Heat treat

[JonB_in_Glencoe]

Today was Heat treat day for my HV project for my Mod 70 win in 243. These are NOE 245-75 FN cast in 94-3-3 alloy.

Sizing and installing Gator GC
http://i640.photobucket.com/albums/uu127/JonB_in_Glencoe/Heattreat1sizeandGC_zps0b78b77b.jpg (http://s640.photobucket.com/user/JonB_in_Glencoe/media/Heattreat1sizeandGC_zps0b78b77b.jpg.html)

OK, I found out that packing a tuna can takes some time !
http://i640.photobucket.com/albums/uu127/JonB_in_Glencoe/Heattreat2tunacan_zpsc9eb836a.jpg (http://s640.photobucket.com/user/JonB_in_Glencoe/media/Heattreat2tunacan_zpsc9eb836a.jpg.html)

One hour at 425º F (that is 425 as per what the dial says)
http://i640.photobucket.com/albums/uu127/JonB_in_Glencoe/Heattreat3oven_zpsdc86e5e2.jpg (http://s640.photobucket.com/user/JonB_in_Glencoe/media/Heattreat3oven_zpsdc86e5e2.jpg.html)

The can-O-boolits moved quickly with my gloved hand into the water, then quickly (a split second), while submerged, the boolits were dumped out of the can with my other hand. The 5 gallon bucket was full of cold tap water, fresh out of the Minnesota ground in July...I suspect it to be about 55º to 58º F, but I didn't use a thermometer.
http://i640.photobucket.com/albums/uu127/JonB_in_Glencoe/Heattreat4coldtapwaterbath_zps1552f527.jpg (http://s640.photobucket.com/user/JonB_in_Glencoe/media/Heattreat4coldtapwaterbath_zps1552f527.jpg.html)

Dried on a towel. I like how the driving bands, which were shiney from sizing, are now bluish.
http://i640.photobucket.com/albums/uu127/JonB_in_Glencoe/Heattreat5dry_zpsd83cd76f.jpg (http://s640.photobucket.com/user/JonB_in_Glencoe/media/Heattreat5dry_zpsd83cd76f.jpg.html)

Next up will be some hardness testing...
==========================
edited: added hardness testing.

"untreated" 94-3-3 (BRN) alloy measures 12.5 BHN @ 4+ weeks

"treated" boolit at 2 hours old, BHN=22.8

"treated" boolit at 6 days old, BHN=27.2

"treated" boolit on 9-30-2014 (2 months) BHN=24.8

[Pb2au]

:popcorn:

[leadman]

From my experience in heat treating they should get to max hardness in about 1 week. Depends on the alloy, temp, etc.

[JonB_in_Glencoe]

First test:

This batch of 94-3-3 (BRN) alloy measures 12.5 BHN with these boolits "untreated" at 4+ weeks since they were cast.

A "treated" boolit at 2 hours old, BHN=22.8

[Deliverator]

I like that bracket to set your lee classic cast unside down for push through sizing. That is a neat trick.

[Rick O'Shay]

Ditto on what Deliverator said.

[Elkins45]

I like that bracket to set your lee classic cast unside down for push through sizing. That is a neat trick.

Isn't that an odd arm motion to lift the handle UP against the resistance of the sizer? That looks like it would make my arthritis wake up and say hello!

[JonB_in_Glencoe]

Isn't that an odd arm motion to lift the handle UP against the resistance of the sizer? That looks like it would make my arthritis wake up and say hello!
The Lee classic allows for 360º adjustment of the handle. The way I have it set up for this function, it's really more pulling toward me, as opposed to lifting up.

[JonB_in_Glencoe]

I like that bracket to set your lee classic cast unside down for push through sizing. That is a neat trick.
The one in the OP was a prototype, heavy duty enough for swaging. Later after that, I made about eight of a simpler and lighter design and sold some here a couple years ago.

http://i640.photobucket.com/albums/uu127/JonB_in_Glencoe/freshlypainted.jpg (http://s640.photobucket.com/user/JonB_in_Glencoe/media/freshlypainted.jpg.html)

Mount the press right-side-up, or up side down.
http://i640.photobucket.com/albums/uu127/JonB_in_Glencoe/standmountedstandingextended.jpg (http://s640.photobucket.com/user/JonB_in_Glencoe/media/standmountedstandingextended.jpg.html)

[JonB_in_Glencoe]

Second hardness test

"treated" boolit at 6 days old, BHN=27.2

[DR Owl Creek]

Nice set up! Thanks for sharing!

Dave

[fivel_976]

Great info

[captaint]

Very innovative set up. Interesting that the nice mount you made is a dead ringer for RCBS green... I guess Mr. Lee won't mind. !!!!! Nice job... Mike

[tomme boy]

Are you sizing the bullets base first to crimp the checks? And what brand is that sizing die?

[JonB_in_Glencoe]

I sized them nose first.
The actual die is a Lyman that I honed out to .2455
the die is mounted into a threaded die body adapter made by theperfessor
http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?158620-Sign-Up-List-for-Nose-First-Sizer-Kit-Part-2&highlight=

[Toymaker]

Good information, JonB. Did you happen to measure the BHN of the alloy or a bullet within a day or two of casting? I could look up the hardness in theory but the actual would be more interesting. Knowing the starting BHN would give a base point to the curve.

