Need a little help with paper patching my 45 caliber muzzle loaders please.

[oldracer]

Please read the very long winded writeup I have just put in the black powder paper patching section to see what I was doing yesterday when I tried my first serious attempt at the shooting of the paper patched bullets in both my Gibbs and the Green Mtn. barreled copy I made this past winter. I did some measurements with cerosafe to see what the barrel internals actually were as I have been going by the numbers from Pedersoli and also Pecatonica River where I bought the other barrel. I measured the last 2 inches of the barrel.

Here are the numbers:

Gibbs = 6 grooves that are round edged, bore = 0.450 and groove diameter = 0.455, twist is 1 in 18.
Green Mtn = 8 grooves that are sharp edged, bore = 0.450 and groove diameter = 0.457 same twist.

According to the folks at Pedersoli their barrels are made that way and the dimensions match their specs

I have read the sticky at the top of the page here, Wright's book and most all the references I can find so I think the issue is the wrapping sticking to the bullets but I have to wait until next week to see. Any ideas or other things to check would help out greatly. Thank you.

[idahoron]

I read the post on the other page. The first thing I would ask is if the barrel has lead fouling in it? I am not the kind of guy that goes back and forth. I either use paper or I don't shoot. A friend of mine had trouble with his barrel until he stripped the old lead out of it. Not saying yours has it but look. Next do NOT lube the bullet. The lee alox may have also been the problem. If you want a pinch of lube use chapstick on the outside of the paper as you load.
The lube left in the barrel from the naked bullets could be an issue as well. I also use a WAY over sized wad. I like them to to be at least .530 for my 45. I like them to pucker a bit when I push them in. Also I use bore butter on the wads. I like them to have just enough that when I push the wad in the barrel the lube helps keep it straight. I don't want so much lube that it compromises the paper or powder.

How hard is your lead? If it were me I would be using lead that is at least 8 to 9 BHN. If someone said they would use a bit harder I would agree. Those are long and heavy. They would do well to be a pinch harder than pure.
Finally not all bullets work in every gun. It sounds like you paper patched some of the ones that did work. That doesn't guarantee that they should work. What is your rate of twist?

[johnson1942]

oldracer, see your pm/s

[oldracer]

Thanks for the info Roger. There is no lead in the barrel and I check it after I clean it from a range trip. My normal lube is Doug Knoell's which I used in the cartridge loads and also never had a leading problem. I have scrubbed the lube off with Dawn and hot water and wrapped the bullets so next Tuesday I'll try again. If I have time I will mold up some additional straight sided bullets and try the single wrap method also to see what happens.

I was a bit perplexed since the lubed bullets shot great and the patched ones were like a shot gun so I figured the powder load, wad, cap and load sequence are all okay. I did not mention but I use one of those very expensive Pedersoli drop tubes to add the powder after a wet (Balistol/water) and two dry patches when shooting. After wiping I insert the tube, listen for the metal on metal sound, add the powder then add the wad and the weight of the rod pushes it down with no compression. Bullet slides down pretty much under its own weight but I have the rod (with tape mark) on it to make sure it went all the way down.

The guy spotting for me suggested I bring the target into 50 yards which I think I will do as it reduces scattering effects.