First Shotshell Press-MEC or RCBS? [Archive]

Scrounger

09-20-2005, 12:37 AM

For thirty some years while I was shooting trap and skeet I reloaded with MECs, first the 600s, then Sizemasters, then a 9000G progressive. Learned I got better loads and less problems from the Sizemaster, so I went back to it. Sold my shotguns and all shotshell reloading stuff when I moved up here. Recently bought a couple of shotguns to shoot claybirds in the desert. My first thought was to reload. Then I found the WalMart sells 12 and 20 ga AAs for $4.95 a box. I can get a $1.25 a box for the empties. Don't think I can reload for $4.00 a box. If I could, my labor would be worth about 10 cents an hour. That's my story and I'm sticking to it...

BruceB

09-20-2005, 01:26 AM

I'm with Scrounger on this one. There's a dusty 600 Jr. in my shop, but it hasn't loaded a round in years. Walmart sells decent plastic-cased loads for target and field at about $4.00 per box locally, 12 or 20 gauge, and it's just not worth the effort (for me, at least) to stock components and take the time away from IMPORTANT loading, meaning cast boolits.

Back in 1959, the first year I could legally hunt by myself in Ontario, I asked my Dad for the money for a box of paper-cased, felt-wad field loads, the lowest-cost ones available. He winced at the price of $3.13 (Canadian $, and at that time the Cdn dollar was higher-valued than the U.S. buck.) Corrected for inflation, I'd bet that represents about $25 today, and we are buying far better loads for a small fraction of that old price!

Dang.... I just found an inflation calculator on the 'net, and ONE US dollar in 1959 corresponds to $6.38 today, so my estimate (or W.A.G.) wasn't all that far off!

Shotshells are just fodder, to me. They don't have any of the intrigue and experimentation which are attached to CB casting, loading, and shooting.

David R

09-20-2005, 06:30 AM

The only problem with the store bought is they are cheap shells. I can load 20 guage for around $3.00 a box but I use magnum shot and load what works in my gun. My handloads seem to pattern better than the ones I buy.

In other words, My $3.00 a box shells shoot like the $6.00 or $8.00 a box.

I would only purchase pre loaded non toxic shot.

To answer your question, I had a LEE, it was junk, then I got a MEC, love it and used it for years. Never used the RCBS. MEC is THE shot shell reloader.

Only MY opinion
David

NVcurmudgeon

09-20-2005, 11:48 AM

Bruce and Scrounger, My former club in CA was a holy shrine to trap shooting, even hosting State level tournaments. We untouchable rifle and pistol shooters were relegated to the status of in-laws with loathsome social diseases. On my semi-annual forays to the trap field I got a perverse enjoyment from dropping fired factory load empties and making mental bets with myself as to how long they would stay there.

I'm with Scrounger on this one. There's a dusty 600 Jr. in my shop, but it hasn't loaded a round in years. Walmart sells decent plastic-cased loads for target and field at about $4.00 per box locally, 12 or 20 gauge, and it's just not worth the effort (for me, at least) to stock components and take the time away from IMPORTANT loading, meaning cast boolits.

Back in 1959, the first year I could legally hunt by myself in Ontario, I asked my Dad for the money for a box of paper-cased, felt-wad field loads, the lowest-cost ones available. He winced at the price of $3.13 (Canadian $, and at that time the Cdn dollar was higher-valued than the U.S. buck.) Corrected for inflation, I'd bet that represents about $25 today, and we are buying far better loads for a small fraction of that old price!

Dang.... I just found an inflation calculator on the 'net, and ONE US dollar in 1959 corresponds to $6.38 today, so my estimate (or W.A.G.) wasn't all that far off!

Shotshells are just fodder, to me. They don't have any of the intrigue and experimentation which are attached to CB casting, loading, and shooting.

