.38 Special - which wadcutter?

[selmerfan]

If you were to purchase a wadcutter mold for a .38 Special, which would you recommend? Not looking to spend a mint, just a good, solid, at least double cavity mold. Are hollow base wadcutter molds even available?

[Dframe]

Yes hollowbase wadcutter moulds are available(look in the group buy section) . I'd check the "for sale" section of this forum. Wadcutter moulds for 38 wadcutter are still quite popular. Perhaps the best of the best is an H&G #50 but you'll find that one very pricey. Lyman, Saeco, and Lee (aluminum) all are available. They're generally available at a reasonable price.

[gefiltephish]

For cheap, the Lee 148 bullet is pretty good. I also have a 155 NOE 5 cav I like a lot better. I have no complaints with the Lee bullet, I just don't care much for the quality of their molds.

[Walter Laich]

My 'holy grail' of 38 wadcutters is Lyman 358101, a 75 gr one that makes the 38 Sp into a mouse-f@rt round. I think NOE makes a copy but it's up there in cost.
Have a Lyman 358405 141 gr wadcutter that does a fine job in the real world

[fecmech]

The H&G #50 and Lyman 358495 are both excellent accurate wadcutters and if a wadcutter is what you want they would be my picks. That said despite what many people think, wadcutters are not the most accurate bullet in .38's. The Lyman 358311 and H&G #39 RN's along with Lee,Lyman and RCBS 120-125 TC bullets IME will outshoot wadcutters at any range you care to try them. They will not however cut clean scoring holes in target paper, that's their downside.

[Tatume]

I have the excellent Lee six cavity mold for 148 grain conventional wad cutters, and have been very pleased with it. The quality is outstanding, and the mold casts buckets of high quality wad cutter bullets in a big hurry. It is worth much more than the typical selling price of $40.

Take care, Tom

[selmerfan]

Well I like the idea of that pretty round hole in the target, but honestly won't be shooting any competition. I've already got a Lee 158 gr RFN mold that should also work well, and several hundred Lyman 358627 SWC PB 215gr bullets from my .357 Max days. I had a guy offer me an H&G #527 10 cavity mold for $285-a little out of my budget...

[ShooterAZ]

I have the RCBS 38-148-WC, and it casts nicely. I agree however with fecmech regarding the RF shooting more accurately (for me anyway). I also have the RCBS 38-140-CM, and these boolits with outshoot the wadcutters all day long.

[Ed_Shot]

I really like my Lyman 358495 but I agree that the Lyman 358311 RN or 358477 SW or Lee 358-158-RF are hard to beat.

[N4AUD]

I have the Lee 2 cavity TL 158 gr semiwadcutter. Works great for me.

[azrednek]

I have the Lee TL 148 WC and an older Lyman hollow based mold. I load them both with anywhere from 2.7 -3.0 grs of Bullseye. Both are very accurate at close range and if there is any improvement with the hollow based in the shot to shot accuracy I haven't seen it on paper.

The hollow based are a real PIA to cast and dropping one vs 6 at a time it is a no brainer. The hollow base mold also has a high rate of rejects.

I've tried both methods, conventionally sized and lubed or tumble lube as cast with both. If there was any improvement of one over the other it has to be very insignificant as I couldn't see it on paper.

In summary IMHO casting with the hollow base is simply not worth the extra work and considerably more time dropping them one at a time or six at a time.

[MT Gianni]

I have owned and shot the LY 35863 a reversible wc, 358495, hb 358395, 358462 and at least one other. I don't think there is an inch difference between the best and worst shooting from my guns. I have stuck with the 495 and the 395 hb for most use. I use the hb only with pure and a low charge of BE, I like the convinence of the double end wad cutter, 35863 but get my best groups with ones that have a nose on the end.

[Cherokee]

My only WC experience is with the Lyman 358495 and it shot well for me. However, I switched to the Lyman 358477 years ago and it shoots as good or better.

[Beagle333]

358432 with a HP pin. Oh yeah.

I like em "Zombie" style. :D
http://i613.photobucket.com/albums/tt214/shutupandjump/PowderCoating/HF025_zps3395dd5e.jpg

[azrednek]

I know I'm wondering away slightly from the gist of this thread. For 38 Special I've grown fond of the Lee 125gr RNF. Although not quite as accurate as the full wad cutters I really like its versatility. I can also use the same casting in 9MM with 100% reliability in a semi-auto.

