Let's talk sizer throughput

[38 Super Auto]

Ok, I have a Lyman 450 and I think I need to upgrade to a Star sizer. I am walking on the edge and need someone to push me over to Star...

I timed my pistol bullet sizing operation on a 450. I can do about 18/minute, but it's tense. I can comfortably do about 12-14/min over a hour long session while listening to Gordon Liddy :-D

What type of throughtput are you Star guys getting?

[miestro_jerry]

My Star is one action, push the bullet through the die and it drops out the bottm in to an awaiting box, Single action, instead the double action that the Lyman and RCBS sizers require.

Jerry

[38 Super Auto]

Jerry,

That brings up a question I have had. How fussy is the Star with respect to lubing? Is it easy to set up to completely fill the lube groove without getting lube on the base or nose of boolit?

[EDK]

The Star can be a PITA if you use a lot of different boolits of the same diameter; you have to do some adjusting to get things right. Nothing big; just a little tinkering.

Once it's set, you are good to go. Run a lubed boolit through it when things start to drag, pull the lube reservoir handle tight and keep rolling on. I have a heater, but seldom need it for LARS 50/50 Alox lube (Plug for a good guy and good product at a great price!!)

I just got a .432 sizer die and have to play with which holes to plug a little more. All I had to do was slightly move the punch adjustment and I am good on #431244, RANCH DOG 432 265 and the treasured 200 grain double ended wadcutter from GLL's group buy.

My LYMAN 4500 is set up with LARS's black powder lube for my 50/90 SHILOH SHARPS and a few other diameters if I get the urge to try black powder for COWBOY ACTION SHOOTING. Mostly I use it to seat gas checks and then on to the Star.

Maybe they did, but I can't recall anyone dumping a Star and going back to a RCBS or a LYMAN. Maybe tumble lube LEE boolits and ALOX and loaded as cast.

:Fire::cbpour::redneck:

[garandsrus]

The Star is great! It is very quick and does a great job. You can size up to 50 or so boolits without touching the lube handle due to the spring loading in the machine.

If a gas check is required, I seat it at the same time I size. You can record the depth measurement for each of the boolits you size and then adjust the punch to the same depth the next time you size the same boolit. It can be a hassle if you have different numbers of lube grooves for different boolits, but many pistol boolits seem to have one lube groove.

John

[mtgrs737]

I have three Lyman 450's and a Star, if I have a lot of sizing to do the Star gets the nod as it is many times quicker. The down side is that the dies cost twice as much as the Lyman dies do and they are harder to find. Also there is that plugging the lube holes thing on the sizer die to deal with. On the plus side the Star only needs a large and small flat punch if you size nose first. You should be able to triple your output or more on a Star. :castmine:

[lathesmith]

Wow, if you can comfortably average 12-14 per minute with a Lyman sizer, you would flywith a Star! 500/hr was about absolute max I could ever achieve with my Lyman, and my arms and back would be aching at that rate. With the Star, the number of arm/hand motions is chopped more than in half, allowing you to size much faster and more comfortably.
That said, there is a place for a Lyman-type sizer for some guys. If you use multiple boolit designs in one caliber with lots of grooves, AND these are fairly low-volume, you will probably go for the Lyman. The Star will work OK under this scenario, but you will need multiple dies to make it happen quickly. I make my own dies, so this isn't a problem, but if you don't it can get quite expensive.
Where the Star really shines is with deep,single- or dual- lube groove-boolits. You can really crank these out in a hurry, with excellent results. Since this constitutes nearly all of my usage, I greatly favor the Star over the Lyman.
lathesmith

[garandsrus]

One other thing to mention is that the Star won't get lube on a bevel base if the punch is adjusted properly. You also won't have any lube on the gas check.

The star is equivalent to a Lee push through sizer that also lubes the boolit as it passes through.

John

[45nut]

Lets not dismiss the other option, the SAECO. After using a RCBS and a Lyman 45 and ending up with the the older stepped style dies in both that shaved off one side of my boolits I happened upon a SAECO, the difference is notable and the geometry of the SAECO feels better as well.

My nickles worth.

[wheelgunner]

I've got my Star set up with a heater, air lube cylinder and a feeder that was made by a machine shop (not Magma) that went out of business. It spits out lubed bullets at an amazing rate. I elongated the feed tube so I can fit 35 or so bullets in it between fillings. Never really timed myself but I would guess about 900-1000 an hour or thereabouts.

I've talked to a mechanical engineer friend about build a power drive system for it which may come to fruition. Then I'd just have to keep the lube and bullet feed tubes full.

