Accurate 5744 powder for cast bullets

[michiganmike]

Greetings,

I spent some time this afternoon cleaning out my Word file Reloading folder, and organizing my Reloading folder in my Firefox Bookmarks. In the process I came across a rather long discussion from this forum about Accurate 5744.

According to the relative burn rate chart in front of me, it is in the same neighborhood as IMR SR 4759, AA 1680 and Alliant Reloader 7. The consensus was that it is a very good powder for cast bullets, with good accuracy in a number of cartridges. Several writers also complained about the cost.

Looking in the Natchez catalog I received yesterday 5744 is still available. Likewise, the cost now appears to be about the same as similar powders from Accurate and other manufacturers.

Question: Is anyone currently using AA 5744? What results are you getting with it? I have a Ruger Hawkeye with the 16 1/2" barrel. And I have the RCBS 7mm mould. It is supposed to throw 168 grain bullets. But it keeps dropping 180 grain bullets, which is fine with me.

Based on the little reading I did, 5744 likes heavier bullets. So, I thought it might be worth a try.

All comments welcome,

MichiganMike

[Bohica793]

I have had success with 27.5 grains of 5744 under a 405 grain RNFP in my 45-70.

[tomme boy]

Usually about 4-5$ higher per pound. Works good in 308win

[WALLNUTT]

I've burned a few pounds of 5744 over the years under cast in about everthing I have. Always at least decent accuracy if not the best. Not as clean as some other powders but that doesn't really matter if it shoots good. I've used it in 30/30,30/40,/30-06,303,45/70,357Max. You'll like it. But you'll also like 4759 and RL7

[rintinglen]

There's them's as swears by it and there's them's as swears at it.
I have tried it in 30-30, 30-06 and 32-20. It works well, but not better than some other powders. I tend to get unburned or partially combusted kernels in the bore. It is usually 5$ a lb more than Hogdon, Winchester or IMR powders, so I tend to use WW-748, 3031, or 4759 instead. Mike Venturino advocates its use. He finds it to give top accuracy in the Military Rifle cartridges he's into these days.
Reloader 7 is also good but availability is spotty.

[.22-10-45]

This has been the most accurate powder I have tried in an original Remington rolling block No. 1 in .40-50 B.N. And while Accurate has it listed for the .22 Hornet..after 1 shot, so much unburned/semi-burned powder grains remained... couldn't chamber another round until I ran a patch thru.

[Scharfschuetze]

I bought an 8 pound caddy when it first came out... what 13 or 14 years ago?

I had abysmal results with it in 45/70 and 50/70 Trapdoor rifles and a Marlin 1895 so I put it in the powder magazine and forgot about it. There was so much partially burned debris left in the rifles that it would tie up even a high leverage action like the Trapdoor. It was unusable in my lever action 45/70 for that reason.

I just tried it again last month in a 30/40 Krag infantry rifle and had the totally opposite result with absolutely stellar results both on target and with consistency over the chronograph with the Lyman 314299 boolit weighing 208 grains with GC and lube. I've now got a series of 303 British rounds with the 314299 boolit loaded for testing when the weather warms up a bit.

I do note that it will heat up a barrel almost as fast as jacketed bullet rounds though. I believe it's a double base powder and that's probably the reason. Compared to my favorite cast boolit powder, SR 4759, it heats up a barrel about twice as fast when using lead projectiles.

While I've never confirmed it, I understand that the formula was revised sometime after I bought my caddy of the powder. Perhaps they got a handle on the partially burned kernels. I always wanted to fire a few rounds of it over fresh snow in a 45/70 to see what the debris pattern was. Never got around to it though and now it doesn't seem too important now that I've found a use for what's left in the jug. Don't think that I'll replace it.

[leadman]

Still has partially burned powder in the bore from currently made 5744. I sold my 5744 to a friend of mine to use in his 223 Rem with jacketed bullets and he likes it. I got tired of it getting in the chamber of my Rolling block and causing dents in the cases.

[ukrifleman]

I agree with previous posts about unburnt powder residue with 5744.
Having said that, it is an excellent cast powder, I use it for all my cast loads with bullet weights from 155gn to 205gn.

I have also used Rel 7, which I find burns much cleaner than 5744 and also gives very good results.
ukrifleman.

[A pause for the COZ]

I have about 9 pounds mainly because it has been the only fast rifle powder in stock.
Lucky me!!!!

I use it with Cast in the 223 AR 15 works real well in that.
I found my 7.62x39 stuff really likes it too with cast.

Much cleaner burning than my RL-7 loads for me. I like it!!

[Artful]

I have used it with success in straight walled or nearly straight walled cases with heavy boolits.
It's a staple for my 300 Whisper loads.

