What's up with LBT ?

[Patrick L]

I ordered some LBT Blue Soft on 8/22. I thought I'd check on my order and I can't get to their web page. That's the one that was sponsored by leverguns.com

Is something going on I don't know about?

PS I forgot to mention I got an email from Veral the day before I sent the order advising me about the Blue Soft.

[Scrounger]

I ordered some LBT Blue Soft on 8/22. I thought I'd check on my order and I can't get to their web page. That's the one that was sponsored by leverguns.com

Is something going on I don't know about?

PS I forgot to mention I got an email from Veral the day before I sent the order advising me about the Blue Soft.

If he'd cheat us (in the form of taxes we all have to pay), what made you think he wouldn't cheat you individually?

[Patrick L]

Scrounger,

I'm sure many here know exactly what the h*ll you are talking about.

I'm not one of them.

In plain english, please ?

[waksupi]

If he'd cheat us (in the form of taxes we all have to pay), what made you think he wouldn't cheat you individually?

Scrounger, you need to research the history of the taxing amendment. It was never ratified, so doesn't stand as legitimate law. So it is the government who is screwing the sheep. Of course, the courts aren't going to rock the money boat. Tax protesters stand on absolutely solid quick sand.

[Patrick L]

Its still all pops and whistles guys. What exactly are you talking about ?

Shall I assume LBT got into some tax trouble ? As for being screwed, my check has not been cashed yet, so its not (yet anyway) a question of loosing my money and not getting the product. I simply have heard nothing and been unable to get on the company's web site. I had emailed the company with some questions about the differences between LBT Blue and Blue Soft, and got a very nice email from Veral answering my questions. The next day I ordered some Blue Soft. 10 sticks, so we're not talking major $$ here guys.

[felix]

Patrick, LBT did not pay income taxes for one or more years and was successfully prosecuted by the federal IRS and then put out of business for a couple of years. What Waksupi is talking about is the state of Ohio not being a legit state at the time of the signing of the 16th, and that state was the last one making up the correct number for ratification. ... felix

[Bret4207]

To expand a bit more, Ol' Veral went to Federal prison for a while, not that that makes him a bad guys necessarily. However, there appear to be some who doubt his honesty. I haven't heard anything bad about LBT since he got out. Could be medical problems or any of a number of other things.

[Patrick L]

Thank you Felix and Bret!

So, do you guys think my inability to connect to the LBT website after having done so less than one month ago is cause for any concerns ? Their website was part of leverguns.com Maybe those guys just dropped the link.

[Willbird]

I ordered some lube this winter, I did get it,

As to Verals troubles, I have traded emails with him quite a bit, and I will say I think he is a good man. What happened to him has happened to quite a few people.

How many of us if we had to pay for every thing we ever did and got away with would be free men today and legally allowed to own guns ? And besides that he was tried, and convicted and did his time.

Did he cheat anybody of $.01 through that whole deal ?? (maybe he did I dunno)

I get the feeling from some other posts here in the past that some here really don't like the fact that they share air with Veral Smith, If ya'al have that much hate in you I hope he is the sole recipient of it.

He has answered questions I asked of him and shared his courage, strength, and hope with me. good men aren't always right and do not always do right, only ONE man ever did that perfectly (from what I read)

Also I have gotten the "feel" that Veral doesn't have a computer or internet of his own, but reads and replies to stuff in batches, just a guess.....it has taken weeks to get a reply.

Bill

[Scrounger]

I ordered some lube this winter, I did get it,

As to Verals troubles, I have traded emails with him quite a bit, and I will say I think he is a good man. What happened to him has happened to quite a few people.

How many of us if we had to pay for every thing we ever did and got away with would be free men today and legally allowed to own guns ? And besides that he was tried, and convicted and did his time.

Did he cheat anybody of $.01 through that whole deal ?? (maybe he did I dunno)

I get the feeling from some other posts here in the past that some here really don't like the fact that they share air with Veral Smith, If ya'al have that much hate in you I hope he is the sole recipient of it.

He has answered questions I asked of him and shared his courage, strength, and hope with me. good men aren't always right and do not always do right, only ONE man ever did that perfectly (from what I read)

Also I have gotten the "feel" that Veral doesn't have a computer or internet of his own, but reads and replies to stuff in batches, just a guess.....it has taken weeks to get a reply.

Bill

The money our tax people, our hated tax people, collect for our country, is supposedly for the benefit of us all. And whether we believe that or not, the burden is also shared by us all. Any man who doesn't pay his fair share is cheating all honest tax payers. And the fact that he is a mold maker does not make him a God, above his civic obligations. Yes, I have a low opinion of him as a man, and I wouldn't trust him for $0.02!