Originally I sized and lubed the 125 RNF .358 for 38 special and .356 for 9MM. My last batch I sized all of them to .357 for use I both calibers. I didn't see any significant drop off in the shot to shot accuracy in either caliber.

The 125RNF makes a wonderful plinking round for either caliber but I'm still stubborn enough when I want to take the time to load for max accuracy in 38 Special. The 148 WC remains my favorite.

I cast the wad cutters with as close to pure as I have on hand. I might add just a touch of tin if I'm not satisfied the mold if filling properly. I have cast the 148 WC's with varying degrees of hardness and in my experience the closer to pure the more accurate. With Lee's Tumble Lube diluted apx 50/50 with paint thinner. Just a light coat works as well as coating them thickly. If I'm packing them away for long term storage. A very light coating of Motor Mica keeps them from sticking together. For what it is worth as it has no effect whatsoever on accuracy. The coated boolits do not smoke as much when fired.

[Beagle333]

Yeah, I only like the 160 version. You don't have to coat em, you can just lube em with TAC#1 and some pop-can checks and light them babies up!
http://i613.photobucket.com/albums/tt214/shutupandjump/cast%20boolits/tb2_zpse59f34ff.jpg

But it sure does make a pretty wadcutter.
http://i613.photobucket.com/albums/tt214/shutupandjump/cast%20boolits/T-buster1_zpsdc737336.jpg

[Beagle333]

The 358063 is fun too. And talk about easy to cast!
http://i613.photobucket.com/albums/tt214/shutupandjump/cast%20boolits/063003_zps881c44d8.jpg

[tazman]

Now those are some seriously impressive boolits.

[Bullwolf]

I normally load and shoot Semi-Wad Cutters, but I have a gun that is very full Wad Cutter friendly.

So I recently picked up a pair of Lee double ended WC moulds. Both regular lube groove, and TL design. Then cast a few from both to see how they would turn out.

I'm kind of liking the TL version more so far.

The TL WC seemed to be easier to cast with for some reason. Maybe it was the lack of vent lines on the new Lee mould, or perhaps I just haven't quite gotten both moulds broken in yet. To be fair I haven't shot both styles side by side to compare them yet either.

So I lubed and loaded up 100 of the 147 grain TL WC's sized at .358 and I went with 3.0 to 3.5 grains of Bullseye since that tends to be a moderately accurate load.

I roll crimped the TL WC in the last small tumble lube groove, for a loaded cartridge Over All Length of 1.225

The TL boolit just felt right there, even though that was a tad deeper than the 1.265 OAL for the regular (non TL) DE WC boolit's dedicated crimp groove.

Now I need to go play with them some and see how the full WC's shoot compared to my regular SWC load.




- Bullwolf

[MT Gianni]

If your gun allows it I get far better accuracy with FWFL by lubing one groove than multiple grooves.

[StrawHat]

For years I fed my PPC competition gun with a pair of 2 cavity Lee 150 DEWC molds. If I were to start over agin, I would get a six cavity mold. I lubed one groove and loaded the traditional 2.8 grains of Bullseye. They all went right to the point of aim. Cast a bit harder and shot a bit faster, they made decent hunting boolits also.

[willvabch]

I have the lee 148 WC mold. I make them 50/50 and size them to .359.

[mdi]

Eveything you'd want to know about wadcutters; http://www.lasc.us/Fryxell_Book_Chapter_11_Wadcutter.htm

[azrednek]

they made decent hunting boolits also.

I used my wadcutter load just once for hunting. Long story but I forgot my 357's. I shot a Javalina with the wadcutter load and all I did was piss him off.

[dubber123]

I did a bunch of 50 yard testing a year or so ago, I have the H&G 50, numerous Lyman designs, and RCBS versions. The LEE version with conventional lube grooves shoots just as good as any at 50 yards, and as stated by several before me, all are out shot by several RN and RF designs. The 358311 is common as dirt, and very accurate. BRP's 360640 RF is my personal favorite.

[Lefty Red]

I have the Lyman 358432 WC as well. Nice bullet!
I load the LEE 358-148-WC mostly for my buddy who teaches the CCW classes for IL.
I think the Lee TL-358-148-WC is better , IMHO. Its bevel base makes loading easier. But I like the "button nose" of the PB 148gr design.
I also have the LEE 358-155-SWC and 358-140-SWC as well. Both are good and the 140gr is what my S&W 642 likes the most.

Lefty

[StrawHat]

...I used my wadcutter load just once for hunting...

Don't use a target load. Cast the bullet a bit harder and load it to 900 fps. They hit hard and go deep and straight.