[runfiverun]

i bought and cut a bunch of clear tubing that fits in the boolit feeder
these hold between 50-75 boolits each put a new one on top pull the cotter pin and keep going.
i do about 1000 per session about 1-1/2 to 2 hrs i put a new stick of lube about evry 500
boolits and have a smoke go wash my hands empty the drawer outgo get a soda then finish
what i am doing if i can get someone to inspect and load the tubes while i am going
i will do 2 or 3 k in a easy days time

runfiverun

[Lee W]

I keep count of the bullets by putting 25 at a time into a small bin. When four bins are full, I dump them into a box.
I do the 25 boolits as fast as I can put the next one in. Not quite one a second, but close.
I have done 2100 in an afternoon.

[bobthenailer]

the speed varies as to the hardness of the bullet and how much oversize the bullet is , my fastest time ever was 1000 9mm 125 gr rn sized to 358 dia in a little over 1/2 hr very little effort to push through die! ii would probly been tired after 1 hour at this rate , this is with a standard star with only a roller handel operating leaver

[DUKE NUKEM]

Ok, I have a Lyman 450 and I think I need to upgrade to a Star sizer. I am walking on the edge and need someone to push me over to Star...

I timed my pistol bullet sizing operation on a 450. I can do about 18/minute, but it's tense. I can comfortably do about 12-14/min over a hour long session while listening to Gordon Liddy :-D

What type of throughtput are you Star guys getting?

If your sizer comes on the market and has a heater please feel free to PM me sir.

[TAWILDCATT]

my take on the Star/Magma is it is excelent if you do one or two bullet cal or types.
I have used Stars dedicated to one bullet/cal.45 swc and 38 wadcutter.they were great.the Star was made to take dies specificly for one bullet design.all the rest of the lubers are based on Lyman design.the Redding/Saeco uses dies based on the Mepos die.:coffee:----[smilie=1:----:Fire:

[hawkeye1]

EDK mentioned something about plugging some holes in the sizing die. Is this recommended or normal for lube/sizers? I am having trouble getting my RCBS Lube a matic to not let the bullet go down so deep. I get lube ahead of the front driving band with the adjustment rod all the way up. Do I need to plug some holes, and how do I go about this?

good shooting

[mtgrs737]

hawkeye1,

The Lyman/RCBS lube dies incorporate a ground pin that has a close fit to the Inside Diameter of the die. This pin will cover the lube holes in the die for the holes that are not needing to be exposed for lube to fill the grooves of the bullet style that you are sizing. You need to adjust the depth of stroke on your lubersizer to completely size the bullet and line up the holes in the die with the grease grooves in the boolit starting with the top hole and working your way down. If you don't need the bottom hole to line up with a grease groove then let the pin keep it covered so that no lube is applied under the boolit as it sets on the pin. Also pressing the boolit too far into the die may allow a hole to be above the shoulder of the boolit and apply grease to the nose area of the boolit.

The Star dies do not have a pin in the center because of the through put type of function. You must plug the lube holes with soft lead shot when more holes are not required to line up with grooves in the boolit. The depth that the boolit is pressed into the die is critical so that it will line up with the open lube holes in the die at the bottom of the presses stroke. Star makes the pluging of the uneeded holes easy as they are double step drilled with the larger diameter to the outside of the die. Shot is forced into the larger outer hole and swaged into the smaller hole to make a tight fit. You have to drill out the shot if you want to open the hole for a different lube pattern boolit, as in going from a single lube groove to a two lube groove boolit. Once set up a Star rocks on as they require only one handling to feed the boolit into the machine. :castmine:

[Bret4207]

I don't have a Star, but I love my Lee system! (Someone had to throw the wrench in the gears!)

[Dale53]

The best production that I and my two sons achieved was over a week end. I cast the bullets and my two boys (age 12 and 14) sized and boxed 13,000 #68 .45 SWC's. I never bettered that. The Star was the champ of that weekend. I was using two Saeco 4 cavity moulds. I had two lead pots going (a 20 lb Saeco plain lead pot to pre-melt) and a RCBS 22 lb pot (bottom cast, of course:-D).


Dale53

[JSH]

I don't have a Star, but am leaning towards one. I have pretty much narrowed most of my boolits down to 30, 35 and 45 caliber. I do however tend to shoot a lot of different designs. That looks to be the major problem for me to over come.
As to adjustments I would think some kind of repeatable micro measurment setting would be in line so one could record the settings? I say or ask this with out much knowledge on how the setting works.
Jeff

[Cherokee]

JSH - Yes you can record certain measurements for ease of repeatability.

"When you get a bullet in the die where the lube grooves are lined up with the holes you are going to use, raise the bullet punch all the way to the top, and measure with a calipers the distance from the top of the die to the punch. Write it down. When you go to set it up again later (after removing the die, doing another bullet type, etc) you will have a reference point for that bullet to get the depth right. You put the die in the press, raise the punch, and adjust it in or out to match the distance from the measurement you wrote down."

In my opinion, there is always room for the Lyman/RCBS. I started with a Lyman #45, then a #450, now a #4500, plus the Star. All 4 sizers get use.

[JSH]

Sounds like me short the 4500 and the Star. I have an old 45 that is what I used when I first tested the waters. It worked fine and seemed to be in better working shape than most 45's I hear about. I have not used it since I got the 450, NIB for cheap.
What really makes me mad is my first miss of a Star. I was at one of the big GS's in KC. There was a lot of realoding stuff there that year, cheap. Redding dies that looked to be new, $5-10 per set. I loaded up on those for stuff I don't even own,lol.
I walked around a bit and saw this funny looking thing. Looked like a walnut cracker to me???
Buddy of mine was with me and we had gotten seperated. I saw him about an hour after we had been there. He asked did you see that Star? I was just ????? WTH are you talking about? He explained what it was. I didn't have a clue. He did ask the gent that had it and he new it was some kind of sizer but not sure for what. My friend new what it was. Asked the guy how much.
$60 and all these bushings and some other stuff to go with it some kind of electric plate. I all but ran back over there. You guessed it, it was gone.
If I live to be a hundred it will never happen again. My friend said there was at least 20 sizing dies and several punches and a bunch of lube with it. Makes me sick to think about it,lol.
Jeff

[BruceB]

My collection of Lyman 450 machines suits me just fine.

There's little doubt that the Star offers much-increased production rates over the Lymans IF, repeat, IF, the caster is using a limited number of designs and wants large numbers of those designs.

In my case, I want relatively-few (generally a thousand or so) bullets of MANY different designs and diameters, and trying to get set up for all the various combinations in a Star is too much expense and hassle. If I was still shooting Bullseye competitively, it's a sure bet that I'd have a Star on the bench. As it is, I don't need or want one.

Once again, for maximizing productiion we must study our hand motions. I don't have a handy figure for my rate on a 450, but there are some things I do to keep the rate up. For one thing, I keep my right hand on the operating handle all the time, unless gaschecks are being installed. The lube pressure wrench is tweaked with the left hand for each bullet, after the bullet is pushed down into the die. The next bullet is picked-up, quickly inspected, and the sized bullet is brought up out of the die.

I have a good-sized tray (cookie sheet)projecting from the bench face below the sizer, and the finished bullet is simply tipped out of the machine by the side of my hand to fall into the tray. This saves considerable time in handling, because now the left hand is immediately free to place the next bullet in the die, and continue the process.

Sequence:

-push the unsized bullet down into the die

-tweak the lube pressure

-pick up and inspect the next bullet

-push the sized bullet up out of the die and tip it out of the machine into the tray

Repeat.

Lube-sizing is also the perfect occasion for sipping a cold brewski while contemplating the state of the universe and the decrepitude and sleazology of Democrat politics.

[Sundogg1911]

I have 3 stars and a Lyman 450. I still use my Lyman for some of my multi-lube groove, and flat base boolits. It's a great machine, but no where near the speed of a Star. The Star is a little slower to get dialed in, but once you're in you can just lube away.

[twotrees]

Y'All got me thinking ( Thats dangerous) If I was to make a plate like the lube pressure plate ( With "O" ring) that was just clearance fit to the shaft. Drop that on top of the lube put in a sutable coil spring, then the threaded pressure plate over that.

Once you pressurized the coil spring, then it would power the lube and you would only need to re-pressureize the lube after you had used 1/8- 1/4 of the lube.

Hummmmmm, where is my "O" ring cutting tool for that lathe??


Does it have a chance??

TwoTrees

[EasyEd]

I have a Star and two RCBS/Lachmillers. The Star is for plain-base pistol bullets, and they fly through the lube/sizer. The RCBS/LM's are for GC pistol and rifle boolits. I sometime, depending, set the GC prior to s/l'ing, sometime during the s/l'ing. I don't want the possible hassle of trying to set the GC's on the Star. And I really would rather s/l them base-first, rather than nose-first, even if Star/Magma suggests otherwise.

EasyEd
USAF Ret
NRA Patron
O&U

[TAWILDCATT]

I used an allen bolt and nuts to set the ram.adjust the nuts to set length of bolt.
then next time use this gage to adjust ram for depth.
Star dies are made bullet specific.