fine and then a seperation wall in between the 2 bays. Garage doors dont seal so good and with the added wall and a door the reloading castinr shop room will be much less drafty and If heat is wanted much easier to heat. Good insulation if its a cold climate also. A solid concrete floor on the shop side would be a big plus also. Pour heavy enough so its stable uf a lathe or mill is expected to be added.Windows that will open are a big plus for added ventalation when casting or other smokey operations. Double the number of outlets your considering and you will still find yourself short at times LOL. Air drops are nice every so often so your not having to run air hoses all over. Air compressor is tied into line down center of building and a drop evry 10 feet or so on each side of seperation wall. Quick couples and no need for a hose longer than 30' or so. Water and a sink are nice to clean up when doing auto work or other messy jobs. Saves alot being brought into the house that way.

[rush1886]

Take a serious look at using LED bulbs as opposed to the fluorescents. The LED lamps are constructed to fit into an everyday fluorescent type fixture, and offer very effective lighting. The type/size I am most familiar with replaces a standard 4' T8 fluorescent lamp.
My buddy just put these in his garage, very close to the size of your proposed structure, and the lighting is great!

The initial cost was a tad more, but the ongoing energy savings should be substantial.

Not trying to be a Greenie, but I was impressed with the light level in there.

[Iron Whittler]

Don't forget the insulation. The high density closed cell foam insulation sprayed on walls and underside of roof will make keeping it comfy on inside much easier on your wallet. Take the number of elect outlets you think you need and multiply by 2. You will be happy you did. Keep number of plugs on same circuit small. High draw items will need separate circuits. 10 ft. ceilings are nice, 12 ft. are even better. Lights, put wall outlets on ceiling and plug in your lights. Makes it easy to put lights where you need them. Put a 48 space(GE) breaker box. You will be surprised how quick it fill up. You might consider a concrete floor sealant suitable for a garage floor. This makes keeping the floor tidy much easier.

[Wayne Smith]

Separate and seal your work areas if you will do any woodworking. Sawdust and sanding dust absorbs water and causes rust on iron/steel. Not what you want around your reloading equipment.

[Bad Water Bill]

Have at least 1 breaker dedicated to a separate light source.

IF you ever overload your panel you will be able to find the door.

And yes even a 7 W xmas light works.

Fumbling around in a TOTALLY dark area when everything goes wrong is not a good thing.

Heck put several in burning 24/7 and you will never be sorry and you will never notice the difference on your electric bill.

If you can, install a couple of GLASS BLOCK windows.

They let light in but no one can see what you are doing much less break in thru them.

[Plate plinker]

I have receptacles every 6' and use all of them from time to time. Many are used very often funny how that worked out. They don't cost much to add either if your a DIY type guy. Windows up high if you are concerned about peepers.

+1. Lots of lights and 220v power. Rest of that stuff can be added later.

[snowwolfe]

Thanks. We have thought about having one small glass block window on each side. Both the ceiling and walls will be insulated and the garage will have its own "power" box.
No need for a hoist nor 220. The only time I ever used 220 in my life is to plug in our dryer:)

[TXGunNut]

Lots of light, natural and electric. Storage will be important, may want to consider a loft for lumber and other bulky stuff. Depending on your location it may make your workshop area easier to keep comfortable if there's a wall between your workshop and the overhead door.

[btroj]

3 outlets per wall isn't near enough.
Ever hear someone complain about having too many outlets? I like some high, some low. That lets me have easy access either above or below a bench.

[pertnear]

Are you going to have a gun safe in there? If so make a closet just for it or a girder in the wall so you can attach it to the floor & wall in such away you can't get behind it with a chain. A tight fitting closet with it attached to the concrete floor is better. Good advice about a sky light or small high windows. I did my shop windowless for the same reasons as you stated but that sucker is dark!

Good Luck!

[TXGunNut]

Yes, lots of outlets. Will have two fourplex outlets and three or four duplex outlets on the "workbench" side of the shop I'm building. Will also have a few on the outside.
A secure storage closet may be a good idea for one corner. Unless you plan to heat and cool it year-round I don't think a gun safe will be a good idea.

[cbrick]

I highly recommend forgetting the early 20th century technology and don't use fluorescents. I recently changed out a 4 foot two tube fluorescent fixture in my laundry room with an LED unit. Mounted on the ceiling with the diffuser in place it looks exactly like a 4 foot fluorescent fixture but inside are 5 strips of LED's totaling 160 LED bulbs. Lordy I need sun glasses in my laundry room. It is 4-5 times as much light plus it's a white light, not yellow light like incandescent or fluorescent lighting. The whole thing draws 68 watts. Bulb life is 20+ years. Price is not out of line with higher end surface mount fluorescent fixtures. I got mine at Lowes for $120.00.