GREAT information, Thank you for sharing

[Garyshome]

Last time I tried that they all melted.

[Garyshome]

Keep us posted on how they shoot!

[OuchHot!]

JonB I am really impressed with that riser and upside down sizing press. Have you tried to track diameter as the boolits age? I know the shift is small, but it has interested me. Great set-up, you gave me a lot to think about.

[JonB_in_Glencoe]

Good information, JonB. Did you happen to measure the BHN of the alloy or a bullet within a day or two of casting? I could look up the hardness in theory but the actual would be more interesting. Knowing the starting BHN would give a base point to the curve.
GREAT information, Thank you for sharing
No, I didn't. I shoudl take a measurement today, in fact.


JonB I am really impressed with that riser and upside down sizing press. Have you tried to track diameter as the boolits age? I know the shift is small, but it has interested me. Great set-up, you gave me a lot to think about.
Yes, I check diameter...no measurable changes.

[JonB_in_Glencoe]

HEAT TREAT Batch #2

The same NOE 245-75 FN.
I used straight COWW this time.
I sized and installed the GC...This time I used a Lyman 45 to do that, instead of the Nose first technique I did before, the GC's look much better.
This is what they looked like in the first batch, that's why I discontinued that batch, and put this off till now.
http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?254730-HV-in-243-range-visit-1
Heated in tuna can to 400º for an hour, same as the first batch.
I'm hoping for a hardness of around 24 BHN.

BHN measured 17.9 an hour after heat treat.


I got called back to work, starting Monday...and thought I'd get these cast and heat treated, It'll be easy to let them 'sit' til spring, if I'm working.

[JonB_in_Glencoe]

Looks like I dropped the ball 25 months ago.
In the last week or so, Another member wanted some 243 boolit samples from me, and these heat treated in the previous post as set to get shipped to them (besides some others). I should take some measurements of these HT COWW boolits today, before they get packed up. I'll post that info in a bit.

[Loudy13]

First thanks for the post, Second any change you want to sell that mold? I am patiently waiting for them to produce that mold again but there isn't a high demand for the 244/6MM/243 mold. My daughter has a .243 and I would like to go down the same road you have paved and be able to produce cheap boolits that can be fired at a decent FPS yet.

Thanks again

[JonB_in_Glencoe]

HEAT TREAT Batch #2

The same NOE 245-75 FN.
I used straight COWW this time.
I sized and installed the GC...This time I used a Lyman 45 to do that, instead of the Nose first technique I did before, the GC's look much better.
This is what they looked like in the first batch, that's why I discontinued that batch, and put this off till now.
http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?254730-HV-in-243-range-visit-1
Heated in tuna can to 400º for an hour, same as the first batch.
I'm hoping for a hardness of around 24 BHN.

BHN measured 17.9 an hour after heat treat.


I got called back to work, starting Monday...and thought I'd get these cast and heat treated, It'll be easy to let them 'sit' til spring, if I'm working.
HEAT TREAT Batch #2
NOE 245-75 FN cast with COWW

Hardness measurements (from my notes in the bin with the lubesized boolits):
BHN=17.9 on 1-25-2015 (one hour after HT)
BHN=24 on 1-22-2016 (yes, one year later)
BHN=22 on 6-3-2016
BHN=22 on 2-20-2017

[gwpercle]

Tip on Quenching ,
drill a bunch of holes in the bottom of your tuna can, when you submerge the can full of hot boolits the holes will allow the cool water to enter inside and around all the boolits for a nice even quench . The holes don't have to be big , just evenly spaced all around the bottom. What you are doing is the absolute best way to harden boolits.
Gary

[JonB_in_Glencoe]

HEAT TREAT Batch #2
NOE 245-75 FN cast with COWW

Hardness measurements (from my notes in the bin with the lubesized boolits):
BHN=17.9 on 1-25-2015 (one hour after HT)
BHN=24 on 1-22-2016 (yes, one year later)
BHN=22 on 6-3-2016
BHN=22 on 2-20-2017

Just a side note, if these numbers seem high for HT COWW...I think they are.
while putting together many different 243 samples from different casting sessions with different alloys, to send to another member, I found some of these boolits from the same casting session (COWW), but un-sized, un-lubed, not heat treated.
BHN was 13.7 on 1-25-2015 (the day they were cast)
BHN=15.7 on 1-22-2016 (from my notes)
BHN=16.6 on 2-20-2017

So I guess that was no ordinary batch of COWW.
and the issue shouldn't be my measuring, as other sources of COWW that I have, have been measured between 12 to 13 typically, with the same Lee tester and my same techniques.

[Grmps]

The COWW may have more arsenic in it?

[35 shooter]

Somehow i had missed this thread...glad i saw it today.
I ht straight ww at 465* and they seem to hit 27 bhn in 3 days, but i've never tried measuring for bhn after 2 hrs.
Wow, you hit 22 plus in 2 hrs......no wonder i've gotten by before by shooting mine the very next afternoon after ht at high velocity lol.
Now i know they were probably a lot harder a lot quicker than i even thought.

Thanks for posting this!