358009 in 35 Whelen

[stocker]

Got to the range today with my less than a week old boolits. From W/W metal they come out at 287 grains lubed and checked. Tested them at 75, 100 and 200 yards. Boolits stabilized fine from the 1/14 Bevan King barrel at 200. Accuracy more than I had hoped for with best loads giving 1 1/4-1 1/2 at 100.
Don't always get that degree of accuracy with first attempst. Boolits were un hardened and accuracy dropped off once I reached 1900fps. Boolit sits a bit below the neck when seated.

Chargar if you catch this thread have you any suggestions on slow burners with a bit of PSB using this bullet weight? Don't concern yourself with the surplus powders you are using. I can't get them. But, if you have any thoughts on 4831, Re 15 or Re 19 I'd like to see them.

Also success tonight in making that FN Mauser a repeater with cast bullets including the original RCBS 200 FN that I'd been using.

Had to stone the claw of the extractor a bit and provide some clearance by some darn hard squeezes on the extractor behind the locking ring with water pump pliers. Finger pressure and hand flexing wouldn't do the job but I became more certain that there was too much drag as the rim slid up under the extractor claw so resorted to some serious effort.

[sundog]

Stocker, that's it. 1900 fps. Accuracy real good with a 1-14 Shilen at 200. I load 40.0 IMR 4895 and get a chrono'd 1900. Can shoot 2" groups at 200 with the 358009 Improved. As far as I know there are only 9 of these moulds in existence, maybe 8. Three are one cavity, five are two cavity, and don't know if #9 even exists, but I think so that it was done for the maker himself. They were cut .360, but one was .359, and one .358. The under sized were gifted to two different regulars on this board about 2 or 3 years after the initial run. No word from either on how they perform (fellers - we need a range report!). But, I will tell you this, mine, a DC, is premier stuff. This is one fine boolit, from one fine mould, and in the right rifle will put a round on target. sundog

[stocker]

Sundog:

Not sure what the difference is in the 358009 IMproved. This is a 2 cavity mould. Someone put his initials (B.C.) on it with an electric pencil and had marked the cavities with a single and a double punch mark. Not sure why he didn't just mark one cavity but?? Those initials ring any bells with you? This is as good a dropping mould as I've ever used. Cut the sprue, open, close. No shaking , rapping or cussing. Someone did some good work prepping this I think. Wheelweights drop between .3595 and .360 and there is a grain or two difference between the two cavities. I'm really pleased with it.

[sundog]

Stocker, the 358009I is NOT a Lyman production. It looks like, patterned after it, but has a meplat on that blunt nose, and drops an honest .360 from a very fine custom mould produced by a true craftsman, David Mos. Other than being a small custom run, it may not be any better than the original Lyman (but then again...,), other than the mould itself is certainly much better quality! Side by side with an original boolit, you may not even notice the nuances..., until you look closely. 35 Whelan's a dandy. Ain't it? sundog

[NVcurmudgeon]

Stocker, I'm envious of you all shooting that fine 35009 Improved boolit. I am left out because my Whelen is a 1:16. It shoots well with boolits from 200 to 255 gr. It could be that the reason a previous user marked both cavities of your mould is so that he could not only segregate, but orient his boolits. I did exactly that with one of my moulds for that reason.

[stocker]

Sundog: I've heard of Mos but have never seen his work. Sounds very fine, will probably never encounter a mould by him. I'll try the 4895. Today was IMR4198 and IMR3031 and the 4198 produced the better groups although the 3031 weren't that shabby-just not the equal.

NV Curmudgeon: That makes sense to me. I hadn't thought of that obviously.
I was worried that the 1/14 wouldn't keep the bullet stable following a post by another shooter who claimed 1/12 was the way to go for the heavier cast. Perhaps another 15 or so grains is the break point. This is going to be a good hunting bullet for sure. We have a gong at our 200 yard butts and it sure does get to swinging when you rattle it. Very audible even with my damaged ears with muffs over them.

[Maineboy]

Stocker, that's it. 1900 fps. Accuracy real good with a 1-14 Shilen at 200. I load 40.0 IMR 4895 and get a chrono'd 1900. Can shoot 2" groups at 200 with the 358009 Improved. As far as I know there are only 9 of these moulds in existence, maybe 8. Three are one cavity, five are two cavity, and don't know if #9 even exists, but I think so that it was done for the maker himself. They were cut .360, but one was .359, and one .358. The under sized were gifted to two different regulars on this board about 2 or 3 years after the initial run. No word from either on how they perform (fellers - we need a range report!). But, I will tell you this, mine, a DC, is premier stuff. This is one fine boolit, from one fine mould, and in the right rifle will put a round on target. sundog

Sundog, the .358 mould is still untested. My Whelen project hadn't materialized due to lack of funds. However that situation has improved. We've sold our house in town and now I have a few bucks to play with. I expect I'll have my Whelen this winter. I will keep you posted.

[Bass Ackward]

Had to stone the claw of the extractor a bit and provide some clearance by some darn hard squeezes on the extractor behind the locking ring with water pump pliers.

Glad you got it. Now you have options.

[stocker]

Bass:

Well all isn't rosy yet. It seems those extractors have some memory as the next day at the range feeding became sporadic. Back home I stoned and polished a tad more and tried another technigue using a dowel and bench vise to spring the extractor a bit more. Working fine when I was done, will have to see if it resumes it's original shape or holds where I left it. Tough steel.

On a positive note I tinkered a bit more with loads hitting some of the in betweens and was rewarded with two consecutive 3 shot groups of 3/4 and 5/8 at 100 using 4198. Chrony (working again) tells me about 1815. That brought a smile to my face. I used the marked bullets from each mould for each group. 3 from one , 3 from the other. Although only a bit over a grain and a half difference the POI was different by 1/2 " vertical . I can see why those 1000 yard black powder boys like their single cavity moulds.

The 40/4895 load did not shoot and groups opened to 3". I'm using straight wheel weights in that lot of bullets and intend to cast more today with a bit higher tin content and try it again. Kind of hit or miss as I just hold an ingot of babbit in the melt until I think I've got enough.

Managed to score about 75 lbs. of radiator shop sweepings today. Owner says he uses 70/30. Will try and get that melted and cleaned and poured into usable ingots over the weekend. Finally a use for my dinky little Lee ingot mould.

Best

[felix]

Do NOT reheat any "babbit" to make new ignots. Some babbits, so assume all, will not go back together in unison unless treated according to an engineering spec. This means the rate of cooling, and the flux used, is very specific to each babbit as formulated according to end use. Therefore, use any babbit as a dip only, into the pot to melt off what is needed. Be conservative here because it is somewhat easy to kill of pot of lead by getting too much babbit into the mix. ... felix

[stocker]

Felix:
Yes , that is how I use babbit. I was referring to the 70/30 solder sweepings and scrapings for making into small ingots. I completed casting for the day and bullet weight dropped about 3-4 grains from the straight wheel weights. Might just be enough to make them a liitle tougher to resist land forces. Unfortunately bullet size also dropped nearly a thou. Still larger than groove depth though and I'm going to check them tonight and see if they'll bump a bit while they're soft during the checking process. Thanks .

[drinks]

Stocker;
I have a handrifle in .35 Whelen.
I am shooting a RCBS cast gc, wws, waterdropped, BHN24, 214gr,LBT blue.
Rel7, 45gr, gave 2380fps and 3 touching at 50yds, about the limit of my shooting place.
IMR4198, 40gr gave 2390fps, 2 touching and 1, 1/2" right at 50 yds.
H4895, 45gr gave 2200fps and a 3/4" group.
BLC-2, 45gr, gave 1860fps and 3/4" at 50yds.
BLC-2, 60gr, gives a Rem. 200gr psp 2650fps and 3/4" groups at 50yds.
I love my .35W, seems to like everything I put through it.

[stocker]

Drinks: I'm working on good hunting loads using unhardened bullets- neither water dropped or oven. I'm sure what I have now will suit my purposes but will play with alloying to see if I can get a bit more. I split the lot I cast today and am oven hardening as I write so that aspect will get some attention too. I've managed to convince myself using other calibers that unhardened bullets work a bit better than a faster harder bullet-at least for cervids.

[Bass Ackward]

Stocker;
I have a handrifle in .35 Whelen.
I am shooting a RCBS cast gc, wws, waterdropped, BHN24, 214gr,LBT blue.
Rel7, 45gr, gave 2380fps and 3 touching at 50yds, about the limit of my shooting place.
IMR4198, 40gr gave 2390fps, 2 touching and 1, 1/2" right at 50 yds.
H4895, 45gr gave 2200fps and a 3/4" group.
BLC-2, 45gr, gave 1860fps and 3/4" at 50yds.
BLC-2, 60gr, gives a Rem. 200gr psp 2650fps and 3/4" groups at 50yds.
I love my .35W, seems to like everything I put through it.



Yep. The 35 bore is the cast bullet bore. Works from A to Z.

If I was forced to go to one gun and cast bullets was the only thing I could shoot, it would be a 35 and in my mind, it's not even close for second choice which would be a 45. The 45 is a constant challenge. The 35 just works and is peaceful bliss.

Just ask Kelly about the superiority of the 35 caliber. He's a big fan. You out there Kelly? :grin:

[felix]

358 is the best cast boolit groove size hands down because it includes pistols. Every gun seems to shoot without reloading effort. Second place would be 32 winchester special, which I cannot find a bad load for. Now, the 22's! No recoil is the name of that game, and rates very high for this reason alone. ... felix

[stocker]

Felix: Twist rates for the 35's and 32's are pretty kind to cast boolits aren't they? I'm dickering on a mid 50's 64 deluxe in 32 now. The owner and I are getting close - we'll see.

[drinks]

2 years ago, I got a .32sp, has been in the family since 1902, when I got it, it likely had not been cleaned since WWII, spent 10-12 hours with cleaners, brushes, 0000 steel wool, chore boy pads and finally put 15 fire lappers through it before I could see rifling.
Went out and shot it, well under 1" at 50 yds with some 50 year old factory 170gr fn.
Could not believe it!

[sundog]

Drinks, by most today, the 32 Win Spl is very misunderstood. It has been relagated by many as inefficient and insignificant. Not. The naysayers shooting the unholy yellow will never understand. Take very good care of that heirloom and give it a good life and steady diet of plain ol' lead! You will be returned favors in turn. The RCBS 32-170-FN is a good place to start. Also the current group buy of the 325-170 should do well also (I've got one of them ordered!). I got a Mdl 94 many years ago and at my Dad's INSISTENCE, really wanting a 30-30, and he said no, .32. Took alot of years to understand, but he knew. sundog

[drinks]

Sundog;
I got the Lee C324-175-1R, sized to .323, it shoots fine at 2100fps with 26gr IMR4198.