Noe 225-45g-4c-2

[Gohon]

I'm considering buying the NOE 225-45G-4C-2 mold for loading in a 22 Hornet and maybe even in a 223. I've got the Lyman 225438 and 225415 molds now, but I'm not getting the performance I want. Does anyone have any experience with this mold and most importantly, how did the casts perform for you. Thanks

[JeffinNZ]

Where are the Lyman moulds not delivering for you? Accuracy? They both have a very good reputation.

[Gohon]

Jeff, the molds themselves are excellent and cast very well. Design and and accuracy is where I'm looking for a change. The 438 is pretty decent at 50 yards with the first three shots in a clover leaf and the next shots opening up to a inch. The 415 with it's pointed shape doesn't give it much authority on small game unless a head shot is scored and it also groups around a inch at 50 yards. This is with IMR4227 which I'm finding is very load sensitive in the Hornet. Looking at the NOE mold with that large meplat just seems to be a better game getter with less than perfect hits. On the other hand, maybe I'm expecting too much from a cast 22 caliber.

[Gohon]

Don't know why I can't edit my last post but the edit function doesn't want to work. What I wanted to add was I would like to get the Hornet grouping at a inch or a inch and a half but from 50 out to 100 yards the groups open up to baseball size. At a 100 yards a squirrel has about a 50/50 chance of not being hit with this accuracy and that is what I'm looking for.

[JeffinNZ]

I'm not sure the solution is a new mould. If you are getting 3 shots cutting then the group opens up the rifle is the problem, not the bullet.

I have the 225415 and find the little FN a great small game bullet however the RN of the 438 would not be as efficient on body shots. I have the 225462 also and chest shots on rabbits is not super effective at mid teen velocities. I had one cavity HPed however and that makes a BIG difference.

Not that I am trying to talk you out of a new mould because NOE's are great but I think you have a pair of good bullets/moulds now.

[telebasher]

I like to use the 215 top punch on the 225438 in my lubesizer. It puts a nice flat meplat on the nose and increases the "whop" factor on varmints and such shot with my Hornets at 2000 fps. Of coarse I had Erik hollowpoint a single cavity copy and that really ups the thump factor. That's the best thing about our infatuation with cast boolits is we have complete control of different boolits/noses/hardness for the job at hand.

[w30wcf]

The 225415 has worked fine for me and in 20/1 lead/tin alloy and a capacity load of 4198 (2,400 f.p.s.) would group in the 1 1/2" range at 100 yards and expands nicely...........

http://i116.photobucket.com/albums/o25/w30wcf/Collector%20Cartridges/2254155.jpg

w30wcf

[Gohon]

That appears to be a picture of the old Lyman 225415. Few years back Lyman lengthened the gas check shank from .071 to .109 inch on the 225415 which added to length and weight. My casts also appear to have a slightly changed nose taper and smaller meplat than the one pictured but pictures can be deceiving.

[Larry Gibson]

Gohon

Some 16" twist hornets don't stabilize the 225415 very well at around 100 yards. Mine is an older mould I've had for 47 years. Works great in my 14" twist but not good at all in my 16" twist or other 16" twists I've tried it in. While either 4227 does very well with jacketed bullets in the Hornet I've also not had the best performance with any cast bullet over 4227. I've found like w30wcf that 4198 performs better as does 4759 with cast bullets.

Larry Gibson

[.22-10-45]

Hello, Gohon..you didn't say what rifle you are using or what twist. I have had excellent accuracy with both the older 48 gr. Lyman 225415 as well as the heaver newer style. I never could get the 225438 round nose to shoot though. I have found the most accuracy improvement came when I turned up a tapered sizing die with I.D. taper to match my rifles throat leade angle. This die has std. outside dimensions to fit Lyman or RCBS lube-sizers. The adjustment screw on machine is used to determine length and dia. of taper..I taper 1st. band so as breeech block closes this band is fully engraved by rifling. Tapering is done before final sizing & lube. The little 415's will shoot well under 1" at 100yds.

[JeffinNZ]

That appears to be a picture of the old Lyman 225415. Few years back Lyman lengthened the gas check shank from .071 to .109 inch on the 225415 which added to length and weight. My casts also appear to have a slightly changed nose taper and smaller meplat than the one pictured but pictures can be deceiving.

Lyman have varied the cherries over time. Here are examples:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v505/JeffinNZ/Shooting%20stuff/224variations.jpg (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/JeffinNZ/media/Shooting%20stuff/224variations.jpg.html)

L-R: new 415, old 415, new 462, old 462.

[35remington]

To make things even weirder, my 225415 has the meplat of the bullet second from left and the gascheck shank of the first bullet on the left. The gascheck shank of the second from the left bullet looks almost too short, but it compares to 30 WCF's example. Explains the lack of much gap between gascheck and band.