C1PNR

09-20-2005, 06:42 PM

Used to shoot in a Company sponsored Trap League here in Boise about 25 years or more ago. One of our fond family memories is the reloading of shot shells on the MEC 600 Jr. with the "help" of our kids. They even mention it from time to time.

Bought "reclaimed" shot from the club and powder in large lot group buys. Pretty cheap entertainment. I'd buy a few boxes of new AA Trap or Peters Blue Magic (I think) at the start of the year and reload them all season.

Willbird

09-20-2005, 07:28 PM

If your real tight you don't even need to load a whole box of shells, and you can pick up wads at the range and use them again (I have read anyway)

I vote for the 600 JR press...........a bag of shot lasts a long long time for casual hunting use, and wallyworld seems to think 20 gauge is at it's best with #8 or #7-1/2 shot, I kind of like #4 myself.

Bill

Scrounger

09-21-2005, 08:43 PM

I loaded shotgun shells for 30 plus years, and for most of that time, if not all, it was a money saver. But a month ago when I bought a shotgun and thought to start shooting claybirds in the desert, I re-did the math. Here's why I decided to buy the shells at WalMart instead of reloading. This is for 20 gauge, 7/8 oz loads.

Primers $0.02
Powder $0.06
Wad $0.02
Shot $0.05
Cost of shell $0.15 each, $3.75 a box
I'm estimating shot at $20 a bag with tax. There are taxes and spillage on all the stuff. Buying AAs and selling the empties for a nickel, it's a break even proposition. Nothing for my labor or to amortize the equiptment; not to mention acquiring the empties to reload. I'm happy with my decision, one of the few good ones I've made lately...

RugerFan

09-22-2005, 12:05 AM

I agree with David R here. If you're happy shooting the low brass cheapies from Walmart that's fine. But if you want the high performance stuff, you will save noticeable coin by reloading. I have a 600 jr thats about 17 years old and my Dad has a Mec 700 that's probably twice that old and both work flawlessly. I love anything RCBS, but as Johnch eluded to, Mec bushings etc will be much easier to come by. You will not regret buying a Mec.

beagle

09-22-2005, 01:03 PM

Go with the MEC.

I bought a MEC250 in the early 60s and later a 20 guage conversion kit. It's still turning out shells for #2 son.

I've upgraded to a MEC 600 (I think it is).

Surprisingly, parts and pubs are still availble for the 250 from MEC. Can't beat service like that. I'm RCBS on metallics but MEC on shotshells./beagle

BruceB

09-22-2005, 02:39 PM

One factor I forgot to mention in my non-reloading of shotshells is that I don't presently own a steel-shot-capable gun, as all my shotguns are older European side-by-side doubles which will not tolerate steel, 'specially some nice Berettas. Even my daughter's 20-gauge Ithaca M37 Featherweight is of pre-steel vintage and is not steel-compatible.This means that on the rare occasions when I do get out for waterfowl, I have to shoot the bismuth $1.80 per ROUND shotshells.

An 8-pound bottle of bismuth shot costs around $95, not a misprint, $95! Also, as time passes my feet increasingly won't tolerate long periods of standing or walking due to diminishing circulation. Both of these factors (cost and feet) mean that my need for "good" shotshells is just about non-existent, and the Walmart cheapies are perfectly adequate for the informal clay-birding that I do.

I dearly wish that other shooters who don't reload their fired shotshells would at least PICK UP THE EMPTIES and put them in the garbage. Thousands of slowly degrading empty shotshells make an ugly bright-colored mess of a range.

felix

09-22-2005, 02:52 PM

Bruce, yes indeed, pick up the empty shot shells and throw them randomly out to 80-150 yards! Make sure they all get hidden from view except for a spot or two, so a 20 power scope can see enough of them to target. ... felix

RugerFan

09-22-2005, 06:15 PM

Bruce,
Yes, the "Walmart cheapies" do have their place (I wasn't trying to disparage their use). I used to buy low brass Federals quite frequently until I started reloading shot shells. They are fine for clays and some hunting applications. But when you step up to loading 2 3/4" shells for turkey (say 1 1/2 oz of #2s or #4s) or you want a stout load for pheasants etc, buying the appropriate high brass shells cost noticeably more than rolling your own.

