Getting started

[DrJay1st]

I fortunately ran across this site while researching casting and loading for a couple of .243s. A little background: I returned to hunting and reloading after about 15 years of very little participation. I have a young nephew whose father is no longer with us that wanted to go hunting. I bought and setup a .243 for him and he took a doe last year and a 7 point this year. He is such a joy to work with. Follows instructions and executes flawlessly. I think I need to spend more time with him and shooting/hunting is a good vehicle for that. He will make a fine rifleman if he carries that gun and shoots it regularly. I would like to see a firearm as almost a natural extension and that will come with a lot of carrying and shooting. Anyway, I would like to start casting and shooting with him...so I need to get back in the reloading game.
Are .243's good candidates for cast bullets? Can one achieve really good accuracy with them? I've never been satisfied with less than MOA accuracy...though I don't always get it.
Which molds are giving the best results? The only casting equipment that I have is a 20 lb Lee pro-pot. If anyone has any casting equipment that they want to get rid of, now would be a good time and much appreciated. I will need everything...sizer/lubricator, gas checks, molds, handles, etc. I don't have to reinvent the wheel on everything that I do...so I'm open to your help...information or equipment...so jump in and help me out.
I spent most of yesterday on this site and I think I've found the right site. I'm looking forward to interacting with the members of this forum.
Thanks,
Jerry S. Walker

[waksupi]

Welcome aboard, Jerry.
The .243 is just fine for cast, and you should be able to get it down to MOA groups.
However, I do consider the .243 diameter too small for deer hunting. I know it is hard to argue with your success, but larger diameter would be a great plus. I would suggest going to .30 or larger, .35 being my preferred size, since I hunt elk regularly.
I greatly appreciate the fact you are getting another hunter started on the path.

[Nueces]

How do, Jerry, welcome aboard. Thanks for sharing that story. Your nephew is lucky to have you in his life. There is a crowd here who will enjoy hearing about y'all's progress.

Mark

[DrJay1st]

He was shooting 100 grain winchester factory. I agree that with cast the caliber needs to be bigger. What I intended was that he and I would roam the woods doing what I did as a budding hunter...shoot targets of opportunity...sort of use the .243 like a 22...carry it a lot and burn a lot of ammo...shoot lots of beer cans...pine cones...hickory nuts...crows. I want him to be able to wield that gun quickly, naturally, and safely...thus lots of time in hand. It will give me an opportunity to influence him on matters of character, values, responsibily, etc. I will load something more appropriate for larger game.
I reread my earlier post and it sounds like some kind of solicitation for something free...NO, NO, NO! I want to buy/pay for anything you guys want to steer me toward. It might keep me from having to go through several wrong choices.
Jerry

[felix]

Jerry, there is too much powder space in that 243 case size for total boolit (cast bullet) satisfaction, especially when the barrel's orientation in the field will be random on a per shot basis. Need to get a smaller case (my preference), or up the bore size to 35 like Waksupi said while keeping the 308 case size, or, actually, both like about a 35 remington. ... felix

[DrJay1st]

Waksupi, elk hunting? Montana? Hmmmm, that just ain't right!
Nueces, thanks for the comment
Felix, he's small and I was trying to come up with something pleasant to shoot. I don't want him fighting recoil until the urge to hunt and shoot is so compelling that he will put up with the recoil gladly. If this casting thing works out, then buying something that cast bullets work better in is not out of the question. 35 reminton...marlin right? microgroove? Do they handle cast bullets well? accurately?
Jerry

[Bullshop]

G'Day Jerry
You will likely find accuracy from that 243 with boolits that you will be satisfied with, BUT. There is always a BUT isnt there. In this case it will be velocity. You will likely find that the level of accuracy required for happyness will be well below that of your boolits jacketed counterpart.
Some of my boys have 243's and do get spectacular accuracy with hunting weight boolits but its more in the 2000 fps range than the 3000 fps of a bullet of near same weight, 100gn.
BTH we got the Stevens mod 200 rifles for $235.00 dealer cost. Can ya believe that at todays prices?
Now we all know that 2000 fps is adiquit velocity for hunting but you must also consider that a hard boolit of small caliber will not act the same as a soft bullet under the same impact conditions.
I see the 24 cal with its longest boolits that will stabalise as a perfect candidate for soft nose boolits. You will find some info here on soft nose casting if you search a bit. A 24 cal 100gn boolit with about a 70/30 % hard soft at 2000 fps muzzle velocity would make an acceptable deer load out to about 200 yards, IMO.
Hope to hear good things of your time spent with your nephew shooting, loading, hunting, and especially casting in the future.
Blessings
BIC/BS