[Gohon]

"To make things even weirder, my 225415 has the meplat of the bullet second from left and the gascheck shank of the first bullet on the left." Mine is the same way......longer nose, smaller meplat and longer check shank. I'm using two guns in testing....A Ruger at 14" twist and a Browning with a 16" twist. Rugers aren't known for accuracy but this one I have now shoots well but the Browning will out shoot the Ruger. First Ruger I had wasn't worth a hoot with anything. Both my guns shoot jacketed well at almost all distances and cast very well out to 50 yards. It's that space between 50 and 100 yards that casts are the challenge for me. All powders I've worked with, 2400, H4227,IMR4227, Lil'Gun, Trailboss, 1680, and H110 all perform the same with the main difference being velocity of each. I just cast a batch using hard shot and tin mixture water dropped which resulted in a 21 BHN cast and I'm going to see what they will do. Main reason I asked about the NOE mold was the design appeared to be a possible excellent bullet for squirrels and rabbits out to 50 yards or so. I've only been casting 22 caliber for about 6 years now and I know it requires a lot of tinkering, but eventually I'll get to the right powder and load for that 100 yard goal I'm looking for.

[Gohon]

Okay......before I post anymore, can some tell me why when I post my paragraphs run together, I can't quote, edit, or delete. Just seems to have started happening with this thread.

[JonB_in_Glencoe]

I'm considering buying the NOE 225-45G-4C-2 mold for loading in a 22 Hornet and maybe even in a 223. I've got the Lyman 225438 and 225415 molds now, but I'm not getting the performance I want. Does anyone have any experience with this mold and most importantly, how did the casts perform for you. Thanks
Experience ??? likely NOT, this mold was recently designed and the first run was made and shipped within the last few weeks. I received my 3 cav PB mold and cast with it for the first time last week. I haven't loaded any yet. Here is the group buy thread.
http://noebulletmolds.com/smf/index.php/topic,222.0.html


Okay......before I post anymore, can some tell me why when I post my paragraphs run together, I can't quote, edit, or delete. Just seems to have started happening with this thread.
Are you posting from a Phone ?
if so, I can't help with that, but maybe it is within the app ?
try a post in the testing section,,, there may be a techy watching and could help.

[JonB_in_Glencoe]

"To make things even weirder, my 225415 has the meplat of the bullet second from left and the gascheck shank of the first bullet on the left." Mine is the same way......longer nose, smaller meplat and longer check shank. I'm using two guns in testing....A Ruger at 14" twist and a Browning with a 16" twist. Rugers aren't known for accuracy but this one I have now shoots well but the Browning will out shoot the Ruger. First Ruger I had wasn't worth a hoot with anything. Both my guns shoot jacketed well at almost all distances and cast very well out to 50 yards. It's that space between 50 and 100 yards that casts are the challenge for me. All powders I've worked with, 2400, H4227,IMR4227, Lil'Gun, Trailboss, 1680, and H110 all perform the same with the main difference being velocity of each. I just cast a batch using hard shot and tin mixture water dropped which resulted in a 21 BHN cast and I'm going to see what they will do. Main reason I asked about the NOE mold was the design appeared to be a possible excellent bullet for squirrels and rabbits out to 50 yards or so. I've only been casting 22 caliber for about 6 years now and I know it requires a lot of tinkering, but eventually I'll get to the right powder and load for that 100 yard goal I'm looking for.

btw, since you've cast 22 boolits for years, you may know how block size(mass) can make casting 22 a nightmare or a ride in the park, in regards to keeping the mold hot enough to cast consistantly. Except for the 2 cav mold, these molds are made in smaller that usual mold blocks. I can say, my 3 cav held good temp and was a dream to cast with.

from the NOE GB thread about this mold: " 3 cavity in 2 cavity blocks, 4 cavity in 3 cavity blocks, 5 cavity in 4 cavity blocks"

[TCFAN]

I also bought that mold but mine is a 5 cavity and it also is a real pleasure to cast with.It will make 500 boolits that will weigh with in a couple of tenths of each other real fast.......Terry

[w30wcf]

That appears to be a picture of the old Lyman 225415. Few years back Lyman lengthened the gas check shank from .071 to .109 inch on the 225415 which added to length and weight. My casts also appear to have a slightly changed nose taper and smaller meplat than the one pictured but pictures can be deceiving.

Gohon,
Yes, it is. The single cavity mold it came from was purchased in the 60's by the original owner. I got it from him in the mid 1980's. It could actually be from the 50's.

Shortly after I got the mold, I replaced the sprue plate with one that had a .07" sprue hole centered exactly in the middle of the bullet cavity. With the new sprue plate, the sprue sets up quickly and I can make close to 300 match grade bullets / hr from that single cavity mold. :D

Bullets as cast, measure .229"(!). I put the g.c. on and lube in a .228" die, then run them nose first into a .225" die.

Thankfully it shoots very well when pushed with 4198......

Jeff,
Thank you for the informative pic.


w30wcf