As far as hulls are concerned, I RARELY buy shot shell hulls. I can usually pick up all I need at a local range for free. Friends that don't reload will give me their empties as well. This saves a fair amount on the cost of components.

-Todd

NVcurmudgeon

09-23-2005, 01:08 AM

Bruce, I'm in a near-identical shotgunning situation to yours. My only shotgun is a 1972 Ithaca-SKB in 3"20. Can't shoot steel, and my best marsh wading years were 1960-1975. SWMBO no longer alllows hunting of quail, doves, or cottontails now that she has seen their babies in our yard. That leaves chukars for which I'm too lazy, and limited sagehen opportunities. My shotgun mostly goes informal desert clay busting now, for which cheap low base 8s are SECOND choice. First choice is free reloads from Duke.

One factor I forgot to mention in my non-reloading of shotshells is that I don't presently own a steel-shot-capable gun, as all my shotguns are older European side-by-side doubles which will not tolerate steel, 'specially some nice Berettas. Even my daughter's 20-gauge Ithaca M37 Featherweight is of pre-steel vintage and is not steel-compatible.This means that on the rare occasions when I do get out for waterfowl, I have to shoot the bismuth $1.80 per ROUND shotshells.

An 8-pound bottle of bismuth shot costs around $95, not a misprint, $95! Also, as time passes my feet increasingly won't tolerate long periods of standing or walking due to diminishing circulation. Both of these factors (cost and feet) mean that my need for "good" shotshells is just about non-existent, and the Walmart cheapies are perfectly adequate for the informal clay-birding that I do.

I dearly wish that other shooters who don't reload their fired shotshells would at least PICK UP THE EMPTIES and put them in the garbage. Thousands of slowly degrading empty shotshells make an ugly bright-colored mess of a range.

9.3X62AL

09-23-2005, 10:46 AM

I'm with David R on this question--the higher quality (harder) shot patterns better, I believe. In 12 and 20 gauge, I use 1-1/4 oz and 1 oz loads respectively, and those do much better jobs afield than the "trap field refugee" loss-leader loads from Wally World. There is a DEEP cost savings when reloading those "high base" 12s and 20s as well as the 28 gauge and 410 shells, and 16 gauge almost requires reloading these days. You also get a wider selection of shot sizes when you re-stuff your own......1-1/4 oz 12 gauge shells in #9 shot are a little tough to find.

Scrounger

09-23-2005, 11:33 AM

WalMart and K-Mart and the other big sellers also sell heavy game loads at a good price, usually in the fall. After the season they can sometimes be had at a surprisingly low price. Now there is no doubt at all that you can load better loads, custom tailored to your guns and your needs. And if you enjoy making them, THAT is the only justification you need... But from an economics standpoint; How many boxes of hunting loads do you actually use HUNTING every year? One for most people, maybe THREE for a lucky few. If you save a buck a box on your loads (remember, WalMart has those special runs of hunting loads for less than $5 a box. I bought a box of 6s for under $3 last summer), you will pay for your equiptment in a hundred years or so... [smilie=l: See above: If you enjoy doing it, that is reason enough, but saving money just won't wash.

