.32 or .36 caliber pistol barrel

[tinsmith]

I've been out of muzzle-loader building for many years. But, I've been developing plans to make an underhammer pistol. These were usually small caliber affairs. For informal target shooting, I am fond of the .36 in a rifle. (I made a neat little underhammer rifle ten years ago.) Does anyone make a pistol barrel in that caliber? A pistol barrel requires a faster rifling twist than a rifle, so a cut-off barrel wouldn't work. Just another thought, is anyone offering something like a surplus .36 cap&ball revolver barrel? I could cut off the back end and have 5"-6" of octagonal barrel. But, maybe the rifling isn't deep enough for a patched round ball. Last question: Besides Dixie Gun Works, who is a good supplier of parts & accessories for the M/L builder? Thanks in advance for any comments or suggestions. Jeff

[Rustyleee]

Try Track of the Wolf.

[Tar Heel]

Track of the Wolf.......ditto

[dondiego]

Do you have a source for the underhammer action for this pistol project?

[Nobade]

Good place to look:
http://www.thegunworks.com/

-Nobade

[DIRT Farmer]

Several barrel makers advertise in Muzzle Blasts from 25 cal up, go to nmlra.org look in classified ads.

[ratboy]

http://nmlra.org/awpcp/show-ad/12/tip-curtis-frontier-shop/cross-plains-tn-37049/barrels/

i called tip looking for a 36 pistol barrel in november. he looked and all he had was 32. he was out of 36.
might try him
also log cabin shop has parts if track does not have what you are looking for.
i was there saturday and the only pistol barrels i saw were 45 caliber rayl barrels.
http://fcibarrels.tripod.com/
i bought a 36 from him at friendship.
he is making me a false muzzle barrel for my next build. he may have 36 caliber barrels in stock.
thats all i can think of right now. good luck.

[tinsmith]

Thanks for the advice! I forgot about Track of the Wolf. I used to teach CAD drafting and machine shop at a high school in northern Indiana. Using Herschel Logan's excellent book "The Underhammer Gun" as a starting point, I designed and built my little buggy rifle. Now that I'm retired and moved out of state, I no longer have access to the machine shop. Just an Atlas 10" lathe with a rinky dink tool post milling attachment. But I think I can still get by with designing and building a small underhammer pistol. If I call around, I may be able to locate a machine shop if I need a real milling machine. Another good thought: I should re-join NMLRA. (Maybe a road trip to the spring shoot.) I'm sick of seeing all the "Tactical" guns & gear in the shooting magazines. I think for me, Muzzle blasts would be like a breath of fresh air. Thanks again from an old retired machine shop teacher! Jeff

[Tar Heel]

Another good thought: I should re-join NMLRA. (Maybe a road trip to the spring shoot.) I'm sick of seeing all the "Tactical" guns & gear in the shooting magazines. I think for me, Muzzle blasts would be like a breath of fresh air.

Yup. Everybody wants to be Tacticool now. It's good for the industry but JEEZ. Remember when primitive firearms season was for PRIMITIVE firearms? Inlines with sabots and smokeless? Good Lord. Can we PLEASE get back to what the intent was?

And I just have to say to all the Taticool range geeks I see nowadays: Try not to piss your pants when the bullets start coming at you. 80% of you wannabes will cry for mamma.

Semper Fi.

[John Taylor]

