Curious about gun cleaning??

[Whitespider]

So... my guns that see only cast boolits never (well, almost never) see any bore solvent. Usually I just run a dry bronze brush through the bore a few times followed by a couple tight-fitting dry cotton patches. Revolver cylinders may get hit with some dry bronze wool or such if there's noticeable build-up ahead of the case mouth, followed by dry patches. Finally I wipe any soot, carbon, and whatever off the exterior with a dry cotton rag before wiping it down with an oily sheep-skin. I use a homemade, soft, sticky boolit lube (actually contains some Crisco) that seems to keep powder fouling soft and from sticking to the bore... the fouling wipes right out, and micro-thin layer of lube seems to remain in the bore.

So, I've done it this way for years.
But, just this last weekend a friend of my son's informed me that dry brushing will ruin a barrel... that the brush needs the solvent as a lubricant. I wanted to call BS, but really, I just didn't know for sure... never really gave it much thought.

Is the guy full of BS??
I'm thinkin' yes... but... well, like I said, ain't never thought about it (shrug).

[Pb2au]

I doubt very, very much that a copper/brass/nylon bore brush will wear out a bore when run dry. I mean sure, if you spend every waking minute of every day scrubbing, you might impact it,,,,,maybe.......
Now, a stainless steel brush.....That's is another story.

[steve817]

Is your gun still accurate?

[DeanWinchester]

If there's no leading in the bore and they are still accurate, my guns NEVER see a brush. Couple of dry patches to wipe out the soot and I'm done.
I've got an old Mauser in 308 that I've never cleaned and probably never will. The load is accurate.
I had an Ishapore in 308 a while back that would shoot 6-8 inch groups when clean. Once the bore settled in it would tighten up to under 3. Went round and round with that until I figured out what was going on. Since then, I clean when I HAVE to. The actions on the other hand get cleaned and lubricated regularly.

[dubber123]

I work my loads until I don't get any leading, and then I never have felt the need to brush. I will run one (1) single oily patch down the bore when done shooting/ Chambers do get brushed when they get gunked up, but normally get the same single oily patch treatment. How many rounds can you go? I guess that depends, but in my 1911 I put perhaps 20,000 rounds down it only brushing the chamber maybe 3 times to clear the accumulated lube and crud. The bore never got any more than an oily patch. It looks like a mirror. I finally did a full cleaning out of guilt.

As to damage, I shot my 625 S&W for competition a few years, and I brushed the chambers after every 12 shot string to assure a smooth, fast reload. I used the dreaded stainless brush, and I think I even bought .50 cal ones to cut the crud out faster between rounds. Each chamber got a minimum of 2 passes. I put nearly 30,000 rounds through that gun, so a LOT of brushing. I can see NO wear at all, the minute mill marks in each chamber it had when new are still there. I don't care for scrubbing on a guns bore, but I doubt it really introduces much wear. I just don't find it necessary in my case.

[Whitespider]

Yeah... I figured he was just repeating what granddad said or some such.
The reason I run a dry bronze brush through the bore a few times (like 4 or 5 times) is to check for any leading before patching. If there's any bore leading at all a brush will spatter out a few flakes of it (or, heaven forbid, worse). I could likely stop that practice with established loads, ain't seen those flakes for a long time now in most of 'em... I still have a couple revolvers that tend to show a bit now-and-then.

[williamwaco]

Let's see now - a dry copper/bronze/nylon brush at .25 feet per second at 75 degrees will ruin a barrel?

But a dry jacketed bullet at 3,000 feet per second and 2,000 degrees is OK?

YEAH! sure! I believe that!

[jonp]

Is copper harder than steel? Unless your Superman or The Flash and running the brush at the speed of light id not worry a whole lot. If it were true why has no-one mentioned this before?

[Le Loup Solitaire]

It will be an incredibly long time before any one wears (out) a bore by using a bronze or copper brush with or without any solvent on it. You should not have to do that kind of scrub-a-dub dub anyway in order to clean a firearm any way. Of course in the cleaning of a long neglected gun it may be necessary to persist, but you will not degrade/abrade a steel barrel with a brush of softer metal. If you have been advised to the contrary by "resident specialists" of the hot stove league and still have lingering doubts then use a nylon brush. LLS

[Shiloh]

I doubt very, very much that a copper/brass/nylon bore brush will wear out a bore when run dry. I mean sure, if you spend every waking minute of every day scrubbing, you might impact it,,,,,maybe.......
Now, a stainless steel brush.....That's is another story.

Probably damage the crown and the last two inches of barrel. NEVER USE STAINLESS!!