RugerFan

09-23-2005, 01:09 PM

Scrounger,
I can see we can go back and forth on this issue without end. Basically it's a "to each his own" proposition. I do take exception to a couple of your statements. Buying ammo AFTER the season on sale does very little good if you need something RIGHT NOW. In the middle of a hunting season stuff happens and you may need some loads you hadn't counted on or the previous "sale" didn't have what you needed (Besides, buying ammo on sale is not a given that you can always count on). So you bought #6s for under $3.00. You don't state the dram, but I know for a fact that Federal sells the low brass/low performance stuff in shot size 6 (If you were speaking high brass game loads, I stand corrected). As for the number of boxes most people use (You said 1-3), I have no idea (maybe a gun rag has done a survey on that). That would be very interesting to know, but I am sure there is a significant number (not sure about "most") that shoot much more than 3. For me personally it depends on where I have lived. While in Alaska I went through several boxes a year on ptarmigan, grouse, and snowshoe hare. In Texas I shudder to think of how may boxes my son and I went through on doves (for the record, shots where we hunted tended to be long so I loaded "heavy" to keep the patterns full at the longer distances. The low brass cheapies would not have fared well). For me usage varies by location, but my Mec is always handy to tailor ammo to my needs. It has taken me considerably less than 100 years to pay for my shot shell reloader and I'm sure I'm in good company. It absolutely is cost effective for the thousands like me that shoot a lot (If you don't shoot shot shells much you are right, it may not be economical. But let's not make a blanket statement). Copy and paste your last post on a shot gunning forum and see what kind of response you get.

Having said all that, I hope we can just agree to disagree. I'm not trying to be abrasive or get on any nerves, but rather just making a point.

Scrounger

09-23-2005, 02:53 PM

Sure, we can agree to disagree; like I said, if you want to do it, that's reason enough. For me, I figured I had done it enough already; I can get by nicely on WalMart's "cheap" AAs, probably the most popular ammo in the U S. Check the ballistics, they come in several varieties, and some of them are equal to the popular Dove Loads (1 oz, 1300 fps) sold for $4 a box every year. And you might want to pattern your bumped up dove loads; going beyond 1300-1350 in velocity usually has the unfortunate result in opening patterns up quite a bit. Makes more sense to increase shot weight and keep velocity the same; fuller pattern and the leads are the same as what you are used to. And high brass? The heighth of the brass has never been meaningful beyond indicating a more powerful load was loaded in that shell. Low brass cases like AA can be loaded just as heavy as high brass. You ought to see the pot shoot loads some guys make up for their informal competitions. I used to have a load with 1-1/2 oz of 6s going out at almost 1400 fps. Your shoulder knew you'd pulled the trigger on that one... :shock: I'm not telling you not to reload (not that you'd listen if I did), I'm only saying that it can't be justified from a money point of view. I'm done. :smile:

Willbird

09-23-2005, 04:51 PM

Well for lots of uses reclaimed shot is fine, and I am not such a hunter that I need more than a dozen shells a season, but I want 4's and 6's in 20 gauge and wally here had not a single box of them for any price.

Bill

Newtire

09-23-2005, 05:01 PM

MEC 600 Jr. makes shells so nice, they look better than factory, especially in .410.

BruceB

09-23-2005, 05:38 PM

Yo, guys....

What I'm seeing here is not disagreement, but rather an interesting discussion of our varying circumstances. It's very illuminating, to read about how we wildly-assorted shooters approach this part of our (non-casting) shooting hobby. You oughta see how I make blackpowder shells for my Olde English damascus doubles!

One thing I want to mention is that my MEC 600 Jr is equipped with one of the adjustable "Universal" metering bars, and lemme tell y'all, this is a wonderful device. If you intend to shoot different recipes of shotshells for different purposes, this device whips the daylights out of having the limited variety of bushings that most folks use for changing the amounts of their components. I suspect that the adjustable bar may be a bit too complex for the "average" shotshell loader, who pulls a recipe out of the book, inserts the correct bushings, and commences crunching out shotshells. For one thing, one MUST have a good scale to safely use the device, and right there we'll lose a lot of folks who might otherwise try the adjustable metering bar. For those of us already engaged in shooting CBs, this of course is a dead-simple adaptation of our existing scales.

I believe the last price I saw for such a bar was about $35.00, but whatever the price, I think it's worthwhile.