[selmerfan]

So what I've gleaned from all of your responses (thank you!) is that the Lee 158-RF that I already own is perfectly suitable for ringing up steel with my .38 Special? Another assumption destroyed - I always assumed wadcutters were more precise because they were used for target shooting, but their primary benefit in shooting paper targets is the big, clean hole - right? Anyone want to trade me some wadcutters for lead before I buy another mold? I'd love to try both DEWC and HBWC and compare them to my 158 RF in a K38 Masterpiece .38 Special that I'll be purchasing from a member here.

[selmerfan]

Eveything you'd want to know about wadcutters; http://www.lasc.us/Fryxell_Book_Chapter_11_Wadcutter.htm

Silly me - I have the whole book printed off in a binder. Thanks for the link and reminder - questions answered.

[45-70 Chevroner]

If you were to purchase a wadcutter mold for a .38 Special, which would you recommend? Not looking to spend a mint, just a good, solid, at least double cavity mold. Are hollow base wadcutter molds even available?
Hollow base or hollow point molds are only available in single cavity. I would not even go there, there is no advantage to hollow base wad cutters.

[armednfree]

I have a 4 cavity H+G and that mold makes some of the prettiest bullets you ever saw.Don't use it much though. Mostly I use 38 as a combat training round, wadcutters and speed loaders don't jive.

I thought about swapping it off, but nobody's got what I want.

[StrawHat]

Hollow base or hollow point molds are only available in single cavity. I would not even go there, there is no advantage to hollow base wad cutters.

Please don't tell Eric, he converts multi cavity molds into wonderful HP or HB molds, and retains the multi cavity function.

http://www.hollowpointmold.com/

[TMenezes]

358432 with a HP pin. Oh yeah.

I like em "Zombie" style. :D
http://i613.photobucket.com/albums/tt214/shutupandjump/PowderCoating/HF025_zps3395dd5e.jpg

That's neat, how do you do that?

[45-70 Chevroner]

Please don't tell Eric, he converts multi cavity molds into wonderful HP or HB molds, and retains the multi cavity function.

http://www.hollowpointmold.com/
Maybe I should phrase that differently, commercial companies like Lyman, RCBS, Lee, and others don't offer multi cavity hollow point or hollow base molds.

[David2011]

The briefly mentioned Saeco wadcutter is a superb boolit. They used to make one with the lube grooves of the #052 and the nose of the #053. For years it was the only boolit I shot.

David

[Mr_Sheesh]

TMenezes - I'd expect Beagle will reply that those boolits are PC'ed (Powder Coated) - Smoke4320 sells PC supplies on the Vendor Services (VS) section. I haven't tried it yet, planning to tho :)

[brewer12345]

So what I've gleaned from all of your responses (thank you!) is that the Lee 158-RF that I already own is perfectly suitable for ringing up steel with my .38 Special? Another assumption destroyed - I always assumed wadcutters were more precise because they were used for target shooting, but their primary benefit in shooting paper targets is the big, clean hole - right? Anyone want to trade me some wadcutters for lead before I buy another mold? I'd love to try both DEWC and HBWC and compare them to my 158 RF in a K38 Masterpiece .38 Special that I'll be purchasing from a member here.

I shoot a fair bit of RFs (different molds than the Lee, but similar design) because the lever action likes them. They are very accurate in the rifle and reasonable in the revolvers. That said, I shoot far more DEWCs than any other bullet of any caliber or design. Out of my revolvers, they are far more accurate than any bullet design. I have two copies of Lyman/Ideal 358495 and a group buy Mihec 8 cavity copy of the H&G 50 design. They cast within a grain of each other and appear to be interchangeable (all like 3.8 grains of HP38). I also shoot Hornady HWBCs (over 2.2 grains of Trail Boss in a snub) and the Berry's plated DEWC (extremely accurate over 4 grains of HP38, one day I will hot rod these things in 357 cases to see what they can do).

Post in the bullet swapping subforum and see if you can get your hands on sample lots of any bullet designs that take your fancy. I would suggest it is well worth getting a wadcutter mold.

[PbHurler]

Miha produced a VERY nice mold here

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?342034-MP-H-amp-G-50-38-Wadcutter-Rerun-Hollow-Base-Brass-or-8-Cavity-Solid-Aluminum

His website shows it to be in stock (4 cavity Brass) @ 135.00 Eu which is roughly $166.00 US

https://www.mp-molds.com/e-shop/molds/hb-molds/mp-hg-50-hbwc-38-357

I don't know if you want to go this much for a mold, but I'll vouch for it being a great mold since you get 3 design changes with one mold.