Rick

Edit to add: Just checked Lowes online and this unit is now $140.00. Still in my opinion well worth it. Here are the specs on this light:

LED Flush Mount Common: 4-ft; (Actual: 4-ft 4-in)
• Energy saving LED uses 47% less electricity than a comparable 4-light T8 fluorescent light fixture
• LED lasts longer - rated to last 35,000 hours
• Produces 5,000 lumens of brightness using only 68 watts
• 68 watt integrated LED therefore no light bulbs will need to be replaced
• This product is dimmable
• Gives off bright white light that is perfect for detailed tasks (4,000k CCT)
• UL rated for damp locations
• 3 year limited warranty
• Brushed nickel finish

Lowes - Portfolio LED Flush Mount Common: 4-ft; (Actual: 4-ft 4-in) (http://www.lowes.com/pd_595696-11840-54651141_0__?productId=50277253&Ntt=led+fluorescent+replacement+lighting&pl=1&currentURL=%3FNtt%3Dled%2Bfluorescent%2Breplacemen t%2Blighting&facetInfo)

[DougGuy]

Put a GOOD exhaust fan in an area you might do welding in, if you make it explosion proof you could also do some painting and it would take the fumes out.

+2 for LED lighting, if you can find CREE brand LEDs buy those they are made in USA.

If you do much woodworking, look into a dust collector, I have one and use pvc pipe to plumb it to my tools it works really well.

[MaryB]

Solar LED security lights, put th panel outside for best sun and run the power INSIDE and mount the light on the wall. Movement turns it in so in case of power failure you have instant lights. Light keeps it turned off during the day. Doubles as light for the security cameras and to light up windows you can see from the house if someone breaks in!


Have at least 1 breaker dedicated to a separate light source.

IF you ever overload your panel you will be able to find the door.

And yes even a 7 W xmas light works.

Fumbling around in a TOTALLY dark area when everything goes wrong is not a good thing.

Heck put several in burning 24/7 and you will never be sorry and you will never notice the difference on your electric bill.

If you can, install a couple of GLASS BLOCK windows.

They let light in but no one can see what you are doing much less break in thru them.

[crabo]

When you wire up your wall outlets, alternate circuits so you don't overload the circuit if you have loads on multiple outlets.

[facetious]

wire it for 20 amp outlets instead of 15 amp

[Dhammer]

I can't really work in my shop without the light on. I have a two story and can't even walk up stairs without turning on the lights. It was built this way when we bought place. A small window for stairs is going in, in the near future. I've also got some idea for brining in more daylight into first floor during the day. Drives me nuts I have to lights on during the day. Second the outlets at bench. I don't have them and can't wait for buddy to come up and help with that project too. Will make life so much easier.

[badgerblaster]

I have modine gas heat in my shop but in hind site I wish I would have put in hydronic heat. The modine blows dust around and if you paint it does cause problems. A friend of mine has a wood outdoor boiler and the hydronic heat and it's nice, especially if your working on the floor.

One thing I did do is put in attic trusses. With a 26 ft wide shop I have 12 foot wide storage upstairs the whole length of shop. You can never have too much storage.

Enjoy your man cave!

[Handloader109]

A couple of thoughts from my experience. Had a 30x30 metal building. I do some woodworking, so I put in a lot of outlets both 120 and 240 volt. Had100 amp dedicated power coming in, too far from house to run and actually was cheaper that way. I put in all quad outlets and had 4 download all four walls and three dual drops down the center of the building. Only three or four dualsfor the 240. I had 6 Fiberglas panels in ceiling. Unless in cloudy weather or night, I usually didn't turn on lights. That natural light saved me a tom of money over the course of the 20 yrs we had the shop. Also had a roll up door rather than just overhead. Saves space. I had two doors, should have had only one. Make sure it is hard it jimmy. Windows that can be seen from house or street. 100 feet is a long way to run to the potty, I didn't have a bathroom, and it was missed. Good luck

[NavyVet1959]

Air-conditioning

It's no fun working in a humid sweaty shop if you can help it.

I second the motion for the 220V outlets. If you ever decide that you need a welder, having a 220V outlet is convenient.

It's also nice to have an ethernet connection in there. If your house is not currently wired for ethernet, then that might not be that big of an issue to you though.

If you are in an area that is subject to power outages, it's nice to be able to backfeed your home and shop from a generator that can supply 220V (after you separate it from the powerline main, of course).

Depending upon how you want it to look, going with exposed metal conduit and metal outlet boxes would allow you to add new outlets without having to crawl around in the attic.

Having a switch on each outlet box so that you can turn off whatever is connected to it there if needed is also nice to have. It's easy to wire and if you aren't going to be using more than 15A combined on all the plugs on a particular outlet, its just $0.70 for the switch and slightly more for a 2-gang instead of a 1-gang (or 3-gang instead of 2-gang) outlet box.

