45/70 boolit for deer hunting

[krazypetman]

wondering what everyone thinks is the best grain of bullet for deer hunting in a marlin 1895 45/70 and the best mold sort of leaning toward lyman like to be able to shoot up to 200 yards

[knifemaker]

If you want to have a flat enough shooting boolit for a max range of 200 yards, I would look at a mold for a cast boolit in the 300 to 350 gr. weight. load it up to 1800-1900 fps and it will shoot very flat out to that range of 200 yards. My favorite is a Ranch Dog mold that throws a gas check 360 gr. bullet and using 43 gr. of IMR-4198 powder has a average velocity of 1860 FPS. It is a round nose flat point bullet that feeds very well in the Marlin 1895 and is very accurate sized at .460.

[dh2]

my marlin is putting out a NOE 460-405 HP pushed by IMR4198 getting a 2 inch 100yd. group is no problem. I do not feel under powered for what ever walks in the lower 48 states

[stubert]

I am shooting the RCBS 45-300 gc. It weighs 324 grains lubed and checked. 49 grains of 3031 in Win. cases. very accurate, not to bad on recoil. However, I have yet to make meat with it.

[siamese4570]

You gotta try the Gould 330 HP. I think that it's the lyman 457122 or 127. I cast pure lead and shoot it about 1350 fps. That speed makes 200 yd shots problematic but I don't see many over 100 yds anyway. Hit one last year at 135 yds and it blew lung chunks out of the off side for about 5-6 feet. to get these boolits shooting flat enough to make 200 yds workable you're going to get recoil that will loosen your fillings. just sayin
siamese4570

[bikerbeans]

krazy,

According to JBM's ballastic calculator you will need around a 2,000 fps MV to achieve a 200 yard PBR with your 45-70 LG. I calculated this with 300, 350 and 400 grain FN bullets and you need right 2,000 fps for any of these 3 weight bullets. FWIW, 400g boolit at 2,000 fps is right at a maximum LG load according to hodgdon and enough recoil to be a handful in a Marlin 1895. A 300g bullet at 2,000 fps isn't too bad in the recoil department and would easily take a whitetail with proper shot placement. You need to slug your barrel so you know what diameter boolit you need to cast. Both the Marlin 45-70s I load for do not like a cast bullet smaller than .460".

Good luck,

BB

[mac266]

Pard, with a round that big, anything you launch is going to put down a deer in his tracks. The best bullet is the one that shoots accurately.

[Doc Highwall]

I like to use sectional density as a way of choosing bullets for a given caliber. In 30 caliber a 180 grain bullet has a S.D. of.271 and a equivalent bullet in .458 caliber would be about 405 grains.

[TheGrimReaper]

I use the Lee 405gr boolit in my Marlin 1895 and it shoots it very nicely. I push it with 13.5grs of Trailboss.

[quilbilly]

From my experiences as a muzzleloader, with a bullet that size all you need is a terminal velocity is about 900 FPS to flatten any deer in North America (elk require about 1200 FPS believe it or not). If memory serves, that means you only need a muzzle velocity of about 1300 FPS to get to 900 FPS at 200 yards. Anything more than that just flattens the trajectory at a cost of more recoil. Reducing the recoil makes the rifle more fun to shoot more often allowing you to become more accustomed to the "rainbow trajectory" making you a better, more confident shooter.

[1Shirt]

The old Gould blt is time proven!
1Shirt!

[runfiverun]

I don't think you need anything too heavy to wallop a deer.
I shoot a 425 gr rnfp pushed along with 2400 it's fairly sedate in it's velocity [more in the 1600+ fps area] and is more suited to ELK out to 200 yds than deer.
a 300 gr boolit at 1600 fps is a 454 casull load with a 20" rossi [and is just above where I could get with a 45 colt in a 24" lever gun] anything above that.... well,,, is more.

[GoodOlBoy]

Honestly out of that rifle the Lee 340, or the lee 405gr should serve you very well. The Lee 340gr bullet will knock a whitetail deer down like a sledge hammer well past the yardage you are talking about if you do your part. The 405gr gives you a little more umph for Mule deer, elk, etc. Either way you can't go wrong.

GoodOlBoy

[winchester 71]

457122............cant be beat for deer..........smucks real loud and tipps them over.......shot 14 so far and DRT is the rule..................this magic formula stuff is good on paper but shooting a 400 grain bullet out of a Marlin will beat you silly at 2000
fps..........that"s MASTODON shooting loads.............and..........a 400+ grain bullet going fast just makes 2 small holes and zips right through where a 322 gr hollowpoint trucking along at 1600 or so put anywhere in front of the diaphragm is a DRT shot with exits
that show spray patterns from 3 inch exits for 40 feet in the snow...these are mulies so white tails should be tipping over just as well
and you dont get beat up with tank killer loads to drop a couple hundred pound deer...........if you can comfortably shoot the rifle you will hit what your shooting at.........if it explodes when you pull the trigger your doomed as you can't hit much tightened up waiting to be hammered.....................

[Doc Highwall]

A 400 grain bullet powered with 24 grains of 2400 powder has approximately the same velocity of a 70 grain black powder charge in the 45/70.

[Bodydoc447]

405 gr FN worked just fine for me on Saturday. Used H4895 out of my Ruger No. 1.

Doc

[Doc Highwall]

Bodydoc447, how much H4895 or how fast and was the bullet cast or jacketed?

I use to shoot 48 to 53 grains of IMR-3031 with a 385 grain Lyman cast bullet, but right now I still have a bunch of Remington 405 grain bullets loaded with Varget that shoot a ragged hole at 100 yards with my 1895 Marlin.

The next test loads are going to be with the new Mihec 405 HB mould that is being made now and a RCBS 45-500 mould.

