is there a way to verify a squib or double load after complete assembly

[edadmartin]

Hello Ive been away with med problems for 4 months and now am ready to go shooting again. I have about 500 45 acp 200swc 200gr loaded. But its been so long Im now questioning myself.Is there a way to test a reload to know if the powder charge was done correctly?? I know what it should have been, Im very careful and look at every powder charge, but Im just a little paranoid since its been a few months, and wasn't feeling 100% and I wasn't that clear with my data sheets, any suggestions?? Id hate to have to pull them.

[Artful]

if you can shake them and hear the powder you know it's got some.

If your charge is large enough you can weigh and a double charge should show up.
You can test this by putting a primed case and boolit and a single charge on the scale and note the weight
then another single charge added too it (double charge) - now you have a base line and can start weight
you loaded cartridges - this works best if you have a larger charge than if you have like a 2 grain charge.

[David2011]

The powder charge is such a small portion of the entire weight that weighing them would not be a viable solution to me. The cumulative weight variations between the boolits and the brass could be as much as the weight of the powder charge. It's pretty easy to verify that a rifle case has powder in it by shaking the cartridge. I can hear it and feel it move unless the bullet is sitting against the powder. I've never been able to feel or hear the powder in a .45 ACP case, though. Other opinions may differ but I would say that there is not an easy, reliable way to verify your charges in this case.

David

[brtelec]

Yep as artful said, Weigh them. I just weigh a handful of loaded rounds from the same batch and then weigh the questionable ones.

[Hamish]

You're going to get several answers on this.

But for me, its a matter of realizing the variables involved. Case weights can vary a few grains above and below the median aver average. The projectiles can vary a few grains above and below the median average. Combine them and you can have two cartridges be an easy 10 grains different in weight.

Nothing wrong with shooting them in a target setting, but be careful,,,,,

[David2011]

Thinking about it a little more- you could definitely cull out heavy cartridges since they could possibly have a double charge and the very lightest might have no powder. It's still only a guess due to the variations in case and boolit weights. You definitely don't want to be shooting any double charges.

I had a friend load 300 rounds of .40 S&W for me when my presses were unavailable a couple of years ago. One was a squib. I was shooting a USPSA match and withdrew. I didn't trust any of the rest and had to pull about 270 boolits with an impact puller.

Oh, it was worth the effort. There was a second cartridge without powder.

David

[osteodoc08]

Life's to short to go without fingers and eyes for the sake of a little time, money or energy.

I'd look at it like this, can 2 charges fit? If so, they all get pulled. If not, you either have a squib or a regular charge. Be careful when shooting and bring a brass rod to knock out the potential squib.

[osteodoc08]

Thinking about it a little more- you could definitely cull out heavy cartridges since they could possibly have a double charge and the very lightest might have no powder. It's still only a guess due to the variations in case and boolit weights. You definitely don't want to be shooting any double charges.

I had a friend load 300 rounds of .40 S&W for me when my presses were unavailable a couple of years ago. One was a squib. I was shooting a USPSA match and withdrew. I didn't trust any of the rest and had to pull about 270 boolits with an impact puller.

Oh, it was worth the effort. There was a second cartridge without powder.

David

Which is why I only shoot my reloads or my fathers. He's passed now and I've shot up most of the ammo he loaded for me.

[kens]

This discussion is why I use powders that nearly fill the case with a safe load. A double charge would overfill the case and boolit seating not possible.

[Shiloh]

Weigh them.
I use a jewelry scale set on carats. That would be for weighing precious stones. I have found rifle ammo that was missing powder.
With small charges in pistol rounds, it is inconclusive. Particularly with cast. The best method is to be very careful when charging your cases.

Shiloh

[Artful]

I'd look at it like this, can 2 charges fit?

excellent point - and that's why I like some bulky but dirty powders (Unique).

[fecmech]

I have an old stethoscope and squibs are easy, even with pistol cartridges. Just put the cartridge on the portion of the scope that goes on your chest and shake it. If there is powder present you will hear it loud and clear!

[Stephen Cohen]

The question you should be asking yourself, is, how much is this gun and my eyesight worth to me. It does not take long to pull and check charge, and if nothing else you will feel so much better knowing for certain your safe, and you will shoot better without the eyes and but cheeks clamped tightly closed. You stated you just got over an illness, do you need another. Given the variables in components you could easily get a 2 gr variation and that could put you way over max if its powder. Pull them and play safe, you have already shown common sense and questioned what you did so long ago.

[DrCaveman]

Im failing to see how this is different than loading up 500 rounds in a sitting, and only shooting a hundred of them, saving the rest for later. Maybe a week, month, or year. The round is still one that YOU loaded, right? And if your results from that initial 100 shot outing werent noteworthy (flat primers, blown up gun), then why would the risk increase from the passage of a few months?

Unless you are prone to experimental, max loadings... anything you loaded that you thought was safe to shoot in 2011 aught to be considered safe to shoot today.

Maybe you dont remember the loading session at all, and never shot any from the run. And maybe you DID mix up powders and dont remember

Chasing a lone double charge in old ammo is futile, i think. Either they all get pulled, or a few get shot to test...with a nice strong gun, and maybe a vice and string. But then, if everything works out ok, if you still think there may be remaining double charges, why would you dare continue?

[725]

When in doubt, tear 'em down.

[shooterbob]

X1 on the weight varying on the brass and bullets.

