Why I love this muzzle loader shooting.........

[oldracer]

As you have seen by some of my posts I started out with 45-70 Rolling Blocks and Sharps and then moved into muzzle loaders only. I have been working with a Pedersoli Gibbs and a Green Mountain barreled copy I made this past winter and to help complicate things started down the "paper patch road"! With the help of several members here and several local shooters I have started getting into the center of a standard NRA 3 target set.

This past Monday I took my home made slug gun to continue on the PP work and the first 10 shots were right where I was aiming. I adjusted the tang up and shot, down and then shot and both left and right and the impact was following just as I was expecting. Soooooo, the last few shots I tried for a nice group and #1 was at 8 oclock near the bulls eye and the next shot was touching as was #3! Wow I was thinking this string is looking great and then #4 was about 3 inches directly left??!! No wind, same load, same trigger pull, etc, etc, etc! I thought, this is what makes this sooooo much fun!

[Fly]

Yep me too.I enjoy working with each getting all I can from them.I have a sharps & a Gibbs also.
My problem with my Gibbs is no where around here to shoot long.

Fly

[dikman]

You were obviously holding your tongue wrong on that last shot!:wink:

[Omnivore]

You were obviously holding your tongue wrong on that last shot!

Yep. Too many shooters ignore the tongue.

So I was out confirming the sights on my 50 cal hunting rifle, for the season that starts here in a few days. 100 yards. Cold, clean bore. I figure you have to zero with a cold, clean bore because in hunting, it's that first shot, which is hopefully the only shot, that counts. You don't get a fouling shot in this "shooting match" that consists of one shot. So I'm attempting to make all my shots from a cold, clean bore, but what is that, exactly?

Ah! Well after the first shot, which went a tad left with perfect elevation, I spit patch swabbed the bore, then a dry patch, followed by a lubed patch. Second shot had the same windage, but several inches low. Third shot, same cleaning sequence, went even lower. Well how can I adjust my sights when I can't get a group?

I tell ya how; make sure your bore is in the same condition every time. I was over-lubing the bore. I quit using the lube patch and the elevation came right back up, I put a few clicks of right wind on the Lyman tang sight and the next two shots were only an inch apart, with good windage. I could have kept lubing, and added some elevation, and that would have worked too. Either way. Just depends on how you want your barrel as you walk out the door to take your game.

I figure that the drier bore's greater hold on the projectile (patched round ball in this case) results, of course, in more pressure, which in turn results in a hotter, more complete burn of the powder during launch, which in turn nets a higher velocity. Slick up the bore right before firing, and ball goes through more easily, netting a cooler, less complete burn and lower velocity.

Oftentimes, when things don't seem to make sense, they actually do.

[bigted]

I have found that this muzzleloading is no different then any blackpowder shooting ... be it a BPCR , muzzleloader , or any firearm shooting black powder ... fouling control ... fouling control ... fouling control.

the first shot / hunting shot is often times the most perturbing to perfect. in order to see if each 1st shot will print to aim ... it is imperative to have a cold, clean, freshly loaded rifle with each shot. to make this a reality ... I find that the usual time consuming shooting of my muzzleloaders now takes three times longer as the need for not only a clean bore ... but a cold one as well ... combined with replicating the expected weather for each shot ... all in all it can be frustrating to find a load that groups well under these circumstances with each 1st shot.


I find that mostly I use a condition that is fairly easy to duplicate. my load column consists of this procedure each time;


- shovel in my powder charge [80 grains GOEX 2F in the 50 TC]
- shove a vegi wad down on top of the powder charge.
- take my prelubed patch and smear fresh Crisco on the side that will go down the bore between the ball n barrel.
- push gently in 1 constant push the ball/patch down on top of the vegi wad.
- cap, aim, shoot.
- clean with 1 in and out ballistol/water [20 water/1 ballistol] three times with cold ballistol/water mix.
- clean patch till dry and spotless on the patch.
- allow 5 full minutes to pass by to cool the barrel before loading and shooting the second time.

this seems to work well for me. YMMV

[ihuntbear]

I tried the balistol mix ( moose Milk ) for cleaning between shots..all it did was gum up the barrel...Now I use windex window gleaner for cleaning between shots,one patch up and down ..My group went from 4" to 7/8" with the same load but I do use 7 to 1 mix balistol and water air dryed for a day to the patch around the ball..I sent a copy of the target to dutch but he hasn't responded....