Shiloh

[gray wolf]

If it's just a little power and lube I clean as needed, when it needs a brush I use a brush,
if I get some leading I use chore boy. I used brushes all my life as needed and I don't think I ever had to have a gun re-barreled because of it.

So I say in moderation they are OK.

[jonp]

Probably damage the crown and the last two inches of barrel. NEVER USE STAINLESS!!

Shiloh

Indeed. Ive always wondered what the point to one is. If the barrel is that bad then kroil and jb bore paste is called foR which, along with some montana extreme copper solvent, ive used on a couple of surplus military rifles.

[canyon-ghost]

I use mineral spirits, the paint thinner from the lumber yard to clean with. It takes the black fouling out a little better than dry brushing and it dissolves a little of the carnuba lube. But, with cast, you won't ever need anything else. Powder fouling is the main thing I use it for, right before I oil the bore.

[MtGun44]

Bronze is softer than steel.

End of discussion.

Bill

[sigep1764]

I guess I'm the only one, but I scrub my guns clean with solvent then oil the barrel and slide rails after every range session. I just like clean guns. Even my rifles and shotguns get a complete breakdown including the bolt once a year. Other than that, I just scrub and oil the barrels lightly and a light coat of oil on the receivers to prevent rust. I know its not necessary but it gives me something to do. I'm single so nobody complains about the smell.

[lar45]

I had an Ishapore in 308 .

I don't mean to hijack this thread, but the Ishapore SMLE is chambered for the 7.62 NATO which runs at a lower pressure than 308 Win. Use of 308 ammo can stretch the action.

[Whitespider]

Hmmmmm......
I've heard it called seasoning, conditioning and a couple other terms over the years... that sort'a phenomenon where cast just don't shoot right until ya' run a few down the bore. Some guns seem to be more sensitive to it than others, but most of my revolvers require at least a dozen rounds down a clean, oiled bore before they settle-in. I only have a few rifles that I shoot cast in... mostly the low(er) velocity rounds like the .45-70, .30-30, .22 Hornet, etc. My Hornet shoots groups resembling shotgun patterns until it "seasons", which requires at least a half-dozen or so rounds.

I avoid that issue, or process, by just hitting the bore a couple times with the brush to loosen anything that may be clinging, and push a couple dry patches through. That seems to leave the bore bright, yet still "seasoned", and semi-protected by a coating of boolit lube. It wouldn't be my choice for long-term storage, but I've never had problems on the short-term. The benefit is my first shot tends to shoot where the gun looks, which is more important for some than others. My Hornet is the yard and garden pest eliminator... I need the first shot to shoot where it looks.

I suppose I should mention that I don't haf'ta "pack-up" and go to the range... my shooting range and bench is just a few yards from my back door. I can, or do, shoot whenever it strikes me to do so, sometimes even more than once in a day. It also simplifies load development and testing because I don't haf'ta make up a bunch of different variables at the same time... I load a few and walk out to the bench, then leave everything set-up and laying on the bench while I walk in the house to make a change, repeat as needed.

[captaint]

I always use a bronze brush after shooting. Just old habits, that's all. A little solvent, a little oil, ready to roll. I have worn out my share of bore brushes..... What does that tell ya ?? Mike

[Cmm_3940]

I use a wet bronze brush, mostly from habit, I guess. The rod handle spins freely and I let the brush follow the rifling grooves. Then wet patch, dry patch, dry patch. This is usually much more than is needed. Hoppes #9, because, well, it's Hoppes #9. That smell. :)

[jonp]

I always use a bronze brush after shooting. Just old habits, that's all. A little solvent, a little oil, ready to roll. I have worn out my share of bore brushes..... What does that tell ya ?? Mike

Pretty much. Old habit. Patch with Solvent usually Hoppes #9, let it sit for a minute while I run one through the other guns as I rarely shoot one gun, couple of passes with the brush then another pass with a patch and Hoppes then a dry one. A little Oil and they are put away. I'm not anal about it though. I might let them sit for a few days before I clean them.

[Bloodman14]

The only cleaning my rifles have seen is a bore mop dipped in a 50/50 mix of 2-cycle motor oil and ATF. Squeeze out the excess and run it through a couple of strokes; done.

[AlaskanGuy]

Ewwwwwwww you use atf and 2 cycle???? Yuk.... And smelly...

:kidding:

[Whitespider]

Two-cycle oil and ATF... well that's certainly a new one on me.

ATF is basically mineral oil with slickeries and friction modifiers added... two-cycle oil can have near anything added, usually including fuel stabilizer of some sort. I believe you could skip the mixin' step by just using Marvel Mystery Oil straight from the jug... which is nothing more than mineral oil with slickeries, friction modifiers, various petroleum distillates (two-cycle oil), and fuel stabilizers (more petroleum distillates) added.

