Bullet seating depth

[Tumtatty]

Hi I"m casting (for the first time!) boolits for my Enfield.

I bought a Lee mold that is supposed to cast a 160gr boolit. They have all come out closer to 170. I used 9lbs wheelweights and 1lb 50/50 solder.

When I seat the projectile they are substantially shorter than the mil surplus rounds I have been shooting.

I've read that the boolit should touch the rifling. I have no idea how to measure this distance but I'm relatively certain that the lead rounds are much shorter. Is this ok?

What do i do to remedy the problem if there is one?

Also, is there a load data chart for cast boolits. I have the Lyman book but it does not cover the right weights for my particular mold.

Thanks for the help!

[Maven]

There are several ways to determine this:

1) The easier way is to take a fired/empty cartridge and indent or bend the neck inward enough to hold a CB. Next, take the CB (no need to use a gas check) you'll be using and either color it with Magic Marker or cover it with soot by twirling it in a candle flame. Insert the CB in the cartridge to the forward portion of the gas check shank. Chamber the cartridge and gently withdraw it from the rifle. You should see bright rifling marks on the CB. Measure the OAL with a [dial indicating] caliper. Repeat this with several other empty cartridges and sooted/colored CB's to establish the OAL. If the CB sticks in the bore, you'll have to seat it deeper with your seating die and repeat the process.

2) This method involves coloring/smoking the CB too. Drop it into the breech and use a dowel and the rifle's bolt to push it into the rifling. Next, take a long cleaning rod and carefully insert it into the muzzle until it makes contact with the CB. Mark the rod at the muzzle with tape, an indelible marker, etc. Use the cleaning rod to knock the CB out of the breech. With the bolt closed on an empty chamber, gently insert the cleaning rod into the muzzle until it makes contact with the face of the closed bolt. Mark the rod at this point as well. Carefully withdraw the cleaning rod and measure the distance between the 2 marks with your caliper. This should give you the approx. OAL. Try seating a CB in a resized, belled case to this OAL. If it chambers easily with the rifling engraving the CB, you're almost done. If you can withdraw the dummy cartridge without leaving the CB in the bore, you're done: Measure & record the OAL and perhaps save the dummy round so you can quickly set up your seating die next time. If, on the other hand, you leave the CB in the bore, seat it slightly deeper until it is still marked by the rifling, yet doesn't debullet.

Btw, you're using way too much 50/50 solder in your alloy. I'd cut it to 4oz./ 10lbs. wheelweights (2.5% Sn) or less if possible (2 oz. : 10lbs. wheelweights = 1.25% Sn) since you don't need much Sn to lower the surface tension of your alloy.

Hope this helps!

[Dross]

2) This method involves coloring/smoking the CB too. Drop it into the breech and use a dowel and the rifle's bolt to push it into the rifling. Next, take a long cleaning rod and carefully insert it into the muzzle until it makes contact with the CB. Mark the rod at the muzzle with tape, an indelible marker, etc. Use the cleaning rod to knock the CB out of the breech. With the bolt closed on an empty chamber, gently insert the cleaning rod into the muzzle until it makes contact with the face of the closed bolt. Mark the rod at this point as well. Carefully withdraw the cleaning rod and measure the distance between the 2 marks with your caliper. This should give you the approx. OAL. Try seating a CB in a resized, belled case to this OAL. If it chambers easily with the rifling engraving the CB, you're almost done. If you can withdraw the dummy cartridge without leaving the CB in the bore, you're done: Measure & record the OAL and perhaps save the dummy round so you can quickly set up your seating die next time. If, on the other hand, you leave the CB in the bore, seat it slightly deeper until it is still marked by the rifling, yet doesn't debullet.

That's a nifty method.

I learn something new here everyday!

Thanks!:-D

[Tumtatty]

Also, is there a load data chart for cast boolits. I have the Lyman book but it does not cover the right weights for my particular mold.

[Calamity Jake]

"I have the Lyman book but it does not cover the right weights for my particular mold."

Just use the starting load for the next heaviest boolet.