[Green Frog]

Beagle333, I’m sure the target is honored to be hit with those bullets with the classy multi colored gas checks. Does the aluminum protect the base of the bullets as well as copper (at least for our levels of use?) :confused:

The green PC bullets are kinda pretty. Of course I’m a little biased! ;)

Green Frog

[evoevil]

Just got on a group buy for a SWC from MP Mold. I like the different pins I can add. It will reduce the weight and still shoot good. Not cheap. I have a Lee that makes 152 SWC is what it drops. Mold was only 42 bucks and works nice

[lightman]

Yes hollowbase wadcutter moulds are available(look in the group buy section) . I'd check the "for sale" section of this forum. Wadcutter moulds for 38 wadcutter are still quite popular. Perhaps the best of the best is an H&G #50 but you'll find that one very pricey. Lyman, Saeco, and Lee (aluminum) all are available. They're generally available at a reasonable price.

You can occasionally find the H&G 50 for reasonable prices. It was one of their most common molds and often sells for less than their other molds. It is common in multi-cavity, often in 6, 8 or even 10 cavities. It is also available in different diameters, from .356 to .358.

[Leadmelter]

Lyman WC worked for me. Watch evil bay, they come up quite frequently there.
Leadmelter

[Hardcast416taylor]

When I was in big shooting indoor PPC with a S&W model 14 6" barrel that was smoothed up `just a little`. I can`t begin to guess how many thousands of the Lyman #358495 mold that I made using 2 molds that threw 4 per drop. I used straight WW as I could get so much of the stuff that I used it straight. I sized them .359" and only lubed the bottom groove with a brown NRA formula lube. I used WW std spp under 3.0 gr. of either HP-38 or Win. 231. Over the years I took a match or so and a trophy of so also using this pistol and load.Robert

[Echo]

I saw an ad on EvilBay for an H&G 4-banger in #50 that went for abut $50 - not bad for a dang good boolit. H&G made a ton of those, so they are fairly abundant, and show up often. Lyman 358495 too.

[PapaG]

My favorite is Lyman 358432, a heavy, solid base that crimps about 1/4" behind the nose. Mine come out at about 160 grains and I have not found a .38 they don't shoot well in. Got it when we began this journey in the 60s.

[gwpercle]

I tested every WC and SWC boolit design I could lay my hands on and the winner in every 38 special and 357 magnum , accuracy wise , is the now discontinued Lyman Design #358432 160 grain version. It consistently shot tighter groups with several different powders.
Luckily NOE has re created this design in their NOE 360-160-WC (PB) and it is still available. Hollow points are available also if you want them .
The 3 cavity aluminum mould is a big improvement over the old used Lyman single cavity I found on Ebay. This boolit is about all I cast for 38/357 revolvers any more.
If you have never tried this boolit....you missing out.

Since the weight is close to the old 158 grain standard, fixed sighted revolvers like model 10, 64 and J frame snub nose , all shoot to their fixed sights...this was important to me . My S&W model 64 , 38 special , fixed sights, adores this boolit.
Gary

[oldhenry]

I also like the #358432. I lucked up in '77 when a local sporting goods store discontinued their gun department. I bought the #358432, #452374 & #452388 (all 4 cavity) for $12.50 each. I kick myself for not buying more (a #358429 & #358477 were available, but I had those in 2 cavity & being frugal didn't want to be extravagant).

I have a H&G #50 in 6 cavity that I don't use (too heavy)........I should sell it (good idea).

Henry

[RogerDat]

NOE makes a hollow base wad cutter mold in .38 which is a good mold at a decent price. I have not managed to do more than some 10 yard tests but it worked well enough at that range that I'm looking forward to warmer weather. You can remove the pins and cast a regular wad cutter with the mold too. Aluminum mold but of good quality.

Lee 158 semi wad cutter tumble lube design. Punches decent holes, decent range, works well with either tumble lube or powder coat. Doesn't lose stability nearly as fast as a true wad cutter. A good companion to most 158 grain 38 molds is a Lyman button nose wad cutter mold. I'll have to look to see the exact mold number but it impinges into the case the same amount as the 158 SWC or RN so the same powder load yields very similar performance to this WC. That Lyman WC also seems to work well crimped into a small groove just a bit back from the nose end. Makes speed loaders a touch easier to use since there is a small amount of bullet for lead in.