35 whelen is good.

[bearcove]

But I think the 338-06 is better! It will give about 100-150 fps higher velocity per bullet weight. The only claim to fame of the 35 is that you can shoot 357 pistol bullets. So what! I have 38's 357's 35rem, 356win. If you want a great medium bore high power rifle the 338-06 is my first choice. 338 barrels have twist to stabilize 300+ gr bullets. Most 358 barrels have a slower twist to keep the light bullets usable.

Why mould you want a medium bore rifle?

To KNOCK down BIG north american game.

What does that best? Heavy bullets.

Look at the 338 sierra and speer regular bullets. cheep. Heavy 35 cal bullets expensive.

338-06 vs 35, no contest!

[felix]

Don't like the twist selections in the 338 cals. ... felix

[James C. Snodgrass]

I do like the 338,but the statement that a 338-06 will push bullets of equal weight faster by 100 to150 fps faster isn't possible with out higher pressure in the 338. With equal pressure the 35 the should produce about 60 to 100 fps more than the 338. Of course I'm talking equal barrel length and bullet weight.

[Scrounger]

But I think the 338-06 is better! It will give about 100-150 fps higher velocity per bullet weight. The only claim to fame of the 35 is that you can shoot 357 pistol bullets. So what! I have 38's 357's 35rem, 356win. If you want a great medium bore high power rifle the 338-06 is my first choice. 338 barrels have twist to stabilize 300+ gr bullets. Most 358 barrels have a slower twist to keep the light bullets usable.

Why mould you want a medium bore rifle?

To KNOCK down BIG north american game.

What does that best? Heavy bullets.

Look at the 338 sierra and speer regular bullets. cheep. Heavy 35 cal bullets expensive.

338-06 vs 35, no contest!


???But I think the 338-06 is better! It will give about 100-150 fps higher velocity per bullet weight.????

Now that's contrary to the laws of physics. Those laws can't be repealed nor can they be broken.

[bearcove]

Why? It seems to me the only reason to justify a slower twist is to accomidate light bullets. That is not what these cartridges are about. They are for good mid to long range power for big game. A 275gr 338 cal at the same velocity as a 250gr 35 cal bullet, same pressure. SD of the 338 bullet says it all.

[bearcove]

Well I 'm glad all of you arm chair ballisticians know better than the fellows at speer with their pressure barrels. Other sources i have read also show the same thing. Why don't you research instead of reacting. By the way I know my Physics I took the classes while working on my Mechanical Engineering Degree!

[NVcurmudgeon]

Years ago, I exchanged letters with a Mr. Jones, head balistician at Speer. My question was how did Speer come up with lower velocities for the .35 Whelen than the .358 Win. in Speer Manual #12? His answer was that Remington had not released calibration ammo for the .35 Whelen at press time, so Speer played it careful. Mr. Jones went on to say that this situation would be corrected in Speer Manual #13. When Speer #13 came out, I bought one and found to my disappointment that the loads listed for .35 Whelen and .358 in #12 were reprinted in #13. I passed on buying Speer #14 which came out last year. Naturally, I have tired of waiting on Speer and found another source which has proved to be safe, accurate, and fast in my 1:16 twist, .3595" groove, 24", Lilja, .35 Whelen barrel. I have slowly worked up to loads that drive 250 gr. Nosler Partitions over 2600 fps with excellent case life and easy functioning. In fact, I backed off from a load that was near 2700 fps and trouble-free just on principle. The 1:16 twist seems to stabilize all easily available jacketed bullets well and is very tractable with target loads using 200-220 gr. cast boolits at 1600-1800 fps. I can't think of anything else I want that rifle to do.

[Scrounger]

Well I 'm glad all of you arm chair ballisticians know better than the fellows at speer with their pressure barrels. Other sources i have read also show the same thing. Why don't you research instead of reacting. By the way I know my Physics I took the classes while working on my Mechanical Engineering Degree!

? I'm overwhelmed! I cower before such intelligence....

[Bullshop]

NVC
Does that 2600fps/250 load of yours use 4320? My Whelen does just over 2600 with 250's and 57gn 4320.
Takes at least 10gn more powder to do the same thing with a 338 mag and with lots more recoil. I have never been able to exceed much over 2700 with the magnum and my most accurate loads were closer to 2600.
I have some of the old speer 180gn bullets that were for the 350mag. Not the newer flatish nose one but these are semi round nose and the canelur is differant and they have heavy jackets.
My rifle gets just over 3000 fps with those. I look at the 35 Whelen as a soft kicking magnum. With the heavy bullets it about equals the 338 mag and with the lighter bullets it about equals the 300 mag and it does it with less powder and recoil.
BIC/BS

[jhalcott]

My 35 whelen has a 14" twist, 24" barrel and a Mauser action. Custom stock and trigger. I have shot LOTS of Jword bullets and more cast thru it. If the 338's EXTRA 100 fps makes any difference it is in the MIND of the shooter! I do not use MAX loads but do strive for accuracy. This whole concept seems to be a "Blondes are better than Redheads" type of argument! Ihave used the 30-30, .308 and 30-06 to kill deer using a 165 grain bullet. I also have killed deer and other critters with the 357 mag, 35 Remington, .358 Win, AND the 35 whelen. Not one of these is any better than the others if you can't put the bullet in the CORRECT spot!!! Sitting on the side of a highway and shooting across the valley does NOT seem like hunting to me.