As an example, if the book shows load data using 2400 powder or whatever and a 170 gr boolet but your boolet weights only 162, then us the starting load for the 170 gr boolet and work up or down .5 gr in powder charge for max accuracy.

[HORNET]

You can also drop down to the CB Loads/ Military rifles forum and search there. Lots of loading data. Also THE LOAD #1 or #2: 16.0 gr 2400 for heavier boolits or 13.0 gr Red Dot for lighter ones - adjust as needed. Usually gets you something to start with. Good luck.

[sav300]

Hi Tumtatty,have a look at the 303 page.They have a load for the 174 cast projectile.Good luck and have fun.
Lionel.

[Tumtatty]

There are several ways to determine this:

1) The easier way is to take a fired/empty cartridge and indent or bend the neck inward enough to hold a CB. Next, take the CB (no need to use a gas check) you'll be using and either color it with Magic Marker or cover it with soot by twirling it in a candle flame. Insert the CB in the cartridge to the forward portion of the gas check shank. Chamber the cartridge and gently withdraw it from the rifle. You should see bright rifling marks on the CB. Measure the OAL with a [dial indicating] caliper. Repeat this with several other empty cartridges and sooted/colored CB's to establish the OAL. If the CB sticks in the bore, you'll have to seat it deeper with your seating die and repeat the process.

2) This method involves coloring/smoking the CB too. Drop it into the breech and use a dowel and the rifle's bolt to push it into the rifling. Next, take a long cleaning rod and carefully insert it into the muzzle until it makes contact with the CB. Mark the rod at the muzzle with tape, an indelible marker, etc. Use the cleaning rod to knock the CB out of the breech. With the bolt closed on an empty chamber, gently insert the cleaning rod into the muzzle until it makes contact with the face of the closed bolt. Mark the rod at this point as well. Carefully withdraw the cleaning rod and measure the distance between the 2 marks with your caliper. This should give you the approx. OAL. Try seating a CB in a resized, belled case to this OAL. If it chambers easily with the rifling engraving the CB, you're almost done. If you can withdraw the dummy cartridge without leaving the CB in the bore, you're done: Measure & record the OAL and perhaps save the dummy round so you can quickly set up your seating die next time. If, on the other hand, you leave the CB in the bore, seat it slightly deeper until it is still marked by the rifling, yet doesn't debullet.

Btw, you're using way too much 50/50 solder in your alloy. I'd cut it to 4oz./ 10lbs. wheelweights (2.5% Sn) or less if possible (2 oz. : 10lbs. wheelweights = 1.25% Sn) since you don't need much Sn to lower the surface tension of your alloy.

Hope this helps!


Hi Maven,
I've just tried both methods. It seems the OAL is longer than I can possible make my Boolits. I smoked a surplus bullet and it didn't even engage the rifling. THe cast Boolits are much shorter than their copper brethren. When I marked the cleaning rod, the OAL marked on it is longer than the surplus ammo. do I need a different mold?

Thanks

[dromia]

Enfields have loong throats, I've never managed to get a bullet or boolit to reach the rifling. Thats even with new barrels, if they've been shot with cordite then throat erosion happens after a few thousand rounds so throat wear is usual on Enfiields

Best thing to do is take a chamber cast and size to fit the throat as best you can, this will get the boolit centred for its journey to the rifling.

Neck resizing helps here too keeping the boolit centred.

You want that cast boolit to get to the rifling as intact as possible so the more support it has in the throat the better.

Lymans 314299 along with CBE designs all seem to work well in in my Enfields, I've had less success with the Lees.

They seem to like fat boolits at least 2 thou over groove diameter.

[Maven]

Tumtatty, What dromia said especially the part about CBE molds. Here's a link:

CAST BULLET ENGINEERING Bullet Moulds MoldsBULLET LUBE SHOP · NEW DESIGNS 2007 · TARGETS SENT TO US BY CUSTOMERS ... 2007 CAST BULLET ENGINEERING Bullet Moulds Molds.
www.castbulletengineering.bigpondhosting.com/custom.htm