[DrJay1st]

Bullshop, reducing the velocity is just what I expected and what I want as well. Setting up an impromptu range and/or wandering the woods without having to be so concerned about setting off full high powered rifle rounds appeals to me. So light loads would be perfect and what I was after...though, I didn't make myself clear. I could just use 22 rimfires but I want the nephew to carry the gun he will actually be hunting with until he is older. I want to make plinking loads for now that are accurate, with a little less range and danger, a little less recoil, hopefully a little less noisy and little less startling for a child. Sort of a 22 magnum but in 243.
All this is probably just justification for doing something I always wanted to do...cast my own and shoot more.
Jerry

[felix]

357 mag rifle, Jerry, and be done with it for a while. ... felix

[Powderpacker]

Hornady and Lyman stopped making/selling .243 gas checks and all of the .243 molds I've seen are gc designs. Shooting these boolits w/o gas checks may not give you the accuracy you're looking for . I don't know what the group buy gas check situation is for .243 checks - that might be a source if you decide to stay with the .243 idea .

[Scrounger]

That reminds me that I about 500 RCBS 95 grain (sic) .243 cast bullets I bought 5 years ago. They are gas-checked, sized, and lubed. I bought them so I don't know any of the details.. You can have them for $20 shipped.

[MT Gianni]

Try a 85-100 gr cast over 11-14 gr of 2400. I think that you will be happy with the results. Gianni

[454PB]

You might consider a 30/30 for the nephew. The 30/30 is a perfect cast boolit shooter, can be used at full power with cast boolits, and is available in bolt action if wanted. I'm presently loading a bunch of cast ammo for my 12 year old grandson as he prepares for his first hunting experience. I'm starting him out with some Lee 170 gr. at 1400 fps., then we will gradually increase the power level. I own both lever and bolt action 30/30's, so he will have several options as conditions change.

[DrJay1st]

Scrounger,
That will be great! I can experiment with them to see if this idea has any merit at all. The .243 choice was in addition to the other reasons was that I have one also...so it would be more fun for my nephew and I both shooting the same thing.
How do you want your money and where do you want it sent?
And thanks...can't wait to get started reloading again and experimenting with this cast thing.
Jerry

[DrJay1st]

454PB, some of the post are leading me in that direction. I just spent a small fortune on his gun, scope, mounts, rings, covers, sling, and a cleaning kit plus a bunch of addtional stuff that I thought weren't contained in it. I also committed to have his buck mounted and of course will pay for the processing...$470.00 more. So, I didn't want to buy another gun right now. I would want one too...so that would be two:)
I'm getting a picture that this cast thing works better at 30 caliber and up...reduced case capacity compared to more modern rounds...is that right?
See a lot of talk on 30-30, 35 remington etc...just what are the surefire cast chamberings? I see some people quite satisfied with 3 or 4 inch groups at 100 yards...I'm not one! I want to get down to at least and inch and a half. Which calibers work best for that? Does the Marlin microgroove work as well as the winchester? Which guns are more desireable? I don't want to find what I think is a good deal and then find that the gun I bought isn't suited for this purpose. Oh well, I've never owned a lever gun...always wanted one...so I'll start looking for gun show dates/locations and dropping by the local pawnshops.
Anybody got any extra guns they want to get rid of?
Jerry

[DrJay1st]

MT Giani, I happen to have some 2400.
thanks,
Jerry

[DrJay1st]

Scrounger's gracious offer got me to thinking...if anyone has any cast 6mm stuff that they want to sell or some other weights or designs that I can experiment with, that would be great. This .243 idea may not have any merit...but if I can get some accuracy...might be a fun plinker. Still may have to go with Felix or 454PB or other suggestions. Anyway, if you've got some 6mm stuff you can sell for me experiment with let me know.
Jerry

[mroliver77]

I think you can do what your intending with the .243. Much easier with a 30-30 but using a fast powder and light loads can work in the .243. It can be another way to spend time with him casting and working up loads with him. I also have a nephew without a dad. We have shared quite a lot of hunting loading moments together. You can also shop for ummmm, condum bullets and light load them. 1000 can be had at not too great of a price. Mebbe consider the NEF handi rifle in .357. I start all my younguns out with single shots. J

[454PB]

I'm getting a picture that this cast thing works better at 30 caliber and up...reduced case capacity compared to more modern rounds...is that right?
See a lot of talk on 30-30, 35 remington etc...just what are the surefire cast chamberings?