[gpidaho]

I've endlessly complained about the filthy burn of 5744, then to get my supply used up I started loading it in 762x54R with heavy boolits and what do you know, works pretty well and burns almost clean. I think the trick with this powder is to use heavy for cal. boolits. GP

[Scharfschuetze]

It's interesting to read all of the above comments. Most correlate closely with my comments posted earlier so I'm glad I'm not the only lone Ranger out there.

When the powder came out, it was highly recommended for straight wall black powder cartridges and reports in all the magazines of the time heralded its performance when used as such; yet real experience on the range and in the field was completely contrary to what the self-appointed firearms gurus of the printed page reported. I found that odd. Did the gun writers get something other than what was sold the public? I doubt it; but doubt still remain as to the veracity of some of the pundits extolling its virtues in the rounds of the 19th Century.

What now seems to be the common thread among us is that the powder is actually quite useful in bottle necked modern cartridges with both cast and jacketed projectiles, particularly in the military 30 calibre rounds of the 20th Century. Is it worth more expense per shot than the IMR and Alliant brands that we also use? I guess only each shooter can answer that.

[wlc]

I've just started using it in my 416 Ruger under the RCBS 350gr bullet. Preliminary results look promising. Not a single unburned or partially burned kernel in the barrel, decent accuracy, and much milder recoil than full house loads. I've also tried it in my 300BLK with mixed results. Accuracy was OK, but I still haven't found the sweet spot between velocity and cycling in the AR.

[rexherring]

I still use it but found that I need a heavy crimp and use mag primers when working up loads.

[WALLNUTT]

I seems to need a little more pressure than one might think from a cast bullet powder to burn clean. Although 5744 is usable I prefer RL7 for my 30cals. I'm surprised Cause finds 5744 cleaner than RL7. These days sometimes we must burn what we got.

[big bore 99]

I've had excellent results with it in 45-70. Sure can't find any around here though. It was called XMP5744. Same stuff? I had problems with unburned powder too and talked to a tech at Alliant. He said to NEVER use any kind of dacron or other fillers with it. He recommended some crimp. A heavier slug and a little crimp worked wonders. Wish I could find some now.

[Boyscout]

I am using Accur 5744 in my 35 Remington, 30-06, and Mosin Nagant: 200, 170, 200 gn bullets respectively. The only rifle I don't get good results out of yet is the Mosin-Nagant but I don't think it's the powder. It was the powder behind the CB I killed my first deer with this year.

I bought it because the guy at the LGS told me it was bulky and filled the case better, a consideration when using reduced loads in a rifle. The Lyman Cast Manual also said it was good to excellent with many of the rounds I reload.

[A pause for the COZ]

I seems to need a little more pressure than one might think from a cast bullet powder to burn clean. Although 5744 is usable I prefer RL7 for my 30cals. I'm surprised Cause finds 5744 cleaner than RL7. These days sometimes we must burn what we got.

Not in all of them. But I have not found it to be dirty at all. But RL-7 in my 300 Black out is a great shooter but what a mess. Nuff so I ordered a Coated bolt and carrier. RL-7 shoots too well not to put up with it. just havent seen RL-7 in at least two years.

[copterdoctor]

I use 5744 with 405 grain .459 hollow base boolits in a Springfield 1884 rifle. Reasonable accuracy at 50 and 100 yards. A 25.5 grain powder charge works best for me. I also get a lot of unburned powder in the bore.

[quilbilly]

It is my favorite powder for my 338 WM, 30/30, and plain base loads in my 444.

[GabbyM]

Have used it all last summer in a thousand 222 Rem loads with Lyman #225646. Standard 223 Wolf primers and no crimp. A tad less than .002" neck tension with either new Lapua brass or annealed converted LC brass. No unburned powder in the 222 but it's running fairly high pressure for a cast boolit load. I may try a slower powder. Have also shot it a little in my 30-06. Never noticed un burned kernels but then I wasn't looking for them. Higher price of 5744 gets evened out a bit by the low charge weights required. In my 222 it fills the case enough I don't have to worry about a double charge. Which is a great asset and worth a buck or two.

[lotech]

5744 is an excellent cast bullet powder. With accuracy my primary concern, it's easy overlook minimal dirty burning, if any. I've found 5744 will often equal or slightly exceed accuracy results obtained using Reloder7, IMR4759, and IMR4198.

[Camba]

Do you have some loads for the 7-08 with AA5744? I have not seen anywhere a load so I can try for this combination. Appreciate the info. Thanks.
Camba

[W.R.Buchanan]

I have used this stuff a lot in all my Cast Boolit rifles. I have good enough results to continue it's use since I have about 8 lbs left to burn up.

As far as unburned powder granules. So ? they don't seem to harm anything.

I got a story from Venturino at the SHOT Show a few years ago.

It seems this powder was originally called 4475 and was developed for the .223-5.56. However the problem was, it didn't meter very well in automated machinery (something I found out real quick) as the granules were too big to flow freely thru the small cartridge mouth. I got numerous powder bridges and so I stopped using it for .223's.