If you work on your own vehicles, having a 4-post lift would be nice to have, but you might need a taller ceiling if you want to lift your vehicle high enough to actually be able to walk upright underneath it. A concrete trench that is deep enough for you to walk in under your car might be a better solution for some people AND it can act as a tornado shelter if needed.

I also think you should consider running water there. Sometimes, when you are working, you get so dirty that you need to clean up a bit before even considering going inside the house. For some reason, many women have a problem with a guy washing grease off their hands in the kitchen sink, especially if they have any dishes there. [smilie=1:
And the most important thing you will need is a kegerator. Can't have a true "man cave" without one. :drinks:
If you have a spare refrigerator, a kegerator is easy and fairly cheap to build AND there is often still enough room to put things in there other than the keg.

[dragon813gt]

Higher ceiling. 12' is the minimum you want for a lift. I'd go to 14' if you can. My garage has 12' ceilings and the trucks don't go up enough to walk completely under them. If you plan on working in it a lot you will want to insulate and condition the space. The garage door should be 10'x10' minimum. I'd install an I beam or two so you can have hoists on trolleys.

[MaryB]

Keezer is better chest freezer with outboard control for temps.


Air-conditioning

It's no fun working in a humid sweaty shop if you can help it.

I second the motion for the 220V outlets. If you ever decide that you need a welder, having a 220V outlet is convenient.

It's also nice to have an ethernet connection in there. If your house is not currently wired for ethernet, then that might not be that big of an issue to you though.

If you are in an area that is subject to power outages, it's nice to be able to backfeed your home and shop from a generator that can supply 220V (after you separate it from the powerline main, of course).

Depending upon how you want it to look, going with exposed metal conduit and metal outlet boxes would allow you to add new outlets without having to crawl around in the attic.

Having a switch on each outlet box so that you can turn off whatever is connected to it there if needed is also nice to have. It's easy to wire and if you aren't going to be using more than 15A combined on all the plugs on a particular outlet, its just $0.70 for the switch and slightly more for a 2-gang instead of a 1-gang (or 3-gang instead of 2-gang) outlet box.

If you work on your own vehicles, having a 4-post lift would be nice to have, but you might need a taller ceiling if you want to lift your vehicle high enough to actually be able to walk upright underneath it. A concrete trench that is deep enough for you to walk in under your car might be a better solution for some people AND it can act as a tornado shelter if needed.

I also think you should consider running water there. Sometimes, when you are working, you get so dirty that you need to clean up a bit before even considering going inside the house. For some reason, many women have a problem with a guy washing grease off their hands in the kitchen sink, especially if they have any dishes there. [smilie=1:
And the most important thing you will need is a kegerator. Can't have a true "man cave" without one. :drinks:
If you have a spare refrigerator, a kegerator is easy and fairly cheap to build AND there is often still enough room to put things in there other than the keg.

[NavyVet1959]

Keezer is better chest freezer with outboard control for temps.

In my case, that's exactly what my side-by-side refrigerator became. It was having problems freezing up and the circuit board was overpriced plus the ice maker no longer worked properly, so I converted it to an external control unit, cut holes between the sides on the top & bottom, and put a couple of 12V muffin fans in it to circulate the air between the two sides, thus making it a side-by-side refrigerator instead of a side-by-side refrigerator/freezer. It's just barely wide enough for a full size keg. Kegs are 16" in diameter and although there is 18" of width in that side of the refrigerator, the shelf supports that are molded into the sides only leave 17", so that just leaves 1/2" on each side of the keg between the keg and the side rails. There's still plenty of room for air to circulate from top to bottom though. I also have a fan blowing on the cooling coil that is what used to be the freezer side of the unit. I keep my temperature probe in a cup of water so that the temperature control unit does not cycle on and off as often. I keep the temperature control unit set for 33F -- being that we have 9 months of summer here, we like our beer COLD.

[Bored1]

Put 220 in! You may think you won't ever need it now, however it seems to me better to have it than not have it. Get everything you may need now, instead of trying to add it later! I never thought I needed 220 either, until I saw the benefit at a friends shop. Hoping to add it to my garage in a few years after some other projects.

[NavyVet1959]

Put 220 in! You may think you won't ever need it now, however it seems to me better to have it than not have it. Get everything you may need now, instead of trying to add it later! I never thought I needed 220 either, until I saw the benefit at a friends shop. Hoping to add it to my garage in a few years after some other projects.