I owned a 6mm Remington model 600 for many years, and handed it down to my son about 8 years ago. That rifle killed deer like lightning using jacketed bullets, and never took more than one shot. My son killed his first deer with it at 14, and since I had inherited it from my grandad, it was only natural to hand it over to him.

There are people loading cast boolits to 2700 fps., and I personally have had them up to 2500 fps with good accuracy. It isn't easy to do, however. The secret of .243 and 6mm success on deer is velocity. Sure, a 115 gr. cast boolit at 2000 fps will kill a deer if placed well, but it will also do a lot of wounding. The worst thing that can happen to a young hunter is wounding several animals. Seasoned and experienced hunter/caster/shooters is a whole different game.

With cast boolits, velocity is limited, but caliber and weight are not. So, IMHO, a larger, heavier boolit is going to be easier to work into a reliable deer killer than a lighter one.

None of what I've said should stop you from continuing on with cast boolits in .243, just consider it before encouraging a neophyte to shoot them at live targets.

[mroliver77]

An after thought, Bullshop has a cast boolit business. He comes very highly recomended. Mebbe you could purchase a few designs before taking the jump into a mold etc. Jay

[DrJay1st]

mroliver77, I sent a pm to bullshop but haven't received a reply. I think your idea is a good one...try it out before making much of a committment. I'm already beginning to think about buying a gun/s that are considered more cast friendly or at least from my reading

LISTEN UP GUYS!

[DrJay1st]

The post should have read:
LISTEN UP GUYS:
I have no intention of hunting deer with 6mm cast bullets!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I have guns from 22 rimfire through .300 Weatherby magnum...I don't have anything larger, at least in centerfire because I don't think I need it for deer or elk! A .243 is perfectly adequate for deer if the right jacketed bullet is used and the hunter knows where the kill zone is and is disciplined enough to deliver the shot! So, give me the benefit of the doubt...I will not use 6mm cast bullets on deer and I don't take my responsiblity to teach my nephew hunting ethics lightly...he will not be hunting deer with 6mm cast bullets either! Sorry about the rant but the thread seemed to turn into a disertation about my seemingly not being an accomplished enough hunter to know what to hunt deer with.
Anyway, thanks to those of you that offered helpful insights,
Jerry

[Bullshop]

Jerry
We have two boys here of several that opted for the stevens 243 when thier turn came for a rifle of thier own. I was absolutely amazed at the accuracy they got from box stock new barrels with boolits. Both rifles had no problem acheiving the accuracy you mantioned at 1.5 moa. I have some far more expensive rifles that are disapointing in comparison. Those stevens mod 200's at $235.00 just mad it seem so easy to shoot good groups with boolits. If that 243 of yours has a good barrel I dont think you will be disappointed with it.
BTW, I have answered the pm. Be glad to help ya!
Blessings
BIC/BS

[coalgeo]

Jerry
I think what you are doing with the .243 is great. My first deer rifle was a Savage 99 in .308 Win - just about put me off of shooting for good. You and your nephew can have a great time working up and shooting cast loads in the .243 while saving the jacketed for hunting as you said. I have been trying Accurate 5744 with cast loads and have several that work great in 6.5X55, .308, .30-06 and 8mm - very light recoil and accepatable accuracy. The .243 case may be a bit small for 5744 but I would email the Accurate folks and see if they have a recommened load for the .243.

[DrJay1st]

Finally figured that out! Where are you getting jacketed at a good price these days?

[coalgeo]

No "good" price. Mostly MidwayUSA, but I shoot so few jacketed (with the exception of High Power matches) that it doesn't hurt tooooo much
Greg

[DrJay1st]

I was hoping someone had a hookup on these jacketed bullets...they have gotten pretty high priced since I reloaded many years ago. Well, actually I've done just a little last year for elk hunting. That's one of the reason that I'm playing around with this cast thing...high prices...but it will be fun too.
Trying to hook up with Bullshop for some cast to experiment with but haven't heard back from him yet. If I can get some from him and with what Scrounger is sending me, I should be able to play with this cast thing for a while.
Jerry

[mroliver77]

Hmmm,
Bullshop stated he answered your PM.