grampa gave me a box of 9mm im wont be sshooting

[rmatchell]

Just thought I would share this because I think its kinda cool but no way ill ever shoot them. Grampa gave me a box of Illinois state police 9mm +p+ with the wcc +p+ 83 so from my birth year. The label says its loaded to 40000 cup so a lil hot.
125455
125456
125457

[starmac]

Interesting, even more so if your grandad was a trooper.

[TXGunNut]

I remember that stuff, I had a similar load using a 115gr Sierra at the time. Remember that industry standards for 9mm take into consideration older and weaker handguns. And no, I won't post that load.

[rmatchell]

He is a retired trooper with lots of stories.

[mattw]

That stuff is toasty! I shoot that load in my hi-power and it is a tack driver. Not for cheap pistols!!

[rmatchell]

Right now I have a pt-99 afs and a marlin camp 9 so its going to sit. I think its going to be moreof a cconversation piece.

[Down South]

Nice Christmas present.

[hithard]

Wow,,,,,,in the wrong hands those could prove to be a more than lethal round in a court of law....And you have it in writing no less.

[MaryB]

The myth of the more lethal round in court... I have never heard of it coming up in court beyond "shot with XX gun" think it is a urban legend that if you load a hot hollow point and use it to defend yourself they can go after you. A bullet is a bullet...

[Catshooter]

A Glock will eat those for breakfast and come back wanting more. I've shot lots.

But only in a Glock.


Cat

[Multigunner]

The major cause of blown up auto pistols appears to be a bullet pushed back deep into the case due to lack of proper crimping.
The early ACP ammo had a annular groove pressed into the case body to form a internal shoulder to prevent this sort of thing. Thats something I'd like to see revived by modern ammunition manufacturers.

When I carried a P-35 I used SuperVel truncated cone high velocity loads.
I never had a problem with these but I have read of several incidents of blown up P-35 pistols traced to the SuperVel bullets being jammed back into the case.
I had polished the throat of my P-35 the day I got it, and always chambered the first rounds of a mag gently. Mine never showed any tendency to mutilate bullet noses.
I also left a round in the chamber, depending on the magazine disconnect to render the weapon safe when the mag was pulled. Re chambering the top rounds over and over again has been blamed for several blown up Glock incidents. The bullets work loose after being slam fed numerous times, then sooner or later end up being pushed back into the case.

[scarry scarney]

I have a box of 38special, that have a US Treasury sticker on it.

[rondog]

I have 14 full boxes of this Winchester .38+P ammo. It's supposedly surplus Royal Canadian Mounted Police ammo, but I can't confirm that.

[starmac]

What pray tell is a MORE than lethal round??

[DougGuy]

What pray tell is a MORE than lethal round??

By the time the prosecution rests, they will have assured the jury just how lethal the +P+ can be... Anything they can trump up to hold up or prop up or pump up their case is fair game, truth or not.

[rmatchell]

What pray tell is a MORE than lethal round??

Depending on the shooter it could be somewhere after the second reload and yes there is a story behind that one.

[starmac]

There is either lethal or non lethal rounds, more than lethal does not even make sense. And iirc it was just something dreamed up by a certain gun rag author, and has never even come up in any court, possibly because of how stupid the idea of it is to start with.

[Down South]

LOL, does more lethal mean it makes the BG more dead?

[runfiverun]

nope..
it just shows the ILL police to be out for some killin.
jeeeezus, it's just loaded to higher pressure.
it probably limits penetration more than anything, besides it's 9mm that argument was settled in the 80's.

[rmatchell]

The story grampa told me was that they were issued a aluminum light weight round that ended up not being able to penetrate leather so this was thw replacement. Then they moved away from 9mm

[DCM]

Rmatchell in your case I would not sell or shoot them either for personal reasons.
If I owned them I would either sell them for the right price or shoot them for ballistics testing purposes. Based on other tests I doubt that I would be impressed with anything but the Temporary cavity.

[shawnba67]

I have the new federal version and from my 4 3/4 barrel they shot 1365fps
the win 127gr + P + was 1285fps! If it had gotten to 1300 would have made USpSA major power factor. Just so you don't feel the need to waste any of those thur your chrono

[Geezer in NH]

Over SAMMI pressure at the time and no Firearms Excise Tax paid on it.

[Multigunner]

The story grampa told me was that they were issued a aluminum light weight round that ended up not being able to penetrate leather so this was thw replacement. Then they moved away from 9mm
I'm sure any 9mm load other than a simunition would penetrate any leather a person might be likely to wear. Its more likely that if the bullets had hollow points that when they cut through leather the nose cavity became plugged and the bullet wouldn't expand greatly reducing its wounding effect.
That sort of plugging up has been mentioned as the cause of failures of some 9mm hollow points to expand resulting in through and through wounds that failed to stop an agressor.
On the other hand truncated cone hollow points with a large nose cavity can cause cookie cutter type holes in automobile tires causing them to go flat very quickly. They are also less likely to glance off light sheet metal, the edge of the nose cavity digging into the metal.

I did once own a 1950's leather biker jacket with very thick quilted padding in the lining. The previous owner had been in a knife fight and the jacket had a long slash in the leather but the knife didn't cut through the padding.
There are high priced biker jackets with chain mail in the linings supposedly to avoid penetration of the body by road debris in case of a spill, but certainly good protection against a knife attack.
I don't think any of these would stop a 9mm bullet unless it was lined with kevlar.

Prefragmented and Glazer safety slugs can sometimes begin to break up in thick clothing before hitting flesh and not penetrate far enough to create a incapacitating wound. One FBI document I just looked over quotes a dr saying that a Glazer safety slug to the abdomen will likely be fatal but usually only days or weeks later and cause of death then would be perotinitus.
Perhaps the bullets your grand dad spoke of broke up too quickly to penetrate very deeply.