[MT Gianni]

To answer the original question, 35 cal rifle molds are found lots of places by many mfgs. 338 are more difficult to find or involve a custom manufacturer. 35 cal will be the last one to stop making gas checks for. 338 are not as easy to find. Almost every one has a 359 sizer die. Gianni

[felix]

A 275 grainer bullet should take no more than a 12 twist in a 338 groove. Especially for a high performance round like for 3K muzzle over a 300 yard plus range. Your gun has what twist? ... felix

[hornetguy]

somebody needs to design a "smiley" that depicts a pizzin contest... sorta like the two beer mugs, only two guys with a stream arching away from each other...

seems to be an ideal smiley for this type discussion....


no animal alive will EVER know the difference between a 338-06 and a 35 Whelen.

Reminds me of the old 30-06 vs 270 arguments, with less to argue about.

[felix]

"with less to argue about" is correct. 6 percent difference versus 10 percent. ... felix

[9.3X62AL]

I've hacked at you guys for 5 years+ about the 9.3 x 62 Mauser, I'm certain you are sick of THAT. I don't think there is a lot of real-world difference between the 338-06, 35 Whelen, or 9.3 x 62. Use good bullets--direct them well--critter down. I've had 33 caliber rifles on both sides of the 338-06, the 33 WCF and the 338 Win Mag. Same story--good bullets well-placed will make meat.

ENTIRELY a Blue Oval/Black Bow Tie/Mopar argument. This happens a lot after football and before baseball, and after hunting season but before the lakes ice-out. Ground squirrels should be emerging soon, and I can't wait. Trout season in the Sierras isn't for 9 more weeks. Yellowtail start running good about June.

[NVcurmudgeon]

Bullshop, not 4320, but RL 15, guess those two are close neighbors on the burning rate chart. Notice: .3595" groove diameter, 24" barrel, and 1:16 twist. Factory Rem. cases, WLRM primers,
3.33" oal.
55.0 RL 15/ 250 Nosler Partition 2564 fps
56.0 RL 15/ 250 Nosler Partition 2620 fps
57.0 RL 15/ 250 Nosler Partition 2652 fps

I have been up to Finn Aagaard's maximum load of 59.0 grains, but I like to back off the top load a little bit. I use 57.0 RL 15/ 250 Speer Spitzer for a more affordable practice and preliminary sight in load. The Speer is a bit slower than the Nosler wth the same load.

Acccuracy is under 1" for three-shot grups at 100 yd. (2 3/4 X Redfield Bear cub scope)

[trk]

"I don't think there is a lot of real-world difference between the 338-06, 35 Whelen, or 9.3 x 62. "

Amen.

GOOD calibers. Some have better selection of bullets and moulds.

[leftiye]

Oops, B.C. was advocating the .338 - Ought 6! So if the 338 W.M. gets 2700 fps with max useable loads, what does that say about the 338 -06? Faster, I guess. I've seen the data putting the 338 (whelen) 06 as fast as the .35 whelen (06), (only pointing out that an 06 case is an 06 case whatever else you neck it up to or down to be), But Scrounger was right, the bigger bore of the 35 should require less pressure to equal the velocity with the same bullet weight as the .338 and vice versa. Any data putting the .338 faster automatically requires higher pressures. All that is necessary is to raise the pressures to be equal, and the Whelen will produce higher velocities with the given bullet weight.. Don't care who says different. I've only got a couple of degrees in Psychology, so I guess I should be thankful that I only took one class in engineering!

[waksupi]

:takinWiz:as so?

[shooting on a shoestring]

A bit of wisdom imparted from my Dad, he observed "the 30-06 must be the perfect cartridge. You can neck it down and improve it, neck it up and improve it, or just leave it alone and do fine."

And I'm feeling left out in this pizzin contest. Mine is a 8mm-06 (.323-06).

The downside is short list of: moulds, j-bullets, load data.

The upside: Shoots good and is really cheap (Dad put this one together and gave it to me b/c he had several other rifles with similar performance numbers), and starting load data is easy to find (use 30-06 data).

Now I realize that 8mm-06 is the little brother to .35 Whelen, and .338-06 and may be lagging behind by a 100 fps or so with 200 gr boolits, so I'll exercise judgement and not attempt to take polar bears, big grizzlies or moose. But I am confident it will work fine on anything that roams central Texas.

[Dave C.]

You guys are missing out on my super secret modification. NICKEL cases!
Critters die 1.2% quicker when shoot with nickel cases![smilie=1: