My 2 headed monster press spews out 2 moa 30 cal for $0.13 each

[stephen m weiss]

Yeah so I am a newb and I know it. But I got a set up I am proud of. Throw your stones/drop your pearls of wisdom, I listen and think to be sure.

So, the elements of the system so far:

* A lee load master progressive press, 308 win, 5 stations are: lee pistol powder autodisk, lee case flair tool, lee pro autodisk with corn grits (cow), bullet seating, factory crimp.
* Home made interior ballistics spreadsheet optimized for 30-50% powder loads with whatever powder the market provides, special inputs for calculating results based on filler.
* Cast ww'ish 30 call 160 grain Lee alox lubed bullets, bare base.
* deprime and case prep are done manually, sizing is on a single stage, priming is manual.

The load is 17 grains of Accurate 2495 or 15 of Alliant 1200r, 26 grains of hominy grits, which is a compressed load, so the powder stays back at the primer where it belongs. It runs fast and fairly neat, with grits spilling a bit and needing blowing out of the press frequently. I am thinking of mounting a vibrating hair clipper to the grits autoloader to make it load smoother. I have to tap the grits hopper at the bottom of stroke to make sure the cylinder fills perfectly. I like grits because my momma's name is Dixie.. enough said... heh

I am not worried about ringing or solidifying of the grits. The load makes about 18ksi peak pressure, whilst the carbohydrate grits have about 200 psi shear strength, and not much toughness. There is no way that material will plug the chamber or barrel. The case is nearly sealed, perfectly at the bullet with the factory crimp squishing the brass into the lead with wax as a sealer, no sliding to create leak paths. The primer is not a perfect seal, being a slide press, but is small and remote from the grits, closer to teh powder. So, there is NEARLY no way the carbohydrate can swell to create an overpressure. Finished bullets are stored in plastic bags, so additinal sealing is implied.

This system is safer than manual fill systems, and safer than pistol powder systems because a double fill is difficult and immediately evident as the measured grits volume cannot be added due to lack of case volume. Also, no powder cases are obvious since the grits are not evident in the case neck. So a stuck bullet from lack of powder is very unlikely.

I tested the load last weekend, albeit with rice for 2moa results, and about 1450 fps. I am testing about 90 tomorrow. so if they suck, I will fess up and eat my hat. I am studying the effects of mag vs rifle primers, and also fast rifle vs slow rifle powder.

I am still not really happy with the burn model on the spreadsheet. It's going to get more adaptable (complicated) but I have a nice analytical tool created for calculating and analyzing many different loads at once and optimizing the model.

Thx for inputs in advance,

smw

[wmitty]

stephen m

Please explain the advantage of using the grits at the velocity at which you are shooting the un-gaschecked Lee 160 grain boolit. Also, could you explain how the burn model is used in analyzing these loads? Have you considered using a powder such as WC 870 or WC 872 as a filler rather than the inert filler?

[stephen m weiss]

Since I only have alliant 1200r and accurate 2495 powders, and dont plan on buying more at this time, I want to be able to shoot my cast bullets effectively. I found that when using these powders at low enough charge to remain accurate with bare base bullets, I was leaving a lot of unburned powder, which got all over, and was not necessarily safe. Additionally, I hate wasting about half the powder with each shot.. it's the cheapskate in me. I also hated taking the time to stuff by hand a filler in. Using the autodisk to put in just the right amount takes a fraction of a second, because my 5 stage press is doing 5 things at once, for about a second per pull. Loading new cases and bullets is the most time consuming part.

The burn model is basically like quickload but home made on a spreadsheet. It is custom to my powder, and works accurately( about 10% repeatable errors that I have to hand correct at this time.) at 30% fill values, and has special entries for inert filler amount, density and fluffyness. That way, I can know how much powder and how much grits will fit my case, know the load is safe, and will stay under 1500 fps and stay accurate. It also allows me to calculate ahead of time that 15 grains of 1200r creates the same velocity as 17.5 grains of 2495. The 1200r even costs a little less, so for this loadout, it sure makes sense. The manufacturer only rates it for using on full loads of 55 grain and under 223's. So, the stuff doesnt really jump off the shelf. And.. well it is pretty explosive stuff and is easy to create an overpressure. It is very dense, at .065 cc/grain, and pretty fast, about 50% faster burning than 2495. So having accurate analytical results for me was key to getting just the perfect bare base load. It's possible that I just love analyzing stuff, so took that route rather than spending more time doing careful work ups. lol

I dont know what wc870 and 872 are. I thought I had recognised the name but my search comes up empty now.

[Thumbcocker]

Somewhere around 6.0 of red dot with no filler might be worth looking at.

[stephen m weiss]

Oh, we shot about 80 and stayed at around 2moa. It was really windy but I dont think we were getting but 1 inch drift at 50 yards. Some guy shooting a 45-70 at 100 yds couldnt figure out why his zero was moving all over hahaha.

A negative with this load style is the grits pepper the crud outta my chrony. It's only like $65 so less than my time is worth.. but I really need to get some armor for it! On my land I just hide the disply behind a thick beer box bit, but I can't approach it at the shooting range because it's befind the firing line from me.

[Wayne Smith]

WC870 and 872 are very slow powders taken from or made for the 40mm cannon.

[C. Latch]

I can't approach it at the shooting range because it's befind the firing line from me.

Cane pole with a string tied to a slab of cardboard? Leave the string long enough that you can position the cardboard then let the tip of the pole rest on the ground or on the table the chrony sits on?

[wmitty]

stephen m

Should you be interested in increasing the velocity of your loads without using gas checks you might consider paper patching the Lee boolit. I haven't tried a filler behind a paper patched slug, but the reason I mentioned the two slow burners was due to the use of these powders in paper patching.

[wmitty]

stephen m

Should you be interested in increasing the velocity of your loads without using gas checks you might consider paper patching the Lee boolit. I haven't tried a filler behind a paper patched slug, but the reason I mentioned the two slow burners was due to the use of these powders in paper patching. You might find Nobade's post on reactive filler in the paper patching threads interesting.

[stephen m weiss]

Heh, good idea C. Latch. I may try that if my oj container clear plastic is not up to the grits lol.

Ya know, I am interested in paper patching, but havent figured out how to do it for a second or two per bullet. I plan to read the paper patching section soonish.

[stephen m weiss]

I did try out taping a vibrating hair trimmer to the grits feeder. I got precise and repeatable fills every time without having to tap anything. I checked my powder fill levels, and they were maximum and consistent too. Haha, this is an old trick from my manufacturing past. It works here too. This should be noted for anyone who is using automatic powder fill.