Yep... Welder... Clothes dryer... Large window unit air-conditioner... Large air-compressor... In-wall type electric oven that you scrounged for baking bullets that you powdercoat... If your wife decides that she wants to upgrade her washer and dryer, moving the old ones to the workshop is useful. Sometimes, you end up with clothes that your wife considers too dirty to put in *her* washer, so one in the workshop that you can use for work clothes and shop rags is nice to have. I have a spare washer and dryer in my garage for this. Prior to this, I was forced to use the pressure washer on my clothes that were *really* dirty before my wife would allow them even in the house, much less in her *new* washer. :)

[Iowa Fox]

Lots of outlets. When I built mine I spaced them every 6' Thats upstairs & downstairs. On one wall I have them 4' high & 14" high. Thats the bench wall that way I have them for the top of the bench & under the bench. 220V for table saws and stuff like that or just in case you get a 220 casting pot. Buried underground wiring for security alarm wire to the house that comes up thru the sill plate into the wall so you have no exposed wiring going into the shed. Same with electrical power, no ugly L b's. My boys and I wired ours 100% so the extra boxes & stuff were nill for cost. My only regret is I didn't put the tubing under the pour for hot water heat under the concete. Talked about it but didn't do it. You can't beat a nice shed, I could live in mine I like it that much.

[lightman]

My shop is a 30x30 metal building with an 11 ft eve height and a 2 in 12 roof pitch. I wish it were bigger, like 30x40. I'm an electrician, so its overwired! Its feed with a 100amp service and wired in conduit. Theres a 50a 240 outlet at the overhead door and under the panel for my welder. A 20a 240 outlet under the panel for my table saw and a 30a 240 for the air compressor. I use florescent lighting (T-8) in mine. I probably would not jump on the LED wagon yet, they are probably going to get much cheaper in the future. I wired in an extra 3-way switch at the backdoor of my house that controls on of the outside lights on the shop. I also have an exhaust fan in the end of the shop, opposite the overhead door. Nice for smelting lead or welding!

I have a single 10x10 overhead door in mine. It makes it easier to back a trailer in and the height is good to have. The walk in door is on the side facing the house. I have no windows and the shop is dark, but light enough to work in, if the doors are open. Windows in the garage door would be nice. I have no water or plumbing, as the shop is very near the house. I did plumb in an air line with a connection near both doors.

I built this shop about 20 years ago, and overall I've been happy with it. I just wish it was bigger!

[btroj]

And lots of storage space. Not just shelves but cabinets. Some things are best kept out of sight and free from dust.

[cbrick]

No doubt LED's will get cheaper over time, they have come down some in the last couple of years. I have replaced every single bulb in my house with LED's inside and out. Today I could turn on every single light in my house, inside and out for less than half the power than what the kitchen alone cost with incandescent. I have far more light than I did plus it's white light. My back porch had a 100 watt incandescent bulb that just lit the porch, today I have 13 watts of LED that lights up the backyard. In my living room where there was two 75 watt bulbs, I now use two LED's at 6 watts combined, 3 watts each. Actually the living room LED's are three way bulbs that use 3/8/18 watts. Two of them at 3 watts each is plenty of light for normal evening/TV use. For reading I crank one all the way up to 18 watts.

With my age (66) and expected life of LED bulbs there is a fair chance that I will never again need to replace a light bulb.

Yeah, they are more expensive but more light, better light at a fraction of the cost, to me it's a no brainer especially for new construction such as the OP is doing.

Rick

[btroj]

LED's are also pretty darn fast at coming on. We had a few compact fluorescent bulbs and they need to warm up to fully light up, LED is on right now.

We are slowly changing to LED. The lifespan is also a good thing with lots of high overhead lights, far longer between change outs.

[FredBuddy]

I put outlets every 4 feet, and alternated the circuits, 2 circuits to each wall. Instead of drywall, I hung heavy grade peg board. 4 inches of fibered concrete, finished and sealed - indestructible. And at 20 x 30, it wasn't big enough! Current shop is smaller, but comfy. I'm not doing the woodwork I used to, and smelt outside, also cast outside in better weather.

[snowwolfe]

I revised my plan and added 6 more outlets and added a block window (approximately 2x3 feet) on each side.
Appreciate the ideas but once again I'll never need 220 nor a hoist so will stay with 10 feet ceilings. This will be an extra building for reloading, casting and minor projects. I don't weld and have no intentions to start.
I will check into switching out the bulbs for LED's. If the swap is cheap will consider it. Otherwise will just wait until the fluorescents burn out in a few years and swap them out as needed. By then they will cost less as well.
I have to remember each time something is added it costs more and there is a budget to consider:)

[blackthorn]

My shop is 30x40 x12ft. high. Should have gone 30x55. Thought I had plenty of electrical outlets. Should have doubled the amount. Put in two doors, one is a 10ft and one is 8ft. I put them in the side of the building---big mistake! Dang snow slides off the roof right in front of the doors. Did not put in water/bathroom---another big mistake! Put a wall across the place making it an 18x30 and a 22x30 foot rooms. The 2x4, sheeted cross wall is fully insulated (as is the whole shed. 6" walls), gyprocked finished and painted. Lots of windows, shelving and lights. One 220 plug and 100 amp service. One corner of the building has an extra heavy section of floor, sufficient for me to construct a 10x12 concrete walk-in "safe" (not done yet). The cross wall has a heavy beam and double sliding doors in it so that if I have to pull a motor or need to lift something I can just slide open the doors, place the car etc. under the beam and lift away. In winter I keep an electric, oil heater in there and when I am in there working I have a wood stove going. Shop never drops below 40 F. I think that no matter how big you make it, you will never have made it big enough!

