barrel slugging result question

[Hannibal]

Ok. This question has likely been asked before but I never have good results trying to do a 'search' on this site, so here goes.
I've been fighting accuracy issues on a .308 Savage. There's another thread on that if you've been following it. Today I slugged the barrel.
This required quite a bit of tapping to get the slug started. Ok. I expected that.
About 1/3 of the way down the bore, it suddenly became VERY easy to push. Hmmm . . . Weird.
At about 2/3 point, the slug FREE TRAVELED THE REMAINING BORE LENGTH, FELL OUT OF THE BARREL AND LANDED ON THE FLOOR ! (???!!!!!!!!).
Said slug measures .307" and can easily be re-inserted from the muzzle end if the rifleing is lined-up.
Aren't barrels supposed to be the same diameter or perhaps slightly tighter toward the muzzle end?
Not the other way around?
Just slugged the barrel end and it measures .3085"

[MBTcustom]

One of my clients is struggling with the exact same issue, and when I slugged the barrel it was exactly like you describe verbatim.
This rifle is a Sako chambered in 6.4X284 Norma, glass bedded in a beutiful piece of American black walnut. The guy has spend hundreds on it. But it shoots 6" groups at 100 yards and will not improve no matter what he does, so he brought it to me.
I knew there was a problem with the barrel, and the slugs proved me right. Just in front of the breech, the groove diameter measured .2639 as it should have. However, the muzzle of the barrel measures .2679.
There is no way a barrel like that will shoot, and I doubt you'll get much love from yours either.
I think you should definitly call Savage and explain that you have a bad pipe. Please write up how that goes and report, as I would be very interested in the state of their customer service.

[mannyCA]

sounds like a bad barrel, definitely contact the manufacturer and explain the situation.

[runfiverun]

that or contact JES re-boring and have a nice 358 win rifle for a reasonable cost.

[Hannibal]

I wanted to make sure I understand rifle barrels correctly. Since we are apparently in agreement that this is not the correct way to bore a barrel, or at least not a method conducive to accuracy, then yes, I plan to contact Savage Monday and explain the situation. I'll updated the thread with their response. Thanks to those of you who have replied.

[DaveInFloweryBranchGA]

The very finest barrels I've had the opportunity of shooting have always had a very slight taper to be tighter as the slug approaches the muzzle, never the reverse. An expanding barrel bore would definitely allow gases to pass around the bullet/boolit and lose velocity and accuracy as well. Yes, that rifle needs to go back to Savage for sure and please keep us posted. I'm with the rest to see how they handle warranty issues.

[Hannibal]

Update : Savage has agreed to at least examine the rifle. UPS to pick-up in the next 2 days.

[gandydancer]

Update : Savage has agreed to at least examine the rifle. UPS to pick-up in the next 2 days.

Keep us all posted for sure on this. I'm a savage fan. I sent one rifle back a model 40 22 Hornet. turns out it was some very old ammo not the rifle. they where great about it. gd :bigsmyl2:

[Hannibal]

Update : Rifle arrived at Savage today and is already on its way back to me according to UPS tracking. I'm not sure if that's good or bad. I guess ill have to wait a week and see. [smilie=6:

[Garyshome]

Yes it's JUNK!

[leadman]

It does not take very long for an Savage experienced gunsmith to replace a barrel. Probably takes longer to determine the problem with the barrel, unless Savage had a run of bad barrels determined by serial number. Then they would probably just change the barrel, test fire, and ship.
Hope you get a good barrel.

[AlaskanGuy]

Wow Gary.... Kinda Harsh...

[Hannibal]

Yes it's JUNK!

Hmmmm . . . . not sure WHAT brought that on. Someone fell outta the wrong side of the bed?:-?

[Hannibal]

Update : I misunderstood the UPS tracking label info. Savage still has my rifle, but in response to my latest inquery they tell me they are replacing the barrel. Trouble is, it seems they have some sort if revolving 2 week shut-down they do in the summer, so no one will be in the finishing department to work on my rifle until 7/28. :groner:
Ah, well. At least it appears they are going to stand behind it.

[Garyshome]

Hey junk is junk, but sometimes I go a little over the top. Sorry!
I know if it was mine I would be saying much worse stuff to the people who made it, I would really be pissed off.

[Hannibal]

At this point, I'm going to reserve my comments/opinion until I see what I get back/how it shoots.

[btroj]

At this point, I'm going to reserve my comments/opinion until I see what I get back/how it shoots.

A wise choice.

I don't think any of the major manufacturers can say they never turned out a gun with a less than optimal barrel.