I ain't gonna' use it or your mix... but if'n it works for ya'... well, who am I to slam it??

[Bloodman14]

It was an experiment; I thought that the mix would not only wipe out any powder fouling, but keep the bore oiled to fight rust. It seems to be O.K. You are right about the smell.

[TXGunNut]

The last few years I shot PPC I didn't "clean" the bore of my revolvers. We shot swaged lead bullets lubed with something similar to Alox, bought the bullets so can't say for sure. I'd knock off the loose stuff with a dry brush, dust it out with a dry patch. I did scrub the cylinder and forcing cone with solvent, brush and patches as the powder and lube did build up there a bit. We figured the bore "fouling" built up to a point and stopped. A fouled bore almost always outperfomed a clean one in Ransom rest tests.

[bbqncigars]

I only use a brush if the bore scope shows it's needed. You haven't had true fun until you've scrubbed a coppered 50BMG bore. That's when a good stainless brush is an arm saver.

[hickfu]

I never run a brush through any of my rifles unless there is leading (there never is...) so its just usually just a dry patch to remove carbon and the barrel is nice and shiny again.. If I put the gun up for a time I will run a patch with some Hoppe's 9 on it.

Doc

[MarkP]

I use dry medical cotton wrapped around a Parker Hale style jag when shooting cast loads.

When shooting jacketed or shotgun; I Moisten the cotton with homemade solvent (ATF, K1, Acetone, Mineral Spirits), I let the solvent sit in the bore for a few minutes, repeat with damp cotton, followed by a wet brushing or two, then dry cotton since I store my guns vertically.

[JonB_in_Glencoe]

I use a jag and dry patch for rifles and that's it...unless something more is needed...when more is needed, it's usually Ed's Red and a bronze brush.

Revolvers tend to get sooty on the outside, so they usually get patched with Ed's Red right away inside and out.

Semi-auto pistols usually get a field strip and cleaned with Ed's Red as well.

Now to the original post...There is plenty of lube "residue" from your crisco lube in the barrel to lubricate the brush...but as it has already been pointed out...That's not needed to 'SAVE' the bore :) lol

[Dale in Louisiana]

Here's an interesting and thorough look at the efficacy of gun oils.

It took the guy a lot of time and effort to put together, and it's worth the read:

Gun oils (http://forums.outdoorsdirectory.com/showthread.php/141077-Results-of-gun-care-product-evaluation)

I found it interesting.

dale in Louisiana
(a big fan of Ed's Red)

[Firebricker]

Dale, That is a great link thanks for posting it. And a big thanks to Mr. Crabtree for his efforts. FB

[M-Tecs]

Dale great link, thanks

[dragon813gt]

Great, the product I currently use was middle of the pack all around. Some of the ones I used to use excelled on some areas but were utter failures in others. Seems to me if you keep everything clean and lubed you have nothing to worry about.

The only part I see missing from his test is an evaporation test. Anyone that has used WD40 knows it leaves a brown varnish behind that gums everything up. I'm wondering if the top performers will leave anything behind that will cause problems like WD40 does.

[Whitespider]

In the end of February my son and a buddy were here to use my range. After they'ed run through there 100 rounds each I broke out a few of my revolvers. One of them, a snub-nosed .44 Special (Taurus M14), hadn't been shot in maybe 4(?) years. Darn thing wouldn't fire... the hammer fell so slow you could watch it and the action felt horribly "sluggish".

I pulled it apart the next day to see what was going on in there... the lubricant/grease I'd used the last time I went through the action had turned into something resembling the glue-like stuff used on flytrap strips. I could lift the side plate off the bench by just touching the inside surface with my finger. The gun lubricant I'd used is a well known brand... and I don't wanna' minimize my 4 (or possibly more) years of neglect(?)... but still, I was somewhat surprised. The grease, which I use extensively on bearing surfaces like hammer and trigger pivot pins, is called Pro-Gold Lubricant from Pro-Shot Products. Anyway, I'll be going through the actions of all my guns (especially those that have been shelved for some time) as the mood strikes me over the next few months or so. A gun that won't operated at a moments notice is as good as a club... heck, a club is better, they're easier to hold while ya' swing 'em.

[dubber123]

I switched long ago to 0W-20 Mobil 1 synthetic motor oil. It seems to be the same viscosity as many gun oils, never seems to dry out or gum up, works awesome in cold weather, and you get a full quart for about $6.

[dragon813gt]

The grease, which I use extensively on bearing surfaces like hammer and trigger pivot pins, is called Pro-Gold Lubricant from Pro-Shot Products.
I stopped using this due to poor cold weather performance. Anything below freezing and it slowed everything down no matter how much I wiped off. For range toys it's no big deal. But it was on some of my hunting firearms so I discontinued its use.