[bart55]

Last couple of whitetails I took with the 45 70 ,One was with the lee 405 Rn hollow base and a case full of goexFF the other was with a GB 400 gr fn that actually casts out to 385 with my ww and pure lead mix that was over 27gr 5744 .Neither deer seemed to know the difference ,as they both fell over within thirty yards . Heck last year I managed to shoot a respectable large buck with a 270 and a 130 gr rcbs cast .Not a typical cast for deer but it was something I always wanted to do ,and it worked just fine .(fast slug soft alloy and short distance) Probably the only time I will use that combo but it worked just fine. About thirty yards and dead. So I think pretty much anything you can launch out of that big 45 will drop a deer and do so with boring regularity.

[Hickok]

The Lyman #457643 works great in my Marlin 1895. It has a nice big meplat.

I really like AA2015 powder in the 45/70. The burning rate is slightly faster than RX7 and Imr3031, and a little slower than Imr 4198, great powders in caliber. AA2015 leaves very little air space in the big case. 42gr./AA2015 and the Lyman #447643 leaves an airspace of about 1/8th of an inch between the Lyman boolit and the powder. You can go a lot higher with the powder charge of 2015, but when I start getting 400+ gr boolits going over 1700-1800fps out of a 7 1/2 pound Marlin lever action, it takes all the fun out of shooting.

I have to admit, the 1895 Marlin is one rifle that can be loaded up "hotter" than I can stand to shoot!

1200-1500 fps will kill anything that needs killing with a 45/70.

[RobS]

I put this one together for the longer flatter shots of a Marlin 45-70 1895SBL.

PB- http://www.accuratemolds.com/bullet_detail.php?bullet=46-375B-D.png

GC- http://www.accuratemolds.com/bullet_detail.php?bullet=46-375G-D.png

[RJH]

300 grain with a gas check. I doubt the deer will know what the bullet profile looked like.

[TXGunNut]

Another plug for the Ranch Dog 460-350, really puts a smackdown on deer and hogs. Shot a nice sow with one a few weeks ago and another hunter about 500 yds away heard the shot AND the impact. Most critters, even big hogs, never take another step. Very accurate and not terribly unpleasant to shoot in my Guide Gun.

[Bodydoc447]

Bodydoc447, how much H4895 or how fast and was the bullet cast or jacketed?

I use to shoot 48 to 53 grains of IMR-3031 with a 385 grain Lyman cast bullet, but right now I still have a bunch of Remington 405 grain bullets loaded with Varget that shoot a ragged hole at 100 yards with my 1895 Marlin.

The next test loads are going to be with the new Mihec 405 HB mould that is being made now and a RCBS 45-500 mould.

I used 45.0 gr of H4895 and a cast 405. I bought a box of jacketed bullets for it once but I haven't shot but 10 out of it. As far as velocity, I would guess about 1550 fps or so. Does a right nice job on our little TX whitetail deer. Used the same load out of my Guide Gun last year to get meat, too.

Doc

[Walstr]

I use the Lee 405gr boolit in my Marlin 1895 and it shoots it very nicely. I push it with 13.5grs of Trailboss.
My LEE 405 gr is too skinny @ .458 w/CWW+5% Sn; leads the last 4 inches or so @ 1600fps, pushed by 45gr of IMR-3031. That's not my kinda boolit, so getting one from Mountain Molds as a "bore rider" for my Marlin 1895GS. I'll start @ 35gr IMR-3031 & work up to about 41gr, where some folks got their best accuracy.

[Bucking the Tiger]

Sir, I have a Marlin 1895 in 45-70 and have found the NOE moulds to be an excellent choice. I have a 460350 HP, 460350, and a 460405.
I would say the 350 grain solid, or the 350 grain hollow point( drops 322gr for me) would be a great choice. I shoot both these boolits almost weekly from my Marlin. I like Hodgdon 4198 or Accurate 2015 for heavy loads.

[Doc Highwall]

In the group buy section MiHec is making this mould that I am in on for my 45-70. Maybe he will have some left over to sell and you can get one, I know others are going to try to get one.

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?150128-MiHec-2-cavity-Brass-Hollow-Base-45-70-mold

[ballistim]

I bought a NOE 460 483 mold on a group buy a while back & it shoots great out of both my 1895 & Buffalo Classic with a duplex load of IMR4198 & WC872, very accurate, don't have velocity but would really like to give it a go on whitetail. NOE 460 350 RD is another I'd like to try, sure has worked great for many others.

[pls1911]

I can't argue with any of the above recomendations.
In my experience Marlins will shoot GAS CHECKED bullets sized .458 and .459 just fine....so long as they're hard enough.r
Bullets? You would be hard pressed indeed to do better than the RanchDog 350 (Now NOE/RD) or the RCBS 300.
Both bullets have hammered deer and pigs from my Marlins, Rugers, and Sharps. Launched at 1600-1800 fps they'll penetrate a good 40" of bone, meat, gristle, joints, and danged hard skull.
The Ranch Dog are brutally unapologetic with they're characteristic impact SLAP.

[44man]

Good stuff here. I love the 45-70. I still want a stainless guide gun but I got sticker shock!
Don't need a fast load for deer.
I have a Browning BPCR that weighs around 12# and with a full load of BP, thing will beat the snot out of your shoulder. Even that monster needs shot with a shoulder pad.
I shoot a 317 gr WLN from my BFR at 1630 fps and it just makes a small hole because my boolit is too hard. Deer can make over 200 yards so I will make the nose soft.
Last deer I shot with it, I used a 420 gr 50-50 HP that Babore sent me and I destroyed half the deer. Yeah, even the revolver can gut, skin and grind a deer. Deer was at an angle, boolit went in behind the shoulder but exited the off shoulder---OH my, what a mess.
There is a reason the 45-70 has been with us so long.