[mdi]

Hmmm. I always thought a barrel ID tapering to the muzzle was more accurate than a barrel with a "straight" bore or one that gradually got bigger towards the muzzle. ???

If I'm wrong, could someone 'splain it to me?

[Hannibal]

That's the problem. .307" at the chamber end, .3085 at muzzle end. Gradual taper between.

[mdi]

Just reread the OP and it read to me that the slug got easier as it neared the chamber. So, the muzzle was tighter (smaller ID) than the area near the chamber (2/3 of the way through)...

Unless, of course, the slug was started from the chamber end, but I've never done it that way...

[Hannibal]

I'm the OP. Slug was started from chamber end. Why? No good reason, that's just how I chose to do it.

[mdi]

I'm the OP. Slug was started from chamber end. Why? No good reason, that's just how I chose to do it.
OK, now I understand![smilie=s:

[woodbutcher]

:shock: Now that just sucks.
Good luck.Have fun.Be safe.
Leo

[Hannibal]

Conclusion : After nearly 11 weeks, my rifle was returned from Savage without any advance notice. Paperwork included with the rifle indicated that they had replaced the barrel, refinished the metal, function fired, target checked and proof tested the rifle. What I received was a barreled action that was no longer blued but matte finished, my original (apparently) blued bolt, and a barrel that slugs at exactly the same dimensions as the one that was on it when I sent it in. No target was included. If this barrel was in fact replaced, then they must be sitting on a mountain of defective barrels. Needless to say, the on-range accuracy remains the same. Words can not express my dis-appointment with the 'service' I have received. And you can bet I have purchased my last Savage product. Their trademark is 'The Definition Of Accuracy.' Hardly. Disgusting.

[Hannibal]

And the saga continues. I have contacted Savage once again and expressed my dis-satisfaction with their prior 'service'. And am 'patiently' awating their reply.

[CHeatermk3]

Don't give up and stay civil(at least with whomever you correspond/speak with).

I have an S&W 44mag pistol purchased in the '80s that had, among other more minor problems, an over-tightened barrel, which caused aiming problems--the sighst didn't line up. I bought this gun for IPSC and steel competition shooting because I favor wheel guns to the autoloaders (But Jerry Miculek I ain't).

I returned it to the factory along with a letter detailing the defects I'd found. A few weeks later it was returned to me in basicly the same condition it was in beforehand.

I sent it back to them(on my dime) and went into a bit more detail--I mentioned the fact that the pistol had been purchased for use in IPSC and steel competition and that if what they had returned to me was their version of customer service they could keep the pistol and send me a check for the purchase price (a copy of the bill of sale accompanied the second return). I remained civil and non-threatening in all my correspondence but I did say that my fellow competitors who were mostly auto-pistol shooters knew the gun had been returned but not that it had had to be re-returned.

A few days later i received a phone call from (I can't remember his name but some of you older pistoleros would recognize it I'm sure) the head of their custom shop. He told me that the problem with the barrel had been corrected and that they'd fired it at (I believe he said 25 yds) their test range with their factory testing ammo and it shot a sub-two-inch group, and was this acceptable? ( along with an apology).

I answered that it seemed so and to go ahead and ship the pistol back to me.

A few days later I received the test target along with a very accurate pistol that had also obviously been hand tuned and fitted--she still shoots like a dream.

[Silverboolit]

You could replace the barrel with a better one aftermarket. They are easy to install. Or, you could just firelap out the barrel that you have. If you firelap, you should have a barrel with a taper to the muzzle, like it should be. You are not talking about a lot of metal to remove and firelapping is pretty easily done.

[Hannibal]

You could replace the barrel with a better one aftermarket. They are easy to install. Or, you could just firelap out the barrel that you have. If you firelap, you should have a barrel with a taper to the muzzle, like it should be. You are not talking about a lot of metal to remove and firelapping is pretty easily done.
You are absolutely correct. I could replace the barrel. And i could fire-lap it. But the fire-lapping option only serves to create a condition of accelerated throat errosion, at best. Agreed?
But consider this. At some point, at least one person employed by Savage agreed that this defect was worthy of warrenty service. What I got back after twice as long as they estimated it would take was a rifle with a barrel in the EXACT same condition except that, now the barrel and receiver are matte finished and the bolt is blued.
I dont know how anyone else feels about matte finishes, but in my opinion they belong on military hardware and pawn shop junk. I DESPISE the fact that they sent me a matte receiver and barrel with my blued bolt.
REALLY ?????? !!!!!!!
Wow. Just, wow.