[felix]

I don't know anything about Veral lately. My dealings with him were extremely pleasant, as he delivered a mold to me, after a phone call and a month, that worked perfectly from the git-go. In other words, my specs were followed to a tee, and his workmanship beyond expectation. ... felix

[Scrounger]

Scrounger, you need to research the history of the taxing amendment. It was never ratified, so doesn't stand as legitimate law. So it is the government who is screwing the sheep. Of course, the courts aren't going to rock the money boat. Tax protesters stand on absolutely solid quick sand.

That may well be legally true, but as Veral and a lot of other people found out, they're bigger than I am and have more guns. I don't believe in starting fights you can't win. It's still the best country around.

[The Nyack Kid]

I mailed a check for his book "JPWCB" back on July 31st . I received it September 1st . wrote on the back of the catalog was the note " P.S. If you send any order send them certifed mail as we're having trouble sometimes getting all our mail - GS at LBT " . I would not worry about it to much just yet as we just got off a big weekend and the mail moves slowly . also people take holidays off or go on vacation , that sort of deal . Veral seems to me to be a very good honest person . as far as being a tax dodger,I know lots of people who object to Goverment taking a large amount of their money and spending it on programs that they object to or find morally wrong .

[Willbird]

I don't hate the taxes, or the people that collect them, just how much they waste of what they take.

I pay my taxes, on time, easier that way, I'v know a few otherwise level headed people that fell for the tax protest deals in the 80's. I guess they end up being lightning rods.

Is there a differance between just not paying taxes and running parts for a half dozen car's and truck thru the tax exempt farm account to avoid sales tax ??

What about ordering over the net and then not declaring the purchase and paying the sales tax when you file your taxes (supposed to do that in oHIo)?

Bill

[PatMarlin]

Patrick,

I have found Veral to be slow at times, but never failed to make good on an order. I would not panic.

I've read a lot of posts bashing Veral on other websites, and statements that seemed out of jealousy by another mold maker... but I got to say- his mistake was paid in full. No man's perfect, and we all make dumb desicions.

I know one thing also- his molds perform better than any others in my pile, from ease of casting to correct sizing and accuracy. Many times I have thought of selling the lot for the exact LBT's taylored to my arms.

Agree or not, the man has tons of cast bullet knowldge, and eventhough I find the writing in his book hard to understand at times, there is valuable knowledge and information there.

He has taken a long time to respond to my email questions, but always does.

His wife is very ill, and he has to take care of her.

[Patrick L]

Wow ! I really didn't intend to start a brushfire with this. Thanks to all who responded, I have had my questions answered to my complete satisfaction.

[Slowpoke]

Patric, Mr.Smith is a straight shooter, he has always been kind of slow, basically a one man show.

Just sit back and relax, unless he has passed on or filed bankruptcy you have no worries .

I think it is something in the air or water up there in Idaho, seem's like in the past there have been quite a few that did'nt feel the need to pay taxes. No biggie for me.

I know when Mr. Smith was paying his debt,alot of people ordered lube they didn't need from his wife and sent some extra cash to help make ends meet.

I also know that in the 18 years I have known Mr. Smith, I have only heard two people bad mouth him. Dan over at MTN Molds, and Scrounger. Again no biggie for me.

Good luck

[Willbird]

It was an ok question to ask, I got a bit nervous myself (and I asked about the same question here) , also remember if you pay with a check LBT waits for it to clear, and the mail is a bit slow in the last 6 months it seems.

I wished I had some other point of contact with Veral, Paco Kelly may be able to contact him, and FWIW if I had questions on LBT no longer being a sponsor for leverguns (as it appears) I would ask Paco, he does answer email.

Bill

[Scrounger]

Patric, Mr.Smith is a straight shooter, he has always been kind of slow, basically a one man show.

Just sit back and relax, unless he has passed on or filed bankruptcy you have no worries .

I think it is something in the air or water up there in Idaho, seem's like in the past there have been quite a few that did'nt feel the need to pay taxes. No biggie for me.

I know when Mr. Smith was paying his debt,alot of people ordered lube they didn't need from his wife and sent some extra cash to help make ends meet.

I also know that in the 18 years I have known Mr. Smith, I have only heard two people bad mouth him. Dan over at MTN Molds, and Scrounger. Again no biggie for me.

Good luck

Lucky for him, he's white. Black lawbreakers are treated more harshly here...

[stocker]

Veral had a sub forum on the Greybeard site although I haven't checked it for quite a few months. Probably still there.

[waksupi]

Just a hint to anyone sending, or recieving mail from Montana or Idaho. Overnight mail, isn't. 4-5 days average for over night delivery. Don't waste your money. Everything else is just plain slow.

[Patrick L]

Oops ! My lube was here today when I got home from work ! :oops:

[Willbird]

Been there Patrick, done that, hehe, got the tee-shirt, and the lube :-)

Bill