[mold maker]

You'll really appreciate the ability to drive through the garage if two doors are in the budget. The second can be made secure from the inside.

[buckwheatpaul]

Been building a man's cave off and on for 9 months....I dont get to work on it every day....and often a week will go by without any work being done....I am flanging it up and will post pictures in a few days....I put 100 amp service in; a pellet stove for warmth; and have a window ac for this summer...Paul

[NavyVet1959]

Been building a man's cave off and on for 9 months....I dont get to work on it every day....and often a week will go by without any work being done....I am flanging it up and will post pictures in a few days....I put 100 amp service in; a pellet stove for warmth; and have a window ac for this summer...Paul

When the first thing you install in your man cave is the kegerator, the rest of the man cave seems to take a lot longer to complete. :)

[MaryB]

Think resale value down the road... 220 in there will add value


I revised my plan and added 6 more outlets and added a block window (approximately 2x3 feet) on each side.
Appreciate the ideas but once again I'll never need 220 nor a hoist so will stay with 10 feet ceilings. This will be an extra building for reloading, casting and minor projects. I don't weld and have no intentions to start.
I will check into switching out the bulbs for LED's. If the swap is cheap will consider it. Otherwise will just wait until the fluorescents burn out in a few years and swap them out as needed. By then they will cost less as well.
I have to remember each time something is added it costs more and there is a budget to consider:)

[NavyVet1959]

If you can, install a couple of GLASS BLOCK windows.

They let light in but no one can see what you are doing much less break in thru them.

Actually, they're not all that difficult to break in through. Maybe a bit noisy, but not that difficult. Just takes a sledge hammer...

"When in doubt... Get a bigger hammer..."

Now, if you framed it out so that each window was a SINGLE glass block and they were spaced around the building, then it would be difficult for someone to gain access through one since even if they broke it out, it's too small of an opening for more than an arm to get through. Not all glass blocks are solid either. Many are hollow.

[Bad Water Bill]

How much noise is a crook willing to make when breaking in a real glass block window?

Each glass block is mortared in place so depending on the size (4"-6"-8"-12") it would be quite noisy and have many sharp edges to CRAWL over when ATTEMPTING to break in.

Much easier to just drive thru the overhead door if noise is not a factor.

[NavyVet1959]

How much noise is a crook willing to make when breaking in a real glass block window?

Each glass block is mortared in place so depending on the size (4"-6"-8"-12") it would be quite noisy and have many sharp edges to CRAWL over when ATTEMPTING to break in.

Much easier to just drive thru the overhead door if noise is not a factor.

I've seen quite a few used glass block windows for sale on Craigslist from leftover from demolition and the glass blocks are in one piece. Some of the new style installation mechanisms use a vinyl track system with silicone sealant instead of mortar. I think the mortar system looks better though and is probably more durable.

Since garage doors can often be jacked open, that would probably be quicker and quieter. If you are talking about a building that just has Hardi siding on the outside and sheetrock on the inside, even going through the side of the building between the studs is not all that difficult if you don't care about the noise.

[snowwolfe]

Construction started today! Contractor first has to clear out another 42 oak trees for additional room for the shop and house.
Shop will be 32 x 32 with 10 foot ceilings and one 12 foot wide garage door.
25 light fixtures will cover the ceiling with a total of 19 plug in's as well as 220 :)

modine gas gas heater will heat it when it's cold
one block window on each side as well as side entrance door. Outside is James hardie siding and asphalt shingles. It should be finished first of july
Appreciate all the input.

[Wis. Tom]

Boy, I would love to live close and "help" clear those 42 oak trees. LOL That's some good burning there, for the old woodburner. Hope you enjoy your new shop.

[Ballistics in Scotland]

When we moved into our present house, I was amazed to be offered the separate brick garage as a workshop, without even asking. I don't know how much that was my wife's instinctive generosity of spirit, and how much the growing list of things I am not allowed to do inside the house. They aren't mutually exclusive, I suppose.