It was sold to some Russian guy who changed the name to 5744 and sold it back to us.

I have had good luck using it for all my .30 cal cast boolit rounds as well as the .45-70. It seems to work more consistently the larger the bullet diameter and with 300 to 400 gr boolits you can't really do anything wrong with it. I have ran from 25 to 35 gr with a 300 gr boolit and the accuracy is the same pretty much across the board. 25 gr with a 400 gr boolit is the same as the 300 gr ones except for the elevation change.

I am still trying to get it to perform in my .303 Enfield with Lyman 314299. I know it will work, I just have to find the magic combination. I have got it to run pretty good at 50 yards but not at 100 yet. .30-06, and .308 were no problem at all and the first loads tried worked just right. 25 and 21 gr respectively. This is with NOE 311299.

I plan on going directly to it for the .35-303 as soon as I complete that gun. There will be a 250 gr Cast load with 5744 for practice shooting and 250 gr Jacketed load for hunting, probably with IMR4895 which is my other go to 30 cal powder.

Randy

[groovy mike]

Anyone use 5744 in vintage 50-70 rifles?

[flint45]

I use it in .45-70,.40-65,.50-70 good accuracy and yes some unburned powder also.

[quilbilly]

My 444, 30/30, and 338 WM all love 5744 with CB's. When it was the same price as other powders, I used it all the time but the price rise cause me to look for alternatives like RE-7 but I still have some extra cans. I still use it in my 338 WM.

[bigowl]

I'm loading my 1885 405 win with 33 gr. A 5744 under a 430 gr pure lead pp. Ave. vel. 1750 fps. Very clean burning and accurate.

[gareth96]

Just saw a pound in Vance's Columbus for $45... Glad I have a good supply... Pretty much only use it for my muzzleloader (Savage ML10-II smokeless muzzleloader).

[Kraschenbirn]

I've tried 5744 with cast in several calibers and it's become my 'preferred' for the 30-30 but only obtained 'so-so' results in .45-70, .30-40, and .32-20 while in .38-55, it was a dead waste of time and effort.

Bill

[Wolfer]

It is the best powder I’ve shot to date in my 7x57 with the rcbs 168 gr. Boolit actually weighs 180 gr. That’s the only gun I have that it has been satisfactory in. Every thing else I get lots of unburned powder and poor accuracy.
Never tried but always suspect it would be great for reduced jacketed loads. Say turning your 30-06 into a 300 savage for the kids to hunt with. Or anyone who’s recoil sensitive.
For cast in most of my guns it seems to need more pressure than I’m willing to give it.

[ShooterAZ]

5744 works great in the 300 Win Mag with the Lee C309-170FP.

[whisler]

There is an article in the latest issue of Handloader about cast bullets in 30 caliber battle rifles and all that was used was 5744.

[Shuz]

Is it me...or did the price of 5744 skyrocket when 4759 went off the market?

[MostlyLeverGuns]

I've used it in 300 Savage and 308 - Savage 99's - 185 grain .310 bullets,18-20grs A5744 very good accuracy at 200 yards 2 to 3 inch vertical, 3-6" horizontal depending on wind, 15 inch drop from 100 yard zero. Marlin 336SC 32 Special 16 grains, 200 grain .323 flatpoint, usually 2 inches at 200 yards, though the wind can screw that up too. All lever actions with 4-16x or 6-24x scopes for fun. Not sure if it is better than Reloder 7, I did get 8lb of Buffalo Rifle to try.

[Drifty4]

Got a bunch of 44 mag loaded with 5744. waiting for good range weather.

[Streetwalker]

I like 5744 for my 6.5 Swede and cast boolits but it is really expensive when found in the western Nevada, northern California area. It burns relatively clean but then I crimp most of my rifle cast boolit loads to help facilitate a cleaner burn. However, I have not found 5744 to be the best powder for accuracy in any of the military calibers I load for but it is a good choice to try out IF you are well heeled and want to pay through the nose for it!

[LAH]

I was given several pounds of this & liked it enough to purchase an 8 pound jug. It works just fine in my 45-70. I use 25 grains & the NEI 460-405-FN which comes in at 420 grains. Load on right.

http://i66.photobucket.com/albums/h244/Creekerpics/Firearms/74%20Sharps/DSC06028.jpg
http://i66.photobucket.com/albums/h244/Creekerpics/Firearms/74%20Sharps/DSC06034.jpg

[Krag1902]

I use it with 210-220 gr. bullets in five Krags. it turns up exceptional accuracy. Meters a lot better than 4759, too.

[crackers]

Is it me...or did the price of 5744 skyrocket when 4759 went off the market?

I think it's the same stuff and we're (well, not me) taking a bath.

[Warhawk]

I’ve got two pounds, planning to try some cast bullet mid range loads with it in my 500 S&W.