I have a couple under hammer pistols in the works. Numrich use to make their pistols by reaming the back half of the barrel and installing a breach plug in the middle. Seemed like a waist of barrel so I make the breach plug about 6" long and machine it to follow the lines of the barrel then cut a groove for the hammer and trigger. There are many ways to make one, here's a few pictures https://www.google.com/search?q=under+hammer+pistols&espv=2&biw=1755&bih=898&tbm=isch&imgil=ETmsq1YE2OAydM%253A%253BCAoPQtjHwuocZM%253Bh ttp%25253A%25252F%25252Fwww.armslist.com%25252Fpos ts%25252F1625343%25252Fraleigh-north-carolina-muzzle-loaders-for-sale--hopkins---allen-under-hammer-pistol&source=iu&pf=m&fir=ETmsq1YE2OAydM%253A%252CCAoPQtjHwuocZM%252C_&usg=__6kBHuHwYkwaXtWA_fUU9-yGT1Gg%3D&ved=0CEsQyjc&ei=cX7JVOrsOonMoATGs4EQ#imgdii=_&imgrc=ETmsq1YE2OAydM%253A%3BCAoPQtjHwuocZM%3Bhttp% 253A%252F%252Fcdn2.armslist.com%252Fsites%252Farms list%252Fuploads%252Fposts%252F2013%252F05%252F16% 252F1625343_01_hopkins_allen_under_hammer_pis_640. jpg%3Bhttp%253A%252F%252Fwww.armslist.com%252Fpost s%252F1625343%252Fraleigh-north-carolina-muzzle-loaders-for-sale--hopkins---allen-under-hammer-pistol%3B640%3B478

[John Taylor]

The other day while cutting a .40 cal cartridge barrel the cutter came loose and dug in a bit on one groove. So not to waist a barrel blank I kept cutting till the grooves cleaned up. It now has a groove depth of .415 and a 1 in 20 twist which should make for a few muzzle loading pistol barrels. As soon as I get one done I will post pictures. May sell the rest to cover the cost of the drilled blank.

[Reg]

tinsmith,
You mention that a pistol barrel has to have a faster twist than a rifle barrel.
Why is that ?
Would not twist be relative to it's use, such as round ball or conical ?
Reason I ask is that many years ago I cut back a .36 caliber ML barrel for a fellow and saved the piece with the idea of someday making a under hammer pistol out of it. Is it tent stake material ?

[Squeeze]

I recently had a custom barrel made by the gun works. I was almost floored when I had it in about 2 weeks. They were pretty much willing to make me anything I wanted. I would highly recommend them and plan on using them again

[DIRT Farmer]

Reg, generaly pistol barrels for round balls are faster twist for a lower muzzle volicity. Considering some of my pistols are smooth bores, a piece of rifle barrel will shoot good, maby not up to match but better than most shooters are capable of.

[rickw55]

John,
Thanks for the link. Lots of ideas there!
I'm interested in underhammer guns, too. I have a Hopkins & Allen with a Green Mountain .54 barrel. I intend to make an underhammer pistol myself some day.
Rick W

[John Taylor]

John,
Thanks for the link. Lots of ideas there!
I'm interested in underhammer guns, too. I have a Hopkins & Allen with a Green Mountain .54 barrel. I intend to make an underhammer pistol myself some day.
Rick W

While looking at the pics I ran across a picture of one of my rifles.

[rickw55]

Numrich has a .36 caliber barrel-585130 (http://www.gunpartscorp.com/ad/585130.htm) Barrel Blank, .36 Cal., Octagon, 9-3/4'' Long - 15/16'' ATF, 8 Groove Rifling.I don't know what the twist rate is for them.
I've bought a couple of them.The bore is off-center, but they seem usable.
Rick W

[Reg]

Reg, generaly pistol barrels for round balls are faster twist for a lower muzzle volicity. Considering some of my pistols are smooth bores, a piece of rifle barrel will shoot good, maby not up to match but better than most shooters are capable of.

Good, I would hate to think I packed it around all these years with false hopes. Need to put it down as a next winter project. Too loaded up for this winter.
I do thank you for the reply.

Reg

[ratboy]

The other day while cutting a .40 cal cartridge barrel the cutter came loose and dug in a bit on one groove. So not to waist a barrel blank I kept cutting till the grooves cleaned up. It now has a groove depth of .415 and a 1 in 20 twist which should make for a few muzzle loading pistol barrels. As soon as I get one done I will post pictures. May sell the rest to cover the cost of the drilled blank.

i am interested in some of one when the time comes

[tinsmith]

John
I enjoyed looking at the pictures of underhammers in the link that you shared. Some are beautifully made and some not. But each one is unique and shows the inventiveness and skill of the builder. The basic simplicity of the design and the individuality of each is what intrigues me. I've got a barrel from a Martini Cadet rifle that I'm going to try. It is .310 caliber, 5 groove, one turn in 20". A Hornady .310 ball and .010 patch gives a good fit. I bought this barrel years ago for very little. Remember when the Martini Cadet actions were used to build varmint rifles? Now they are collectable; wish I had one! Thanks to all for the advice & comments. Always good to hear from others with similar interests. Now to the designing & building.

[tinsmith]

I sent in my membership dues to the NMLRA. Looking forward to receiving my first "Muzzle Blasts". Hopefully I can make it to the Spring Shoot in Friendship, IN. It has been many years since I've been there! Just thinking, that was my first road trip by myself after getting my driver's license (1967). 1962 Rambler six cylinder, three in the tree!

[dondiego]

I just signed up for the NMLRA using the link in post #7. It's about time! I have been a life member of the NRA for over 30 years! How do I set up the banners for my handle for being a life member?

[swathdiver]

You can find .36 cap and ball barrels on ebay quite regularly. Uberti guns generally have deeper rifling than Pietta. For ease of machining I would imagine that the Remington New Model Navy or Belt/Police models would be preferrable to a Colt.

[BrianL]

A pistol barrel requires a faster rifling twist than a rifle, so a cut-off barrel wouldn't work.

Actually you might be surprised at the accuracy with a cutoff. I used 9" of a Rayl .36 cal barrel to make a barrel for my Patriot. It shoots great! The 32" Seneca shoots pretty good too.
I am thinking of making one with a 40 cal drop.

EDIT: the Rayl barrel was a 1-48" twist


131363131364131365

[Ballistics in Scotland]

John
I enjoyed looking at the pictures of underhammers in the link that you shared. Some are beautifully made and some not. But each one is unique and shows the inventiveness and skill of the builder. The basic simplicity of the design and the individuality of each is what intrigues me. I've got a barrel from a Martini Cadet rifle that I'm going to try. It is .310 caliber, 5 groove, one turn in 20". A Hornady .310 ball and .010 patch gives a good fit. I bought this barrel years ago for very little. Remember when the Martini Cadet actions were used to build varmint rifles? Now they are collectable; wish I had one! Thanks to all for the advice & comments. Always good to hear from others with similar interests. Now to the designing & building.

That should work, but if you use the Cadet barrel, it more or less guarantees that you will immediately afterwards see a Cadet action going cheap because it doesn't have the original barrel. That doesn't give you the original, unaltered wood, but some Cadets were built as sporting rifles, and that is one of the easier restocking jobs. Alternatively there are people who would buy a good Cadet barrel, with unaltered chamber, for a lot more than a barrel blank would cost.

[Ballistics in Scotland]

tinsmith,
You mention that a pistol barrel has to have a faster twist than a rifle barrel.
Why is that ?
Would not twist be relative to it's use, such as round ball or conical ?
Reason I ask is that many years ago I cut back a .36 caliber ML barrel for a fellow and saved the piece with the idea of someday making a under hammer pistol out of it. Is it tent stake material ?

You are at least close to correct on this. Velocity and weight make


very little difference, in most cases, to whether a bullet is adequately stabilized. I found that a 248gr. .330 bullet for my Portuguese Guedes rifle needed something like the 1700 ft./sec. of the original load to be stabilized by its twist of about 11.5in. But bullets tumbled at 1300.

Almost any twist at all, though, should stabilize a round ball, or the bullets close in length and weight to a round ball which are often used in pistols or very large-caliber muzzle-loading rifles. In borderline cases a hollow base bullet gives more stabilization than a solid based one
of the same weight.

Track of the Wolf are very good for barrels and liners, and they specify not only the twist but the land and groove diameters. This is quite important, since for a patched ball you need deep grooves, but for others (such as Lee's REAL bullet or the heavy bullets of the British long-range target rifles, you need shallow grooves. For these a barrel meant for breech-loaders might be better.