Some people are happy without windows, some aren't, and some don't know till they've tried it. There is a lot to be said for skylights rather than translucent panels, especially if they can be opened in hot weather. If you have a pitched or sloping roof with storage space (for that oak wood, for example), something like this, which I am sure is available in the US, might have its advantages:

http://www.velux.co.uk/products/sun-tunnels?gclid=CKjc-_SkqMUCFYnKtAodDnMAGg

Garage door height and height of the working space depend very much on whether you are going to need a vehicle in there regularly, or just for occasional deliveries of large equipment. It can be a mistake to make the working space too high, because the air you heat in winter rises, and it would be a shame not to have any portion of your anatomy in it.

An absence of windows in the walls does offer one advantage. If you fit draught excluders, shuttered keyhole etc., nobody can be quite sure it is unoccupied at night. Dogs are territorial beasts, and I don't think a well-chosen workshop dog would mind spending his nights there. You can't buy better, and you don't have to remember a function check and set button every night.

If it is on your own property, anything from ten to twenty-five yards of concrete pipe (the sort of thing that could be sold off cheap after big contracts) can make a useful testing range. If it is at floor level you could cover it over to make a rock garden or something, and very little noise will get out. A trolley for target frames will run neatly back and forward with ropes or drain rods, as long as the weight comes below the axis of the wheels. But you should read the thread on lead poisoning before using it regularly, except for airguns.

[garym1a2]

Compressed air taps all over, a skylight will work in place of windows.

[HATCH]

I know I am late to the party but here is my advice.

You want at least 100 amp service.
They will run 240 (220) out to the shop from the main house. It will be just like your house panel.
Have them install skylights. it will save you on lighting.
have them put in rows of lights with 2 switches.
One switch turns on every other row and the other turns on what the first one didn't.
that way you don't need to run all the lights if you don't need to.


Put in more outlets then you think you need.
Also with a shop that big you might as well put in a bathroom with a shower/sink and toilet.

What you need to factor in is that what you are into now may not be what your into later.
I built a 20x20 shop in my backyard.
I ran 100 amp 240 service out there.
At the time I built my shop, I didn't have a master caster or large compressor. It wasn't even on my wish list either.
I put 6 outlets on each of the 3 walls with the 4th wall being the roll up and walk thru.

[Ballistics in Scotland]

Just as work expands to fill the time available for its completion, equipment expands to fill the available space. I'm not sure what I will do with the bandsaw and flypress which crept up on me, but I will think of something.

A water supply is useful for a lot of cooling and tempering applications, and for making you fit to enter a house occupied by a person of the opposite kind, but it needn't be drinkable. A smallish cistern on the rafters or the roof, if they are strong enough, and filled up occasionally by a hose, would be very useful. Paint it black and put it in a cheap plastic glazed garden frame, and it will get pretty hot in summer.

I was dismayed at the cost of large workbenches made of anything better than veneered digestive biscuit, but on eBay I found a 12ft. kitchen worktop laminated from solid beech, for a lot less. It establishes the limit of what I can lift single handed, onto my bolted softwood frame. I fitted the eight legs with steel sockets made for bolting 4x4 posts to a patio, but it is so heavy that I haven't had to fix it to the floor. One or two fluorescent tube lights under the bench will save you days, over the years, in looking for small objects which have run for cover.

What I plan next is hinged wooden garage doors, which I can buy on eBay cheaper than I or anyone local can make them. I will only very seldom need to use them, and if I have a couple of 2x4s bolted to it with wingnuts, from concrete to concrete, nobody is going to jimmy that. If they were going to be the only doors, I would consider a small door in the big one, stepping over the lowest cross-member.

[snowwolfe]

Boy, I would love to live close and "help" clear those 42 oak trees. LOL That's some good burning there, for the old woodburner. Hope you enjoy your new shop.

Wood here is Bascially free for the taking since an ice storm hit this winter and downed trees all over the place.
I could easily spend the next ten years just cutting and gathering the downed stuff on our property and along the main roads close by. Couldn't burn it all in my remaining life time.

We are doing this backwards. Workshop is first then the house construction starts in a few months.

[doc1876]

had one experience repairing Hardee siding. Glad it was the only time, and hope to never have to do it again. Good luck, but I would find something different. Just me.

[Hardcast416taylor]

I would recommend a water supply to the building with a small electric water heater plumbed into the cold water supply and joined at a sink with a drain going into a decent sized drain croke outside the building. A mini fridge can store drinks as you may want.Robert

[snowwolfe]

had one experience repairing Hardee siding. Glad it was the only time, and hope to never have to do it again. Good luck, but I would find something different. Just me.

My builder prefers it over the other brands. Different strokes for different folks.
Not adding water, nothing else will be added or changed at this point as the contract was signed, deposit made, and construction is started.

