Looking for suggested starting load for 200gr RCBS FN-GC in .357mag w/Hod. Lil'Gun

[GooseGestapo]

I recently aquired a Ruger M77/357. I've tried several loads in it and it's marvelously accurate with 17.4gr of Lil'Gun under a Remington 158gr JSP. It chrono's to 2,020fps avg. (10 shots) and has given some 1.5" 3-shot groups at 100yds.

I've tried #2400 under the 200gr FN (mine casts to 215gr) for ~1,350fps (9.8gr). It grouped acceptably but at max load won't quite get the speed I'm looking for. (1,500fps if possible).
Obviously, I'd like to try the Lil'Gun and want to know if others have tried this powder with this or similar boolit.

Hod. gives data for a 180gr Jacketed as their heaviest listing (15gr).

As title states; I'd like to hear others experience and suggestions to include H110/Win296 or H4227.

btw; the 158gr Lee TL-SWC shot suprising good over 6.0gr of Unique for 1,385fps... Shot ~2" at 50yds. Suprised me!

[LuckySavage]

Why so heavy? Local tyrannosaurus rex pissing you off? That said, here's a recipe I found on handloads.com- use at your own risk!

210gr LFN-GC 13.5 gr Lil’Gun 1,222 fps 1.725" CCI 550 This was an accurate load in my 5.5" Redhawk, above and below this the bullets keyholed. Primers and cases showed no excessive pressure signs. Temp was 49 deg F.

Considering that the given speed was 1222 fps. out of a 5" revolver, you should end up around 1600+/- fps in a 20" carbine. That's my experience shooting up to 180gr.
boolits in my Rossi M92.

[bobthenailer]

If you are crimping the rcbs-200 in the crimp grove for a col of approx 1.790 takes up no more powder space than a 158 gr boolet ! Ill bet the 180gr bullet takes up alot more powder space.
I have shot thousands of the RCBS-200 in my SS pistol and a few in my Marlin 1894 single loaded

Speer list there 200gr jacketed sil bullet at a col of 1.690. crimped in the crimp grove for a contender at start @13.0 gr of 296/H-110 @1,286 and a max of 14.5 gr @1,392 fps this is with a bullet slightly deeper seated and longer bearing surface. safe for only ss pistiols and large frame revolvers loaded to 45,000 cup should be ok in the ruger bolt rifle

Lyman list there 204 gr cast boolet #358315 with a col of 1.880 with a start load of H-110 13.9 gr @1359 fps and a max of 16.5 gr @1,515 fps.10" barrel.

With LG powder i have usually be able to get another 100 to 200 fps at safe pressures with the 357 mag.
And with a rifle barrel i would add between 200 to 500 fps.

In Midway's load map with the Speer 200 gr sil bullet loaded to a col of 1.690 show's a max load of lilgun @12.7 gr @1227 fps @35,000 psi with a 10" barrel.

[Tallbald]

Sorry but I can't add anything helpful at all here. What I'd like to do though is say it does my heart good to see another happy posting about the 77/357. I have one that languished in my safe for about 1 1/2 years untried. I bought it on a whim. An impulse buy through and through, I was overcome with the flush of having sold a couple other safe queens and saw the hard to find 77/357 on a LGS rack. Then it sat until in (forgive me folks) boredom one day until heading to the range I grabbed it from the locker to try. I was amazed with the light recoil, accuracy and overall handling of the little carbine using commercial jacketed 125 and 158 grain loads. I also credit the gun with kindling my enthusiasm for learning to cast slugs, because at the height of the .22 rimfire "shortage" I calculated I could cast and shoot the .357 cheaper than the elusive .22LR.
Completely at the other end of the loading spectrum, I cast for and load very light putterbutt rounds. With slugs from my Lee 358-125-RF mold sized to .358, and upper end Trail Boss loads I myself can shoot 5 shot groups of 3/4 to 1 inch at 50 yards. Slow loads I know, with the manual listing 900 to 1000 FPS from whatever test barrel they use, but they are fun fun fun and don't hurt to shoot long strings at a time.
Thanks for posting and please forgive my off-topic comments. Don

[GooseGestapo]

Thanks for the imput.
No T-rex but I have a lot of the 200gr FNGC's cast and on hand. In fact, I killed the first deer with that boolit Monday evening behind my house. I was suprised at the lack of expansion and damage to the deer. I shot it though the heart broad-side and broke the off-side femur. No blood or hair at all. Deer didn't bleed out the entrance or exit wound. I thought I'd missed it till I did due-diligence looking for it and found it lying just off the food-plot in the edge of the woods. Talk about eating up to the boolit hole!
Load was 34.5gr of H4895 from my 20"bbl Marlin M336 in .35Rem. Range was ~100yds give or take 10yds as I couldn't find exactly where the deer was standing when I shot it. From my stand, I had to shoot between trees and under/over limbs and recoil caused me to not see the impact. That, and I'd cranked the scope up to 9x to make sure the deer didn't have "nubs" or spikes. Bucks with less than 4pts on one side aren't legal in my county... Definitely have to "measure twice", cut once! to stay "legal".

I'll later do a work up for the 200gr in the .357. I don't plan to seat them "long" to the crimp groove. The few I've tried to this point I seated to fit the magazine.
For hunting, I'll probably stick with the 158 JSP at over 2,000fps. I "KNOW" they'll expand and leave a blood trail.

I'm going to have to cast some "soft" nose 200's. I've got a bunch of pure lead, and a couple of old Lee "small" pots. I'll use a ladle to pour the nose, and top-off with w/w +2% lead-free solder.