[jonp]

I stopped using this due to poor cold weather performance. Anything below freezing and it slowed everything down no matter how much I wiped off. For range toys it's no big deal. But it was on some of my hunting firearms so I discontinued its use.
When hunting in cold weather I completly clean the firearm and do not lube with anything just wipe it with hoppes and then a dry patch/cloth. I also leave the firearm outside.

[jonp]

Here's an interesting and thorough look at the efficacy of gun oils.

It took the guy a lot of time and effort to put together, and it's worth the read:

Gun oils (http://forums.outdoorsdirectory.com/showthread.php/141077-Results-of-gun-care-product-evaluation)

I found it interesting.

dale in Louisiana
(a big fan of Ed's Red)

That's a great read. I watched a youtube video where the guy used boilerplate or something and did quite an exhaustive test. I think he found Rem Oil and Mobil One winners but I can't be sure of that.
I clean with hoppes 9 and use Ballistol short term, or use Ballistol for clean and lube, and Rem Oil for longer term storage and have not had a problem.
For tough cleaning jobs like copper its montana extreme, for pb I use kroil and really tough stuff kroil/jb bore paste.
I guess if I was going to put the guns away for a year or more id use RIG but ive never done that.

[Whitespider]

Sort of a funny story...
Probably 40 years ago Dad and I were pheasant hunting around the area were he grew up. We stopped at this old farm to ask permission and the old farmer recognized dad... after a short re-acquaintance the old boy said he'd go out with us. So he walks over to one of the out-buildings (I don't remember which), reaches inside the door, and produces an old rusty model 97 with a whiskey cork stuck in the muzzle, and a filthy box of ammunition (paper shells). He yanked the whiskey cork and tried working the action... which wouldn't open all the way. We watched as he walked over to the fuel oil tank and opened the drain valve sightly... stuck the action under the steam and began working it until he was satisfied. Then he wiped the "excess" off with his shirt tail, loaded the gun, gave us a grin and pointed to the east... "let's go boys, I've been hearin' them ring-necks over this-a-way."

Ya' know what... that old boy was a pretty good shot‼

[Shiloh]

Here's an interesting and thorough look at the efficacy of gun oils.

It took the guy a lot of time and effort to put together, and it's worth the read:

Gun oils (http://forums.outdoorsdirectory.com/showthread.php/141077-Results-of-gun-care-product-evaluation)

I found it interesting.

dale in Louisiana
(a big fan of Ed's Red)

What a thorough study and evaluation!! I'm an Ed's Red fan as well.

Shiloh

[Dale in Louisiana]

Great, the product I currently use was middle of the pack all around. Some of the ones I used to use excelled on some areas but were utter failures in others. Seems to me if you keep everything clean and lubed you have nothing to worry about.

The only part I see missing from his test is an evaporation test. Anyone that has used WD40 knows it leaves a brown varnish behind that gums everything up. I'm wondering if the top performers will leave anything behind that will cause problems like WD40 does.

A lot of people in the electrical field used to refer to WD-40 as "PM (preventive maintenance) in a can" because they could walk up to s sticky circuit breaker (big ones: 13,800 up to 500,000 volts) and squirt a bit of WD-40 into the mechanism, operate it a few times, and --BINGO!!-- it would operate like new. Trouble was, all it had done was soften the old grease. When the solvent evaporated, the breaker was in worse shape than before. When a circuit breaker is called upon to trip and doesn't, in the big power world, a system called "Breaker failure" goes into action, and instead of the correct breaker tripping - it's stuck - the system trips the next breaker up the line, so instead of maybe a city block going dark, you lose a quarter of a good-sized city. Don't ask me how I know.

I've opened up shotguns that were 'maintained' by spraying them down with WD-40 after a day in the marsh. After a few of these cycles, that varnish builds up and -BINGO!- "Uh, can you look at my shotgun? It ain't working right."

In its place, WD-40 is good. That bit about spraying down a shotgun after a wet day out? Good idea. WD is water displacing. As long as when you get home, you clean the gun right and then use a real lube.

dale in Louisiana

[jonp]

Idk about what you said dale. While wd40 has been panned in a number of tests as a gun lube the product tested here is not the typical yellow and blue can stuff.

I'm very surprised at the one shot. Different color can but is this the same case lube stuff I've started useing?

[725]

I brush, oil patch, Ed's Red solvent, and once clean, I leave it wet with Kroil or Ed's Red until next use. Then I dry patch it a few times before the first round

[detox]

I use a Dewey plastic coated cleaning rod and try to be VERY careful around crown of barrel.