[white eagle]

you may want to consider adding another entrance in case of fire and loose power and the other entrance is blocked
just a thought

[gsdelong]

For not much more I went with 2x6 studs. When insulated it stays much more tempature stable. Since framing is simple it really did not cost much more

[BrentD]

had one experience repairing Hardee siding. Glad it was the only time, and hope to never have to do it again. Good luck, but I would find something different. Just me.


Interesting you should say that. I have Hardy plank on my house and barn. I do love it, but it is not w/o its own problems and I have had some repairs that were necessary. It is not quite the bulletproof stuff it was made out to be, but it is pretty close. The newer stuff is way better than the older stuff, circa 2000 and before.

[NavyVet1959]

had one experience repairing Hardee siding. Glad it was the only time, and hope to never have to do it again. Good luck, but I would find something different. Just me.

Well, don't poke holes in it and you'll not have to repair it. :)

I needed a heat shield for some welding once and decided to take an oxy-acetylene cutting torch to a piece of Hardee plank siding to see if it would work. Although I was able to get it to eventually glow slightly, I could not get it to burn. It cuts easily enough with an abrasive blade in a circular saw, albeit with a lot of dust. The powered shears cut it very easily, quietly, and with no dust -- that is what the installer used on the house that I owned at the time when I had all the siding replaced with it. You really need two people to be able to handle the pieces during installation though. It's not very tolerant of being bent. Then again, wood siding is not very tolerant of being burnt. Everything is a trade-off.

[BrentD]

a torch? You are lucky you didn't burn down the entire building. No, it is not cutable with a torch. I don't see that as a big draw back. Might be a plus!

[snowwolfe]

you may want to consider adding another entrance in case of fire and loose power and the other entrance is blocked
just a thought

Garage door in front, 36 inch wide side exit door.

[NavyVet1959]

a torch? You are lucky you didn't burn down the entire building. No, it is not cutable with a torch. I don't see that as a big draw back. Might be a plus!

The Hardee plank was not attached to the building at the time, so no potential for burning down the building. I needed it as a heat shield for arc welding one item near something else that was painted so that I didn't damage the paint.

[wch]

Don't forget the security features.

[alamogunr]

This post reverts back to the early post on lighting and electrical service. My small(16X20) shop was built about 12 years ago, a couple of years before I retired. I had electricity run underground from a tap on the house service entrance to a 100 amp panel. Each wall has 2 duplex outlets at 4'.

Lighting is 8 fluorescent fixtures, 2 tubes each. I believe that on an absolute basis they are not that much more expensive than LED's. I probably don't use them more than an average of 30 hours a week. I also have about 25 or so 4' tubes given to me by a friend that replaced all his lights for his businesses w/T8's. I doubt that I will be able to use this building long enough to use all those fluorescent tubes.

I also put in two 220V outlets. One for the thru-the-wall AC/Heat unit and one for the table saw and the 220V Pro-Melt.

Would I like a bigger shop? Yes, but there wasn't enough room on our small lot to build as large a shop as I would have liked. Also, I admit to being a pack-rat. Anything larger would just fill up with junk.

Having read thru every post in this thread, there are many good suggestions here. I don't believe anyone would be able to use everyone of them but all of them prompt further thinking.

[snowwolfe]

Yes, plenty of good suggestions. But sometimes people forget everyone is on a budget of sorts with $$$ and land.

[BrentD]

Put in more 220 than you think you will need. I put in 2 and wish I had 4.

I also put a few 110s in the ceiling. I have 4-plex drop boxes that hang over one of my benches and for some ceiling spots that focus on areas where high lighting for detail work is especially important. the drop boxes are really nice when I have hand tools that I'm using on a bench and I need to walk around the bench regularly w/o tripping over cords. There is no such thing as too much light (or too many outlets).

[NavyVet1959]

Yes, plenty of good suggestions. But sometimes people forget everyone is on a budget of sorts with $$$ and land.

Understood, but generally it's cheaper to put it in now than it will be to retrofit it later. How much more it will cost later on will depend upon how flexible you designed it in the first place. Some things, you really want to put in initially though (e.g. floor and toilet drains in concrete slabs). Water supply and electricity can be put in later with not too much added expense or trouble if you don't mind exposed conduit or water lines. If the building has a wood subfloor and is raised off the ground far enough for easy access, even adding a toilet or shower drain is not so difficult that you couldn't do it yourself.

I also find it convenient to have an old top loading washing machine in the workshop so that I can wash the clothes that I get so dirty that my wife wouldn't even want *near* her new front loading machine. :) Before I did that, I have been known to have to use a pressure washer on my jeans before being able to put them in the washer. :)

[snowwolfe]

Being 62 years old and see no need to add water, toilet, or even consider a washing machine. I can walk out side and take a leak anytime I need to. Don't need a workshop that has a duplicate of everything the house contains which is just 15 yards away.