[gnoahhh]

In actuality, a "squib" load is a low velocity load, like a "cat sneeze" load. How it came to be a term for a dud load that leaves the bullet sticking in the bore is a mystery to me. If I think there is a remote chance that something is wrong with a batch of handloads, I tear them down. A rare event for me because I employ the flashlight method of determining powder levels in a loading block full of cases, going over them twice before starting to seat bullets.

[edadmartin]

I also use a flash lite and a guage on every load,so I loaded 50 today using the same specs and setup as I had done prior to surgery, all the 50 came in 297-301 grains. This with range brass, rem large pis primers, and 4.5 grains of AA#2. and lswc. So I've weighed a box of 100 each, that was done during the questionable time period and the weights are with in the same range with 1 being 302 and 3 being 294. I believe some difference is in the brass used. Ill use this method unless a better one surfaces, before shooting the next oldest batch. Thanks for the tips guys.

[btroj]

This is an area where I do have one hard, fast rule


When in doubt, throw it out.


​

[303Guy]

I employ the flashlight method of determining powder levels in a loading block full of cases, going over them twice before starting to seat bullets.Is there any other way? :roll:

You weren't well when you loaded them. Mistakes are almost guaranteed under those conditions so doubting your loads is quite reasonable. As much as I love to save things and weigh them to see if they might be duds or overloads, I have to say pull them. Unless of course you happen to have a 'friend' who is forever asking you to reload for him ... [smilie=1:

[243winxb]

is there a way to verify a squib or double load after complete assembly No. None for that small of a cartridge. 45 acp 200swc

[375RUGER]

In actuality, a "squib" load is a low velocity load, like a "cat sneeze" load. How it came to be a term for a dud load that leaves the bullet sticking in the bore is a mystery to me. If I think there is a remote chance that something is wrong with a batch of handloads, I tear them down. A rare event for me because I employ the flashlight method of determining powder levels in a loading block full of cases, going over them twice before starting to seat bullets.

Source??
Where did you come up with that? As long as I've been shooting and loading a "DUD" is one that fails to fire-no ignition. A "SQUIB" is one that lacks the power to push a bullet out the end of the barrel.

[303Guy]

I'm confused now. I've always thought of a squib load as a very light load, as in cat sneeze load. To me a squib load might or might not push the boolit out the bore and is usually unintentionally light. That doesn't make me right, just confused. Do we have a consensus on what a light load is called and what a squib load is?

[243winxb]

LOAD, SQUIB A cartridge or shell which produces projectile velocity and sound substantially lower than normal. May result in projectile and/or wads remaining in the bore. http://www.saami.org/glossary/display.cfm?letter=L :guntootsmiley:

[303Guy]

Thanks. Makes sense and fits the way the term has been used.

[rhead]

The definition that I saw written in an article stated that a squib was a load that was purposed to attain less than fifty percent of factory velocity. As opposed to a reduced recoil load that was between fifty and one hundred percent velocity. I do not recall any mention of the cat sneeze loads in that article. Sorry I cannot nail that down any better. I could not find that one in my library. There are several holes in my collection due to loans not being returned.

You may encounter a stuck boolit a time or too while developing a squib load.

The article was in a Guns Digest published back in the early to mid seventies.

If this definition is Official or not I have no idea. When I speak or write and use the term Squib I mean one that i loaded on purpose. when I say Dud it was a surprise. The boolit may or may not get stuck. When I indent the primer and get no effect I use the term Fail to Fire.

The differences in terms may be regional.

[HeavyMetal]

I'll put in my 2 cents for what it's worth:

Pistol ammo, particularly 45 ACP, will need to be completely "documented" as to brass weight, powder charge, primer weight, boolit weight!

Each of these plays a huge part in the weight of a loaded round and, if you use mixed brass and or do not weigh your castings, you have no way to establish a usable base line to determine load "condition" based solely on the weight of a finished round.

Your Options are:

Pull every round and start over

Or pull a sampling of the batch in question and determine if these are the load you think you put together.

If you were pushing a max load and find a big variation in the pulled rounds pull them all!

If you were using a mid range load and find your OK with the pulled rounds shoot them with care.

Me? I'd pull them if there wasn't ton of them, sample check if there was a ton of them and never back myself in that corner again!

[a.squibload]

+1 for HeavyMetal's advice, except that you seem to have an idea that the
rounds in question might have a problem. Not suspecting double charges or
missing powder but what charge was it / not documented. Hard to say,
if you normally used a certain load it's probably that load. 500 rounds is a bunch!
I would pull some to check, 10 would give you the load assuming they all
weigh about the same. Any problems noticed - pull more, or all.

I had to pull a box of 50, the crimp wasn't right or seating depth,
something like that. Didn't want to do it but pressure could have been high.

Different but same: a guy from school had sold his gun, gave me a box of
44 mag reloads, labeled with 5 different loads.
I pulled 'em all, not worth the risk!

Always thought a squib load was very reduced, maybe on purpose
or maybe by defect, but not a dud which doesn't fire at all.
But then I'm no expert...

I don't use a loading block, charge one at a time, look in to confirm,
and put it in the press.
Lately, especially with Unique, I weigh each charge. Was advised that
Unique doesn't meter well, they were right.

Stop me before I write a novel here.

[257]

you can weight them if I didn't reload them I won't shoot them, guns cost to much to chance destroying one over the cost of a shell