StarMetal

09-23-2005, 07:07 PM

Well I might as well throw in my two cents. First off I don't like shotguns, but I got one out of the necessitidy for small game hunting which I love. Then I got into the H&R heavy barrel rifled scoped single shot shotguns loading the Lyman wasp waist slug. Well I didn't want a dedicated shotshell loader so I bought a RCBS 20 ga die set that fits my Rockchucker press. It's not fast, in fact it's like reloading rifle cartridges, but I'm not a skeet shooter nor do I have a machine shotgun. The RCBS turns out some really fine reloaded shell. It does me for what little amount I shoot my shotgun now adays.

Joe

Scrounger

09-23-2005, 07:35 PM

I'm not familiar with these dies, Joe. It works just like rifle reloading? Interesting. I'd like to see that just out of curiosity...

Rod B

09-23-2005, 08:47 PM

I have two MEC 600 JRs & a MEC9000G. They have all worked well & produced quality reloads.

Rod. ;)

StarMetal

09-23-2005, 10:19 PM

Art,

I'll try o get some pictures of it, but yes like rifle dies my the main one die body takes parts to make it doe the functions of various dies. That is resizing, decapping, cappining and crimping.

Joe

RugerFan

09-24-2005, 12:01 AM

Scrounger,
When I said I used "heavy" dove loads, heavy refered to shot not powder. (which made your point moot). I find it interesting that you choose to critisize my loading when you had NO idea what went into those shells. I used the terms "high brass" and "low brass" to differentiate between the factory loaded economy dove loads from the higher dram stuff. Obviously you can hand load low brass hulls with a potent recipe. That wasn't the point. I'm familiar with AAs. I don't recall seeing factory loads in anything but trap, skeet, and dove loads (shot size 6 or smaller). That doesn't help a pheasant hunter that wants 1 3/8 oz of # 5s. Price a case of heavy pheasant loads and compare to what hand loading would cost. My point is that reloading shot shells IS economical for some, but not necessarily all.

waksupi

09-24-2005, 12:07 AM

I would suggest you both go to the post I made yesterday, on the ML forum about smoothbores. What Vic states there, goes for modern shotguns, also.

Scrounger

09-24-2005, 12:34 AM

http://www.grafs.com/ammo/391

doc25

09-24-2005, 03:50 PM

I'm thinking about buying one of the Lee presses to load slugs with. We don't have much access to tactical slugs here and I figured this would be a cheap and handy way to do this. If I need a box of this or that every once in a while I can pop it out as well. For busting clays I'll stick to the factory fodder. Any comments on the Lee for making about 400-500 rds a year?

RugerFan

09-24-2005, 11:51 PM

Doc,
See post #5. David R had a Lee and thought it was junk. I've never used one, but have examined a Lee Load All and thought it was flimsy. If you can afford it, go with a MEC 600 jr or a slightly cheaper solution is the RCBS shotshell die that Starmetal was talking about (not sure how they handle slugs, but you could look into it). See:

http://www.gunaccessories.com/RCBS/ShotshellDies.asp

Bret4207

09-25-2005, 09:05 AM

Scrounger

09-25-2005, 10:15 AM

2 questions- one for BruceB and one general-

1. Bruce- I have an unused 12 gauge MEC600 jr with the adjustable charge bar. Do you by any chance have a copy of the instructions on how to use the charge bar? It's a long story on why I've never used it, but not having the info for the charge bar is part of it.

2. Guys- I really NEED to load for my 16 ga as there isn't much afffordable in the way of heavy loads. Is it worth it for me to buy seperate die sets for what I load- 16, 20,410- or should I get seperate loaders? And how do I tell if I have the old style 600 or the newer post 1983 style. Thats about when I boought the press for the gunshop and do see any way to tell in my reseach.