[NavyVet1959]

Being 62 years old and see no need to add water, toilet, or even consider a washing machine. I can walk out side and take a leak anytime I need to. Don't need a workshop that has a duplicate of everything the house contains which is just 15 yards away.

When you're in the doghouse, it pays to make it as comfortable of a doghouse as possible. :)

The only reason I have a washing machine there is because my wife wanted a new front loading one and the old Maytag unit was still working. If I've been working on something and gotten particularly greasy or dirty, it's nice to have.

[David2011]

Not trying to talk Snowwolfe into anything; just information. I bought a house that had a 36x36 building out back. It was just an open building at the time. I added a reloading room, small gunsmith shop and an art studio for SWMBO. It's all framed like household framing, insulated, sheetrocked, textured and room finished. Outlets are on pretty much every other stud except where I knew they wouldn't be useful like behind the lathe and mill and all are above normal countertop level except in the art studio. I also ran Ethernet, phone and TV cabling. A bathroom was added. That was expensive. I had to have to done by a plumber and the total cost for framing and a long run to the septic tank cost about $5000. That's OK. It kept SWMBO happy and I like having running water out there.

David

[Ballistics in Scotland]

Beware the trap of spending so much time working on the workshop that you never have time to work in it.

[rondog]

Don't even wanna get started.....I dream every day about having/building a shop.

[Handloader109]

Hey Snowwolfe, I am suggesting that you make sure your lights are on a couple of different circuits. You usually won't be working all over the building at one time and you could save a few $ over time by running only what you need. Good luck, I'm wanting to get back to the countryside and miss my big shop a lot. Would probably build shop first if I don't find one on property first.

[lightman]

Snowwolf, sounds like a nice shop and I know you will really enjoy it. It also sounds like you know what you want and what you can afford. I would really suggest switching all of those lights separately, by row or area or something. It would be really cheap, and a good electrician/electrical plan may already have plans to do this. I really like the fact that I thought to have a switch by the back door of my house that turns on a light at the shop door. I know, budget, budget, budget! Good Luck and enjoy!

Some of you other Guys have some great ideas and must have some awesome shops. I really enjoy mine.

[snowwolfe]

Contractor told me the lights will require 4 switches to turn them all on or off so we have that covered.

Construction began this Monday and is scheduled to be completed the first of July. It is a little nerve wracking not being in the area to inspect the building process on a regular basis. But I have faith in the contractor as he knows we are in the process of finalizing the contract and blueprint to build the house starting in September.

[NavyVet1959]

On my next house, I'm planning on using relays to control each of the lights with an Arduino controller so that I can not only automate it / turn all the lights in the house or a zone of the house on at once. I suspect that the amount of wire I'll save between the switches and the light fixtures will nearly cover the cost of the relays and Arduino controller. As an engineer, the software to do it will be easy to write and I will be able to allow control from an Android phone, PC, or even across the internet if I so desire.

[alovelikejesus]

Construction started today! Contractor first has to clear out another 42 oak trees for additional room for the shop and house.
Shop will be 32 x 32 with 10 foot ceilings and one 12 foot wide garage door.
25 light fixtures will cover the ceiling with a total of 19 plug in's as well as 220 :)

modine gas gas heater will heat it when it's cold
one block window on each side as well as side entrance door. Outside is James hardie siding and asphalt shingles. It should be finished first of july
Appreciate all the input.
Hi there, we are traveling through TN this weekend for a quick smokies trip. My husband was wondering about the oak trees you had taken out.

[BrentD]

about the Modine heater, I cannot unrecommend it strongly enough. I absolutely hate mine. very unreliable.

[snowwolfe]

about the Modine heater, I cannot unrecommend it strongly enough. I absolutely hate mine. very unreliable.

I had one if my first Alaska home for 13 years - zero issues
Next house in Alaska we lived in for 12 years had one installed 4 years before we bought the house- zero issues
Current house in Colorado had one installed when it was built in 2007 and we bought the house in 2012 - zero issues with the heater.

Alovelikejesus,
What would you like to know about the oak trees? There are so many downed oaks along the roads in Cumberland county just stop and knock on the owners door and they most likely will be ecstatic you want to remove the downed trees.

[BrentD]

if they have worked for you, congratulations. I can only tell you about the 1 in my shop, and it sucks.

[alovelikejesus]

Sorry about that! My message sent before I was ready. We are building a log home and are looking for white oak logs that would be suitable. We are building on a piece of land similar to yours in Western KY.
Do you recommend any places between Gatlinburg and Nashville for guns and anything shooting related.

[snowwolfe]

Only gun store in Tennessee that I visit every time we in the area is Outdoor Junction located off exit 290 from I40 as they usually have tons of powder including most if not all handgun powders.