[idahoron]

I am another that has worked for the perfect cold clean barrel shot. The Paper patching has helped my shooting the most I think. I
also fully believe in two bullets. The lee 500 S&W bullet for my 50's, and the RCBS 11m bullet for my 45's. These bullets have proven time and time again that if I take them out to shoot the hit where I was aiming last time and the time before that and the year before that. Paper patching for me has improved consistency.

[waksupi]

I tried the balistol mix ( moose Milk ) for cleaning between shots..all it did was gum up the barrel...Now I use windex window gleaner for cleaning between shots,one patch up and down ..My group went from 4" to 7/8" with the same load but I do use 7 to 1 mix balistol and water air dryed for a day to the patch around the ball..I sent a copy of the target to dutch but he hasn't responded....

If Moose Milk is fouling your barrel, you need to add more water.

[ihuntbear]

The mix for moose milk that I got from Dutch was 1 part ballistof 1 part pineal and 23 parts wAter. ..didn't work for me so I tried windex and had great results

[fastdadio]

I use automotive wind shield washer solvent. The cheap blue stuff. I take a pump spray bottle with me to the range and clean between shots. Methyl alcohol is the actve ingredient here. Cuts fowling great and evaporates clean. Cheaper by the gallon than windex. We actually use it in the kitchen also.

[oldracer]

I have been using the "moose milk" cleaner since I started with black powder about 7 years ago or so. I have some small containers that seal very well and fill them with the appropriate sized patches a "dash" of Ballistol and then pure water and shake well. I squeeze the patches before use and then wipe once. I use both sides of another patch to dry. I do use a full length funnel/tube to drop the powder in so nothing gets on the barrel walls. If I am using the slug guns they are paper patched (at least for now) and for round balls I use pillow ticking lubed in large batches with Bore Butter and saved 300 or so in a zip lock bag. So far that has worked well for me and in the near future I don't think I'll change unless something points directly to this part of the shooting steps.

[ihuntbear]

I use automotive wind shield washer solvent. The cheap blue stuff. I take a pump spray bottle with me to the range and clean between shots. Methyl alcohol is the actve ingredient here. Cuts fowling great and evaporates clean. Cheaper by the gallon than windex. We actually use it in the kitchen also.

I've seen guys at the range use a mix of windshield washer and dove dish soap for their BP cartridges brass..After they shoot they drop the brass in a bottle of that mix..cleans the brass like new

[fastdadio]

Intresting. I have thought about adding a few drops of dish soap to the mix, but it cleans so well as straight solvent, I never bothered. I wonder if the dish soap would leave a trace of residue in the bore? I will give it a try.

[Good Cheer]

Do some dish soaps use salt as a surfactant?

[oldracer]

I would NOT use any Dawn or other dish soap when shooting due to the possible product left behind in the barrel even if wiping with dry patches. I checked with my black powder mentor, Doug Knoell and he agreed not to use that. The Windex/water idea he noted would be okay but the problem of doing the same thing each time is hard to do since the evaporation rate of the window cleaner will vary greatly with temp. I used water and a couple squirts of Dawn with my cartridges to loosen the fouling only and would rinse off immediately when getting home. Note in the ingredients list there are several that are very corrosive to gun barrel steel:

Triclosan, water, magnesium, sodium dodecylbenzene sulfonate, ammonium laureth sulfate, lauryl polyglucose, lauramidopropylanine oxide, SD Alcohol 3A, sodium xylene sulfonate, sodium chloride, fragrance, pentasodium pentetate, sodium bisulfite, quaternium 15, D&C Orange 4

[bigted]

I gotta say that the "blue" windshield wash fluid is something I will have to give a try ... I have used Windex [WITH VINEGAR] with fair results. the windshield wash fluid sounds interesting as it sure cuts the road film nicely. I have heard the same thing tho with antifreeze but just cant bring myself to try that sticky stuff.

[johnson1942]

I love boreing shooting like that. by boreing I mean it is always reliable and always accurate. never have to mess with, they just shoot at the point you aimed at.