Bret, Precision Reloading (http://precisionreloading.com/index.html) sells the charge bars; no doubt they could help you get instructions for using it. As for the 16 gauge... not much choice for loaded ammo out there and it's never cheap, so reloading it is almost a given. When I used more than one gauge, I had a MEC in each gauge. I mounted the bolts coming UP through the bench and it took less than a minute to switch machines (gauges). Changing dies and making adjustments eats up a lot of loading time; so I vote on getting another machine rather than going the conversion kit route. Check out Ebay: http://tinyurl.com/8cq44

Edited link to shorten.

StarMetal

09-25-2005, 11:57 AM

Tpr Bret,

Go here to the actual Mec sight and download your manual free:

http://www.mecreloaders.com/OwnerManuals/OwnerManuals.asp

Joe

Willbird

09-25-2005, 02:22 PM

I just looked at Gander Mountian, the only 20 gauge shells that had with #4 or #5 were 9.95 per box, and that was lead shot 2-3/4 shells.

Bill

omgb

09-25-2005, 10:05 PM

I'm going to toss in my $.02 worth. I use a Hornady/Pacific 366 and love it. i had a Lee Load-All and it worked...most of the time but it was a sorry machine at best. I tried a Texan and a Mec 600. The Mec was a fine press and the universal charge bar a great idea. That being said, the Hornady 366 beats them all. It turns out perfect ammo at well over 300 rounds an hour...faster if I can feed it that fast. It's smooth and effortless. A used one with a couple of bushings can be had for right around $175 and it's worth every penny.

For 16 GA I'd just buy a Mec 600. No body shoots more than a few boxes of 16 GA a year any way so the volume loading deal is kinda moot. If you shoot 12 or 20 though, that 366 is sweet.
R J TAlley

BruceB

09-25-2005, 10:51 PM

I'm a bit late replying here. The suggestions for obtaining the adjustable-metering-bar instructions are excellent, and better than I could have done.

I learned the use of the metering bar without instructions, and it was not difficult. Most of my troubles disappeared, once I discovered those tiny Allen screws which lock the settings! Once over that hump, it was pretty simple.

Again, I certainly understand the need for specialty loadings for shotshells, and have loaded a goodly number of specialized shells in the past. I just don't need them now.

omgb

09-26-2005, 01:21 AM

I wish there was an adjustable metering bar for the 366. That being said, in truth I don't really need one. I have a good load for the 12 GA that works for most of my clay birding. 11/8 oz 71/2 shot and 18.0 grains of Hodgdon Clays in a WW AA hull along with WW AA wad and a Win 209 primer. For upland birds, I use the same powder, 11/4 oz. of #6 shot and a slightly reduced powder charge. For water fowel I buy store-bought steel loads at Wally-Mart. I use so few of them over a season (6 boxes) that loading them is too costly. I do load my own 16 GA but since buying a new Ruger Gold Lable 12 GA I don';t use the 16 that much any more and may quit loading for it too.

Trap and Skeet is where I go through almost 3000 shells a year. Wally mart sells AAs for $45.00 a flat but I can beat that by loading. I actually enjoy the process so I don;t count my time. 1000 primers and 8 lbs of powder run me $95.00. I get the hulls for free from others so, reloading is cheaper. I guess I could have bought a Spolar or a PW but dang, I can but a whole lot of powder and shot for the difference in price over a used 366.

R J TAlley

BruceB

09-26-2005, 10:39 AM

[QUOTE] "Wally mart sells AAs for $45.00 a flat but I can beat that by loading. I actually enjoy the process so I don't count my time."

Boy howdy, and AMEN!

This is HOBBY time we're talking about. How much shooting can we do in bad weather, or after dark, or in a lot of the time we spend away from "work"? How many times have we seen things like, "Yeah, but if you factor in your TIME, it doesn't make economic sense to (cast, handload, tie dry flies, make decoys, etc. etc. etc.)"

Good grief. Are these people so soul-dead that they can't see the benefits of expanding one's hobby to the off-hours, where we can at least think, reminisce, and plan for future activity within the chosen area? Does everything have to come down to cold cash? I guess it does for some, although I also suspect that for some people, it comes down to pure butt-laziness that would rather park itself in front of the tube and vegetate.

(I made reference, on the dry-firing thread, to cycling my new M1A a few thousand times "in front of the tube". Let me say that in the course of a three-hour NFL game, there is ample time to cycle a rifle MANY times. In other words, I don't watch "soaps", or "reality", or any of that sort of dreck.)

omgb

09-26-2005, 10:59 AM

It's funny how "zen-like" pulling that handle can be. Some good tunes on the radio, an empty shop and a press with all of the goodies. Hulls on the platen, wad in the guide, give the handle a pull and a completed shell drops out the back. 500 cycles later and I'm ready for a month's trap or skeet. Problems melt away, the world's mysteries get solved (in my mind any way) and great hunts of the past get re-lived while future adventures get dreamed about. Geez, I love this hobby. Guys, try a 366, you won't be sorry. Built like a tank, runs like a Swiss watch. My kind of machine.

R J TAlley

felix

09-26-2005, 11:03 AM

Work is defined as presently doing something you rather not be doing at that moment or even later when absolutely required. For some it would be making shot, or even shotshells, and for others it is smelting lead from the junk pile. I personally fit the latter category. That is the main reason Sundog and I had the large smelter made. Sundog named it the "mother of all smelters" (MOAS). We typically melt once a year for the fun of it, but this activity surely is not needed that often. A typical melt can yield a full ton of lead if we so desire and have the energy to work all day. ... felix

9.3X62AL

09-26-2005, 06:26 PM

Taking Felix's lead here......Mark Twain observed in "Tom Sawyer" that "......work consists of what a body is obliged to do, while play consists of what a body is not obliged to do." Made sense to me at the time I first read that almost 40 years ago, and still does today. With that definition, just about all the on-topic stuff we discuss here involves PLAY.

I use different machines for each gauge, all MEC 600 Jr's currently. One of my retirement goals is to use enough shotshells to justify a Ponsness-Warren machine is some gauge I don't re-stuff yet--like 16 gauge, since the shotgun came with a whole case of "loss-leader" shells--the kind that don't reload well, with brass-dipped heads. It would help if one of the MECs would crap out, but that ain't happening--at all.

C1PNR

09-26-2005, 10:46 PM

Deputy Al,
Nice to see you mention the Ponsness-Warren shot shell reloader. Or should I say, "factory equivalent loader" as their advertising suggests!

Back in the day I was a married with kids shooter and my Brother was a divorced with NO kids shooter. I got the MEC 600 JR and he bought the Ponsness-Warren!

Man, is that some machine! A decent hull loaded on that comes out looking like you just got it at Abercrombie and Fitch!

Now that I'm retired, I guess the MEC 600 JR is what I'll have to get for reloading 20 gauge too. Then again, maybe I'll try and talk my Brother into buying 20 gauge dies for the P-W.;-)

brimic

09-27-2005, 07:27 PM

I use the Walmart value pack cheapo loads when shooting sporting clays on a local course where they don't allow you to pick up your hulls. Walmart sells 2 brands of value pack target loads: winchester and federal. I prefer the federal because the winchesters have such thin brass on them that edges often hang out off the hull a bit and have caused me some jams in the past.

For trap, I reload AA's on a Mec 600 Jr. Its an easy machine to set up and use, I started reloading 12 guage trap loads under the tuteledge of my dad when I was 10 years old on one of these machines.

4296

09-28-2005, 10:42 AM

Checked out the RCBS Shotshell Die(thanks for the link) and was shocked to see the price-as much as the Mini Grand and ten bucks less than the MEC Jr.-no thanks! As the original poster of this thread I am surprised NOBODY has the RCBS Mini Grand. With all the RCBS fans (myself included) and their outstanding warranty and customer service this surprises me. It seems that MEC has established itself as the benchmark.

MARCORVET

09-30-2005, 12:53 AM

MARCORVET

09-30-2005, 12:56 AM